mo v wilson interview-witness-42

8/10/2019 Mo v Wilson Interview-witness-42

1/19

August 16, 2014

Special

Agent

SA

Special Agent

SA

Federal Bureau of Investigation,St. Louis Division

Special Agent

Special Agent

Unintelligible =

UI

SA

= SA

= SA

This is Special Agent nd Special Agent

, date of

birth We re at

and this

is the interview

of

We re

with

SA

SA

SA

SA

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...did, d id you see what took place last Saturday? That

would

have been...August

t he n in th

around noon.

Yes,

I did, I did

no t

see

th e

initiaL

1

did

no t

see

the

initial

start

of

th e

situation bu t I seen

the

closure of th e situation. Because I was on

my

porch ...

to ge t

reception on

my

phone? And, um, I heard a

gunshot..fo

..

i t, i t, it caught

my attention.

Okay.

As

it

did the attention of everybody else around h r. And when I got,

um ... to my phone, as fa r as then talking on my phone, I t ol d t he

individuaL 1told her, I call them back. Ou t of town calL 1 stood

up ...walked that direction to see what was going on and

when

I looked

to

see

what

was going on police was running

after

a young man

that

was running in

th e

direction toward that

way

...

Okay.

He shot again, shot

the

individual in

th e

back,

Mr.

Brown, I don t

know

what

part

of

th e

back he shot bu t he

turned

around,

Mr .

Brown

turned

around ...and literally pu t his arms up... in

a,

in a fashion to

where

...

my

understanding that means surrender.

So

th e

individual

is

running away and then

turned

around and

pu t

his

hands...

After

being shot

...up. Okay.

Can YOu ...so on this map here..where

where

was it ..you

would

say that

you saw hi m running towards?


2/19

I gotta

see

this

I m, I m getting up

chuckles)

Oh, I understand. That s f ine.

sighs)

Okay so

this bend, this bend coming of f West Florissant right?

Yeah.

Exactly?

That s r ight.

So

he s running

in this direction

Okay.

trying

to

run in this dir ecti on. Well , he act uall y ran in this dir ecti on.

Okay,

so

he ran Eastbound on Canfield then?

Exactly.

Okay.

So it d

be goin this

it li

be coming-going this way.

Okay.

S as

I

see

that,

as

I

walk further

on

my

porch, I see

the

officer chasing

after the

individual and he

hi t

him pow one

time

in

the

back

and

the

individual realized he was shot

so

he turns around and immediately

put

his arms up, and

as

he s stepped closer

to the-the

officer.he s

surrendering himself, he

he

the

officer.

has

his arms up already and

he continued

to

let every round, I mean every round,

the

visual is

so

clear.

He let

every round in his chest off and

as

he

got

closer, he

le t

a

round

of f

in his head, his cheek, his head and he f inished a r ound and

stood over him.

How

how many rounds total?

I I didn t count cause I was stunned

1was in shock. I I I stopped

counting.

Okay.

It was gruesome.


3/19

S

so the

officer continued

to

shoot at hi m, in

the

chest? Do you

know

what

the

distance was between

the

officer

I d

say

about

a good

twenty

feet.

Okay.

before

he cap before he

got

shot

in

the

sense of

the the

back

shot

Uh

huh.

he

turned

around,

it

was c1oser 1mean-I mean he was close, he was

so

close. The visual was gruesome.

Okay.

Could you

put

an x on this map. I ll give you m y pen here,

and

where where

this

took

place,

just so

we can confirm.

I can t see

this

what

number would

I be?

So

this is Canfield right here

You are chuckles)

you re we

are in building

Exactly.

this

is

labeled

as

building

Exactly, yes,

that s

a clear visual in w hi ch I had. Um, okay, cause t his

was Crenshaw

this Crenshaw building right here. This

the

leasing

office, I m believe

it

happened. I m

You re

That s right.

So your front

porch facing

that

way.

Exactly,

so

I m gonna

say that it

happened,

the

visual.

Yeah, cause you can see

it

right front

your front

porch, correct?

Exactly

and

that

that s

where he

turned

around, cause I seen when he

turned

around and immediately

put

his arms up.


4/19

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Okay.

And he started walking back, this direction,

toward the

officer and

the

officer closed in on h im , l iter al ly closed in on h im and

Ho w close was he when y ou said he closed in on h im ?

sighs)

Ten feet? Ten yards?

Less than that.

Really? Like from me to the wall, or?

He ah

he was he was he did this

Like ah,

from

here

to

here.

Yes

and I

t hi nk t hat

h e d id

n ot kn ow wh

he did

not know to

get down.

Oh okay.

He didn t know

to

get down.

He

didn t know to get down. So he

walke d up o n h im .

So he was walking to the officer with his hands up.

He

didn t

know

ta

he

didn t

know

Right, cause he s a young kid, probably really never been in trouble

Scared shot.

Yeah.

Body started feelin hot.

Uh

huh.

I know I

go t

a

bullet

in my back, I been, I been shot before, so

he

didn t know

to

get down.

So

Okay.

he did, he di d

Was walk b ut w it h his hands up and yeah.


5/19

SA

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He did it in a fashion

to

where prob

ey

scared th e shi.

Oh yeah.

You know so

Go ahead, you can say it.

He- he- he f inish ed h im o ff . I t

doesn t

make it s no t just that

wasn t

protocol. That s no t protocol. I t wasn t

protocol at

all.

Do you remember what

Mr

Brown was wearing that day?

sighs) Wow

Can

you describe him physically?

What

I can remember

is

basically he had a red ha t on, a s hirt on, s ome

shorts, some socks

you know stripey socks, long socks and th e flip flops

in which was

left

up the street before he start running

Let me secure

t ha t d oo r

too

Okay.

sighs)

Okay, so

so

to

recap here

and correct me

if

stop

me at

any

point

if,

if

I m incorrect about ho w I understand um, your, ah account of events

here. So you were standing on your front porch here, on your phone,

correct?

You

heard a single gunshot,

is

that right?

I h ea rd a shot.

Okay. And, YOU

...

you

couldn t

see anything at

t h at t ime

No.

Is that

correct?

Exactly.

And and then, shortly

thereafter

I seen individual.

Did you walk on your porch there?


6/19

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Yes

And, I seen an individual, I seen Mr. Brown running in this

direction, you say

what

bound?, East bound? You said?

Right, so

that

would be

as

you indicated there, it looks like it would be

eastbound on Canfield.

Right, so I seen him running and I I heard another gunshot

pow

and

Mr. Brown turn around and

put

his arms up. Ya know, and I seen the

officer

pursuing him, getting up on him and Mr. Brown was walking

towards

him cause he didn t

know ah

how to get down after being

shot he didn t know no procedure you don t know.

Okay.

So the officer, I don t know just shot him. Repeatedly.

Okay.

So

when

he was-when he was walking away

When

who was walking away?

When Mr. Brown was walking

from

the officer,

or

running away, and a

shot was f ired, do you know if

that

shot struck him?

I I sighs yeah, I believe

so

cause it was s s.. .a so called, I think the

f irst shot was the shot

that went of f

in the

suv

And

that s when

you paid

attention?

Yeah.

Okay.

And

then

that second shot,

another

shot

it

was, I think

it

was three

shots prior to me, because

there

was one shot that went off in

the

SUV

from

my understanding. And

then another

shot went of f in

the

building

over there, in which

they

retrieved the bul let. And

another

shot went

off in his back and the remainder, I

don t know

what k k kinda clip he

had

1don t

know was it a sixteen round

with

extra in the c1ip

1

don t

know

what

kind

of

gun he had.

Okay.

So we, we want to focus today on what so,

1know that the media

obviously has, has

Trying to.


7/19

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reported on this

and as much as you can I

know

it s difficult.

No i t s not .

But

we

want to focus specifically on you know what you saw.

Exactly

as opposed to

Exactly exactly

as

opposed

to

what

Exactly it s all

about m y

visual.

ha t

I seen.

Right. Okay

so

as

as

he is walking

or

running or.

was

it

walking

or

running

down

Canfield?

Hah. He was running.

He was running okay.

So as

he was running

down

Canfield you

observe I assume

ah

I observe

did you actually observe

the

police officer make

the

shot

or

you just

heard

th e

shot?

The f irs t shot? I

just

heard

the

shot. The second shot I m sure

it

came

f rom t he

officer.

Okay.

No cause I seen

th e

individual

turn

around.

Okay.

And and and

the

and and and in amazement like I

know

he

didn t

shoot this individual cause he had no arms

on

him.

Okay.

And when he realized he was shot he immediately

turned

around and

walked

toward the

officer.

And

the

officer.

w hen did

the

officer come

into your

field

of

view.


8/19

SA

I m

c1ear

you, you, you want to stand

ou t

there and see?

Yeah. Well, yeah, let s, let s go and then come back

to

th e recorder

though to though.

shuffling, clothing sounds heard)

Okay.

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[outside now

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You good?

UI) good, tha UI) jacket, they so basically

1was right there, listening. See ho w much of a visual I have. It s clear.

Okay.

Let s say he there

that

tree right there .......he s walking back, he s

walking, he s walking back towards th e officer. and th e officer closed in

on him.

Okay.

And, as he walking closer to

the

officer,

the

officer continued to let

rounds off.

Okay.

Period.

So he s they re walking towards each other.

Yes .

at this poi nt , and th e officer is shooting at him.

Yes sir.

Okay. So again, you re standing here on your porch

Yes

You hear a shot, right?

Yes


9/19

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You see ah Mr. Brown

Yes

.

running east

down

Canfield

there

Yes .

and

then

at th t point when did

the

officer come

into

view before or

fter

you heard

th t

shot?

He

came

into

view

fter

I heard

the

shot because

Okay.

I m trying

to

figure

ou t wh y

is this individual running.

Okay.

And he turns around immediately l ike I said puts his arms up

You

and you

don t know if

he was

h it o r no t

by

th t

round right?

i..i..yeah

it

was a clear indication because he

turned

around like this.

Okay.

So

you

think

he was hi t and th t time?

Yes

I believe

th t

he was hit.

Okay.

When he was running away.

So

you

think

he was

hi t

in his back then right?

Yes

Okay. And then he

turned

around and continued.

Yes

he did.

Okay.

cause

th e

M r. Br ow n closed in on

the

officer in

th e

sense

of

surrendering himself.

Okay.


10/19

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UI) Yeah, so

I I

I seen it. I mean sighs) 1seen it

ya

know?

Okay. And

so

he, you said t hen he turned around towards the officer.

Yea .

and

they

continued to

w lk

towards each other?

Yes

Mr. Brown came in closer, not knowing to get down.

How close do you

think

he got to the officer?

Stay right there.

So th t looks like boutmaybe six seven feet to me? Okay.

The officer

got

closer, and UI)

got

closer.

Okay. Okay.

Execution style.

And

as

the officer continued to approach, he contined

wh t

did he

do?

He continued to let of f rounds.

Okay. And, do you know where

the

rounds, when he continued to

approach him, actually struck then?

Based on where I was standing at-based on where I was standing at, I

could say th t it was um, upper chest, lower abdominal, repeatedly, um,

and t hen, um a head shot.

Oh

really.

Where, where was he ah, w hen the head shot took place? Where was

the officer in proximity to Mr. Brown?

I mean, it was it was like less than the feet th t we was just apart.

Okay.

t

was a visual to where

Like an arm s l ength? Or wh t are we talking bouthere?

Hmmph, less than that.


11/19

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That was when

the

headshot happened?

Boom, boom

Where,

where

was Mr. Brown, like was Mr. Brown standing, was he

kneeling, was he on

the

ground,

where

was he when

the

headshot

took

place?

The headshot took

place

before he

ah,

got down

on

the

ground.

ause he had

took

several shots in his upper torso and his

lower

abdominal. And

the

headshots came when he, he,

less

than, he was

too-he

was close,

too

close, he was

too

close

Okay.

And

the

individual, Mr. Brown

was like don t shoot ,

after

taking

these bullets.

You heard him

say

don t shoot ?

Yes

Okay.

That was his last words.

Okay.

So

He

knel.

he fel l, he fel l

to the

ground-he fell he fell

to the

ground and he

continued

to

let

the

rounds off. And everybody seen this on a Saturday

morning, kids are all playing.

Right. So

so

he was actually on his knees

Yes

when he received

the

round to

the

head?

Before he flipped over.

When he received

the

round

to the

head or.

No, he had received

the

round to

the

head before he had

got

on

the

ground.

Okay.

11


12/19

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And he still had life in him. And

th e

extra rounds came after he

sighs)

sloped over. And

it was overkill.

So when he actually

what

di d he do, di d he fall forward?

He fell forward

Okay, he fell forward and then what happened?

The officer s to od o ve r h im and fin is he d him o ff .

Okay, can you, can you explain

that

ho w d id he f in is h h im of

Well, f inish him off means in a sense f inish his r ou nd s o ff . He s a lr ea dy

tooken several bullets, and to actually stand over individual and finish

a clip

off

[slaps hand]

How,

ho w

many rounds

would

you say?

I man, I I I was in awe,

I

I

I

I couldn t believe

th e

officer was

ou t of

I couldn t believe a officer was

ou t of

p ro to co l. Based on a man being

unarmed.

Okay.

So I..the numbers, in which

ho w

many rounds

went off

1couldn t tell

you. Its just what th e f

Fuck. chuckles)

I couldn t tell you, man.

Okay. So th e

officer

just, le t

me

make sure that I understand your, your,

your

description here so th e

officer

is standing over him

Yes sir.

While he s, at this point, laying on

th e

ground.

Yes

sir.

And he continued

to

fire?

Yes sir.

And he st ruck hi m in his head

Yes sir.

12


13/19

Okay. Wha

what

happened after that?

Hah. Everybody came

ou t that

was seeing it. They was just in awe.

Couldn t believe that this

officer

fo r six years on th e force

Uh huh.

didn t

use protocol,

didn t

use a taser,

didn t

use if he was armed,

didn t

s ho ot h im in the leg, ya know and I everybody was just in awe.

Okay. So basically a crowd started to

Yes

Okay. Did you see anyone with

Mr.

Brown?

No, I did not. I

didn t

see l ik e I said, I

didn t

see

th e

initial start,

ya

know

...and

th e

people that you s probably know that was with

Mr.

Brown, I

didn t

I didn t

see

them.

Okay.

So

you just saw Mr. Brown

You know.

and y ou saw th e officer?

Yes

Can you give me, an obviously a police officer s is gon na be in uniform

bu t can you give me characteristics, basically a good description of th e

what the police

officer

looked like, to you?

sighs)

He

was tal l. Um, I see UI)

brunette

ah, he was tal l

brunette

ah,

ah, I I just

knew

he was in

uniform.

Okay.

I couldn t give you a visual really

of ho w

he looked.

So

he he was tall

with

brown hair, you said?

Something like that. Brunette.

Okay.

Ya

k now, I didn t I just was, couldn t, I d I m looking a t t he

uniform.


14/19

S

S

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S

Sure.

Right.

Ya know I m

no t

Sure.

really trying to

get

a visual.

Oh I understand. Um

do you

know

like what type of build he had? If if

he was like

Slim slim build.

Slim build?

Yeah.

The officer?

Yeah.

Okay.

Yeah

So

he was tall slim he s

go t

brown hair.

Something like that yeah.

Okay. And then what color are their uniform shirts?

It was blue.

h

l ike light blue or navy blue.

Navy blue.

Okay. [pause] ha tam I forgett ing

to

ask you here? Wha

what

else

is

Whatever you w an t t o

1don t know I mean

Is there anything else we need to know that we didn t ask

That s

alii

know.


15/19

SA

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cause you

know

we

I mean, that s all I have.

cause we

go t

very general, you know, very general information

Yeah, I that s okay.

t hat s w hy w e r e talking to you guys.

Yeah, it s okay. I mean, because, I mean 1haven t been to sleep since

Saturday and I was looking

to

ge t some sleep.

Sure.

Yeah,

ya know w hat

I m sayin ?

And you

go t both

of

us

knocking on

your

door. laughs)

That s okay,

bu t

I f igured you guys

were

coming anyway.

Yeah.

So um , I have no t really 1 was

tryin to

get in contact with you guys,

you know. I kn ew you was coming. yname

is

ou t

there

already. You

know

what

I m saying and I wasn t holding my tongue concerning

what

I seen.

Yeah.

It was gonna be t old. You know? Um, I wanted to go to

th e

Marines,

you

know what

I m saying, I

wanted to

become

you

know what

I m

saying and g et a chan

Do the

right thing.

I

didn t

ge t a chance t o. You

know w hat

I m saying, and

so

you know,

and

fo r me to

see this..,.it just,

just

Especially with a kid. You

know

Yes it

tears me up.

We know

what

it s like.

Good God. Now check this out. y n 1just found

ou t

he s my

nephew s friend


16/19

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laughs)

Ohhhh

....

...

and

my

sister um, came and visual yesterday

...

she

say

he s been over

to

her house several occasions, I

say ho w

was his character, she

say

he s

ver y w el l m annered. And, and i t s like people

pu t

displays of trying to

assassinate his character, like he was a

thug ...

okay, you m ight have a

visual

or

camera of him hanging

with

some individuals where

they

probably did that

...whatever they

did at Ferguson

Market

or

whatever

had you,

bu t

his parents, his grandma

...they didn t

tolerate that crap,

so

therefore

whatever

the

media

tr y to

project his character

to

be

...

Right. Yeah.

That s right.

Yeah,

that s

th e

problem

with

UI)

th e

media.

You

know.

Yeah, cause

they

want

a story. T hey need a story.

Umm hmm.

That s ho w

they

get paid, you

know what

I m saying,

bu t if

you

wanna

...pu t

something

ou t

there,

pu t it ou t th e

right way cause Karma

gonna come back and

whether

you w an t t o accept

it or

not. You gonna

be exposed.

Right.

You

know.

Yeah. Clearly

the whole

situation

is

very sad.

t

is it s a

sad ...

1mean,

other

human being.

Sa ... it has

nothing

to

do

with

color.

You know what

I m saying?

Right.

You bleed

th e

same way, you

go t

a heart, you

go t

a brain, you

know...

you

know...

I police this

...

this over here. I m like

the ...

Mr.

boonie man

...

.. 1

pu t

my b oo nie on, I

pu t

m y boots on, and

...

I t ell you that I m

concerned

about

th e

elders over here and

th e

kids over here and there

state

of

mind.

I I

perimeter, I check everything and I by myself. I m

the

same like minded individual ya

know what

I m saying. That

we

go

ou t

here

..we

make sure everybody s okay. I

don t

get in unt il

three

o clock


17/19

every morning and I make sure everybody s cool, you know

wh t

I m

saying. sighs) Um, just trying just keep doing th e right thing cause

wh t

they re

doing in West Florissant has nothing to do

with

this

community over here.

Right.

And

and um, wh t

they

doing in West Florissant, this where happened

at. t h t s tu ff t h t happened at Quick Trip and all

t he other

places, these

people coming

f rom t he

city and

t he nor th

count, south county and

just

expressing themselves

opportunities

Hurts you guys.

They looking fo r opportunities, opportunists, you know wh t I m saying

and we don t represent none

of

th t violence, you know w h t I m

saying?

Right.

Justwe trying to keep the order here.

Good. That s

ho w

it should be.

Exactly, ya

know

wh t I m sayin ? And I never seen peopl e come

together

and

there

is always a tragedy

gott

happen before people can

come

together

and wh t

we

trying to instill in

them

is consistency

fter

months and months

Well remember th t and keep going.

Exactly, exactly.

Any questions, any additional questions?

Ya

know, if we leave you with a card, and you can call.

I was waiting fo r it. I was w ai ti ng 1was waiting to see your guys badges

to o t hough. But

Oh, we can give you th t too.

Yeah.

It s so rainy no w we d on t w n t t o get everything all wet.

Exactly, right. oyou mind

if

I hol d it?


18/19

S

S

S

S

S

S

S

S

[End of Tape]

So

what

I m going

to

do with card is right the office number on the back

of it.

Okay.

And, you

I m gonna lock it in m y phone, don t worry.

laughs) Yeah,

if

you ever need anything

UI) you can call

us

Right.

You can call either number, I encourage you to call

the

number of

the

office on the back, which

is

Okay.

And obviously this is a stressful situation for everyone who s involved,

so if at some point you remember something you forgot to tell us ah, if

your perception of what took place changes, anything

of

the like there,

just don t hesitate

to

reach

out to us

Okay.

there

gonna take

your

name,

they re

gonna take

your number

and

then

we re

going to call you back.

Okay. I m, I m, I m, I m

in

the

regards

of

it

changing

i t s been

consistent. It s been

the

same. Because, I mean w hen you have a

visual. actual, seeing what actually went down

It s caught.

Yeah. And, I mean, I onl y se 1onl y seen t hi s w hen I was t welve, I seen a

guy um, a mailman take the life of a guy you know, w he n I was in

grade school or whatever.

Oh

wow

Um, he got caught you know. But, a 357 and all the kids and you

playing in the school yard and he take the life of this dude cause of

jealousy, cheating, you

know got

caught and like what?

bow

He was

running everywhere. I can remember.


19/19

mo v wilson interview-witness-42

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