ellen in the critics’ den what about those web sites? presented by: william fagal
TRANSCRIPT
Ellen in the Critics’ DenEllen in the Critics’ Den
What About Those Web Sites?What About Those Web Sites?
Presented By: William FagalPresented By: William Fagal
Criticisms are Not New
Criticisms are Not New
• Many during her lifetime
• Dudley Canright –1880s-1919
• J. H. Kellogg – early 1900s and beyond
• E. S. Ballenger –1920s and 30s
• Many during her lifetime
• Dudley Canright –1880s-1919
• J. H. Kellogg – early 1900s and beyond
• E. S. Ballenger –1920s and 30s
Web has Increased and Spread Criticisms
Web has Increased and Spread Criticisms
Web has Increased and Spread Criticisms
Web has Increased and Spread Criticisms
• Critics throw mud
• Hope that some will stick (in your mind!)
• Critics throw mud
• Hope that some will stick (in your mind!)
Types of CriticismsTypes of Criticisms
• Alleged Conflicts with Scripture
• Conduct Unbecoming a Prophet- Unethical practices
- Inconsistent teachings
- Conflict with critic’s view of inspiration
• Alleged Conflicts with Scripture
• Conduct Unbecoming a Prophet- Unethical practices
- Inconsistent teachings
- Conflict with critic’s view of inspiration
How Do We Address These Today?
How Do We Address These Today?
Helpful BooksHelpful Books
• By: F. D. Nichol• Written 50 yrs ago,
but still helpful
• By: F. D. Nichol• Written 50 yrs ago,
but still helpful
Ellen G. White and Her CriticsEllen G. White and Her Critics
Messenger of the Lord
• By: Herbert E. Douglass• New and effective
Messenger of the Lord
• By: Herbert E. Douglass• New and effective
Helpful BooksHelpful Books
Web SitesWeb Sites
• http://www.WhiteEstate.org
• http://www.Ellen-White.com
• http://www.EllenGWhite.info
• http://www.WhiteEstate.org
• http://www.Ellen-White.com
• http://www.EllenGWhite.info
www.WhiteEstate.orgwww.WhiteEstate.org
www.Ellen-White.comwww.Ellen-White.com
www.EllenGWhite.infowww.EllenGWhite.info
Public Meetingsheld by
White Estate Personnel
Public Meetingsheld by
White Estate Personnel
Mail and PhoneMail and Phone
• Ellen G. White Estate
12501 Old Columbia Pike
Silver Spring, MD 20904
• #301.680.6540
• Ellen G. White Estate
12501 Old Columbia Pike
Silver Spring, MD 20904
• #301.680.6540
Let’s Take a Look at Some Issues
Let’s Take a Look at Some Issues
1. Contradicts Scripture?1. Contradicts Scripture?
EGW: YES “This system was corrupted before the flood by those who separated themselves from the faithful followers of God, and engaged in the building of the tower of Babel” (Spiritual Gifts, vol. 3, p. 301).
BIBLE: NO “After the Flood ... they said, ‘Come, let us build ourselves a city, with a tower that reaches to the heavens, so that we may make a name for ourselves and not be scattered over the face of the whole earth’” (Genesis 9:28 and 11:4).
www.Ellen-White.com
EGW: YES “This system was corrupted before the flood by those who separated themselves from the faithful followers of God, and engaged in the building of the tower of Babel” (Spiritual Gifts, vol. 3, p. 301).
BIBLE: NO “After the Flood ... they said, ‘Come, let us build ourselves a city, with a tower that reaches to the heavens, so that we may make a name for ourselves and not be scattered over the face of the whole earth’” (Genesis 9:28 and 11:4).
www.Ellen-White.com
7. WAS THE TOWER OF BABEL BUILT BEFORE THE FLOOD?
7. WAS THE TOWER OF BABEL BUILT BEFORE THE FLOOD?
One only needs to look in the table of contents in the book which contains the above quote (Spiritual Gifts, Vol. 3) to see whether or not Ellen White knew when the tower of Babel was built. Note the order of the following chapters of that book:
www.Ellen-White.com
One only needs to look in the table of contents in the book which contains the above quote (Spiritual Gifts, Vol. 3) to see whether or not Ellen White knew when the tower of Babel was built. Note the order of the following chapters of that book:
www.Ellen-White.com
VI. Crime Before the Flood
VII. The Flood
VIII. After the Flood
IX. Disguised Infidelity
X. Tower of Babel
XI. Abraham
www.Ellen-White.com
VI. Crime Before the Flood
VII. The Flood
VIII. After the Flood
IX. Disguised Infidelity
X. Tower of Babel
XI. Abraham
www.Ellen-White.com
Ellen White writes in the chapter entitled “Tower of Babel” these words: “Some of the descendants of Noah soon began to apostatize.... They built them a city, and then conceived the idea of building a large tower to reach into the clouds...”
www.Ellen-White.com
Ellen White writes in the chapter entitled “Tower of Babel” these words: “Some of the descendants of Noah soon began to apostatize.... They built them a city, and then conceived the idea of building a large tower to reach into the clouds...”
www.Ellen-White.com
With this clear statement, along with the order of the chapters, it seems quite apparent that Ellen White understood when the Tower of Babel was built. So why the statement that seems to indicate the Tower was built before the Flood?
www.Ellen-White.com
With this clear statement, along with the order of the chapters, it seems quite apparent that Ellen White understood when the Tower of Babel was built. So why the statement that seems to indicate the Tower was built before the Flood?
www.Ellen-White.com
The statement should have read “This system was corrupted before the flood, and by those who separated themselves from the faithful followers of God, and engaged in the building of the Tower of Babel.” It was corrected to read this way in the very next printing of the book.
www.Ellen-White.com
The statement should have read “This system was corrupted before the flood, and by those who separated themselves from the faithful followers of God, and engaged in the building of the Tower of Babel.” It was corrected to read this way in the very next printing of the book.
www.Ellen-White.com
The typo was caught by the editors long before any critic brought it up. In 1866 [July 31 issue] the editor of Review and Herald magazine explained the typo and the needed correction to his subscribers, thus clearing up the whole issue.
www.Ellen-White.com
The typo was caught by the editors long before any critic brought it up. In 1866 [July 31 issue] the editor of Review and Herald magazine explained the typo and the needed correction to his subscribers, thus clearing up the whole issue.
www.Ellen-White.com
Again, in light of all that was written about the Flood and Tower in Spiritual Gifts, no reasonable person could think that she, in one sentence, nullified the rest of the book. The chapters speak for themselves.
www.Ellen-White.com
Again, in light of all that was written about the Flood and Tower in Spiritual Gifts, no reasonable person could think that she, in one sentence, nullified the rest of the book. The chapters speak for themselves.
www.Ellen-White.com
Let’s Take a Look at Some Issues
Let’s Take a Look at Some Issues
1. Contradicts Scripture?2. Conduct Unbecoming a Prophet?
1. Contradicts Scripture?2. Conduct Unbecoming a Prophet?
Unethical PracticesUnethical Practices
• Plagiarism—Did she copy her material?– Borrowing a common 19th-century practice– Adapted material to her own purposes– Recommended the books she used– Gave method and reasons in The Great
Controversy, p. xii:
• Plagiarism—Did she copy her material?– Borrowing a common 19th-century practice– Adapted material to her own purposes– Recommended the books she used– Gave method and reasons in The Great
Controversy, p. xii:
“In some cases where a historian has so grouped together events as to afford, in brief, a comprehensive view of the subject, or has summarized details in a convenient manner, his words have been quoted;
“In some cases where a historian has so grouped together events as to afford, in brief, a comprehensive view of the subject, or has summarized details in a convenient manner, his words have been quoted;
but in some instances no specific credit has been given, since the quotations are not given for the purpose of citing that writer as authority, but because his statement affords a ready and forcible presentation of the subject.
but in some instances no specific credit has been given, since the quotations are not given for the purpose of citing that writer as authority, but because his statement affords a ready and forcible presentation of the subject.
In narrating the experience and views of those carrying forward the work of reform in our own time, similar use has been made of their published works.”
The Great Controversy, p. xii.
In narrating the experience and views of those carrying forward the work of reform in our own time, similar use has been made of their published works.”
The Great Controversy, p. xii.
• Plagiarism—Did she copy her material?• Money—Too much? Did she get wealthy
off the faithful?- Frequently borrowed money against
royalties, to help the cause
- Lived frugally, hired staff, financed printing
- Her own statement (from our Web site):
• Plagiarism—Did she copy her material?• Money—Too much? Did she get wealthy
off the faithful?- Frequently borrowed money against
royalties, to help the cause
- Lived frugally, hired staff, financed printing
- Her own statement (from our Web site):
Unethical PracticesUnethical Practices
More than once in her ministry, Ellen White was confronted by reports that she was accumulating great wealth because of her book royalties. Here is her direct response to one detractor, written in 1897 while she lived in Australia:
More than once in her ministry, Ellen White was confronted by reports that she was accumulating great wealth because of her book royalties. Here is her direct response to one detractor, written in 1897 while she lived in Australia:
Was Ellen White a Millionaire?
Was Ellen White a Millionaire?
“You have made reports in reference to me being rich. How did you know I was? For about ten years I have been working on borrowed property. Should I sell all that I have in my possession, I would not have sufficient to pay my outstanding debts.
“Where have I invested this money? You well know where. I have been the bank from which to draw to carry forward the work in this country. . . .
“You have made reports in reference to me being rich. How did you know I was? For about ten years I have been working on borrowed property. Should I sell all that I have in my possession, I would not have sufficient to pay my outstanding debts.
“Where have I invested this money? You well know where. I have been the bank from which to draw to carry forward the work in this country. . . .
“I see debts on our meetinghouses and it hurts my soul. I cannot but feel distress over the matter. I have invested money in the Parramatta church, in the Prospect church, in the Napier church, in the Ormondville church, in the Gisborne church, and in the education of students. I have sent persons to America that they might be fitted to return and do work in this country. If this is the way to become rich, I think it would be well for others to try it.
“I see debts on our meetinghouses and it hurts my soul. I cannot but feel distress over the matter. I have invested money in the Parramatta church, in the Prospect church, in the Napier church, in the Ormondville church, in the Gisborne church, and in the education of students. I have sent persons to America that they might be fitted to return and do work in this country. If this is the way to become rich, I think it would be well for others to try it.
“All the royalty on my foreign books sold in America is sacredly dedicated to God for the education of students, that they may be fitted for the ministry. Thousands of dollars have been thus expended. Is this the way to accumulate money? The old story that Canright and others have circulated, that I was worth thirty thousand dollars, all fiction. It has increased to thirty thousand pounds, by report, since I came to Australia.
“All the royalty on my foreign books sold in America is sacredly dedicated to God for the education of students, that they may be fitted for the ministry. Thousands of dollars have been thus expended. Is this the way to accumulate money? The old story that Canright and others have circulated, that I was worth thirty thousand dollars, all fiction. It has increased to thirty thousand pounds, by report, since I came to Australia.
“I do not know where it is. I am using up my means, just as fast as it comes in, to carry forward the work in this country. If I had thirty thousand pounds, I would not have sent to Africa for the loan of one thousand pounds on which I am paying interest. If I could, I would get a loan of another thousand pounds, so that we might be able to put up the main school building.
“I do not know where it is. I am using up my means, just as fast as it comes in, to carry forward the work in this country. If I had thirty thousand pounds, I would not have sent to Africa for the loan of one thousand pounds on which I am paying interest. If I could, I would get a loan of another thousand pounds, so that we might be able to put up the main school building.
“I have not thirty thousand pounds. I only wish I had a million dollars. I would do as I did in Sydney. I would put men in the field to labor, defraying their expenses from my own funds. We need one hundred men where we now have one in the field.”
(Letter 98a, 1897)
“I have not thirty thousand pounds. I only wish I had a million dollars. I would do as I did in Sydney. I would put men in the field to labor, defraying their expenses from my own funds. We need one hundred men where we now have one in the field.”
(Letter 98a, 1897)
Inconsistent PracticesInconsistent Practices
• Money—Too Little?– Warned against debt, but died in debt– Reason: not lifestyle, but Lord– Debts paid in time from her royalties– See discussion on our Web site
• Money—Too Little?– Warned against debt, but died in debt– Reason: not lifestyle, but Lord– Debts paid in time from her royalties– See discussion on our Web site
Inconsistent PracticesInconsistent Practices
• Money—Too Little?
• Pork—Inconsistent Stand?– Canright charged he had eaten it in her
home—but likely was in 1850s.– 1858, she opposed S. N. Haskell for
pushing the pork question:
• Money—Too Little?
• Pork—Inconsistent Stand?– Canright charged he had eaten it in her
home—but likely was in 1850s.– 1858, she opposed S. N. Haskell for
pushing the pork question:
“I saw that your views concerning swine’s flesh would prove no injury if you have them to yourselves; but in your judgment and opinion you have made this question a test, and your actions have plainly shown your faith in this matter. If God requires His people to abstain from swine’s flesh, He will convict them on the matter.
1T 206-207
“I saw that your views concerning swine’s flesh would prove no injury if you have them to yourselves; but in your judgment and opinion you have made this question a test, and your actions have plainly shown your faith in this matter. If God requires His people to abstain from swine’s flesh, He will convict them on the matter.
1T 206-207
“He is just as willing to show His honest children their duty, as to show their duty to individuals upon whom He has not laid the burden of His work. If it is the duty of the church to abstain from swine’s flesh, God will discover it to more than two or three. He will teach His church their duty.”
Testimonies for the Church, 1:206-207
“He is just as willing to show His honest children their duty, as to show their duty to individuals upon whom He has not laid the burden of His work. If it is the duty of the church to abstain from swine’s flesh, God will discover it to more than two or three. He will teach His church their duty.”
Testimonies for the Church, 1:206-207
James White:
“This remarkable testimony was written October 21, 1858, nearly five years before the great vision of 1863, in which the light upon health reform was given. When the right time came, the subject was given in a manner to move all our people. How wonderful are the wisdom and goodness of God! It might be as wrong to crowd the milk, salt, and sugar question now, as the pork question in 1858.”
J.W., note to second edition of the Testimonies, 1T 206
James White:
“This remarkable testimony was written October 21, 1858, nearly five years before the great vision of 1863, in which the light upon health reform was given. When the right time came, the subject was given in a manner to move all our people. How wonderful are the wisdom and goodness of God! It might be as wrong to crowd the milk, salt, and sugar question now, as the pork question in 1858.”
J.W., note to second edition of the Testimonies, 1T 206
Incompatible with Inspiration
Incompatible with Inspiration
• Used non-inspired sources– But so did Scripture– Paul quotes Greek authors
(Acts 17:28; Titus 1:12)– Inspired writers may make their points
this way– Originality is not a test of inspiration
• Used non-inspired sources– But so did Scripture– Paul quotes Greek authors
(Acts 17:28; Titus 1:12)– Inspired writers may make their points
this way– Originality is not a test of inspiration
Incompatible with Inspiration
Incompatible with Inspiration
• Used non-inspired sources
• Vision gave “wrong information”– 1846 vision of other planets, including
numbers of moons around them– Described, and Joseph Bates identified– Planets have more moons than she said– But what planets were they?
• Used non-inspired sources
• Vision gave “wrong information”– 1846 vision of other planets, including
numbers of moons around them– Described, and Joseph Bates identified– Planets have more moons than she said– But what planets were they?
Incompatible with Inspiration
Incompatible with Inspiration
• Used non-inspired sources
• Vision gave “wrong information”
• Uttered nonsense: amalgamation– Crossing of man and beast?– Statement rules it out!
• Used non-inspired sources
• Vision gave “wrong information”
• Uttered nonsense: amalgamation– Crossing of man and beast?– Statement rules it out!
“Every species of animals which God had created was preserved in the ark. The confused species which God did not create, which were the result of amalgamation, were destroyed by the flood. Since the flood, there has been amalgamation of man and beast, as may be seen in the almost endless varieties of species of animals, and in certain races of men.”
The Spirit of Prophecy, 1:78
“Every species of animals which God had created was preserved in the ark. The confused species which God did not create, which were the result of amalgamation, were destroyed by the flood. Since the flood, there has been amalgamation of man and beast, as may be seen in the almost endless varieties of species of animals, and in certain races of men.”
The Spirit of Prophecy, 1:78
Incompatible with Inspiration
Incompatible with Inspiration
• Used non-inspired sources
• Vision gave “wrong information”
• Uttered nonsense: amalgamation
• Predictions did not come true– 1856 Vision: Some there would be alive
to see Jesus come?
• Used non-inspired sources
• Vision gave “wrong information”
• Uttered nonsense: amalgamation
• Predictions did not come true– 1856 Vision: Some there would be alive
to see Jesus come?
1856 Vision:1856 Vision:
I was shown the company present at the Conference. Said the angel: “Some food for worms, some subjects of the seven last plagues, some will be alive and remain upon the earth to be translated at the coming of Jesus.”
Testimonies for the Church, vol. 1, pp. 131, 132
I was shown the company present at the Conference. Said the angel: “Some food for worms, some subjects of the seven last plagues, some will be alive and remain upon the earth to be translated at the coming of Jesus.”
Testimonies for the Church, vol. 1, pp. 131, 132
Cause for Delay?Cause for Delay? “Had Adventists, after the great disappointment in 1844, held fast their faith, and followed on unitedly in the opening providence of God, receiving the message of the third angel and in the power of the Holy Spirit proclaiming it to the world, they would have seen the salvation of God, the Lord would have wrought mightily with their efforts, the work would have been completed, and Christ would have come ere this to receive His people to their reward.”
Selected Messages, book 1, pp. 67-69
“Had Adventists, after the great disappointment in 1844, held fast their faith, and followed on unitedly in the opening providence of God, receiving the message of the third angel and in the power of the Holy Spirit proclaiming it to the world, they would have seen the salvation of God, the Lord would have wrought mightily with their efforts, the work would have been completed, and Christ would have come ere this to receive His people to their reward.”
Selected Messages, book 1, pp. 67-69
How shall we face the challenges?
How shall we face the challenges?
• Watch for unfair representations– What does the evidence actually say?– Are things left out?
• Watch for unfair representations– What does the evidence actually say?– Are things left out?
How shall we face the challenges?
How shall we face the challenges?
• Watch for unfair representations
• Identify the assumptions– View of Inspiration?– Meaning of words?
• Watch for unfair representations
• Identify the assumptions– View of Inspiration?– Meaning of words?
How shall we face the challenges?
How shall we face the challenges?
• Watch for unfair representations
• Identify the assumptions
• Find the literary context and historical setting– Read around the passage– Learn what you can about historical
setting
• Watch for unfair representations
• Identify the assumptions
• Find the literary context and historical setting– Read around the passage– Learn what you can about historical
setting
How shall we face the challenges?
How shall we face the challenges?
• Watch for unfair representations
• Identify the assumptions
• Find the literary context and historical setting
• Get the big picture– More from EGW on the subject?– How does it all fit together?– What are the principles?
• Watch for unfair representations
• Identify the assumptions
• Find the literary context and historical setting
• Get the big picture– More from EGW on the subject?– How does it all fit together?– What are the principles?
How shall we face the challenges?
How shall we face the challenges?
• Watch for unfair representations
• Identify the assumptions
• Find the literary context and historical setting
• Get the big picture
• Ask for help if you need it– Pastors, teachers, White Estate
• Watch for unfair representations
• Identify the assumptions
• Find the literary context and historical setting
• Get the big picture
• Ask for help if you need it– Pastors, teachers, White Estate
Today, Ellen is in the Critics’ Den
Today, Ellen is in the Critics’ Den
• But like Daniel in the lions’ den, she is not there alone.
• And all the critics have not devoured her!
• Her works still stand, and still bless.
• But like Daniel in the lions’ den, she is not there alone.
• And all the critics have not devoured her!
• Her works still stand, and still bless.