print page | close window mountainman's caboose log...

Print Page | Close Window

Mountainman's Caboose Log (Completed!)

Printed from: myLargescale.com Forums

Topic URL: http://www.mylargescale.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=17958

Printed on: 30 Nov 2005

Topic:

Topic author: MountainMan

Subject: Mountainman's Caboose Log (Completed!)

Posted on: 18 Oct 2003 00:11:13

Message:

Hey all,

Jumping on the rolling stock challenge bandwagon, I am scratchbuilding a Coahuila Y Zacatecas

narrow gauge caboose...

of 79myLargescale.com Forums

11/30/2005http://www.mylargescale.com/forum/pop_printer_friendly.asp?TOPIC_ID=17958

That's the prototype, which ran on a Mexican narrow gauge line.

Mine won't be an exact copy, just trying to get it close, and it will be lettered for my railroad, the

"Gritty Creek & Browder". I do have plans that I found in a back issue of Narrow Gauge and

Shortline Gazette. I understand that one of the original CyZ cabooses (#151 I think) still survives

today at the Huckleberry RR in Flint Michigan, might be worth a roadtrip to see it...

Here's a quick picture with the framed walls temporarily clamped to the frame...



So far I have the frame cut and assembled, the flooring is scribed basswood. The walls are framed

with 3/32" square spruce (just cause I had it handy) with sheet basswood in the areas that the

grab irons will go, still have a couple of places I need to reinforce before sheeting the sides with

scribed basswood.

Updates will depend on free time and how nice it is outside, still lots I'd like to do on the layout

before the ground freezes...This caboose was to have been built last winter but it got interupted

by spring!

Onward Ho....

Replies:

Reply author: ACL BIG50AE

Replied on: 18 Oct 2003 01:32:25

Message:

john looking good looks like a great project.

Reply author: chuckger

Replied on: 18 Oct 2003 04:48:20



Message:

Hi John,

Your off to a great start. Thats a kool prototype, reminds me of a converted box car.

chuckger

Reply author: docwatsonva

Replied on: 18 Oct 2003 08:47:45

Message:

John,

Great looking project so far. Something different for a change.

Reply author: cjwalas

Replied on: 18 Oct 2003 10:33:32

Message:

DARN, DARN, DARN! The very prototype I was planning on doing! Excellent choice, John! I've

loved the look of these cabeese since I first saw them in NGSL, but never had the courage to

attempt one. You beat me to it and it sure looks like you'll do a much better job of it than I could

ever hope to!

Can't wait to see this one done.

Chris

Reply author: Richard Smith

Replied on: 18 Oct 2003 15:39:19

Message:

John,

That is a great prototype and you are off to a beautiful start on the model. That is very close to

the type of caboose I'd like to build for the Port Orford Coast R.R. I must have skipped by the plan

in NG&SLG. Thanks for the heads up. I'm still a couple years away from building any rolling stock,

still too much to do on the RR itself, but I'll file the info away for later.

I will be following your progress with much interest. Please post info & pix as often as you can.

Have you thought about trucks for that beauty? I may retire a couple older Bachmann passenger

cars in the future. Do you think their trucks might work for a car like that?

Anyway thanks for the pix.



Reply author: MountainMan

Replied on: 19 Oct 2003 06:59:17

Message:

Thanks to all for the encouraging words!

Hey Chris, great minds... ya know I fell for this beauty when I saw it in Gerald Best's

wonderful book "Mexican Narrow Gauge". Great book for inspiration, by the way.

Richard, Plans were in the Jan/Feb '97 NG&SLG with a letter from Mal Ferrell updating the

whereabouts of #152 in the Jul/Aug issue of the same year. Apparently, #152 was rebuilt with

end platforms sometime before it was buned in a fire set by vandals in 1969 (damn hippies! ). It

then made its way to the Huckleberry RR and was rebuilt. I'm building the version without the end

platforms btw. Here's a recent pic I found - not a very good one...

As for trucks, thanks Richard, I do have a set of Bachmann passenger trucks I am planning on

using (great minds again! ). The caboose is sitting on them in the picture but it's hard to see as

it's dark and I don't have the bolsters cut yet...

Next up is butchering a Bachmann caboose for the windows. The bobber caboose's windows are a

close enough match to the CyZ's caboose but I need 16 of them and there are only 4 of the

correct size on the bobber. This will also be my first attempt at casting which I will do my best to

document here. I am planning to remove all 4 and making a 4 window mould to speed up the

casting.

Here's the victim...



Removed one of the windows last night, don't worry, the dremel wasn't on for this pic I do like

that thumb!



One down, four more to go...



I hope to get the rest of the windows removed and cleaned up tonight.

Mould making should start tomorrow...

Reply author: Jim Francis

Replied on: 19 Oct 2003 18:26:15

Message:

John,

Great start!

Welcome aboard! I have added you to the running list for the Winter Rolling Stock

Challenge.

Anyone else out there starting on something for the WInter Rolling Stock Challenge please

indicate you are joining the Challenge under the Winter Rolling Stock Challenge thread.




Replied on: 21 Oct 2003 00:18:50

Message:

Okay time for an update...

Got the rest of the windows out of the bobber and cleaned them up with the power sander and

followed with some hand sanding,



Now it was time to create the mold I needed to cast the windows. Here's the mold making

material I got from Micro Mark



Man my workbench is cluttered...

Anyway, first step was to make a mold box for the originals, I made this out of some strip balsa

and built it on plate glass,



In retrospect, I should have put some clay underneath the balsa as a gasket to keep the material

from seeping out from underneath, not much did but it would have kept it a bit tidier.

I used a very small drop of thin CA to secure the frames in place on the glass



I mixed up the mold material in a clean bowl, it was measured 10:1 by weight, helps to have a

good digital scale for this.



The mixed material...turns a nice sky blue when mixed.



Then don't forget the mold release I almost did...



Here we go...



After pouring the material, I put my homemade de-airing devise (I owe my wife a new bowl

now ) and ran the vacuum for about 5 minutes to remove all the bubbles.



With the mold material I purchased, it requires a 24 hour cure time and the directions emphasize

not to try to remove the mold until this time has passed. Man, I should have gotten the quicker

curing stuff, it's hard to wait...It's been long enough as I type this but I'm at work and have to

wait until I get home this morning to take the mold off....

More pics will follow...


Replied on: 21 Oct 2003 05:29:51

Message:

Great instructional photos John. I'm sure everyone will benefit. Casting isn't too bad if you keep it

simple. No modeller should be afraid to try it. Micro Mark does carry a very good line of casting

products.

Reply author: Rick Raively

Replied on: 21 Oct 2003 05:37:33

Message:



Wow John,

I have not try to make any pieces out of a mold. Thanks for making it look so easy. Can't wait to

see the rest of your picture tutorial.

Thanks

Rick R.


Replied on: 22 Oct 2003 00:51:02

Message:

Tuesday's update,

I got home this morning and pulled the mold off of the glass and this was the result,



There was a bit of flash that creeped under the masters and it worried me a bit. A razor blade was

used to carefully remove as much as I could. Afterwords, I discovered this wasn't much of a

concern since the molded parts would need cleaned up anyway, any distortions from the flash

would be sanded off.

The mold was washed in warm soapy water and let dry. This evening, the CR-600 casting resin

(also from Micro-Mark) was readied for use.



The end was cut off of a oral medicine syrine left over from the last cold our children went

through. These things are usually free from Walgreen's when you get prescriptions filled, I try to

get a couple each time. This is used for accurately measuring the resin in a 50/50 ratio.



Then after thoroughly mixing the resin it was carefully poured into the mold. This is some good

resin as it flows just like water. Mold release was not required.



The resin turns white as it cures,



The instructions say that you can normally demold in 30-40 minutes. On the first cast I did, I

removed one at 40 minutes but found that it was still quite easily deformed, so I let the others

cure for another 20 minutes, they came out easily and were much firmer.

And here are the demolded castings,



A bit of flash but they clean up rather quickly. Won't be long and I'll have all 16 required for the

caboose! This was my first casting attempt and seemed to have gone pretty well....

During this whole casting process, while waiting for things to cure, I sheeted the interior walls. A

mistake was made that I should have known better to do. Since I sheeted just one side, when the

glue dried completely, this resulted...Warp Speed!



Not wanting to rebuild the walls, I cut out the window openings, and clamped the heck out of the

wall to the frame with some angle iron,



The outer sheeting was then added and clamped again,



After allowing it to dry for a day, the clamps were removed and viola!



Not laser straight but better than having to rebuild it. I'm not letting my breathe out completely

until I give it another day or so to fully dry.

Next up is casting a few more windows and getting the other walls glued to the frame.

I hope you guys aren't getting overloaded with the pictures by the way. I'm not trying to do a

tutorial with this project, just document it. If someone picks up a tip, it's worth it then. It is rather

unnerving to have your work out in the open like this...

Reply author: Rick Raively

Replied on: 22 Oct 2003 05:28:52

Message:

Hi John,

Love the update on the mold process. You are doing a excellent job.

quote:

I hope you guys aren't getting overloaded with the pictures by the way. I'm not trying to do a tutorial with this

project, just document it. If someone picks up a tip, it's worth it then. It is rather unnerving to have your work out

in the open like this...



Never... The more pictures and info the better the log. I have already learn from it, Thanks. Its

always a little bit hard to open yourself up for the world to see your work. You are doing a great

job, so don't worry about it.

Thanks again

Rick R.

Reply author: Dougald

Replied on: 22 Oct 2003 07:00:36

Message:

John

Great progress and keep those pics coming. Casting is one of the best ways to create multiple

copies and you have made it look very easy.

Regards ... Doug

Reply author: Jim Francis

Replied on: 22 Oct 2003 17:51:21

Message:

John,

Keep those pictures comming!

We are all learnign casting from your instructions and pics!

Please don't stop now.

Jim


Replied on: 24 Oct 2003 00:02:22

Message:

Thanks to everyone for the kind words! I'll try to take all the pics I can. Sometimes it's hard to

remember to grab the camera while building...

Thursday night update:

I got the other side wall glued on last night. Remember, you can never have too many clamps

around the shop!



The wall came out pretty straight although not perfectly square to the frame. It will straighten out

when the roof formers are installed.

Speaking of which, it was time to cut the formers. After making a paper templete from the plans,

5 pieces of 1/8" basswood were tack glued together. Then they were shaped using the disc

sander.



The ends were notched on the table saw,



Also, while at the saw, I cut a 3/16" notch for the center stringer.



Here's the formers dry-fit into postion,



I had considered making the roof removeable to have access to the interior. Not sure exactly what

would work best to allow the roof to come off easily. Perhaps if I make 2 more fomers and set

them inside the 2 end formers (end formers would be glued to the side walls), once the roof was

glued to the other formers, this should allow it to be removed. My only concerns are that I would

have to be very careful to avoid gluing the roof to the side walls and would the whole roof would

be sturdy enough to survive being removed without breaking.

I'm not against having a permanent roof...

Any ideas?

Can you tell I'm making this up as I go along?!?


Replied on: 09 Nov 2003 02:11:46

Message:

It's been a while since an update, work and civic duties have been eating up alot of spare time. I

have been taking pictures since my last update as you can tell from the dates on them, just

haven't been able to post...



Enough excuses, on to the pictures!

In order to make the roof removable, I made two more formers and cut notches for stringers in all

of them, here is the roof after gluing and clamping with rubber bands

This picture better shows how the roof comes off. Notice the outer stringers are missing where the

cupola will go. The center stringer will be cut out in this area also when the sheeting is glued on

but that won't happen until I get the trim along the top of the carbody applied.



Here's the end wall being framed



And sheeted (Lots a clamps!! )



The window trim was the next job. The openings were touched up with a file and then the sill was

added



Then the side pieces,



The window frames,



Here's a higher resolution pic of the completed window with the header in place



The line above the window is where the trim will run around the carbody. That's next on my list...

Hope to get more done early this week!

Reply author: peter bunce

Replied on: 09 Nov 2003 03:39:46

Message:

Hi All, & John,

Looking good John, I was debating with myself whether to make the roof of my boxcar

removeable, but in the end decided that it would be stronger to be glued down all round, so I am

interested in your methods of making it removeable.

Will you need to add some stiffening, or bracing to the body at all?



Reply author: Bubba

Replied on: 09 Nov 2003 09:45:36

Message:

John, that caboose is looking great! I really like that prototype and I'm convinced you're going to

do a fantastic model of it. You've even got scribed wood on the inside walls! Are you going to be

making an interior as well?


Replied on: 09 Nov 2003 13:03:19

Message:

John,

I agree with Bubba. This is one great looking caboose.


Replied on: 09 Nov 2003 22:01:06

Message:

Peter,

The walls are straight enough that I should be able to get away without any bracing. They do bow

in slightly and help to hold the roof in place.

Bubba,

Yeah, I'm planning on putting an interior in it. I have no pictures or idea of what the inside of the

prototype looked like so I'll have to guess.

Doc,

Thanks!

Reply author: Timmy

Replied on: 12 Nov 2003 16:53:22

Message:

John-

You've done a beautiful job so far, and I agree with everybody else about the prototype - Very

nice caboose to model! Thanks for the casting tutorial (never too many pictures) it makes me

think it's possible for a guy like me with 5 thumbs on each hand to do it! WELL DONE!


Replied on: 22 Nov 2003 03:55:47



Message:

Been really trying to get time to update my log. Finally have a few minutes sooooooo....

The trim around the top was applied along with the roof sheeting

Here's the bottom of the roof



I wasn't happy with the way the roof fit on the ends. It didn't sit down against the top of the trim

very tightly. So I had an idea...

First drilled some holes in the floor under the trouble spots



Then reinforced the holes with a bit of 1/16" plywood



This is the underside of the roof. I epoxied some hardwood blocks under the ends



Then holes were drilled in the blocks an they were tapped out 3-56NF



I cut to length and threaded some 1/16" brass rods and locked a couple of nuts on the end



Here's a shot inside showing how the rod fits up into the block



And the bottom



Don't know how well you can see the difference but here's the roof end before I tightened the rods



And here's after



It is much more noticeable in person... This way too, the roof is securely attached to the body

and I know that if it wasn't I'd try to pick it up by the roof one time and probably wind up

dropping it.

On to the cupola! Here's the ends...



Framed up...



End windows installed...



And finally the nearly completed cupola an top of the caboose and on the trucks



It's really starting to take form. I'm getting excited about finishing it... It might not seem like it

to some of ya'll but this project really is progressing pretty quick for me.


Replied on: 22 Nov 2003 04:30:50

Message:

Hi all & John, Looking superb, nice work, and the photo's help to show your solutions to the little

problems as they come up. Congratulations.


Replied on: 22 Nov 2003 21:35:15

Message:

Thanks Peter. I find the photos usually explain things much better than I ever can!




Replied on: 23 Nov 2003 05:48:41

Message:

John,

Wonderfull progress you are making there. I really like your idea of attaching the roof.

Reply author: chuckger

Replied on: 23 Nov 2003 07:10:01

Message:

Hi John,

Caboose looks great. Neat way of keeping the roof on. Nice work.

chuckger


Replied on: 20 Dec 2003 22:05:07

Message:

Greetings all!

I've been very lazy lately about updating the log . I'm sure glad this isn't a race ! Work has

been progressing on the caboose, so onto the pictures...

Built the doors from scratch using 1/16" and 1/32" basswood. It's projects like this where I

couldn't live without my Micromark table saw...



The roof was "tarpapered" with Sig silkspan that was painted on with Floquil weathered black

paint. The paint does a good job of holding it on but I took some thin CA and went around the

edges to keep them firmly attached.



Here's a closer shot



Been adding some of the details now. The couplers ahve been attached (accucraft). Lots of nut

and bolt castings yet to add! I'm not sure what function they provide, but if you look at the

prototype pics there are what appear to be pieces of sheetmetal behind each grab iron. I used

some .005" styrene to simulate these.



And here's the point I'm currently at now...



Not much further now. Truss rods, roof walks, brake wheel, detailing the trucks, and a few other

things and she'll be done! Hope to get alot accomplished over the holidays...maybe I can have it

done by the 1st

Reply author: Bubba

Replied on: 20 Dec 2003 23:09:02

Message:

Cool! I love this caboose! I've been waiting to see the next update. I like the fabric you put down.

Its a very fine texture and looks great. That is used for model aircraft, isn't it?


Replied on: 21 Dec 2003 00:25:53

Message:

Andy,

Thanks , I'm off work next week so hopefully there will be some significant progress on it.

Yeah, silkspan is made by Sig for the flying model airplane folks. I've used it before and really like



the texture for simulating roofing materials. It's pretty easy to work with.


Replied on: 21 Dec 2003 01:26:57

Message:

Hi All, & John,

Your caboose is quite a big one - and looks very nice - thanks for all the photo's.

Are the pieces of metal (005 plastic) behind the grab irons in effect 'kick plates' and there as

protection for the (softer) boards underneath?

Reply author: Crisolite

Replied on: 22 Dec 2003 00:23:42

Message:

quote:

Are the pieces of metal (005 plastic) behind the grab irons in effect 'kick plates' and there as protection for the

(softer) boards underneath?

Peter, you hit the nail on the head there. Over the years I've heard them called all kinds of things,

but the only one I can remember right now is 'boot blocker'


Replied on: 22 Dec 2003 01:39:36

Message:

Peter & Ed,

Thanks for the info. This certainly makes sense. Maybe they wore alot of pointy toed cowboy boots

down there?!?


Replied on: 13 Feb 2004 15:19:22

Message:

Well, I finally have a working digital camera and the time so it's time to update the log. I got a

new computer last month and it took a bit of tryin to get the usb driver for my older camera to

work with it. Time has been scarce lately too. Being the mayor of a small village here in Illinois



doesn't exactly add to my leisure time!

Enough excuses, on to the pics!

I went outside today and took a few pics...(click on link below image to enlarge)

http://gold.mylargescale.com/MountainMan/DSC01350.JPG




Here's a few detail shots...(no larger links)



A few notes on the model, the colors are a guesstimate as to what the CyZ actually used. Since I

was lettering it for my own RR it really didn't matter. I'm sure that the CyZ used a darker, golden

yellow for at least some of their cabooses, but as far as the red goes, I kinda guessed. The b/w pic

in Best's book (pg 63) suggests that the windows and cupola were of a darker color but I have

been unable to comfirm that the color was red. The colors used were Badger Modelflex "Soo Line

Dulux Gold" and "Soo Line Red". Just a coincidence that they were both Soo colors! The red

closely matched the color of the Woodland Scenics dry tranfer letters that were used. The Gritty

Creek shops decided when they get around to building passenger cars that these colors will be

used again.

Using Kevin Strong's post on his trucks as a guide, I added a bit of detail to the Bachmann trucks.



I didn't add any brake rigging or super detail the underbody. After doing so to the first few large

scale models I built, I found that it usually doesn't get seen when the car is in operation anyway.

The interior is also rather sparce at the moment,



One item I had a bit of fun with was lighting the marker lamps...



They are Ozark Miniature lamps with small 1.5v bulbs run off of a AA battery under the cupola

seats.

There's many things I'm forgetting to add about the model I'm sure. It was alot of fun to build and

I'm quite happy with the results.


Replied on: 13 Feb 2004 15:59:19

Message:

Hi John,

Very nice & colorful, you have a very useful piece of equipment there.

Congratulations on a real good job!

Looks a wee bit cold there, not like the where the original (mexico)ran.



Reply author: TimFlan

Replied on: 13 Feb 2004 17:00:09

Message:

Dang, that is cool, and a very unique piece of rolling stock. I gotta build me a little toolcar/MOW

caboose one of these days...

Reply author: Torby

Replied on: 13 Feb 2004 18:04:18

Message:

Sparce interior? Looks pretty detailed to me!

Nice.

Reply author: Dougald

Replied on: 13 Feb 2004 18:04:41

Message:

Very nicely executed ... and fine craftsmanship displayed in those windows.

Regards ... Doug

Reply author: East Broad Top

Replied on: 13 Feb 2004 18:24:15

Message:

Very cool! Just caught the the thread with the finished product, and enjoyed looking back at the

construction. It's a helluvalot of work, but damn! ain't it worth it! I really like the silkspan roofing

material. I'll have to file that one away in my bag of tricks. You done yourself proud with that one.

Later,

K

Reply author: Bubba

Replied on: 13 Feb 2004 20:01:31

Message:

Fantastic work! That sure would look great behind a Connie!




Replied on: 13 Feb 2004 20:44:29

Message:

Peter,

Yes, quite chilly today, temps around 4C (25F) with 20 mph winds. Very different from the

Zacatecas area!

Bruce,

Switch? What switch? Just kidding, it's underneath. A simple slide switch..

Torby,

Thanks, I was planning to add a table a chairs plus some general interior clutter in the future...

Kevin,

Considering all the ideas I've gotten from your work, I'm quite happy to return the favor! As a

matter of fact, I have 4 or 5 Bachmann ore cars sitting on my RIP track that I'm planning on

giving the "Strong" treatment...

Andrew,

Thanks, my Connie is sitting on the workbench now. Lotsa mods planned. I'm leaning towards also

giving it that "South of the Border" flavor...

Thanks to all for the kind words! I honestly have to say that this caboose wouldn't have gone

together without the inspiration and support of the wonderful folks here at MLS!


Replied on: 14 Feb 2004 06:04:20

Message:

John,

Your caboose looks fantastic. Excellent workmanship.

Reply author: Torby

Replied on: 14 Feb 2004 08:21:58

Message:

John, Did we meet at the Bloomington GATS show last fall?

Reply author: blackburn49

Replied on: 14 Feb 2004 12:26:49



Message:

Stunning work. Couldn't hardly appear more professional than that!


Replied on: 14 Feb 2004 16:14:07

Message:

Torby,

Living just 20 mintutes from Bloomington, you would think I could have made it. Actually I'm

waiting for it to be held at closer location so I can just walk to it! Just kidding! My work

schedule has occupied my weekends for the last 5 months but fortunately, this is the last weekend

for that screwy schedule. I'm planning on going to the Springfield show though. I'll look for you

there...

myLargescale.com Forums : http://www.mylargescale.com/forum/

© myLargescale.com / Model Railroads Online, LLC

Close Window



print page | close window mountainman's caboose log...

Documents