robbo d

I sold my K1 and D FA70-200 because AF was still unacceptable for paid work ..... nonetheless the k1 and this new lens offer staggeringly good IQ for those that seek such mind blowing quality.Pixel shift even with an old plastic FA j wide zoom was insane.In another time I hope they improve their short comings because some of this new glass is incredible.The 50-135 crop lens seemed soft when you first look but in fact it was rendering so much detail that it was almost embarrassing. Pity it had the AF and motor reliability of a pig.....ReplyLike4 weeks agopermalinkReportRachskis801Rachskis801

Interesting that you say this. I shoot on 2 k1 bodies and a ton of glass but my money maker is the 70-200. The K1 FAILS miserably with FPS and auto tracking/focusing. Other than that, it is almost perfect. I keep thinking that I’m going to have to buy into another system but I have invested SO much money into Pentax and I’ll never get close to what I have into it. I just sold my K3 for $340 dollars! Ugh. Anyways, I have, what you might call a “taco fund” for certain things such as new lenses and I have specifically been stashing cash for an 85mm for at least 7 years!!! Now, it here and I’m torn. If I purchase, I’m never going back. I think if NikonD850 had IBIS I would have pulled the trigger a couple of years ago BUT, here I am still waiting it out. So then, I read this blip from Pentax and I see “ Anticipating the further advancement of SLR camera bodies in the future” and I’m wondering...are they coming out with a faster full frame In a few years?!!Like4 weeks agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

They wouldn't release lenses like the D FA* 85mm f/1.4 if they didn't plan FF cameras. Lenses are longer term products.And a new FF would necessarily be faster; the K-1's fps is limited by its sensor readout rate (automatically solved by using a newer/current sensor), the processor should be updated, and the AF should be new as well.But, what exactly and when... I have no clue. Perhaps the new APS-C will give us a hint about "what".Like4 weeks agopermalinkffking

My pig has great AFLike4 weeks agopermalink

Pentax was smart by scaling production to match today’s smaller camera market, which has allowed them to not waste money on unwanted bodies and to focus on producing great lenses

like the 85mm.ReplyLike4 weeks ago*permalinkphoenix15phoenix15

Pentax is slow, but surely is on track. They dont have fastest AF, but their features cant be underestimated. IBIS, pixelshift, and great IQ are the most desired for the landscape and portrait photographers. The other brands are moving to mirrorless for video and AF capability, like Sony, Nikon, and Canon. But I dont think DSLR will obsolete anytime soon. The trend people will keep mirrorless, and DSLR from different brands. Pentax has the chance if they release outstanding lens like this.ReplyLike4 weeks agopermalinkBRWAT

Their approach of slowing production, producing fewer models and focusing on the lenses is likely the best approach.

Canon and Nikon's push for mirrorless isn't something that can be stopped now. They've invested too much marketing and they can't afford to lose face.

IMHO, Pentax is likely developing an cost effective implementation of their hybrid viewfinder technology, which will effectively bridge mirror-less and DSLR technologies. When that happens I'll buy into Pentax...Like4 weeks agopermalinksilversalts

You can’t shame me into trading Pentax for CaNiSony, or any EVF for that matter.

I ain't gonna work on Maggie's farm no more.No, I ain't gonna work on Maggie's farm no more.Well, I try my bestTo be just like I amBut everybody wants youTo be just like them.They sing while you slave and I just get bored.I ain't gonna work on Maggie's farm no more.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkHowaboutRAW

inside the museums, infinity goes up on trial.

Like4 weeks agopermalinkteiki arii

The best STAR D-FA Pentax lens built to date for all generations as of today? With its bi-concave front lens, this lens enters the very closed circle of lenses with exceptional formulas such as the Zeiss Otus at 4,000€. Except that it is autofocus and takes advantage of the ISIS / SR of Pentax DSLR OVF cameras. It is a monster in every sense of the term where priority is given to quality versus maneuverability, like many optics released in recent years. In fact, the lens is heavy, bulky, and its setting point is probably not as pleasant as with a Leica-R optic I own…Whatever tests come, apart from lens centering defects, the probability that it will be exceptional leaves little room for doubt. Especially since the K-1, despite a 36Mp Sony sensor (derived from the Sony A7R) "dated" for several years, but in Pentax sauce, remains in my eyes the best of FF OVF / EVF format until day with interchangeable lenses…ReplyLike1 month ago*permalinkteiki arii

Just for that, both for the qualities of the body and the lens combined, the couple deserves to be in the bag of any photographer who seeks perfection, whatever brand he is a fan of…In truth, I don't see any FF system capable of competing when the needs are very specific with the Pentax K-1 / HD PENTAX-D FA★85mmF1.4ED SDM AW couple. They justify their purchase alone.Like1 month agopermalinkstarbase218

ISIS? Didn’t know there was a terrorist in the camera. Makes me wonder what will happen when you shoot anything with it.Like1 month agopermalinkteiki arii

IBIS...Like4 weeks agopermalinkIgor Sotelo

Pentax lost time with their 77mm 1.8, 43mm 1.9 and 31mm 1.8 limited lenses. They should have introduced a 135mm 1.8, 85mm 1.4, 50mm 1.4 and 28mm 1.4 top quality lenses.

I have switched to mainstream DSLR brands.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkffking

well, there was a big gap between the FA Ltds and the K-1, and they had no reason to make FF

lenses in that 15 + (depending on which FA Ltd) years - they're catching up now though, and I don't think that it'sthe Ltds that are slowing them down

Isn't choice great, though :)Like1 month ago*permalinkAlex Sarbu

Switching to mainstream DSLRs brands... somewhat reminds me of people switching to Samsung's NX ;-)Like1 month agopermalinkRachskis801Rachskis801

Hoping a 135 is in their future! My favorite length.Like4 weeks agopermalinkIgor Sotelo

I switched to Canon and Nikon. Used a Pentax MX for 30 years with a 35mm 2.8, 50mm 1.4 and 135mm 2.5 lenses. Went with Pentax *ist DL, but for some reasons it was near impossible to make good photos with that camera, it was also barely compatible with my lenses.

I remember scratching my head when saw the 77mm 1.8 was more expensive than the older 85mm 1.4.

Today with a 5Ds and several L lenses, the magic has returned. Even my Df with the mainstream 50mm 1.4G takes phenomenal pictures.Like4 weeks agopermalinkClass AClass A

Ten full-resolution sample images are available from http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/lens/k/telephoto/hdpentax-dfa-85/.ReplyLike1 month ago*permalinkzakariazakaria

@hickerdocYou are right about that. I was supposed to be more specific and have more confidence in what I said. But it may be because of my sensation of an unwarranted attack on everything Pentax produces.ReplyLike

1 month agopermalinkUSN SquidUSN Squid

377 comments already and this lens isn't even available to buy, let alone shoot with.

Bet: none of the commenters here has taken a single shot with this lens. But you already know everything there is to know about it.

Summary: either it sucks/it's horrible or it's amazing/the best lens ever made.

What are you going to do when it becomes available? Move on to the next lens pre-announcement?ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkffking

Well, there are sample photos available as well as MTF charts but yes, it's better to have personal experience - oddly enough particularly with Pentax, who stress that they don't makes lenses with the purpse of performing well simply in lens test charts but more in a particular rendering that users appreciate.Like1 month ago*permalinkpentaust

What are you going to do when the lens becomes available?Like most people spending lots of time in online forums: 1) not buy the lens, 2) go online to bash another soon to be released lens or camera. I bet most of the most talented photographers don't spend their time in useless online drama. Well not so useless, actually the vast majority of online content is aimed at selling stuff, very sterile regarding building up professional know-how. Most comments online show lack of practical experience, people want stuff, criticism stuff within the realm of commonly popularized thought, but they actually have no idea why. Online "education" by marketing content is the best way to actually never learn anything grounded in reality and remain beginner. Review site and gear brands don't want users to develop practical proficiency, better keep people soaking into virtual, as it help selling more equipment that actually get very little use.Like1 month agopermalinkffking

^^ :))Like1 month agopermalinkkai liu

$1899? Canon 85mm f1.4 is $1499 now. We pay more for a less popular brand? Should it be the opposite? Less popular brand should charge less for their gears to attract more customrer?

ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkpentaust

If the less popular brand drop their price they become popular again, so they have to raise their price to match the increased popularity that occurs after dropping price. Your idea doesn't seem to work, or only works on black Fridays.Like1 month ago*permalinkpentaust

Chinese brand Zhongyi Mitakon 85 f2 is only about $100, not so popular despite the low price. Should be world most popular 85mm prime lens according to price.Like1 month agopermalinkkobian

Probably because Canon is popular you pay this amount on its lens, if it wasn't popular this lens would cost 40 percent lessLike1 month agopermalinkffking

Yes - it's quite possible, though I have no proof either way, that Canon are making a higher % profit on their lens through economies of scale and less of the expensive ED glass. The price at which something is initially sold has to represent, amongst other things, the cost of production -but in the end the Canon is for Canon shooters and the Pentax is for Pentax shooters.Like1 month agopermalinkzakariazakaria

But this pentax lens is much better than canon 85mm regarding the build quality. It is solid AW weather sealed and better coated.Like1 month agopermalinkhikerdoc

@zakaria, Canon users who have had vast experience with the weather resistance in all conditions with their 85 may not agree with your claim of much better resistance in this yet to be released lens. Also,please provide more specifics on the better coatings used on this lens. Superior coating claims appear in marketing literature from every major lens producer and then describe essentially the same thing with fancy charts with squiggly lines and arrows. The DF-A* site discusses the Ricoh versions of these HD, multicoat, nanotechnology, fluorine coatings used on high end lenses. However, you will specifically note on the special site development story for this lens that they did not include AeroBrite II coating relying more on lens construction (including that concave front end) as they sought to achieve the “amazing performance” seen by the other high

end 85mm lenses they viewed as “benchmarks”.Like1 month agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

I'm not sure if the Pentax is better built than the Canon - Canon is no slouch with their top lenses (I've been impressed with some Lens Rentals disassembly articles); as for the coatings, I cannot say if Pentax' HD is better than Canon's ASC, but I fully expect the D FA* to be significantly more resilient to flare (which is a weak point for the Canon).Also, I expect the D FA* to be better optically.Like4 weeks agopermalinkBRWAT

Read up on their technology. Pentax will be implementing hybrid viewfinders so that lens will be able to be used on a K1 MKX 20 years long after Canon's DSLRs are gone.Like4 weeks agopermalinksilversalts

Uhmmmmmm — Leica?Like6 days agopermalinkpentaust

Pentax will be doing what?Like4 days agopermalinkjacksprajackspra

Leaving aside the taste for slr or mirrorless or all the different formats,Pentax seems to stay with any other manufacturer when it comes to the quality of shots.ReplyLike1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

Does nobody want to talk about the MTF charts for this lens? Stupendous comes to mind or draw dropping would be another.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkegk4260

Looking at the MTF graphs Zeiss and Sigma have been giving Sony, Canon, and Nikon users an 85mm with MTF wide open in the 90-95% range out to beyond 15mm. Now Pentax users can have

that same level of optical performance. It appears those interested in bragging rights will be putting their hopes on measurements in the far corners. The photographers will be interested in a tremendous lens.Like1 month agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

Before the D FA* primes: "Pentax lenses aren't as sharp as the competition's, look at those MTF graphs!"After the D FA* primes: "Photographers aren't interested in MTF graphs".Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

I give up. Optically corrected like the Zeiss but not the others.Like1 month agopermalinkTheRealYeats

MTF charts are boring. I shoot Pentax (primarily) because I enjoy the experience and am pleased with the quality of the images.Like1 month agopermalinkHeliar

I'm not a MTF chars guy either. Pixel peeping is a fetish I'm not into.

My fetish is bokeh. And this lens has some really good one.Like1 month agopermalinkegk4260

No need to give up. There is not a competition. You suggested looking at the MTF charts, which I did, and noted three almost identical theoretically derived straight lines in the 95% range out essentially to the edges. Of course they all use slightly different scales on their graphs and bury it in marketing hyperbole. Since none of these options are really interchangeable between CNS and Ricoh Pentax systems one can just be thrilled to have a lens of this caliber for whatever their system choice. If this lens can resolve 1554 line pairs in the corner on a K1 it is totally irrelevant to the owner of a A7mk4. If a Zeiss Otus does 1451 line pairs in the corner on a D850 it is totally irrelevant to the owner of a K1. (random made up numbers). I hope you are able to purchase and enjoy your lens. I will need to enjoy someone else's images this round.Like1 month agopermalinktinetztinetz

Now, isn't producing an own brand high class lens, that might come just close to the Zeiss Otus something to celebrate?

I mean, for the money of the manual focussing Zeiss lens you can get an AF-lens and have enough left to buy a K-1... ;)Like1 month agopermalinkzakariazakaria

Pentax is always concentrate on color rendering and bokeh.And this is what iam considering when I buy a lens. I never think of the sharpness .Like1 month agopermalinkphoenix15phoenix15

MRSP: 1900 USD price in US, and 280,000 Yen in Japan. I dont know why it is so much expensive in Japan. Almost 80,000 Yen more. But I just checked market price only 248,000 Yen.ReplyLike1 month ago*permalinkLees Channel

In Japan the price is tax inclusive, that may be part of the reason.Like1 month ago*permalinkPanachromic

Everytime i see one of these pentax announcements a part of me wants to sell the Nikon gear and go back to pentax. Using their cameras is a joy like no other. I switched from a k20d to a D700 11 years ago, the AF and the image quality were the pluses. Everything else was better in the pentax on my opinión. Still miss the pentax sometimes.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkpentaust

Looks like top notch 85mm prime lens. Although, from customer standpoints, it is hard to see how it comes as a camera system. There is a D-FA*50mm of this class. But, are there any wide angle lens such as D-FA*24mm, D-FA*35mm, D-FA*135mm for prime quality? Is there a Pentax full frame camera body designed to match the quality out of the high quality D-FA* optics? How many years should customers wait to be able to compose that camera+primes system? Should we just buy that 85mm lens and wait for two, three, four years hoping that some days there will be a D-FA*35mm and a D-FA*24 available, and by the time lenses will be, what will Pentax camera be compared to camera technology of other brands? It's not clear how to compose a high end Pentax system within less that two years time frame. On the other hand, a full range of primes is available for Sony and Nikon, so why buy Pentax out of hope? Engaging money in Pentax mount is full of uncertainty.ReplyLike

1 month ago*permalinkClass AClass A

Why buy Pentax?

They still make cameras with optical viewfinders which many prefer over EVFs.

Ergonomically, Pentax cameras are excellent and they have a ton of features that one either doesn't get anywhere else (IBIS + OVF, astrotracer, great PixelShift implementation, etc.) or pays a *lot* more for (weather-sealing, etc.).

Regarding uncertainty, I wouldn't bet on Canon or Nikon to do much for their DSLR line anymore, now that they need to make their MILC technology a success, after all the investments they had to make. Pentax just announced three high-end products; it seems right now is not the time to worry about them not continuing.Unlike1 month ago*permalinkClass AClass A

Regarding the lenses, the range from 15-200mm is covered with modern f/2.8 zooms. Great primes of any focal length are available if one is happy to tap into the used market as well. With respect to modern primes, there are the excellent 50/1.4 and 85/1.4, a 21mm Limited lens has already been shown as a prototype, and apparently a D-FA* 24 will be next.

The Pentax system doesn't beat others for breadth (in FF, for APS-C it's a different matter) but for some photographers it is simply, already even without further lenses, the best choice.Like1 month ago*permalinkpentaust

a 21mm Limited lens has already been shown as a prototype, and apparently a D-FA* 24 will be next.

Not so fast.1) The 85mm is not on the shelves2) The 21 has been mentioned (like the 85 was mentioned in 2017... we're 3 years later)3) 24mm and 35mm are not even in the pipeline.

Releasing one lens every two to three years is okay for people who buy lenses out of lust or as collector (just for the pleasure to buy a new lens, own it and be excited to use it as a new toy) as opposed to buying a system on photographic purpose. If you buy a camera system based on photographic needs, it's very difficult or even impossible to tailor a Pentax system to photographic needs unless waiting a decade and then realize that half of that system is obsolete. Given a photographic purpose, you can select the bodies and lenses needed from Canon, Nikon, Sony and Fuji. This difference makes Pentax a good choice for gear collectors, but not so much a good choice from a purely photographic purpose.

Like1 month ago*permalinkClass AClass A

@pentaust

This difference makes Pentax a good choice for gear collectors, but not so much a good choice from a purely photographic purpose.

Good grief, really?

Are you trying to convince me that my Pentax equipment is not serving my photographic needs and wants? If you do, it's not working because real life trumps preposterous opinions on the internet.

Time to give up on the idea that one can conduct a reasonable conversation with you.Like1 month agopermalinkdavid_sladek

@pentaust seriously? collectors? people love taking pictures with Pentax cameras, you need to open your eyes and get out of the bubbleLike1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

There is another on the way in 2022, after the 21 Limited drops. Don't know yet if its a 24mm or 35mm.@Pentust, c'mon seriously, are you suggesting that you need to go out, buy a body and a bagful of lens at the same time to do photography?Like1 month ago*permalinkAlex Sarbu

So... only on FF, we have it covered from 15mm to 450 *continuously* - with perfectly good lenses, that is (as Class A said, 15 to 200 with f/2.8 zooms). And an extra 560mm with a prime.There are 18 lenses in total, only the current line.I don't know what a "purely photographic purpose" is, but it has nothing to do with photography.Like1 month ago*permalinktinetztinetz

seriously? Have you compared the image quality of the 36 Mp sensor of the K-1(II)? Have you realised that new sensors offer no discernible improvement in IQ for stills but are more trimmed towards video and the necessities of mirrorless cameras e.g. by sacrificing some pixels to allow on sensor AF?

Your scenario is a strawman, the coverage of focal lengths by Pentax DFA is from 15mm to 560. State of the art fast primes are constantly updated to even better diversify the portfolio.Why do you assume that someone looking for a system will go for a full setup with a FF camera, a fast 85, 50 and 28 prime for all together more than 10k cash? People are cleverer than you might think if your strange patronising post gives any indication of that. They might have checked their focus first and then had a look if the system offers it.Like1 month agopermalinktinetztinetz

If a fast 24mm is your need now you are clever to go where you can get that. If you like stills photography with high resolution pixel shift and phantastic modern lenses in 50 and 85 mm you might rejoice by this new offer from a manufacturer that has been catering a crowd of image quality affine professionals and hobbyists with also a 645 and 6x7 system for decades.I really don't know why the addition of yet another high performance lens to the market to choose from seems to make some people so very uncomfortable.Like1 month agopermalinkdrummercam

A high quality Pentax 24mm will not be forthcoming after the 21Ltd., which won't be 3 or 4 years but 2021. I'm not sure why anyone wants to quibble about 3mm wider. Thinking in the old "standard" focal lengths is simply not necessary. The 21 fills their lens road map for an ultrawide prime and I'm sure it will be stellar.Like1 month agopermalinkpatarok

What is the SPRSPCL task, you can't do with K-1 and available lenses?Y' implicitly say, other sys are optically perfect,Pentax isn't and had no quality til now, offers no body that offers results with undoubtable IQ??Go and tell it to the marinesl! K-1 DR is unbeatable.Even the old PENTAX A* 85mm 1.4 optically beats Canons new 85mm 1.2 II L-lens.The PENTAXs sharpn. across the whole frame is unbeatable already wide open.Nikons super-CA-corrected 58mm can NOT keep up withPentax's DFA 50mm 1.4 microcontrasts.

Somebody asks me to shoot food photos for a mag or site, I'll do that with an FA 50mm 1.4 because the CAs in the soft areas are PURE fairy dust.But I can have perfect also, so what?Fear, there wont be a successor to K-1? Actually not.Do cams mandatorily have to outresolve their lenses? No.You see the crispness on 36MP nonetheless.I can print up to billboard-size.

I mean sure, you can have it a bit crispier, but dont blame us you cant afford a whole LEICA-SL lineUp.

Unlike1 month agopermalinkBNapa

I don't know about you guys but I have made money with my Pentax cameras. As in my clients paid me to produce high quality images for them.

I started with a K5IIs, then a K3 and now with a K1. I got paid, handsomely, sometimes! And no one ever asked me what system or camera I was using. We made poster size 3'x8' or bigger images from the K5IIs files for trade show use! How is that for is it good enough for serious work. It helps that I had the FA Limited trio in front of all these various Pentax bodies.

So there you have it. So much for a system that is not good or pro enough.Unlike1 month agopermalinkPortion Control

I could imagine the day when Canon and Nikon will be making only mirrorless cameras and Pentax will own the space as a boutique DSLR brand. Kind of how Leica is with rangefinders, only Pentax will never have the cachet to be so exorbitantly priced. They’re already just the little side project for the big printer company, so hopefully as long as a small hardcore group of users keep buying their...moderately overpriced... new products, Pentax will continue to get support from Ricoh.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkegk4260

Who knows what the future holds. For now it seems Ricoh percentage share of DSLR market remains stable around 3% in Japan, but with dramatically decreased volume for all comers. Demographics will come into play as the typical base ages. They need to begin attracting new users and users of other systems. New users from any system is a constantly declining denominator. What really matters is what new tech they have to offer if, as you suggest, Canon/Nikon begin to disappear from DSLR stage as their just released DSLR offerings age. All the current announcements will be old news by then. Remember the D500, hot for a time, but now really old news in less than 5 years. This new 85 and K new are great news for a subset of current users, but it is the pipeline a couple years down the road that matters in your scenario.Like1 month agopermalinkffking

@egk4260

You know that's what saddens me - Pentax have fallen from being a top brand to a tiny also ran who still make graet kit, but a lot of people seem to want to drive them under. Nobody who cares about photograhy would want to see any of the histric brands disappear - they've all contributed so much to where we are now and still have a unique offering to give.Like1 month agopermalinkClass A

Class A

Moderately overpriced?

Have you held a Pentax camera?The value for money for these gems is through the roof.

Are you keeping up with what Sony, Canon, and Nikon are charging for their FF cameras?

What if the new Pentax HD D-FA* 85/1.4 will rival the Zeiss Otus 85/1.4 for less than half the price but with AF?

Have you seen the beautiful, all-metal and super compact Limited lenses? They are not cheap but you cannot get anything like that anywhere else.

Yes, Pentax is no longer the bottom bargain brand it once aspired to be, but especially their cameras are anything but overpriced.Like1 month agopermalinkLeandros S

@Portion Control: Ricoh has basically publicly stated this as their goal - to be the last fully committed DSLR company standing.Like1 month agopermalinkTheRealYeats

@Class_A - "Have you seen the beautiful, all-metal and super compact Limited lenses? They are not cheap but you cannot get anything like that anywhere else. "

Fujifilm. They have several tiny well-made primes, some of which are even WR. Not quite as jewel-like as the Pentax Limiteds, but the WR easily makes up for that.Like1 month agopermalinkpentaust

@ClassA: 2020 glass technology on 10 year old K1 camera tech. K1: all AF points crammed in the center of the frame, poor AF tracking, poor live view AF not even covering 100% of the frame, slow frame rate, slow UHS-I SD card writing speeds when every other brand used at least UHS-II and faster card technologies, 36Mpixels when all other brands are at 42, 45, 47, 50 and 60Mpixels. K1 has good ergonomics, but inner guts are 10 years old tech. K1 = D800 tech sold as new 10 years later. Of course whenever Ricoh released a decent K1 upgrade, that high end glass will shine, but now there is Pentax FF body tech to align with a $2000 prime lens. Time to open eyes ClassA.

@TheRealYeats: are Fuji well made primes full frame?Like1 month ago*permalinkClass A

Class A

@pentaust

This may come as a shock to you but I don't need improvements to any of the limitations you have listed.

I don't shoot action so all the speed-related aspects don't affect me.

The difference between 42MP and 36MP is 8% resolution. Not significant, in other words. 36MP are plenty anyhow.

In a spec. contest, the K-1 will lose against other cameras in some columns, but if one does not depend on the respective areas then the K-1 is a truly remarkable camera. I wouldn't want to swap it against any of the super modern FF cameras. I'm serious.Like1 month agopermalinkpentaust

@classA, the problem is you are not the market. Sometimes, customers are confused, they assume they are the whole market, or market segment.Like1 month agopermalinkClass AClass A

@pentaust

No single person is the market.

With respect to Pentax, I'm a member of their target market.

You don't seem to be and that's OK.

I hope you are happy for individuals to make decisions that work for them, rather than aligning to some "majority market".Like1 month agopermalinkTheRealYeats

@pentaust - Of course the Fuji primes are not FF, since Fuji doesn't make FF. Pentax DA Ltd are not "full frame" either, although a couple come close.Like1 month agopermalinkLeandros S

@pentaust: The point about AF points in the centre applies to other major full frame cameras like D810, D750, 6D/II.

The D850 improves on it slightly, but it's in a different price range. The 5D III/IV are marginally better as well, but overall, the spread of dedicated (off-sensor, nontransparent mirror OVF) PDAF focus points is a design limitation of DSLRs. The difference between the K-1 series and any other DSLR in this respect is marginal, but do an image search for "[camera name] focus points" and see for yourself. There is a myth about the K-1 being much worse than other cameras, propagated by people who apparently had never bothered to check the spread of focus points on other cameras before the K-1. The outermost 1/3 to 1/5 of the frame is not populated with conventional PDAF points on a DSLR. Mirrorless camera, different story, but you pay a price in other departments for that.Unlike1 month agopermalinkSylverphoto

Honk of glass. Too expensive since this is Zeiss Milvus Territory.It is half price of the Otus. I am not saying its bad but this aint work.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts Also, this ain't work in particular for Pentax. Their bodies' AF is not there yet, it will be just too bad for such a shallow DoF application. Too much hit&miss.Like1 month agopermalinkdavid_sladek

@dpthoughtshave you every used the D-FA* 50/1.4?Like1 month agopermalinkpatarok

You are generalizing things or confusing AF.C(in which admittedly Pentax lags a bit behind) with AF.SAnd AF.S already IS there on K-1...I guess you'll have to try the 85mil with a K-1 before you really know.

Talking for myself, I know how fast the HD DFA* 50mm 1.4 lens focusses and that aint slow, nor does it miss my friend.and BTW:If you dont know what you are doing, you will always be missing shots...with every camera/lens combo.Most people just dont know what a half press is andtend to hold focus while they actually move their head+cam until they finallypress through... and pal, there is no healing from such veins just by trusting brand-fame... If you have that neurosis...I guess you will be able to miss shots with a Canon 1DXII or a 5DIV also.

(which will also miss focus under other certain circumstances)https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/62807519The difference is u wont admit it, or would you?

So from my experience:K-1+DFA* 50mm 1.4 - no hit and miss. RTFM!Unlike1 month agopermalinkPolacofede

@Sylverphoto Pentax should have ask for your advisor services before getting into building such a lens, a shame... such a wasteLike1 month agopermalinkdavid_sladek

@PolacofedeRicoh/Pentax run a massive survey amongst Pentaxians a couple of years back asking what kind of lenses they would like to see introduced. 85/1.4 was one of the winners if I remember well. I am sure few users wanted other stuff, but trust me, they know why they built itLike1 month agopermalinkSylverphoto

@Polacofede hahahah thx.I only do a few things here and there and try to be humble. However I gave myself a treat: I got a Milvus 85 dirt cheap (Showroom model + rebate and I was sold) just this January and since Covid is on I still did not have chance to take it for a proper walk.

Anyway, the discussion is about something else. Looking at the pricetag, it does not matter how good the lens is. In fact it could be the best lens of the world and be twice as good as the Otus opically and as good as a Nikon 200mm f2 in terms of focus aquesition. The whole Pentax envrionment doesn't work. Pentax is floating on pieces of styrofoam in the big Ocean.

The is not branding, no marketing, no nothing, nada, niks, clum.I have to say their cameras were always admirable. They put a lot of effort in it, from wheather sealing to their swivel LCD screen. Fantastic. For me as protrait shooter It would be enough.

Conclusion: there are not enough lenses to choose from. This is sad and unfortunate.Like1 month agopermalinkpatarok

sounds like more meaningless trolling?Hm...D'ya think its possible to say "PENTAX" now's niche brand...and the lens may be cool, but i dont think they will sell a lot?

without that supernegative and dismissive connotation?Styrofoam? What the, is wrong wid'ya?

Are you really so much in need of attention, that you have to spit in the faces of the engineers who gave their best and delivered their best, that you have to write like that?I also have my opinion about other brands like Canon or so,but I dont go to their birthday-partyand tell them, their cameras feel just like balloon figures and most of their DSLRS also deliver the same ruggedness as that balloon dog, and that I am tired of ERR 2435 ERR 243254 ERR23452354 and ERR 1dunnowhat3?

And I cant remember the day, I went to a forum when Sony released their 400mm lens with double PLM and wrote:Yeah, but what's it good, when your cameras only need a wet cough to refuse to work, and then nobody feels like responsible...Unlike1 month agopermalinkstarbase218

@patarok Isn’t AF-C incredibly useful with a DOF of maybe one or two cm and a subject and photographer that might not stand perfectly still, especially when you’re lining up your composition or wait for a certain look on your subject’s face, etc?Like1 month agopermalinkSylverphoto

@patarokShall I be really honest? I am sure what Pentax is thinking. As a company you need to be self-sustaining and this is what I don't think Pentax is.

Some engineer was drunk and said to the others while partying: "Let's do a massive 85". I say it differently to tell you what is worrying me and my hand keep off Pentax.

Pentax does not have a strategy: Their cycle of innovation is too slow. Also their 645 is from 2014 and could need a face-lift. I wonder why they let fujifilm into their market. Tell me why @patarok? I really don't get it.Like1 month agopermalinkpatarok

I think peeps like you postin trash, about a brand they dont use, want to blow up their ego they build on the hype of their brand.Actually it wouldnt interest, but since it's PENTAXs birthday party+lockdown and I use the brand since like ..ever, s'feel like telling you what I think bout peeps smearing on that brands reputation for whatsoevr:I think you'r the one who's drunk and just never knows how to do tisOthat setting on yur cam,Or not checks how to make chrome watches NOT reflect the flash when shootin product,and for that reason it is, that you have noth'n else to do than fling insults at PENTAX lens devs.

For sure, there is always a reason to not pick this or that, but what has this got to do with PENTAX releasing a new LENS that may or may not be optically perfect? maybe more perfect than any other available 85mm?Envy?boy, i know enough other photogs who do their thing with exact 1 or 2 lenses.none of them gives a dam about what hypeman thinks a pro needs.Like1 month agopermalinkpatarok

@starbase218:since honesty seems to be a trend in this thread(somebody called for it) and its lockdown, you shall be the second to have mine:I hardly doubt that you know you know what professional photography is about, when I read your question. Why? read:

You want to shoot only photos with an in-focus area of 1-2cm ?Despite the fact even a (7yrs old)Pentax K-30's AF.C will hold F with that lens and good light...We assume you use an 85mil... you will always shooting with a distance of app. 1m to your subject. ROFL ^^I mean given the fact, you dont want to shoot a dragonfly on ecstasy,you could:-) consider talking to yur model...-) even use manual focus (if you dont suffer from severe 'Parkinson')-) even use a Petzval lens instead n resharpen the lid since you think everybody will dig your photos because they show nothing in focus but the eyelid of your model.jokes aside, of course better AF.C would be welcome but for sure not 'cause o the reasons you are fancying about.Like1 month agopermalinkpatarok

@starbase218:I admit, having cool Eye-AF like on the Sony A9, that locks-on and holds it there, (IF... and i say IF, the light is good enough!)is really a cool thing to have.I would not deny that.But thats not AF.C nor does it have anything to do with making good use of a stellar 85mil. Even though it may be perfect wide open, some photogs will buy it and never use it below f:2.0 because what magazines and the web want to sell you just is not how real life works.Dont get me wrong, I also dig nice photos of a womans face where sharpness is only about the eye. But you can do exactly that with a K-1.And what you would mostly like to use an 85mm lens for, is for shooting fashion:You will want to separate your models full body from the background.When you shoot the 85 from app. 5-8m, wide open it will give you exactly that, and the AF of the K-1 will do its job just fine, despite you would not always want to pinpoint F to the eye of one model.Or:

product/food-photos - nut moves?Like1 month agopermalinkpatarok

you should also know, the attraction of a supersharp non-distorting 85mil starting at F:1.4 for 2.000 for pros is not, to have just 1-2cm DoF(what you fancy about there is an illusion you made up for yourself, like every hobbyist does to rectify the acqusition of an 85mil that costs above 1.000bucks)its (I am pretty sure it will deliver that) the sharpness across the whole frame/its microcontrasts,its potential for object separation or background compression,the pleasing bokeh,And despite it should be an optical marvel for 2grand,the most important thing about 85mil: no distortions...I guess that lens will deliver already good on the K-1 and maybe even better on its follow-up.And about the why o why 645-blahblah:I seriously doubt you will ever use a 645D or god beware a 645Z.But the reasons others will stick to 645, is that photography doesnt mean:Yippy-yappy-I'll-buy-a-new-lens-every-day-because-that-makes-me-so-cool-wonderland. it's actually just about taking good photos.Like1 month agopermalinkstarbase218

You know, you could just have answered the question, or even ignore it, instead of making all kinds of judgments about me.

Thank you.

I do think there’s an answer in there, and even a nuanced one. But really I’m not motivated to read it at all.Like1 month ago*permalinkpatarok

I guess, what you took for my message to you... was meant for Sylverphoto,For his ridiculous insults on PENTAX dev-team... (or general talkin)And his 'know-it-all-talk' ..like: "what Ricoh should do and whot not".Like the world could only work like he imagines...

But if you feel its for you... ┗( T﹏T )┛Dunno. Sry you feel that way.I am pretty sure, when answering your question I did keep very close to all the facts known to photogs and did not state anything about you personally.

For sure, I know where you wanted to go with your suggestion and as I admitted before its a good

one. Eye-Tracking in Live-View Mode is cool.But not needed for close up shallow DoF. And its not like Eye-AF is the only way to take stunning shot...my first test on the A9 in Vienna, the salesguys couldnt even get Eye-AF on it to work, not even with the g-master lens.There was a problem with the firmware AFAIR.And exactly that is that with hype-features and blown-up lens line-ups.No practical use.Like4 weeks agopermalinkstarbase218

Well, you mentioned that 85mm f/1.4 would not be something people typically use. First of all I’m talking about travel photography. Ok, I would not buy this lens for that (nor for anything else) but when I was in Japan I took, for example, a photo of a local that I kind of liked. With my Nikon 17-55 on APS-C at f/2.8, so comparable to an 85mm at f/4 on fullframe. Turned out the eyes were not exactly sharp, which was a bummer to me.

This was just a guy who didn’t mind me taking his photo. But we didn’t speak each others language (so no, I couldn’t talk to my model) and I didn’t want to bother him any more than necessary.

I have had situations similar to this (in terms of technique anyway) and AF-C was sometimes very handy. Eye AF doesn’t even matter. If necessary I can hold the AF point over the eye, or I can use 3D tracking to both keep an eye in focus and give me compositional freedom.

If what I described isn’t photography to you then it isn’t. It is to me.Like4 weeks agopermalinkSylverphoto

@patarokWhy are you ranting about so much I wrote? That is not worth the time man. I have only said what I think. You are deeply in love with Pentax and I respect that and thus you are so defensive about Pentax that are about to glorify them.

Pentax has written great history and I hope they will continue to do so.I have also nothing against the gear they produce. They are great bodies and lenses. I just expressed my thoughts that they are about to produce the most expensive AF 85/1.4 lens and that very little people will buy.

The Pentax ecosystem offers very little alternatives. Currently there are only 2FF Sigma and 3 Tamron lenses on offer.

I am not here to insult anyone. I tell my opinion about the crap Nikon or Fujifilm is doing too. I have not upgraded my camera bodies since 2013 or 2014 or so because I find them sh*t and have not found an adequate replacement.

Also, when people asked me what get to start with I recommended a used Pentax and a lens.

Like4 weeks agopermalinkHowaboutRAW

Sylverphoto:

But you can't mount a Zeiss Milvus or Otus on a K mount camera. There are a few of the film era Zeiss MF 85mm f/1.4 lenses (ZP?) around used that will mount on K bodies, BUT Zeiss stopped making them years before it (Cosina) discontinued the same line for Nikon and Canon.Like4 weeks agopermalinkpatarok

@sylverphoto & starbase...talking for myself I do not "rant"... I keep close to the facts, and point out what people like you have on their minds....actually its always the same: You always come up with those:Pentax is cool, and had history BUT , BUT BUT-sentences...But you gotta realise, that most of what you say neither makes sense, norhas anything to do with PENTAX releasing a lens thats most likely gonna be a perfect 85mm 1.4 lens for 2000bucks which will most likely even outsmart an Otus plus it has AF which the Otus has not AFAIK.Like3 weeks agopermalinkpatarok

...Again:I dont see a rant (whatever that may be) coming from my side, by just "expressing my thoughts" ^^ ... LOL... what both of you really cant say of yourself...you are spitting around like wild, because you cant take it that PENTAX steps up its game now... Its so obvious. Like someone driving a porsche saying this Mercedes over there actually is a crap of a car.The very same ego problem.The only thing you have on your mind in this thread, is commenting it to death.I mean where in the world is,comparing Pentax to trash swimming in the ocean, considered just expressing your thoughts on a company you actually "hold dear" or value?I mean, when you talk with people like that do they also say, nice thank you for laying down your precious thoughts about my future, thank you mister!

... again: not so much of what you say here makes sense at all or can be considered appreciative.Its what would call it toxic talk hiding behind a christmas tree richly adorned with hypocrisy.Like3 weeks agopermalinkpatarok

Actually your statment about how you use your 17-55 on an APS-C Nikon says very much ... but what it shows the most, is that you really dont know what this lens is about, or why cameras still have an AF.C and an AF.S mode...

And I am NOT "deeply in love" with PENTAX.

I feel the Pentax cameras are way more than usable.Their flagships are very reliable tools, even more reliable than Canons AFAICS when I have a look at their forums and the problems they have.Being reliable is a very important for me,and I also see value in the fact that their bodies are sealed to an extant you would have to pay 5000bucks-plus if there is a Canon badge on it.

I actually got banned from pentaxforums.com for stating the truth about what the pros and what the cons are in having a PENTAX.And for making suggestions about what would need improvement and whats rather stubborn useless feature wishes no one actually needs.

I dont like the weirdos over there.Like said beforeLike3 weeks agopermalinkstarbase218

@patarok “Actually your statment about how you use your 17-55 on an APS-C Nikon says very much ... but what it shows the most, is that you really dont know what this lens is about, or why cameras still have an AF.C and an AF.S mode...”

You say I don’t know certain things but you are keeping your reasoning to yourself, as if you know it all and I should just accept that. And you won’t help me with it either. So you are putting yourself in position of dominance in this ongoing conversation. I don’t much care for that.Like3 weeks ago*permalinkpatarok

I like facts.So tell me, where PENTAX,which is now a prestige brand owned by Ricoh(a company, that has a revenue of app ¥2.000 trillion)(a company, that has a rev. of app ¥2.000 trillion),could be considered styrofoam, should be called a fact.I dont like people lying around.And I express that in what I write here in the most friendly way possible.You seemingly talk nonsense about a brand you dont know...On the very same post where you state that you wish pentax the very best you spread lies about the alternatives that are available.Not a word about Laowa, Irix, Mitakons(even Mitakons 135mm 1.4 was available with Pentax mount for a short while)..., etc.

Even the new Daguerrotype was produced for PENTAX mount.... and more.Sure, 3rd party always tend to produce only a fraction of lenses with PENTAX mount than, with those mounts with a more widespread adoption andYes, they stop after they think they fed whats to feed.Still those lenses are there. And you ignore that.Like3 weeks agopermalinkpatarok

and the greatest joke of it all:You keep on with the same toxic attitude and double talk:And tell me I should stop telling the truth about your intentions.Nice move. ...But no. You keep on spreading lies baby,i'll keep on pointing out, what you say is pretty nuts.Simple as that.If a lockdown isnt good for exposing trolls, for what is it good than?I mean what else than spreading poison should your posts be good for?

You are happy and deeply in love with your brands, we understood that now.

But if you are so happy about them, and do a lot of photography in your lockdown-towns... why do you stroll around on PENTAXs birthday party and keep on talking like... forever without any real cause.And the same goes for starbase.Like3 weeks agopermalinkpatarok

@starbasewhatever...I dont keep reasoning to myself,And IN FIRST PLACE I explained to you how one would use such an 85mm lens.And I explained to you how focus works, but you just dont care, write in even worse english than I do ... and try to make me look bad...And guess who doesnt care about that.. ME :P

Still no one is gonna stop me from publicly denying your trolly accusations, nobody needs in here.Its just like you state "a to the power of 0 is 0" , ... :)why should I let you spread that,when everybody knows that a to the power of 0 is always 1.But hey go on with your double talk and tell everybody how 1+1 is 3...The party is all yours, I aint got enought time for that, cause I know you guys will go on forever with that sh. since you have weird emotional connection to your brands and cant stand pentax releasing fine lenses to the market.Its OK we got that now.now go and tell everybody how bad I am. Have a nice day!Like

3 weeks agopermalinkstarbase218

@patarok “Have a nice day!”

You too.Like3 weeks agopermalinkSylverphoto

HowaboutRAW

I know that Zeiss discontinued Pentax mounts. None of third party manyfactureres have interest in producing gear that cannot be sold because only a very few people use Pentax.If fewer people buy gear, gear will become more expensive because the enigneer still wants to be paid a competitive salery.

Anyway, I don't have Pentax anymore and I am very happy that I moved away from it. It is unfortunate that Pentax relies on the laurels of yesteryear's results.Like3 weeks agopermalinkdpthoughts not only Zeiss, also everyone else had abandoned Pentax by now. Even Sigma, the biggest of them. They completely stopped any production of even the oldest Sigma lenses for Pentax K. So it's not only that they didn't issue any of their modern 'latest & greatest' lenses of the past years for Pentax any more. By now they buried any hope for Pentax completely.Like3 weeks ago*permalinkSylverphoto

@patarokYes, you are right. I don't know anything about Pentax because I abandoned them in the late 2000's . They could not offer what I was looking for. Then in the mid 2010s (lets say 2013-2015) I was interested in getting a digital Pentax 645. I am happy that I didn't go that route either. Why? Because I was wise.

The current line-up of Pentax FF primes lenses is 10. The lenes I am interested in ranging from 18 to 100mm and Pentax offers no standard 1.4 lenses : 18, 24, 25, 35.

Third party lenses: You just did acknowdlege to yourself that there are very little manufacturers that support Pentax. I don't mention Laowa, Irix or Mitakon because I don't support made in China products because of economical and political reasons.Like3 weeks agopermalinkSylverphoto

@ patarok

Also you are stating that Pentax is stepping up the game? With what? One lens in 2020 or the next decade? I am not sure if Pentax is alive or hanging on life-support.

Pentax does no marketing, nothing at all. From a markting perspective, I need to do something to let my potential clients know: "Hello, we are here and we show you what we have on offer and where our future is heading to"

Pentax is not doing that. What I am afraid of is that Ricoh pulls the plug from Pentax.

You should find out why Minolta stopped. It was not the revenue.

But I am stopping here because the discssion does no longer make sense.You win or let you win. I don't care.Like3 weeks agopermalinkdavid_sladek

@dpthoughts @Sylverphotojust move on and let people who enjoy Pentax or want to explore it to get their own opinion. For now, everything you use as argument is history and you have no experience with the existing product so, please, stop trolling. It didn't suit you, didn't match your requirements? Fine, those were you requirements. But stop enforcing your arguments on other people

I am seriously sick of your endless negativity and it was reason why I left this forum once already. You are taking joy from users of this forumLike3 weeks ago*permalinkHowaboutRAW

Sylverphoto:

It is unfortunate that Pentax relies on the laurels of yesteryear's results.

More than a few excellent new lenses for both APSC and DSLR bodies are yesteryear's laurels?

The K1 II and the KP are in many ways excellent bodies. As stills cameras--so not video--the only thing they really lack is strong AF.

And if you throw the Ricoh GR2 and GR3 into the mix, quite suddenly Pentax-Ricoh becomes very significant. In 2020, Leica no longer makes a camera in that market,, Nikon dropped out, there's no Sony, which leaves just Fuji--while the 3 or 4 lenses that Fuji has used don't compete with those 2 Ricohs' lenses. Right, 2 of the Fuji lenses are faster--the ones from the X100 cameras.Like3 weeks agopermalinkpatarok

pah, no matter the price-tag...

I freakin love this lens, looking at it and its first results, you see this is a huge step for the Pentax-brand and mount and the foundation-stone for better lens-production and more lenses on the same level and a stepstone for more "common"(or casual) lenses one level below.(Looking at what the new 50mil does, I love the idea of the new and fast ring-motor-driven AF-drive... moving glass that heavy that fast... not comparable to anything before.I mean the new 85mil is 1,3kg just like an Otus and I guess most of its weight is glass!!!)

I wonder how all these people on PetaPixel-article about it,manage to write such baneful comments about this wonderful piece of kit,and being able to look in the mirror next day.No matter what those psychos, say... I gotta have it for food-photography ^^

...Bunch of g.d.m.n Scandalmongers...(whining after cheapo samynag glass)ReplyLike1 month ago*permalinkil_alexk

Roughly for times heavier and three times more expensive than optically excellent Samyang AF FE 85mm/1.4. That's even before mentioning the uninspiring Pentax AF.

Exactly why I switched from Pentax a few years ago and never looked back.ReplyLike1 month ago*permalinkffking

Well, if cost and weight are the most important features of a lens to you, you made a good move - just interested why someone who never looked back came to look at this...?Like1 month agopermalinkil_alexk

@ffking Cost, weight, support by 3rd parties, and last, but not least, a fast and reliable auto-focus - all of these are important to most of photographers, not only to me. May be Leica and Pentax shooters are the only exception to this formula.

As for your question, why I am here. Assuming you are really interested and not using this question as a fallacious argument...Well, there is actually a quite common trend between DPR users to read, check and compare gear from all camera/lenses vendors, not necessarily limiting ourselves only to the brand that we are shooting with. Just curios, have you ever read a review of another camera/lens without any intention of buying it or of switching to another brand?Like1 month ago*permalinkdpthoughts well the "uninspiring Pentax AF" is just plainly bad, too bad for a shallow DoF application. This lens

sits between all chairs. Doesn't make any sense for such a brand. Also the Pentax community remainder is a tiny landscape photography crowd, there are no (serious) people photographers left. It is too late in 2020. People who are invested in Canon or Nikon DSLR will stay there (or migrate to their mirrorless bodies). Those who just join people photography will go mirrorless straight away. This lens makes no sense from no angle.Like1 month ago*permalinkklimbkatklimbkat

@dpthts "no sense from no angle" pretty well nails it; the double negative means that is makes sense from every angle - AGREED. Perhaps not great for shooting a weaving oncoming bicycle, but since that is typically not how most of us shoot portraits, products, etc., the typical subjects for a portrait lens, I think we will be fine. Since I seriously doubt Pentax was counting on your purchase, no loss.Like1 month agopermalinkffking

Look, @dpthoughts - if Ricoh are making a mistake, that's their problem, not yours. Meanwhile, people who are actually photographers have another lens available to them. and a very good one by the looks of it. Is that bad?Like1 month agopermalinkffking

@ il_alexk

Thank you for responding - you know, a lot of people use the "I used to own X brand and would never use it again" as a form of trolling - just checkingLike1 month agopermalinkLeandros S

Oh please, not that broken bicycle test where they don't even control for the lighting. It's such an embarrassment for DPR.Like1 month agopermalinkPentUp

Well, it looks like you’re still looking back...?Like1 month agopermalinkil_alexk

@Leandros Please no more of this silly "bicycle tests are irrelevant" argument, Pentax AF feels obsolete even for candid portrait work with super fast glass and ultra-thin DoF.

You might not like what I am going to say, but the de-facto industry standard shooting experience today is to raise a camera, frame and camera's eye-AF does the rest. A fraction of a second to photo with sharp eyes.

Pentax experience? It was always "keep it still, please don't move, keep it smiling, almost done, let me check the photo, oh, let's do it again". Focus and re-frame (good luck with accuracy then) or fiddle with moving AF point to eyes every time I change framing or my kids move. And this is even before I start talking about the consistency and accuracy.

Even entry-level E-PL1 eye-AF felt many light-years ahead for kid's candid portraits compared to advanced K5IIs. Unbelievably effortless, liberating. More advanced MILCs is another quantum leap forward.Like1 month ago*permalinkklimbkatklimbkat

@il alexk You are not going to like what I say, but years of whining by you don't change the fact that there are still more than enough photographers to support the Pentax niche. Not everyone wants robust, weather-sealed kit with great ergonomics and superb output, but you are more than willing to complain about a 12 year old body (K5iis, really?) to make your inner critic happy. Speaking of liberating, consider liberating yourself from the delusion that Pentax cannot focus with fast glass wide open - that's just silly.Like1 month agopermalinkil_alexk

@kimbkat Nah... The entry level mirrorless E-PL1 (announced in 2010) was miles ahead from the Pentax flagship model (K5 IIS) announced two years later (in 2012, not 12 years ago. If you think Pentax is closing the gaps in terms of AF, than keep dreaming.

The difference between us is that I actually tried all other systems and can compare. You, on the other side only shoot with a 7 years old K3 and but think you know it better.Like1 month agopermalinkklimbkatklimbkat

@Iil alexk Still on about the K5iis (loved that you picked that planted nit, really too easy :-) )? Not even competent trolling, par for the course (hint: I've never taken a single shot with a K3, not one). Looking forward to the brilliant new 85 and very much doubt I'll miss focus. Everything beyond that is just pointless noise . . .Like1 month agopermalinkil_alexk

Good luck. Though you will not know what you miss until you try it. :PLike1 month agopermalinkbrett nzbrett nz

dpthoughts that is contrary view to what I see around me - Are there sales figures on current used film cameras because many of the young photographers who are serious about photography are buying old Pentax (and other) film cameras - but most I know are buying Pentax K1000's - this is a serious trend, look it up on Instagram - these new photographers will then move to Pentax dslr's imo - wait and see!Like1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts No, there's also this trend among some hipsters for vintage Polaroids again. This doesn't imply, that they will move to Polaroid DSLRs or Polaroid mirrorless, as soon as they need a kit for serious contemporary performance ;) Anyone who wants to give analogue SLR a short try, gets something which is dirt-cheap used. Where there's an over-supply on the used market (including lenses), for example because it is a dead or dying system where everyone else is dumping such stuff on ebay.Like1 month ago*permalinkThylacine

Fuji seems to have latched onto that “trend among some hipsters” with its Instax cameras. The last time I looked, revenue from sales of that camera and the film was holding up their profits quite nicely. How many move from Instax to Fujifilm digital? No idea, so if you do know, perhaps you could share.Like8 hours agopermalinkdavid_sladek

I see the new line of lenses as three point strategy:1. offer product that Pentaxians and potential customers can aspire to2. move as far as possible from what today's and future mobile phone photography can offer. Because it will grab larger and larger groups of users3. offer quality that can satisfy the MF users because there is no R&D in the MF line

I should also add, that a the products practically copy results of the massive user survey that Ricoh/Pentax did a couple of years ago. So they are fulfilling our wishes - which other company can say this?!ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkcport

I have never realized the latter fact. Where are the results of the survey?

But I would agree anyway - Ricoh is listening. Pentaxians did not want to have RICOH on the rear side of K-3, they did not get it on the rear side of K-3 II, Pentaxians wanted a FF, they got it, Pentaxians wanted something more than KP, they will get it ...Like1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts The KP was originally intended as a K-3 II successor, but then was changed to a massively stripped version, to lower the costs. The KP was still sold as expensively as the K-3, to increase profit. Less camera for the same money.- The RAW buffer became 8 RAWs small.- The shutter downgraded from 8.3/s to 7s, its life expectancy went down from 200 to 100k

#NAME?- slower USB (2.0 not 3.0),- only one card slot (where the K-3 had two),- no GPS built in any longer,- body structure more plastic rather than metal,- battery life only ~420 shots rather than ~720. I suspect, that the next K-3 II successor will go along similar lines, for similar reasons. For such specs which usually do not appearing on the front pages of marketing materials, it may well be degraded from the K-3 II, as well. But it also may get some new gimmicks, for the marketing front pages.Like1 month ago*permalinkdpthoughts @david, if you translate "MF users" to "manual focus users", that could be about right. However, regarding (budget) medium format: yes, Pentax is dead there. That business is mirrorless as well by now, and occupied by Fuji GFX at the moment. However, Sony/Nikon/Canon become increasingly more medium format like with regards to utilizing newest sensors. Pentax strategy (as of the K-1 II) instead was to use very old sensors (the one of the Nikon D800s), but then try to keep up with competitors' test results with the help of a cheating chip (called "accelerator chip") which forces denoising of RAWs, even lower ISO RAWs, as revealed by the DPR review. Which cannot be switched off. So, having lower resolution of cheaper older chips, but with cheated secret RAW denoising, is less medium format like than using the best of current high-res / native low-noise sensors (as Sony, Canon, and Nikon seem to aim for). Also, medium format type resolutions demand good AF qualities.Like

1 month ago*permalinkdavid_sladek

@dpthoughts Ricoh/Pentax is the only one that 'bakes' RAW? And is its implementation any worse then of the other manufacturers? And do you have information that the next FF body (when it comes) will have the same 36MP chip?

I can answer for you:no, no and noLike1 month agopermalinksilversalts

@dpthoughts:You know less than nothing about the Pentax brand.

KP was NOT originally intended as a K-3ll successor. K-1 was intended to be the Flagship - there was NO K-3ll successor 0lanned at the time KP was released.

KP was intended to be an alternative to APSc MILC bodies in size and weight, but with an OVF. Once Ricoh understood Pentax users want an APSc body with full Flagship features they set to work on K-new, which will put paid to any discussion points left in your cynical trick bag.Like1 month agopermalinkHowaboutRAW

dpthoughts:

Sensor resolutions, for APSC and FF cameras, beyond about 10-12 MPs really don't matter much for 90% of photographers, including many professionals.

Provided a good lens was used, and Pentax has plenty of those, both APSC and FF, you can readily print small posters with very good, human hair resolving, detail from "just" a 10 MP file.

Nor does the K1 II massively cook NR in to its raw files, though I'm sure it does some cooking. That 36 MP Sony sensor, the one from the D810, is very very good. Whatever 36 MP Sony sensor was in the D800/E wasn't any where near as good.

Now, Pentax absolutely makes preposterous claims about the high ISO capacity of the K1 II.

Then the Ricoh (so the parent of Pentax Cameras) GR3 does have raw problems; there are compression artifacts in the shadows, ones that would make some printed 8 x 12s (inches) unacceptable as fine art photos.Like4 weeks agopermalinkbackayonder

You've tried the rest now try the bestReply

Like1 month agopermalinkcatlyn

Expensive and probably great optically... but for those that own a Pentax camera.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkffking

not as much of a drawback as some think :)Like1 month agopermalinkMike HiranMike Hiran

Think of it this way: for less money than an Otus, you can buy an amazing 85mm with AF and VR along with a k1ii. How's that for great value?Like3 weeks agopermalinkthx1138thx1138

Looking at the size, weight and price, it's a no expense spared optical design I guess like an Otus or Noct, well it better be. Looks nice, for sure.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkxeppelin

wow. 1899 usd / € 1999 for a non-stabilized, tiny niche brand DSLR-only 85/1.4 in 2020. some people really must have too much money.

Meanwhile the excellent Canon EF 85/1.4 L IS works flawlessly on mirrorslappers as well as mirrorfree EOS R bodies and can be had for about € 1300 after cashback. or one can pick it up in hardly used mint condition or a Canon EF 85/1.2 L II for well under a grand.

Pentax ... a value proposition. not.ReplyLike1 month ago*permalinkbilmenot

Who need stabilization on Pentax lens !? the good about Pentax is it has IBIS that save a lot on lens design. IMHO Pentax is for those love photography not those make money with it, I've no comment on this gigantic lens and I can't afford it.Like

1 month agopermalinkffking

So nice to see even Canon users feeling threatened :)Like1 month agopermalinkxeppelin

hehe! Don't feel "threatened", lol.

Just at a total loss, why a handful of people might consider products like this one at extreme prices like this one, when more sensible alternatives are readily available.

Yes I know, it is a hobby for most - but still don't see any reason to go "gear masochist".Like1 month agopermalinkdanart

A Canon 85mm 1.2 is hardly a sensible alternative for Pentax K1 shooters. This is just a recommended retail price for a lens not yet released.Like1 month agopermalinkDericali

Pentax users can buy cheaper older lenses, such as picking up the 77mm second hand. Some may want to buy a premium lens, here the manufacturer is giving them that choice.Like1 month ago*permalinkdanart

The 77mm is pretty special not to mention the 43mm limited. Very nice lens.Like1 month ago*permalinkAlwina H

It surely cannot picked up yet in hardly used mint condition. I would advise everyone to wait for its release before considering offers like that.Like1 month agopermalinkzakariazakaria

But this for k mount should I leave it to a canon one and use adapter and finally wow it is working flawlessly but ..ih no it is not working on af.Like1 month ago*permalinkCouscousdelight

the excellent Canon EF 85/1.4 L IS.When i see how a vintage Pentax 85 F1.4 compares to the modern Canon 85mm f1.2 L mkII, maybe Canon could learn how to make a sharp 85mm from Pentax :

http://www.16-9.net/lens_tests/pentax85/pentax85mm_c.htmlLike1 month agopermalinkphoenix15phoenix15

@xepelin: what is your point ? You dont use pentax, and you complained. Even if this new 85mm F1.4 is 1000 USD, you will not buy it, will you ?You want cheap one, buy something else.Like1 month ago*permalinkthegreat26thegreat26

If you don't want to buy the best you can always buy the great 85 1.4 in the used market. I see no reason in mentioning Canon lenses in a Pentax release announcement. We might be a handful of people but we are still enough.Like1 month agopermalinkxeppelin

Correct. I won't buy any Pentax lens or camera, no matter what the price is. Unless they came up with a fabulous new mirrorfree system at great bang for the buck. :-)

But even as a non-buyer and non-fan i am free to state my opinion regarding Pentax products and their pricing - absolute and in relation to competitor's products.

Anyways, "limited" is probably the right word in this context. :-)Like1 month agopermalinkdanart

Well I guess if we are talking Canon, we could simply point to the superior sensor of the Pentax k1 series vs any Canon sensor. We could therefore assume that due to its absence of a AA filter that this lens will hold its own very well, much like the 50mm 1.4 DA holds up against the 50mm RF 1.2 In fact we would likely be achieving a higher pixel resolution vs Canon. The Pentax K1 with the 501.4 DA can at half the price of the RF 1.2

Why would anyone buy an expensive Canon that doesn’t even hold up to a niche and by your accounts irrelevant product.

In fact I would argue even before seeing result that there is a very very high chance that this lens will perform better that the Canon 85mm 1.2 you’re touting

Like1 month ago*permalinkAlephNull

Is this lens even heavier than the Sigma 85 Art? I thought that lens would hold the all time record for heaviest 85mm lens, but I think this one beats it.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkMightyMike

The Zeiss Milvus 85mm F1.4 is 1280g and its not even autofocusLike1 month agopermalinkxeppelin

and twice the price of the Sigma Art 85/1.4 ... which is available in every mount except Pentax K-mount.

Must be great to be a Pentax user. really dont get it, why some people spend significant money on that brand's gear. to me it would be "economic masochism" to do so.Like1 month agopermalinkffking

There are many things I don't get, but I generlly prefer to keep them to myself, unless I'm genuinely looking for enlightenment.Like1 month agopermalinkAlephNull

Ok, so there are multiple 85mm lenses heavier than the Sigma - not what I expected.Like1 month agopermalinkWingsfanWingsfan

I shoot m43 mostly, but have used Pentax dslrs ( and Canon and Sony to a lesser extent) cameras quite a bit. If I were focused mostly on photography only ( as opposed to the significant amount of video I tend to take), I'd be most likely to go with Pentax. I like the ergonomics, weather resistance, the features per dollar, and the OE lenses tend to be very high quality. I don't know why people have to always beat down the brands they don't use, or have never used. This looks like a good addition for the brand.We should be glad whenever a high quality lens or camera is released. It shows the manufacturers are continuing to support their customers.ReplyUnlike1 month agopermalink

4sofnature

While third-party keeps making lightweight and affordable glass for E mount, Pentax is stuck with a dead mount.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkdavid_sladek

Does your mount take pictures for you?Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

@4sofnature What the #&*€ are you going on about? We've had lightweight, optically sublime lenses for years. Pentax has the best APSC lineup of any manufacturer. Small, lightweight probably started with the M series, that is DFA > DA > FA > F > A > M or 5 generations ago. Say mid 80s.Perhaps you need to look up some of the smaller DA's such as the 21, 40 or 70, maybe you want small FF, there is the 43 and 77. Go away, educate yourself then apologise to yourself in the mirror for embarrassing yourself in public.Unlike1 month ago*permalinkcali92rs

@Robbie, better APS-C line-up than Fuji?Sure, maybe 10 years ago.Like1 month agopermalinkThylacine

Dead mount? Mine still seems to work, even with my new (live) lenses.

Seriously, why do you bother? DSLRs are still selling as well as MILCs, and no amount of obsessive trolling is going to change that.Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

@cali92rs :D sure everything from 11mm to 560mm11-18, 15, 15-30, 16-50, 18-55x3, 21, 24-70, 28-105, 31, 35/2-2.4-2.8, 40, 43, 50/1.4x2 - 1.8-2.8m, 50-135, 55, 55-300x2, 60-250, 70, 70-200, 77, 85, 100m, 150-450, 200, 300, 560. All can be bought and mounted on K APSC. That's off the top of my head. Might have missed one or two.Like1 month ago*permalinkzakariazakaria

Third party for third party!Like1 month agopermalinkcali92rs

@Robbie, sure if you want to move goal posts (you said APS-C), you could include FF, and then you could mount any K mount lens on Fuji.Of course, on both Nikon and Canon you could also mount full frame lenses on their APS-C cameras too, then your statement "best APS-C line-up of any manufacturer" is meaningless.Like1 month ago*permalink(unknown member)

@cali92rs, I stand corrected on the fuji aps-c lineup. Numbers wise it looks pretty fleshed out. There are a few caveats there however, not all of these lenses are optically corrected at lens level? ie they need help from either the camera or raw converter, that's a no from me. I popped over to Photozone and took in some test results, lots of vignetting wide open, surprising amounts really, you're missing a couple of stops (f/11 is typical max), centres are good but only a few have corners that really come up, pricing is another surprise, pretty sharp so a premium of 25-50% over what I'd expect to pay for a Pentax lens which is optically correct, less vignetting, stronger corners, shake reduction in body and will stop down more. So I still think a K aps-c has a stronger lens lineup because I can bring out the big guns if I wish.Like1 month agopermalinkdanart

Third party lenses tend to have some third party qualities to them. You might save money to get something as “sharp” but the trade offs are generally, af, build, QA, weather sealing. sometimes I find it’s expensive to go cheaper in the long run.Like1 month ago*permalinkBoramiBorami

Nice design at least!ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkPriaptorPriaptor

I have no idea about it's performance and it is not a lens I need BUT it looks great.ReplyLike1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

Trolls are in very poor and disappointing form today. 1 idiot trying to say it's a Tokina offering, Pfft

Another saying its the wrong time to release and the usual morons practising counting on their fingers and thinking that they equal the number of Pentax users. Lastly we have that special type that have to bring up the 'Pro' debate, allow me to explain, photography is an art form thereby you don't say I'm a Pro this or Pro that or do the Pros use it, you refrain and wait to be called a Master of your craft. Typically if you reach that stage, you don't care what others call you, you're above that. :DReplyLike1 month agopermalinknoirdesir

Not sure whether that would qualify as trolling, but I was wondering today if there are any noticeable number of people switching from another APS-C or FF system to Pentax these days. Or how many first-time ILC buyers are choosing Pentax?Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

@noeldslr, not trolling. An interesting / genuine question. If I look at newcomers at Pentax forums there is a steady stream of users that can't get on with EVFs, there will be those who want to step up to FF but balk at the pricing of a FF mirrorless kit and see Pentax as a value offering. Then there are those that want a more involved photography approach. So a mixture. Conversely there are those leaving, finding the pastures greener for their type of shooting or they find Pentax are not releasing gear fast enough for them. I bought into Pentax because of a few things, I liked the tactility of the cameras, I loved the fact that the Pentax area here was all about the images and not the gear and then I got sucked into the vast arsenal of lenses I could find, use and learn about. I joined here in 2009 and have been through 50 or 60 lenses and 5 bodies. Great fun.Like1 month agopermalinkRolliPoli

A Pentax product! Cue the uninformed contempt, sneering, condescension and undisguised stupidity from those who have never used Pentax. Those who have never lack for comedic entertainment here on DPR.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkapsc4ever

Sadly it is a limited edition. Only 10. 10-4 users oh that means 6 will never be soldReplyLike1 month agopermalinkffking

So hilarious! So original!Like1 month agopermalink

Tibor1

apsc4ever> Sadly it is a limited edition.--------

Why is being a "limited edition" sad?

The most valuable moments, people and things in our lives are usually the rarest ones, don't you think?

Have a great day!

TiborLike1 month ago*permalinkzakariazakaria

10 will enjoy it though you will stay here countingLike1 month agopermalinkMr Garibaldi

You really do come across as an ignorant dopeLike1 month agopermalinkAlephNull

I think ‘limited edition’ is Pentax’s version of Canon’s L - just an indication that the lens is one of their best.Like1 month agopermalinkffking

Pentax's premium range are the * star lenses (like this one) - the Ltd's are a different line which is sort of unique to Pentax that are a bit quirky but beatufully built and have rendering characteristics like 3-Dpop that don't necessarily shine in lens tests but produce beautiful real world imagesLike1 month agopermalinkjacksprajackspra

Would like to see gallery shot with this beauty.ReplyLike1 month agopermalink

Leandros S

Here: https://pentaxofficial.com/en/5548/Like1 month agopermalinkLeandros S

And here: http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/star_lens/special/sp_dfa85-14/impression/Like1 month agopermalinkjacksprajackspra

All the shots are so good from the Pentax equipment.Colors are so good.The little fellow would make any lens look great though.Real cute.Like1 month agopermalinkstarbase218

Leave it to Pentax to announce and release new products right in the middle of a crisis. Fits right in with them doing the unexpected.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkBNapa

I agree 100%. By the same token, so are all the other companies. I guess they did not get the memo!!Like1 month agopermalinkJoey Bagodonuts

What is the first thing everyone thinks about when the economy is crashing?Hey, its the perfect time to buy an $1800 Pentax lens. What a great investment!Like1 month agopermalinkAbrasiveReducer

Why announce something when things are quiet, when you could introduce a new product in the middle of a Sony advertising blitz?Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

Bit of good news to help cheer us up. You should really be saying Thank You Pentax for giving us something to drool over. You're a bit of a disappointment really, I was hoping for some more

substantial trolling.Like1 month agopermalinkdrummercam

The production lines have been up an running. You don't just tell everyone to stop everything and go home. This 85 was due and ready. No need to say wait. It will sell now to those who want it now and later to those who want it but might need to wait. I give Ricoh/Pentax for staying on their slow but steady schedule, in spite of COVID-19. This 85*, the latest 50*, and the new 21mm Ltd. are going to be new standards for a lot of Pentax shooters. K-new aps-c will come out this year, after which I'm sure K-1new FF body will be forthcoming.Like1 month agopermalinkJoey Bagodonuts

Hey, I am on record saying this should make the 5 or 6 Pentax owners happy. They need cheering up.Its just a shame only 2 or 3 of them will be able to afford this lens. But it gives them something else to look forward to.

And more good new for Pentax owners. When out in public shooting Pentax you won't be stared at as much for wearing that paper bag over your head or covering your face with a mask.Like1 month agopermalinkffking

@JoeyBagodonuts

Have you counted the iterations of that 'joke' on this thread? - And it easn't even funny the first time, however many years ago that was...Like1 month agopermalinkJoey Bagodonuts

Oh its always funny. Its the gift that keeps on giving.Why is it always funny? Because its true, :)Like1 month agopermalinkffking

So if I say 'you're a troll' - that's funny?Like1 month agopermalinkMr Garibaldi

It's ready to go, what's to gain by holding it back? Besides, aren't we supposed to be getting the world back to work?Like

1 month agopermalinkTibor1

What is the first thing everyone thinks about when the economy is crashing?

Hey, its the perfect time to buy an $1800 Pentax lens. What a great investment!------------

Well, probably not everyone, but I will do exactly that!This lens is a great investment since it will help me to enjoy my hobby more :) And my life is definitely NOT crashing, I've just left my comfort zone, and look for new opportunities.

Have a great day!

TiborLike1 month agopermalinkMarBa

Would be nice to get a K1 upgrade with this beautiful lens as well. Bump in resolution, AF speed and finally decent video specs. Seems like there will be no new FF camera from Pentax for quite some time. I will not invest in FF Pentax until there is a new body. But it is nice to see that Pentax is still alive!ReplyLike1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

Let's get the new APSC flagship out first with a new enhanced architecture and then think about the K-1 & 645Z updates.Like1 month agopermalinkDarren James

Man, they always lean on the high-price to make up for low sales numbers, don’t they? I love my K-1 as much as the next person, but yeesh. Surely Ricoh could have toned the engineering down a bit, it only needs to render a max resolution of 36mp to match the K-1’s nearly 10-year old Sony sensor...Oh Pentax, it hurts to watch you wither and die 😢ReplyLike1 month agopermalinksilversalts

Pentax designs lenses for the future, not for the past. This lens will outresolve sensors several cycles in the future. Intentionally.Like1 month agopermalink

Darren James

I don’t see what kind of future they can have honestly, given that their next big reveal was an APS-C DSLR. There isn’t even a hint of a new full frame camera, nor a more successful foray into mirrorless than the K-01. They were hurting hard before the ‘rona hit, now that everyone’s sales are off a cliff I don’t see Ricoh dumping any significant money into R&D on a floundering camera brand. It makes little to no sense to do so when you’re actively losing money. And this is coming from someone who owns 3 Pentax DSLRs, 2 film bodies, and who knows how many lenses.Like1 month agopermalinkbrownie314brownie314

I don't know if the images will be good - but nothing can quite compete with the way a big 85mm prime sits on a body with the awesome looking big pool of glass out front.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkDericali

Got any samples?ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkdavid_sladek

Some, though not very great and not full size, samples herehttp://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/star_lens/special/sp_dfa85-14/impression/Like1 month agopermalinkSnapper2013

Got a nice compact size to it.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkwats0n

this should make all 4 Pentax users happy...ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkbaldeagle21b

My, but aren't we clever today.Unlike1 month agopermalink

david_sladek

@wats0n Some great Maths masters here today.... few users already counted to two and three... fingers crossed noone beats you with five! :)Like1 month ago*permalinkunhappymeal

I don't know why people rip on Pentax or DSLR users. I'm a m4/3 shooter, but that's because I value the hybrid capabilities of the Panasonic cameras (also the nicely fleshed out lens line-up). DSLRs are still incredibly capable devices for still imagery with notable advantages. You can get a Nikon D610 + battery grip + 50 f/1.8 G for $1,000 CAD. That combination will give you over 1,000 shots of battery life with image quality competitive with the Z6. Yes, it weighs more and that is a legitimate concern for some, but otherwise, that's hard to beat.Like1 month agopermalinkReactive

I agree the OP's comment is silly, but it does make you wonder what the production run will be. It's a heavy and expensive lens that will be bought by a small proportion of users of a relatively unpopular brand. I guess there's heaps of profit in that price or they wouldn't bother.Like1 month ago*permalinkDarren James

I can’t afford it, can’t speak for the other 3 thoLike1 month agopermalinkBNapa

@wats0n, you missed one. With me it makes 5!!Like1 month ago*permalinkRolliPoli

+ 1 here = 6Like1 month agopermalinkErgo607Ergo607

[quote]and can be used in tough conditions when paired with a weather-resistant Pentax camera.[/quote]

Since the K200D (released many moons ago), every Pentax DSLR has been weather sealed...Somehow I don't see myself using this lens on an *istD...Reply

Like1 month agopermalinkSmitty1

Or maybe they are just touting the fact that Pentax cameras are weather-resistant...Like1 month agopermalinkstarbase218

“Since the K200D (released many moons ago), every Pentax DSLR has been weather sealed...”

(Cough) K-x K-r K-500 K-01 K-S1Like1 month ago*permalinkAlex Sarbu

Actually the one non-weather sealed camera which is compatible with this lens is the K-S1.Like1 month agopermalinkIxoyeIxoye

It looks gorgeous....ReplyLike1 month agopermalinknimo_ornimo_or

Another engineering marvel from Ricoh / Pentax. Probably, I will sell all my Pentax glasses and buy/keep only the following : DFA 85 /1.4 and the upcoming DFA 21 Ltd for portraits and landscape respectively.

Pentax K1 with DFA 85 and DFA 21 will be the solid combo for my needs for several years.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkzakariazakaria

That is what iam thinking .k1ii with dfa*50mm dfa 21ltd and dfa*85 plus fa 31mm ltd. What a set!Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

Why not have all of them? :)

I have in the Limiteds, the 31, 43, 77 + 21 in the futureDFA* I have 50/1.4, 70-200/2.8 + 85/1.4 next monthFor padding I have a 25/2.8, 55/1.8 + 50 & 100 Macro's + a 1.4TC.I'm in a good place with my kit bag, Pentax release a new DFA* or Limited and I'll probably get it. Pentax release a flagship body in APSC or FF and I'll probably get it. Its all about the cadence now and or if I feel like I want to track down some exotica like a 200/4 Macro or 300/2.8 or 600/4 I have reached the end of my LBA.Like1 month agopermalinkstarbase218

@Robbie Corrigan I'm not him but for me at least, what is gained by having so many similar and overlapping options is outweighed by not knowing the lenses as well as I can, stressing over which ones to use, and generally having a focus on the gear instead of the photography. Plus it costs more money. There is an elegance to compromising if the compromise is made in a good way.Like1 month agopermalinkOld Cameras

Is this some sort of collaboration, like the 50mm was also a Tokina? I’m skeptical that Ricoh could justify developing such a premium lens for its ONE full frame camera that’s been around for years now. I’m curious how many of these they expect to sell and whether that would pay for the R&D and production tooling and setup - doubt it. Will this lens show up branded as a Tokina in EF and F mounts later on?ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkdavid_sladek

No collaboration50 wasn't Tokina, but a Pentax design licenced by Tokinawho says K-1 is the last FF?What is wrong with all of you asking about re-brands/collaboration etc. ? Why is this the first question so many people here feel they need to ask?Like1 month agopermalinkOld Cameras

The 50mm IS a collaboration, that’s why you can buy a Tokina Opera version of the lens for F and EF mounts wearing a different suit of clothes. Ricoh also name brands several Tamron lenses, undoubtedly to save development costs. It seems unlikely that they would develop this very expensive lens solely for the K1, which would only be of interest to a small subset of K1 users. I’m just curious from a business perspective. I think they’d have to sell at least several thousand within the first 2-3 years to break even on R&D and setup unless the costs were shared, but that’s just a guess.Like1 month agopermalinkdavid_sladek

@Old Cameras Why would Tokina need to colaborate on design/development if they wanted to licence it and sell under their brand with modification? You don't necessarily need to colaborate for that. I think I heard there was some agreement on sharing production facility but do not know how much truth there is. Both lenses have dedicated micro websites where Ricoh/Pentax developers talk about the process of designing and developing them. With both lenses they also clearly stated that they were designed to satisfy requirements of future cameras and sensors. This makes perfect sense if a lens is only upgraded once every 10-15 years or so...Like1 month agopermalinkOld Cameras

David SladekThen that is good news for Pentax and the future of k-mount. It’s suggests they are planning on new FF cameras. I believe the 36mp sensor is basically the same one used in the original A7R and the D800/810. It would seem that only the K1 uses that sensor today. Perhaps they’ll change to another more current sensor from Sony. Regardless, good news, I hope Pentax persists.Like1 month agopermalinkDericali

The 50mm IS a collaboration, that’s why you can buy a Tokina Opera version of the lens for F and EF mounts wearing a different suit of clothesThat doesn't follow - you could buy this lens as Tokina Opera IF Pentax sold Tokina the licence to defray costs and Tokina used their own manufacturing processes.In the absence of any solid information to the contrary that is my understanding of the agreement but happy to be corrected if you've got well-sourced info. The Pentax was launched well in advance of the Tokina.Like1 month agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

david_sladek: I guess some people just can't accept Pentax - of all brands - is a top level optical lens maker. This would be slightly more palatable if someone else made the lens...Except nobody was able to link the 50mm f/1.4's development with Tokina in any way. No patent assigned to Tokina; no engineer talking about the challenges during its design.If they insist on comparing "Pentax" (Ricoh Imaging's) and Tokina's lens design capabilities... RI just released one of the best 85mm f/1.4 to date, while Tokina rebadged a Viltrox. 'nuff said.Like1 month agopermalinkOld Cameras

DericaliThen we’re having a semantic argument over the word “collaboration”. The Pentax and Tokina versions of the 50/1.4 lens are the same. It’s the same lens, exactly the same, with differences in the casing and the mount, obviously. This was obviously done to same money by sharing costs - that’s what collaborate means. The Pentax version is $1050 currently and the Opera is $950. The Pentax versions of Tamron lenses are also more expensive.If the 85/1.4 does NOT turn out to be a collaboration then that’s good news for Pentax cameras

because that means they could make a business case for the lens without having to collaborate and share costs and production with another manufacturer, like Tokina or Tamron. I don’t care what it says on the Pentax website, they would divulge information of shared costs or production anyway, in fact they would go out of their way to hide that information.Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

Not a collaboration. No Tokina offering in the works. The reason they can design, build, and offer for sale a bespoke FF 85/1.4 is probably because there are people like me who enjoy using the system and will buy the glass as and when it is offered up. Now please refrain from trying to create FUD about the K mount system.Like1 month agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

Tokina likely gave up rebadging Pentax D FA*s lenses after their first attempt, as "their" 50mm Opera didn't sell. Even on this site, it has 3 "I own it"...Like1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts Might well be a secret cooperation, i.e. a cooperation contract with non-disclosure clauses. Possibly, Ricoh was fed up by the public image that others have to (help) designing lenses for them.The cooperation model with Tokina might be, that Ricoh rents computing time at Tokina, using Tokina's know-how embedded into Tokina's lens computing software. For zooms, I don't believe that Pentax/Ricoh is able to design good zooms on their own, because such are challenging to design for todays quality expectations. Pentax never learned that in their history. But for "simple" primes, maybe they still can do something on their own, w/o the help from others like Tokina, and w/o just rebranding old Tamron lens designs. But because this lens will become a market failure (the Pentax community remainder is too tiny, and the wrong one anyway for such a lens), I don't think that Ricoh will have invested too much on their own.Like1 month ago*permalink(unknown member)

@dpthoughts.. ROFLSeriously? Is that all you have. Talk about clutching at straws. Go away, get some proof and come back you pathetic little troll.Like1 month agopermalinkffking

Might well be a secret cooperation,Yes, indeed, that is a theoretical possibility - well done!

Now, can we get back to reality and away from empty speculations whose only intent is trolling.Like1 month agopermalinkHeliar

I confirm this lens is a fruit of secret cooperation. In fact, that was cooperation with me. Ricoh reached out to me, because they knew I designed many lenses under no-disclosure agreement, like for example, Nikkor Z Noct 58/0.95 (we all know that Nikon never learned how to do ultra fast lenses in their history, the old ass noct from the days of yore is riddled with chromatic aberrations) and Fujifilm XF 200mm/2.0, as Fujifilm corporation wasn't sure whether the Fuji X community is good one for such a lens and didn't want to invest too much on their own.

I'm very humbled by the admiration DPR's community has for all those lenses. They encourage me to do more of such work, even in this troubling times. I'd love to show you my next design, but unfortunately, it's another secret cooperation.

Stay safe everyone. Watch out for 5G towers and may your tinfoil hats always be shiny.Like1 month agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

Tokina is the company which - recently - didn't design their own 85mm, preferring to rebadge a chinese lens, a Viltrox. Now we know why, they rented all their computing power to Ricoh Imaging and forgot they needed it themselves <rolling eyes>Why is that troll tolerated, I wonder? It's not even funny.Like1 month agopermalinkrjmcsr

This old talk over and over again "The patent for the Pentax HD FA 50mm f/1.4 SDM AW lens was filed in Japan by Ricoh"https://pentaxrumors.com/2019/08/24/the-patent-for-the-pentax-hd-fa-50mm-f-1-4-sdm-aw-lens-was-filed-by-ricoh/#more-6860

The 85 is a Pentax/Ricoh design also, with short R&D resources and necessary long development period. And saying Pentax doesn't know how to develop zoom lenses is naif and history denying...is like saying Canon doesn't know how to make IBIS..or doesn't know how to make MF lenses...Pentax effectively does :) and I know Canon can also do it if they want :)Like1 month agopermalinkMagnus Wedberg

@Old Cameras: Tokina doesn't seem to have any resources for optical designs anymore, their recent lenses being rebadged from other makers (or badge-engineered/possibly re-coated versions of their own older lenses). So it seems the Opera may be licensed from Pentax/Ricoh, not the other way round.Unlike1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts

Pentax "father of the Limiteds", Yun Hirakawa, left Pentax already during the early Hoya era, and went on to an opportunity with a brighter future (to Tamron). I suspect that Hoya had dissolved Pentax' lens design team completely, because this would have made sense. Hoya wanted to cut down resources and costs wherever possible, and they had already Tokina as their preferred lens maker. Also Hoya must have realized, that even $1000 Pentax "star" lenses are just cr*p, i.e. mediocre optically, and equipped with a quickly-failing "SDM" lens motor. For example, the $1000 DA* 16-50mm 2.8. If I was Hoya, I would have dissolved such a handicapped and unable team fragment (now without Hirakawa), as well. So I assume, that since after Hoya, Pentax was on ground zero again, not having any more lens making experience than any recent Chinese lens maker.Like1 month ago*permalinkdpthoughts This would explain why the Pentax team need others (Tokina again, or Tamron) to get out something new, possibly by renting computing time, software, and engineering skills embedded into such Software (from Tokina), or by just re-badging old-to-very-old Tamron lenses, after having ripped out their optical stabilization (which would have been superior to IBIS where IBIS only has a tiny movement leeway). After the Tamron lens got downgraded so much, Pentax then adds a hefty price surcharge for their achievement.Like1 month ago*permalinkdavid_sladek

@dpthoughts

Seriously, the amount of assumptions driven by your contempt for the brand is incredible. You have no proofs but won't stop pushing you agenda.Like1 month ago*permalinkffking

@david_sladek -I think that's it's deeply sad that dpthoughts has nothing better to do than spend his time endlessly vomiting bile all over Pentax and Ricoh threads, particularly when nobody takes him seriously, but I suppose we all need a hobby, and at least his does no real harm to anybody.Unlike1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts I'm just iterating soberly over facts and assumptions. It is the fanb*ys who are vomiting bile, as always. Some other facts are: the Tokina Opera variant of the 50mm 1.4, i.e. with Canon/Nikon mount, was a desastrous market failure for these markets. Nobody wanted such a lens with such

characteristics (including heft and weight). At Amazon.com, it ranks at #1,803 in SLR Camera Lenses (both mounts combined). No sale. The Pentax variant seems not even listed at Amazon, can't find it there. I.e. literally zero sales interest then. So it is easy to extrapolate, that a Tokina Opera or Pentax 85mm 1.4 will be a complete market failure as well. From there, it can be assumed, that only little development effort/risk has been sunk in such a lens. I doubt that this is a Pentax only lens, due to expectable return-on-investment = zero, but on the other hand, I doubt that Tokina will want to market it as well (given the failure of the previous 50mm 1.4).Like1 month ago*permalinkdavid_sladek

@dpthoughtsyou obviously have access to market research of all these companies, so perhaps you could share the data?Like1 month agopermalinkffking

Ah - a nonsense level up!Like1 month agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

Still curious why dptoughts is allowed to lie and troll continuously.Mr. Iwasaki, Product Planning; Mr. Watanabe, Product Exterior Design; Mr. Nomura, Optical Design; Mr. Oara, Mr. Ito, Mechanical Design - here are names (and faces, if you follow the link) which we can associate with the development of the D FA* 85mm f/1.4.http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/star_lens/special/sp_dfa85-14/interview/Mr. Iwasaki, Product Planning; Mr. Enomoto, Mr. Saori, Optical design; Mr. Iikawa, Mechanical Design; those are names (and faces) we can associate with the development of the D FA* 50mm f/1.4.http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/star_lens/special/sp_dfa50-14/interview/Then there are the lens patents which don't appear without any kind of research.Last but not least, we have Pentax-developed lenses appearing on the market.With all these, what kind of person would still "suppose" there's no development department?Like1 month agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

The Tokina is largely ignored on this site - 3 "I own it", despite being offered for Canon EF and Nikon F. This might be because people interested in a high quality 3rd-party 50mm f/1.4 already had, or decided to buy a Sigma Art.The Pentax D FA* 50mm f/1.4 has 44 "I own it", more than an order of magnitude higher, despite being for the much less popular Pentax K.I suspect Tokina indeed doesn't sell, and that there will be no further rebadging of high-end Pentax designs. It's sad to see Tokina rebadging instead Viltrox lenses...

Like1 month ago*permalinkdpthoughts Actually I found the Pentax variant of the 50mm 1.4 on amazon.com, where it costs $1100 and ranks down at #861 in "SLR Camera Lenses". That's almost zero. But interestingly, the Tokina Opera variants (from $800) sell even nearer to zero, because for Nikon and Canon, there are much more attractive alternatives around, than such a Tokina Opera 50mm 1.4. The same can be expected for this 85mm 1.4 lens (if Tokina will ever offer it for Nikon/Canon mounts) (which is highly unlikely though, given its sibling's market failure).Like1 month ago*permalinkdavid_sladek

@dpthoughtsand what is your point? does it make it a bad lens?and why do you care? why don't you take pictures with what you like and let others do the same?Like1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts I'm just wondering about what has been driven this overall lens package:=- hefty price=- hefty weight=- hefty size=- No body available, which would have a decent-enhough autofocus to deal with such a shallow DoF- so effectively, it is to be used as a manual focus lens mainly, but w/o the manual focusing aids of mirrorless EVF (focus peaking), so this doesn't work out well neither=- No (serious) people photography community left at Pentax, The few ones had left many years ago, to where they were served consistently better.- the remaining tiny crowd of landscape hobbyists won't buy such a lens. So I think this lens is an absurdity. I have actually no idea, what the point of this lens is (for Pentax). My writing is more to express my astonishment, how the downfall of a brand is accelerated all the time, due to ongoing wrong product decisions.Like1 month ago*permalinkffking

One of Richard Dawkins' less know contributions to Western thought is identifying 'Argument by personl incredulity ' as a logical fallacy :)

While we're at it -I think Mr Thoughts takes too much of the concerns of Ricoh management on himself - they are in a far better position to judge what is ensible than he is.

Also, he devalues everything he says by his incapacity to say anything positive about Ricoh/Pentax - apart from being insulting to all those who choose to use the system it demonstrates a total lack of objectivity. I use Pentax cameras and lenses - I criticise their weak points as well as praise their strengths. He doesn't use Pentax cameras and has nothing good to say about them. Seriously, if anybody had to chose, would they benefit more from listening to somebody in my position or his?Unlike1 month agopermalinkDericali

can dpthoughts just have their account deleted? What a waste of space. Their talents could be put to use on a Russian bot farm.

@dpthoughts184984738383Like1 month agopermalinkMariano Pacifico

Bring it on Ricoh. Tired of Canon and NikonReplyLike1 month agopermalinkHandsome90

The more the merrier!Like1 month agopermalinkTBLF

This is not going to make people with LBA lives any easier.*Drool*ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkdavid_sladek

Just seen the manufacturer MTF ... it really looks better than Zeiss Otus 85/1.4ReplyLike1 month agopermalinktex

Well, I'm a Pentaxian....but I'd say let's wait and see on that one. I'd like to see independent testing....Unlike1 month agopermalinkCAT Productions

CAT Productions

The Zeiss Otus 85/1.4 is getting a bit long in the tooth. Lol, still amazing no doubt, but others have started to catch up.Like1 month agopermalinkTactical FalconTactical Falcon

Okay let's assume for the moment this lens is amazing. $1899.95 USD is allot of green here. This thing is a heavy too. I wrapping my head around this and this keeps being spit out. A Sigma Art lens 85mm f1.4 selling now at B&H photo new for $1099.00 USD, built very well, nice optics, weighs less at 2.49 pounds or 1130g. Versus 1255g or 2.77 pounds. Doesn't sound allot, but when you are traveling, the weight matters. Every once counts. Also my budget does too. Glass is expensive already, and I have shot with the Art lens, and it is very nice. Interesting point also, Sigma is no longer supporting the K mount for Pentax moving forward. I had a Pentax K5 mk.2. Nice stills camera. But my needs changed and Pentax was no longer able to fill those needs. I have no intention of going back to Pentax. Though at the time I did enjoy that K5 mk.2. Reminded me of a 4/5th scale pro camera. Made nice, weather sealed dual mode dials, battery grip option. Nice glass. Was well made and trouble free.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinktex

So, a couple of things here. First, when backpacking, yes, every ounce counts. Traveling? That's just hyperbole. Since 2000 I have traveled to 10 countries on 4 continents (plus Japan, Ireland and the UK/Scotland) and made multiple trips to the western U.S. by plane, as well as 3 cross country driving trips. So, I know for a fact that several ounces don't actually make a difference traveling.

Next, this is obviously a high end lens that is native to the system and designed with it in mind, no knock on Sigma---except as you mention they have decided to stop supporting Pentax. Sounds like it may have some aspects superior to the Sigma (but we'll see).

Finally, you say you left Pentax and are not coming back. I'm struggling to understand your stake in this.Like1 month agopermalinkkobian

Fa 77 mm is the best for travellingLike1 month agopermalinkAdam007

Let me split the difference here.

When I finally gave in an bought the DFA* 50mm 1.4, I swore I'd never travel with it. What BS - I leave stuff at home so I can bring it with me everywhere. However, the 50 is much more versatile

than the 85, so should I cave in once again, I expect to keep my promise this time.Like1 month agopermalinkunhappymeal

@tex I would be careful about being unequivocal about your statements. Not everyone is the same. My wife is quite petite (5 ft. 3, 80 lbs.) and a few hundred grams is immediately noticeable to her. For me, it's nothing. Having said that, I would agree that it's marginal for anyone shooting with a FF DSLR.Like1 month agopermalinktex

@unhappymealThat is correct, people are different. If you go FF, or medium format and FF as I have, one sorta figures you know what you are getting into. Also, I spoke of Traveling, as in aircraft, trains, & etc. Not carrying. Carrying is another matter entirely, and there may be lots of reasons---including disabilities, arthritis, & etc, where a few ounces do make a difference, especially with respect to ergonomics. For me, finally having good bags, packs, and straps was very enlightening. BTW, just turned 64...

Finally, It does irk me when people who have zero stake in a system jump in to criticize it. I have had meh things to say about Canon and Nikon both---but I also use these at work. But I tend not to jump into threads about other systems to criticize them, unless it's to refute a claim that's tendentious, cherry-picked, or just not accurate.Like1 month agopermalinkTactical FalconTactical Falcon

No struggle at all. I just went in a different direction that is all Tex. Real easy. Cheers.Like1 month agopermalinkPentUp

Yes its expensive and when you convert that price to Australian $$ I may well not be able to afford it... But on an APSC body (127mm) it would make a great night time African wildlife lens (for night drives).Not everyone's travel lens requirements are the same...Like1 month agopermalink6x96x9

That's a MONSTER lens!And beside this, it is an SDM drive again? No, thank you!Pentax refused to recognize design flaw with their earlier SDM lenses failing in large quantities, did not offer a free fix after warranty (unlike Nikondid with their D610).

I will stick to my 77mm Limited for now.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkMikeyBugs95MikeyBugs95

This SDM is a new "SDM." It's the same type of motor found in the DFA*50 - a ring motor. Not a micromotor like in the DA*'s of old.Like1 month agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

Sigh... if people would get informed before complaining... at least read the product page, folks!SDM is just a label, like Canon's "USM". I will post once again the image with the D FA* 50mm f/1.4's SDM motor next to the old-style, micromotor SDM. The D FA* 85mm employs a more powerful ring-type motor, which can be seen in the next link.http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/japan/products/star_lens/special/sp_dfa50-14/img/a6_img_01.jpghttp://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/star_lens/special/sp_dfa85-14/img/a4_img_01.jpgLike1 month agopermalinkdavid_sladek

If you didn't bother reading about the AF than why asking? The drive is a completely new ring motor (upgraded one from D-FA* 50/1.4)... the old SDM is not used in new Pentax lenses anymoreLike1 month agopermalink6x96x9

david_sladek:Was you comment addressed to me personally ? You do not know me, I do not know you. I would appreciate if you can make an effort to stay polite.

Regarding the matter: nobody can be sure in anything before the "Thing" is released and there is some statistics. When the previous SDM generation of lenses was released, there were many complaints, then Pentax made a statement that the updated SDM design solved this problem. But this was not entirely true. There were still issues (but less than initially). My $700 lens failed after just over a year of a very light use. It was just out of warranty. Pentax refused to recognise their fault and wanted to charge over $300 for repair.My complaint was mainly about the wrong decision made by Pentax at that time of not acknowledging their fault and not rectifying the problem in the way which would keep their customers happy.Like1 month agopermalinkffking

It's sort of understandable that Ricoh didn't want to start their time as owners of the late Pentax Corporation by shelling out vast amounts of cash on a problem they were not responsible for, but I don't think that would have been much comfort if I'd owned one of the affected lenses.Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

There is always one, head to the 85mm special site or even read the DPR article, it says Ring Motor, a more powerful ring motor than the 50 to shift the extra glass at the same performance level. DA* SDM != DFA* SDM. Really, really simple concept. Say it back to yourself 21 times and it might sink in.Like1 month agopermalinkdavid_sladek

@6x9

it was a reaction to your message which made clear link between the old micromotor SDM and the new SDM. The new SDM is an upgrade of the DFA*50 SDM. I happen to have the lens and not only the design of the drive is totally different (and you can already prove this), the issue that there was on the old SDM cannot be replicated here because there is no plastic rotating wheel responsible for moving the glass. That is just a fact and clearly visible from the images even for this lens. So I just don't get the 'oh no, it's SDM again' thing. SDM is a silent drive motor. It is a name that Ricoh/Pentax is using. Others use different. But there cannot be bigger difference between the old and new SDM.BTW I had to send my 50-135 SDM for replacement too, so I know how annoying it is. But just from seeing the pictures and reading the basic description of this lens you would have been reassured that it is a different beast.Like1 month ago*permalinkdpthoughts It probably doesn't matter much, if the SDM would be "new" versus "old". The SDM helped destroying Pentax reputation a lot, for fragile lenses that wear out and fail quickly, due to some lack of engineering skills there. This is the worst thing which can happen to a lens maker, and it takes a long time for people forget this engineering legacy. It is just like with the Pentax autofocus. With every camera since their "*ist" model some 15 years ago, Pentax said "now the AF is good". But it was still bad, of course, as ever. So why should people suddenly trust any "now the SDM is good" statements?Like1 month ago*permalinkffking

@dpthoughts - try to make up your mind whether Pentax design and make these lenses or not.Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

@dpthoughts, because it is a completely new design and an over engineered one at that. Fact is DA* SDM != DFA* SDM. I have had a failure with a prestine 16-50 which I rarely used and probably killed the capacitator due to lack of use, I just converted it to body drive. I also have a much more worn 50-135 which is working away quite happily. The DA*s used micromotors whereas the DFA*s use big torquey ring motors, different animals altogether. You're also getting Pentax under an asset stripping Hoya mixed up with a much more engineering focused Ricoh.Also AF has improved with each generation. I have seen noticeable steps from K20D through K-5 through K-5iiS through K-3 and K-1 and will expect another jump with the new K-APSC.One of the reasons that this will have an oversized OVF is to allow the AF array to fit the forthcoming K-1 replacement so it will have wider spacing over the current AF array.Now be a good boy and crawl back under your bridge troll!Like1 month agopermalinkOiche

A monster lens is required to pass test charts and as sharp in the corners as the centre. As you know you will be staring at the corners of your portrait photographs.

It's yet another monster lens for internet forum arguments, whatever happened to the idea of lenses for photography?Like1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts

I think Ricoh is 5 to 10 years late to the game. The era of monster lenses (heft, weight, costs, monstrous corner sharpness) seems to be going downhill again, since the recent years. The lenses which are high in demand today, are those where top quality is engineered into compactness (of course utilizing mirrorless flange distance opportunities). So, the newest Pentax lenses are like dinosaurs of the past. Nobody wants to suffer the heft and weight of carrying around a few lenses of such kind.

In particular not at Pentax, with a tiny landscape hobbyist community left over, but no (serious) people photographers.

The other Problem: If you offer a lens, with such a shallow depth of field, your brand's AF needs to be ready for that. Pentax isn't. Canon and Nikon DSLRs are, and all mirrorless models from all brands are able anyway. These set the new standards for focusing precision and success rate, anyway. But for Pentax AF, a 85mm 1.4 lens just doesn't make any sense at all.Like1 month ago*permalink6x96x9

@david_sladekMy point was that using wording like "If you didn't bother reading ..." was rude.Pentax made a mistake years back not recognizing the problem with their initial SDM concept. This is the fact. Does not matter how good the new SDM is, the "shadow of Hamlet's father" is still there.

Like1 month agopermalinkffking

Oooh! I love literary references - you know you're dealing with sensible people :))Like1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts 6x9 just tries to bring across, Pentax demonstrated they didn't have the mechanical skills to engineer a proper lens motor (SDM), and likewise embarrassing, they didn't acknowledge the problem of the resulting mass failures, across all of their expensive SDM motor lenses. Even if a new SDM is different, that doesn't tell if it is better or more reliable this time, maybe it will last a year longer than previously, maybe not. Only time will tell, in a few years. Until then, it is a risk of just burning money.Like1 month ago*permalinkAlex Sarbu

Reading about the motor is the minimum one could do *before* bashing. And if the "shadows" persists because of such ill informed claims...SDM is just a label, just like Canon's USM - both were used for micromotor and ring motors.Like1 month agopermalink6x96x9

@ Alex SarbuI was not bashing at all. I am Pentax user for long years. I shared my bad experience with SDM and I still consider that Pentax' made a mistake by not acknowledging a problem officially.Like1 month agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

6x9, I agree that Pentax - or rather, Hoya Corporation - should've handled it better.However, the fact remain that we're talking about vastly different motors, rather than "a SDM drive again". Have you seen the image with the two motors side by side?Are you aware you're talking about lenses introduced more than a decade ago? I see no reliability issues with the DC motor, the PLM or the ring-type SDM.Like1 month agopermalinkdavid_sladek

@dpthoughts @6x9maybe they did not officially acknowledge (their German Pentax engineer and repair technician did), but they changed the components back in 2012 and the new ring motors don't share any of the failing components so there is no reason why they should be linked to the old design

https://www.pentaxforums.com/articles/photokina-2012/jens-petersen-on-pentax-sdm-failure.htmlLike1 month agopermalinkronniemac

I've said this before and I'll say it again. I have the 7 original DA SDM lenses. All of them work perfectly, none have failed, ever. I know others have different experiences, but equally I know that every lens with electornics is not imune from failure. We hear about failure because it is something to write about. When things keep working, there's nothing to say. I like to offset this and just to repeat, all of my 7 DA Pentax lenses have work perfectly and always have done.Like4 weeks agopermalinkdpthoughts Each and every SDM lens out there was condemned to fail, if it saw enough actuations.The actual failure rate probably reflected, how often a lens was typically used.For example, the DA* 16-50mm F2.8, being a standard zoom, had extremely high failure rates (up to 50% failure chance per user, in some years, according to the Pentaxforums survey).Other lenses, which tend to used more rarely, and mainly collect dust while sitting on some shelves, were ususually below the SDM failure threshold.Some fanb*s which actually rarely take photos but just collect gear and write about it, had obviously no failures. Because it only happens, if a SDM lens sees some usage above a certain threshold. It also depends on what you photograph. Someone who does 5 pictures per weekend (only during some 'perfect' sunrise or sunset minutes) will never reach the SDM failure threshold neither, of course.Like4 weeks ago*permalinkdpthoughts Here is the survey: ALL SDM lenses saw failures, only one 18-135 kit zoom with a simple little toy motor (rather than "SDM") didn't see motor failures.https://www.pentaxforums.com/sdmsurvey.php?do=viewresultsLike4 weeks agopermalinkdavid_sladek

@dpthoughts I'll say it again: the new SDM is a completely new system where the cause of the failure that doesn't physically exist. Will it never fail? Nobody knows. Which is exactly the same situation with every other brand (except for manual lenses, of course)Like4 weeks agopermalinkdpthoughts Then I'll say it again, as well: Pentax demonstrated a lack of mechanical development skills with lens parts. This is the main problem. Therefore, any future developments suffer from such lack of skills, as well. Regardless if they call an SDM again SDM, or bananacactus or whatever. Also completely other mechanical lens parts could be affected next time. Pentax just don't develop and

test carefully in general, maybe. Then, Pentax was denying the problem, which was so evident to the entire community (over 200,000 Google hits, and a user survey): This demonstrates a certain service and customer orientation attitude. So it is not only the lack of skills, but also how a company deals with that. Of course we also don't know if this could have been a deliberate, planned obsolescence, to generate profitable income from mass repairs. Both of these things, skills and attitude, change much slower than product life cycles. It is a stamp which a company almost never gets rid of.Like4 weeks ago*permalinkdavid_sladek

@dpthoughtsI think you are going too far! Deliberate obsolescence?? Seriously?You keep talking about 10 years back, skills improve with time and experience . Most of what people know today was learned through errors and mistakes. Applying 10 year old experience to every future product is shortsighted, biased and wrong. If you do not want to trust Pentax products yourself, feel free, but stop fighting and discurraging people who have positive experience and scaring off potential buyers of products that are clearly not prone to issues that you (and others including me) experienced in the past.Like4 weeks agopermalinkHeliar

Pentax demonstrated a lack of mechanical development skills with lens parts. This is the main problem. Therefore, any future developments suffer from such lack of skills, as well. Regardless if they call an SDM again SDM, or bananacactus or whatever. Also completely other mechanical lens parts could be affected next time. Pentax just don't develop and test carefully in general, maybe.

As proven by D600 oil spitting shutter mech (never recognised by the manufacturer as oil btw, only "dust"), and D750 faulty shutter three(!) recall campaigns, Nikon demonstrated a lack of mechanical development skills with camera parts. This is the main problem. Therefore, any future developments suffer from such lack of skills, as well. Also completely other mechanical camera parts could be affected next time. Nikon just don't develop and test carefully in general, maybe.Like1 day agopermalinkdpthoughts But that was only one camera. Pentax had such an issue as well, see e.g.https://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/2918963 "It's oil on K-5 sensor".Googling "pentax k30 failure" yields half a million results.The difference to SDM is, that it was not only one product, but each and every SDM lens was flawed with such a limited lifetime. The SDM lenses that broke, were just those which were owned by users which used them more frequently than the average Pentax hobbyist, where most of such lenses just collect dust maybe.Like

1 day ago*permalinkdpthoughts I just learned, also Pentax camera bodies (not just their SDM lenses) suffered from mass failures:K-S2K-S1K-500K-50K-30Where the failure chance is about "every third". Probably again, each item is flawed, but the 1/3rd of most frequently using users got hit.Survey results are here:https://www.pentaxforums.com/articles/photo-articles/pentax-aperture-block-failure-survey-results.html So now I just learned, that Pentax is not very skilled mechanically in making cameras neither, which is in contrast to the fanb*y mythology around them. I save my above two posts, so I'll have them ready for re-use when I need to comment the expectable press release about Ricoh quitting their Pentax camera business, when every Pentaxian asks in comments "but why" and "I'm so shocked and surpised".Like1 day ago*permalinkdavid_sladek

@dpthoughts and you have learned that from 448 responses when most people who respond to these surveys are, obviously, those who suffer the issues. Seriously, you have to stop the hate! What are you trying to achieve?

Are you going to call all issues of the other brands too? Or are you just so obsessed with hurting Pentax that you can't eat and breathe without saying something bad about them?Like1 day agopermalinkHeliar

It's oil on K-5 sensor.

It's nice that you don't read what you link to. There are links to Canon suffering from the same problem in their flagship at the time. And also Canon treated the matter professionally, while Nikon in their infinite egotism said "use a dust blower".

Also that K-5 problem came with the Sony sensor package, and didn't show up in any relevant quantities. As opposed to D600 shutter mech, that resulted in class action lawsuit and a state enforced ban on selling it in China.

Just learned, also Pentax camera bodies (not just their SDM lenses) suffered from mass failures

Repair of that thing is very simple DIY that costs around 20 bucks, because that's how much the

spare part costs including shipping from China. And also, at least in Australia, Pentax repairs it free of charge out of warranty.

Indeed, what a failure. I mean, certainly a bigger shame than faulty shutter in a full frame camera that working pros often use as their daily driver, like D750.Unlike1 day agopermalinkHeliar

The difference to SDM is, that it was not only one product, but each and every SDM lens was flawed with such a limited lifetime."

None of the SDM lenses different from 16-50, 50-135 and 17-70 had a failure rate any bigger than Canon, Nikon or Sigma lenses. And if you say that the other lenses aren't reported a lot because they weren't used enough, then old SDM happened to fail when NOT used for a longer period of time. So no.

I save my above two posts, so I'll have them ready for re-use when I need to comment the expectable press release about Ricoh quitting their Pentax camera business, when every Pentaxian asks in comments but why" and "I'm so shocked and surpised"

Maybe wait until Nikon goes belly up, because following your "logic" their repeated failures with shutter, mechanically flawed lenses like 24-70 with chronic problems with stuck zoom ring (in a supposed workhorse of a lens) and wildlife-grade super expensive lenses that turn out decentered , is doomed indeed.Unlike1 day ago*permalinkdpthoughts Pentax has zero (serious) pros, because Pentax doesn't meet their bare minimum requirements, regarding performance, quality, reliability, dependability, and service attitude. Contrarily, the D750 has a lot of pros, indeed, for obvious reasons. My linked thread about the K-5 oil stains still has interesting posts containing valuable experiences, e.g.:When Canon and Nikon have defects, official responses happen, recalls, free shipping there and back are the norm. Sometimes companies make boo boos, at least Canon and Nikon try to make things right for their customers...

SDM failures, Shutter Blurring floating sensors, and now K-5 stained sensor means Pentax will remain QUIET !!!!!

No free shipping, no acknowledgment what so ever is Pentax business as usual, norm. Hoya will not pony up the cash to issue recalls, so its up to their loyal customers to pay for the recurring QC problems out of pocket, as usual.Like

1 day ago*permalinkHeliar

Valuable post = a vent from a random user that's similar to yours. "Blurring floating sensor" so much substance in this I can literally drown in it. This is what you base your claims on? Can I dig up and show you all the hate flow towards Nikon, then?

Nah, I wasted enough time already. I ended up in a pseudodebate with a dude that once put K-1 II in his gear list just so he could rate it one star. Your posts are one of the reasons this community is increasingly seen as toxic. Why is it tolerated here by moderators will remain mystery.

Goodbye.Unlike1 day agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

Heliar, my K-5 had the oil on sensor issue... it was promptly exchanged by Pentax.I remember very well, they addressed this very quickly.https://www.photographyblog.com/news/pentax_k-5_sensor_stainsThey said repair, but my camera was replaced.Like1 day agopermalinkdpthoughts What he refers to as "blurring floating sensor" is probably part of the Pentax shutter blur. For Pentax, their shutter shocks makes the wobbly sensors wobble. Pentax shutter blur in its own right is big enough to render cameras such as the D645 useless, but the wobbly sensor in the DSLRs seem to make an additional contribution to blurred images. Again, bad hardware design skills. Other brands don't seem to be affected that much AFAIK.Like1 day agopermalinkdavid_sladek

@dpthoughts "Googling "pentax k30 failure" yields half a million results."- Man, I'd hate to be your math teacher, but "About 45,100 results (0.46 seconds)" really doesn't equal "half a million". No wonder your perception of the error rate is so magnified.Like1 day agopermalinkdpthoughts I just googled again, to check for daily fluctuations. Right now google said "About 499,000 results (0.49 seconds)" when searching 'pentax k30 failure' (WITHOUT any quotation marks in the actual search query, of course). I was also surprised by that figure. Probably there's so much abundant internet content related to Pentax failures in general, which is therefore deemed as highly relevant by Google, so that the term 'k30' doesn't matter much as an additional restriction term?

On the other hand, if I modify the query to 'pentax k-30 failure' (i.e. k-30 instead of k30), Google returns 760,000 hits.Like21 hours ago*permalinkffking

Looks like there are many more Pentax users than any of us realised :)Like21 hours agopermalinkdpthoughts Yes that's strange. Maybe there is such a strong correlation between Pentax and failure, to an extent that Google algorithms assume that "Pentax" always implies "failure" and or vice versa. Else I wouldn't know neither, why there would be 1000 hits per remaining Pentax K-30 user ;)Like20 hours ago*permalinkdavid_sladek

@dpthoughts "Yes that's strange. Maybe there is such a strong correlation between Pentax and failure, to an extent that Google algorithms assume that "Pentax" always implies "failure" and or vice versa. "I just googled again, again without quotation marks, again from the UK, and this time got "About 36,200 results (0.46 seconds)". I think it rather looks that google knows exactly what number will make you happy so it gives you 10x what it gives me :) I knew regional differences are normal, but such fluctuation is truly questionableLike19 hours ago*permalinkMichiel953Michiel953

Probably a great lens, but the weight... Hold the camera, triangulated firmly, breathe in, breathe out, eye your subject and see it wavering in front of you.

I'm not man enough I guess.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkffking

But the IBIS is :)Like1 month agopermalinkMichiel953Michiel953

You've got a point, but feel that would not be adequate. Let's wait for a field test.Like

1 month agopermalinktinetztinetz

This sounds like noone was ever able to shoot with a medium format camera ever...Like1 month agopermalinkunhappymeal

...because tripods don't exist...Like1 month agopermalinkAbrasiveReducer

If you insist on full frame, high speed and good quality, it's going to be uncomfortably heavy.Like1 month agopermalinkMichiel953Michiel953

I was talking handheld, obviously.Like1 month agopermalink

Oiche

As per usual their sample photos are bloody terrible.

Seriously who are these 3 'photographers'? I ain't impressed, they did the same with the DFA* 50 f1.4 and others too.

Phone cameras have better samples but Pentax don't do marketing.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkReportOiche

It's time again for that flogged to death unfunny Pentax joke...

I wonder will all three Pentax users buy it?

HO HO HO HA HA HA or has somebody beat me to it?

I was actually using a Pentax * 60-250mm lens this morning, first photography in months along with first mountain visit in months. Pentax * star lenses are bellissimo ;)

ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkLensBeginnerLensBeginner

That one is actually one of the lenses I wait to get a good excuse to buy... always fascinated me.

Right now, I can't find a good excuse to buy any lens period... I'd like a good "event" set (i.e. a couple of good 2.8 zooms), but I don't really "need" them, so... either I'm set or I must try harder XDLike1 month agopermalinkOiche

60-250 is my long landscape lens (as I am a landscape photographer), used it at 250mm at dawn this morning for the sun rising, pity I brought my toy tripod by mistake but made do with it , as you do!Like1 month agopermalinkJoey Bagodonuts

For those of you saying there are only 3 Pentax users or saying "I wonder will all three Pentax users buy it?"

The joke is on you!!!!! There are 5 Pentax users. Bam! In your face! Whose laughing now?

(Although only 3 are able to afford this lens, so your probably right)Like1 month ago*permalinkKurgo

*bellissime. If you want to use a foreign language, do it correctly, dear lad.Like1 month agopermalinkio_bgio_bg

And suddenly Nikon's f/1.8 Z primes don't look too big now...ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkAbrasiveReducer

They're as big as ever.Like1 month agopermalink

PentUp

@io_bgThat's really great for Nikon!!... of course Nikon's f/1.8 Z primes don't have much utility for Pentax camera owners...Like1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts Nikon seem somewhat smart here. They comprehend, that there is an emerging trend towards compactness, and it is so strong, that it even "justifies" a f/1.8 line of lens, where the others usually aim for 1.4.Ricoh instead seem dumb in a way they don't comprehend this emerging trend towards compactness. They now start doing big monsters, as if we were 5 or 10 years ago. Actually, the two most important Zooms for the K-1 (standard and ultra wide zooms for landscape) are just rebadged Tamrons from that era, 10 years ago. Most camera makers look forward, whereas Pentax looks backward. As a side note, I believe that the downsizing trend was one reason of the death of Pentax budget medium format. The other reason was the superiority of the modern Fuji GFX system, of course. Which successfully brought the downsizing trend also to budget medium format.Like1 month ago*permalinkJohn McMillin

Yes, it's too big for me, too. But Pentax has the compact quality market covered. There's the wonderful, pocket-friendly 77 Limited that would be the choice for anybody concerned about weight and size.Like1 month agopermalinkDima_467

Even slightly heavier than sigma and on par with canon RF 85 1.2. Pentax going crazy.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkClass AClass A

Crazy good, you mean, right?Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

I thought all you mirrorless fans went that way because you couldn't handle the weight? and now you're giving out about the high end mirrorless glass?

The 85 will balance nicely on the K-1 and because the K-1 allows you to grip it securely in your hand, a few grams here and there won't bother us.Like1 month agopermalinkblank_

I used several Ricoh cameras since 2002 and always kind of liked the company, but it has to be said that they tend to launch the product 3-4 years later than they should.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkkobakokh

Probably it will be great lens, with 1255g weight and 1900 USD (!!!) price...ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkFotoni

DFA*50 is a very sharp lens especially at the center. Successful pixel shift with this lens means very realistic details even at 100% size. Its "only" major flaw is LoCa and CA generally when using wider than F2.8 - F3.2 in harsh light. Considering the price of the DFA*85, I'm not quite sure they have budget to reduce those CA issues. Is there any other lenses below two grands which perform better? I hope that this time Dpreview remembers it when reviewing the lens.ReplyLike1 month ago*permalinkdavid_sladek

Check out the samples on http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/star_lens/special/sp_dfa85-14/impression/I don't see any LoCa on themLike1 month agopermalinkMortal LionMortal Lion

It is not about the budget, it is about design choices. The 85 has a different design than the 50 because it is a portrait lens. https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/49944810027_40cdc0e31e_o.jpg I have no doubt dpreview will do their utmost best to find a flaw and turn that into a mayor problem. The fact it has a K-mount should be enough though.Like1 month ago*permalinkAlex Sarbu

Ricoh Imaging restarted the optical design from scratch so they'd be able to properly control CA.Indeed it might be the best in its class, for under $2000.http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/star_lens/special/sp_dfa85-14/interview/

Like1 month agopermalinkmoga

You should consider real APO designs like zeiss Otus. No other lenses gives you CA free images at 1.4 aperture, at 1.5-2k $. Maybe some macro lenses as well but those are 2.8.Like1 month agopermalinkMortal LionMortal Lion

I can produce CA free images with any lens.Like1 month agopermalinkRishi SanyalRishi Sanyal

It's too early to tell until we see full-resolution samples, but it does look like from the even lower-resolution sample of the water splashing that LoCA is well-controlled. We've been seeing a number of 85mm primes with well-controlled LoCA of late: Canon 85/1.4 IS, Sigma 85/1.4 Art, Nikon 85/1.8S, Canon RF 85/1.2. I'm glad to see manufacturers prioritizing LoCA performance in fast primes.Like1 month agopermalinkmatsonfamily

can we have a DP article on Chromatic Aberration? I just spent the last coule of hours researching this subject and found that I was wrong with several assumptions. I'd love to have a recent authoritative essay with examples and statistics. Or the URL of an already present article. :)Unlike1 month agopermalinkMortal LionMortal Lion

It has a concave front element like the Zeiss Otus (more concave actually) and it also weighs 55 grams more than the Otus, at less than half the price. So you pay $686.35 per pound. The Sony G master is $998.89 per pound so look who is expensive now. I know where I would buy my meat. :pLike1 month agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

@Rishy Sanyal: Sigma Art appears to show significant CA:https://www.opticallimits.com/canon_eos_ff/1000-sigma85f14art?start=1Like1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts

@matsonfamily, LoCA is what the Pentax 85 1.4 displays in the water splashing picture, even though they tried to reduce such weaknesses a little, by stopping down (to f/1.8). The water structures are purple in front of the focal plane, and cyan behind the focal plane. That's how you recognise LoCA most easily, if a lens suffers from that a little. They didn't dare to show it at f/1.4, that would have been interesting. We also don't know how much optical weaknesses have been repaired in post-processing, e.g. by desaturating such wrong color casts a little. This is why proper testing by DPR would be interesting.Like1 month ago*permalinkdpthoughts Why does it matter? If we assume for now, that the K-1 II will show off AF precision difficulties at such a shallow DoF scenario, in a real-life portrait shooting (rather than just manually focusing on 2-dimensional test targets), then such portraits will often have these LoCA color casts on facial features, resulting from very slight defocussing. These can ruin photos, because all what Photoshop/LR can do for you, is helping to desaturate ugly green or purple fringes into ugly gray fringes, and even that with limited success. So you can't repair it really.Like1 month ago*permalinkRishi SanyalRishi Sanyal

Alex: You're quite right; my memory seems to have failed me. The other lenses I mentioned do hold up well in this regard though; I just went back and checked our own comparisons / widgets / samples.

dpthoughts: Ah, I was looking at that image on a Retina display at 100%, and it was so small I couldn't see much purple fringing. Or, to me, it didn't look too offensive at that size, but that's the issue - we need full-resolution samples. And as you say that's at F1.8, so it looks like there might be a fair degree of LoCA at F1.4.

But, one should also keep in mind - that water splashing shot is a torture test for LoCA, so it'd be good to see how it performs across a variety of situations.Like1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts I think they created ideal conditions for the spashing scene: using a flash light to carefully control the light dose. With that trick, they mitigated two things: - the drops' highlights are only just about overexposed / very slightly blown out, therefore would show much less CA, than if it was a naturally sun-lit scene. =- The flashlight has No UV raditation, but UV is The one which may trigger purple fringing issues on some lenses. So if you would go out and do a test shot of sparkling water, but under natural sunlight this time,

then you may see a surprising amount of "natural" LoCA, which the Pentax test shot may hide a little from us. If no fountain is available, then classic cars or bikes with their chrome strips are also a good "classical" target of course.Like1 month agopermalinkHeliar

That water splash picture has way less CA than my Zeiss Makro-Planar 100mm F/2 has wide open in similar circumstances.

I'd also like to point out that 85mm Otus isn't zero LoCA either and you can see such fringing in similar conditions.

https://www.lenstip.com/415.5-Lens_review-Carl_Zeiss_Otus_85_mm_f_1.4_Chromatic_and_spherical_aberration.html

Anyway, I can't wait for some tests.Like1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts The Zeiss Otus 85mm 1.4 test shot is astonishing, no CA is really perceptible, beyond any relevance, even at 1.4.Whereas the Pentax seems to be an 1.8 only lens (only performing reasonably well until 1.8), this is why they didn't dare to do their splash photo at 1.4. Would have been too embarrassing. This may be a continuation of the Pentax prime lens heritage, that they are only good when stopped down.Like1 month ago*permalinkHeliar

If the Pentax at F/1.8 has LoCa levels of 2x more expensive, manual focus Otus at F/1.4, I call that a win.Like1 month agopermalinkdpthoughts Pentax at f/1.8 is worse than Otus at f/1.4. But as Rishi said, there are so many good 85mm lenses out there already, that all contemporary 85mm lenses would be a "win", if you just compare them to the price tag of the Otus. Pentax doesn't seem to add anything to the market. It adds just something for Pentaxians, because 3rd party lens makers have abandoned Pentax by now. Let me stand corrected: the Pentax 85 is even superfluous for Pentaxians, because there are no (serious) people photographers among them any more, since many years. Pentaxians are only a tiny landscaper crowd, and those don't buy such a lens.Like

1 month ago*permalinkHeliar

I disagree with the statement that it's worse. I'd prefer to wait with such evaluation till the lens gets released to the market.

There aren't that many contemporary 85mm 1.4 lenses that have similar optical quality. Nikkor AF-S G 85/1.4 is a bit long in the tooth, not that sharp and suffers from LoCA a lot. Canon EF 85/1.4 IS has similar LoCA problems, worse than Sigma Art 85 which is noticably cheaper. Sony FE GM 85mm F/1.4 is worse in almost all respects (except bokeh) than a Samyang which costs 1/3 of its price. Sigma Art 85mm is optically quite solid, but mechanically it's a value proposition and it shows.

I had some hope that I could make a reasonable discussion with you, but your claim that "there are no (serious) people photographers among Pentaxians" is an insult to people I know, who make quite a bit of money out of this kind of work, one of them actually being a brand ambassador in my country specialized in children photography.Goodbye.Like1 month agopermalinkmoga

Hey guys, I want to point out that I really like a bit of LoCas in my photos. It adds vibrance and character I don't find in an Apo lens like ZEISS Otus. Too much is not good and I prefer the purple-green ones than yellow-blue. Why are you so picky about locas, I don't understand. The pentax 50 1.4 is about perfect and sigma 50 1.4 Art as well.Unlike1 month agopermalinkdavid_sladek

@dpthoughts I am not taking this personally, but your claim about no serious Pentax people photographers is utter bulshit. You better start showing your serious work to support all your expert talk here. Because so far all you are doing is making people feel sick, angry and disenfranchised from coming to this websiteLike4 weeks agopermalinkWladislaw

I still have a positive sentiment for Pentax owning the MEF (autofocus in 1983) ME,MX, ME Super. Could never afford the LX in my youth. I switched in the digital era to Nikon. The D850 with Sigma 85mm 1.4 art is my winner. Looking forward to a dpreview test of this lens. Well done Ricoh.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkmmacleodbrownmmacleodbrown

I still use my collection of SMC K series primes on my Sony cameras. Sadly my Pentax camera has long gone, but as a lover of their glass I am glad to see them still producing what looks like a top

notch lens. Kudos to them and I hope they stay around for a long time..ReplyLike1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

What a shame for those poor K Series lenses :pLike1 month agopermalinkPentUp

Sadly my Pentax camera has long goneThen by another. They are (comparatively) not that expensive! :)Like1 month ago*permalinkwed7

with this, the DFA 50 and the DFA 21 Pentax going upmarket again, only for the Pentax faithful. Good luck and thank you Ricoh.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkDavid610

In 1984 Pentax released an 85mm f/1.4 that weighed 700 g lighter, had a 67mm filter, and yet was the third-highest rating lens on Photodo. Yes, it was not AF but it was superbly manufactured.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

Ricoh Imaging tried making a smaller lens; they just couldn't control chromatic aberrations as they wanted - the current design does.Like1 month agopermalinkTN ArgsTN Args

We've come a long way baby.Like1 month agopermalinkLensBeginnerLensBeginner

Completely different design priorities, consistently with the modern market trend.

Not saying it's good or bad; at least the "old" lenses are still available and compatible.

Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

Still a fine piece of glass with used values to match. Say hello to its successor's successor. Actually some are of the opinion that the 77 is closer to the A*85 in optical philosophy than the FA*85 which was more a dedicated portrait design.Like1 month agopermalinkAuricom 007

Day1purchaseReplyLike1 month agopermalinkBNapa

I am salivating over this lens. Little rich for my pockets. If I shot regularly as I did back in mid 2000s, I could buy and justify the relatively high cost.

Yes we do not have access to Sigma or Tamron glass. So be it. At last we have a modern AF option albeit an expensive one. At this price, it is made for working pros who can justify the cost by making money with it or it is made for amateurs with deep pockets!

We have to see bench marks to see how this lens compares to Sigma, Sony, Nikon and Canon offerings. For me I am comparing it to the Otus line of lenses from Zeiss, and for that comparison, Pentax is a bargain against the $4,400 price tag of the Otus 85.

Otus trio (28, 55, 85) is priced at $11,500. The Pentax trio (21,50,85) will be in the $4,000 range. Legend vs. legend, I would say Asahi Pentax rules at a bargain price.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkUser9362470513

I wonder how many working pros use Pentax today. Probably very few sadly.Like1 month agopermalinkJonathan MacJonathan Mac

But I think with each release it becomes more and more possible to use the Pentax system for professional work.Like1 month agopermalinkBNapa

@ User9362470513, we have to define working pro. If it is sports or video then Pentax is not the

system. For just about all other disciplines Pentax can deliver just as good if not better results than other systems. I shot weddings (ok not so great for weddings) and mostly commercial studio work with my K5IIs, K3 and K1. I also do landscapes and fine art work with K1. For the last two areas, I am shooting to enlarge to 40"x60" and beyond. Pentax K1 and my FA Limited lenses are more than up to the task. Even my Tamron 70-200 f2.8 gives me pro grade results.

I agree, Pentax is not the first name that comes to mind these days. But for people on the know who want to shoot at a high level and get it done at a reasonable price, then Pentax is in the running. Let's not forget that Pentax 645Z was the darling of the medium format world for a while before Fuji took over.Like1 month agopermalinkgameshoes3003gameshoes3003

Some of the commenters here have commented on how expensive the new mirrorless lenses have been. And now here is a Pentax lens that is way more expensive than any other, and they don't bat an eye. Well, here I see a brand new lens, and an excellent one. It's just amusing how often goal posts move.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkMyRealityMyReality

The few remaining Pentaxians are just glad to see something from Ricoh, so the price is beside the point. The motto of all Pentaxians:Nowadays, people know the price of everything, but the value of nothing. --- Oscar Wilde.Like1 month agopermalinkvscdvscd

I sometimes hear the music of his wife Kim.Like1 month agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

Similar mirrorless lenses are either more expensive, less ambitious or non-existent.But which of the commenters here commented? On the contrary, I see a comparison going more and more ridiculous (just for laughs), down to a Canon EF 50mm f/1.8Like1 month agopermalinkMortal LionMortal Lion

It's introductory price is just $100 more than the Sony G master 85mm 1.4 (which still is at it's introductory price (or again).

Like1 month agopermalinkOiche

Quoting a poet who smelt other mens farts, not my kind of philosopher.Like1 month agopermalinkvscdvscd

Yeah, and who is often citing has no own opinion...Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

Cheapskates :)

Pricing on top end Pentax glass is only going in an upward trajectory, materials cost money, money has less value, materials cost more, prices go up.Like1 month agopermalinkMyRealityMyReality

Prices go up for a number of reasons, including when desired objects reach almost a cult-like status: Phase-One cameras, Leica SL2, certain Otus lenses, certain Leica and Zeiss lenses. It can even include certain Leica M3's in mint condition.It does not hurt that Ricoh has essentially a captive audience in Pentax users that do not want to change brands.Every thing has it's point of diminishing returns and breaking point, which may be the reason that the super rich brand Nieman-Marcus declared bankruptcy.Like1 month ago*permalink(unknown member)

I was under the impression that Niemen-Marcus was leveraged to the hilt by the current owners. Lockdown stopped customers = no cash flow = not being able to service the debt taken on by the owners to purchase it in the first place. Bankruptcy.Like1 month agopermalinkMyRealityMyReality

@Robbie Corrigan - That may be true. Maybe the COVID-19 was just the catalyst the precipitated the breaking point. It looks like it may do the same thing to a lot of businesses.Like1 month agopermalink

Gesture

Props to Ricoh. Stayed the course better than many after an acquisition.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkphoenix15phoenix15

It seems that Ricoh didnt provide product to review to DPR. If you wish to see what this lens can perform go read this;http://www.ricoh-imaging.co.jp/english/products/star_lens/special/sp_dfa85-14/impression/ReplyLike1 month ago*permalinkjohnamijohnami

Perhaps the correct comment is....hasn't provided a lens for testing yet......

Looking around. nobody has tested this lens yet outside Japan....The tests will come......Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

Lending DPR a lens is probably not a problem, lending DPR a photographer to show them how to use a photographers camera probably is :p - OK guys, here is the mode dial, we will take it off the Green symbol and take it step by step. First up we have AV...Like1 month agopermalinkmasklayermasklayer

Is it interesting to anyone else that all their recent D FA lenses have an AF/MF switch on the lens? What Pentax dslr doesn't have an AF/MF switch right next to the mount already?ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkTheRealYeats

Some earlier Pentax lenses also had an AF/MF switch on the lens. It can be easier to access the on-lens switch than the on-body switch, allowing the shooter to keep their hand on the lens.Like1 month ago*permalinkdrummercam

The AF/MF switch on the body retracts the body's AF motor pin. However, it also switches off AF on lenses with in-lens AF motors driven electronically, not by the motor pin (at least, for the ones I have and can test). With a legacy collection of Pentax AF lenses always available, the body AF/MF switch is needed and will remain. It might be the case that there are some lenses that do not use the in-body motor pin for electronic AF shutoff and need the lens switch. And it might simply be the case that the lens switch is just for user preference. I find the body switch very well placed and use it reflexively as needed.Like1 month ago*permalinkbrett nzbrett nz

To access Pentax's wonderful "catch in focus" shutter release you need to have either a manual lens or a lens that can be switched to manual - the body itself you leave on AF to access this feature.Like1 month agopermalinkOiche

Using my DA* 60-250 this morning the MF/AF switch on the lens was handier to get at rather than the one on the body, you can also operate it with your thumb without taking your eye of the viewfinder. ;)Like1 month agopermalinkdrummercam

brett's answer regarding catch-in-focus would be correct. Pentax has not always made the functions of its cameras abundantly evident. You need to read manuals and lens booklets very carefully, and even then there are sometimes translation issuesLike1 month ago*permalinkmasklayermasklayer

Brett NZ omg... Thank you for mentioning this! I've wanted to use that feature, but I never figured it out (and never took the time to find a manual). Good to know.Like1 month agopermalinkwy2lam

If this lens is a superlative like the ancient FA* 85, it would be legendary. Only if there's a new mirrorless system to back this up...ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkBNapa

Yes a mirrorless camera would be nice. For now I guess the K1 has to suffice!Like1 month agopermalinkClass AClass A

There are plenty of mirrorless options available.

What the market does not need is yet another player following the same trend.

I'd rather have Pentax focus on a quality OVF experience. Unlike what mirrorless evangelists would have one believe, using a DSLR can be a concious decision for an infinite refresh rate, zero lag, zero battery life reducing, natural white balance, and environment brightness adaptive viewfinder, which incidentally also allows the sensor to be free from PDAF sensels that can cause banding and striping.

Part of the fun of photography is producing images. Another big part is enjoying the process. I tried the best EVFs available and found them all horrible compared to a good OVF.

Apart from OVFs still making perfect sense for some, it would just be financial suicide for Pentax to try and play in the mirrorless market as well.Like1 month ago*permalinkyayatosorus

@Class A There's a lot of truth to that, and clearly there is a market for OVFs with companies like Fujifilm having new X-PRO and X100 series cameras developed every few years. I for one am very annoyed with the EVF experience when shooting in extreme low light, everything gets very grainy and rather unpleasant, which is one advantage of the OVF, aside from being really beautiful to look trough. The new 5.76m dots EVFs are very good and I can't wait for the day when even better ones will come out, but for now OVFs have a slight edge.I can see Pentax continuing to develop a DSLR niche, hopefully their new APS-C DSLR will be good enough to keep them around.Like1 month ago*permalinkQuarryCatQuarryCat

@ classBI started with Pentax and always enjoyed working with LX, 645, 67 and so on.But a 1.4/85 mm (built again at Tokina?) with size and measures of a 1.2/85 mm is ridicules.Nothing new on this lens - even Nikon did a fantastic 1.4/105 mm!Pentax - go light or go crazy.

And all you write about viewfinders and possibilities of better pictures by DSLM is wrong - you definitely hafe and real experience with Sony 7RIV, 9 or Nikon Z!So dream on with your working process - hope you have enough Kodachrome.Like

1 month ago*permalinkyayatosorus

@QuarryCatI've held a Z6 in my hands last week, and yes the EVF is great, so is the one on my X-H1 (it's the same), if you have some available light, but try and go do some outdoors shooting at night. And I'm not even speaking about using focus assist tool like peaking/punching in. Same goes for the 5.76m, it's good, but I think there is plenty of room for improvement. It's like when people were saying that 6mpx digital sensors are good enough, since that's what you needed for an A4 magazine cover print. Well good enough, yes, but why stop here?

As for OVFs, well it's a different beast -it does the same thing as an EVF, the experience is just different. Mirrorless and DSLRs are like driving a 2010 Lexus LFA and then driving a 1997 Porsche 911 GT1 Straßenversion. It does the same job, the internals are vaguely similar, but the experience is vastly different.Like1 month ago*permalinkffking

Nothing new on this lens What are you actually looking for @QuarryCat? It's a lens - it;s value is in the images it delivers not its size or eight or the numger of buttons on it - or anything else.Like1 month agopermalinkKeshaKesha

If Pentax gives us an option for high end mirrorless and design by real camera man, not that "Marc thingy" anymore....

Cross FingersLike1 month agopermalinkQuarryCatQuarryCat

@yaya...

kidding?Outdoor at night with DSLR?You should try a DSLM with f:4.0-5.6 lens against DSLR with the same lens without adapter - you get a dark screenor try to verify your dof... you can see it very clear with a 7RIV...and even at dawn for wildlife - I would never take again an DSLR with me...

in good light with a premium lens, a DSLR is fantastic and nearly 3D and you can see colors and dynamic still a bit better - but that's it.And Pentax viewfinder's are not Nikon HEP - they are mostly smaller and not as bright.Like

1 month agopermalinkyayatosorus

@QuarryCatHi, well I was just on my balcony - aside from the street lamps it's pitch black outside - with my Pentax K2, a Fuji X-H1 and a Pentax 135 f/2.5. Tried it side by side. Although the EVF can be brighter, when looking trough the OVF, you just know you're seeing the real deal. I mean I love my EVFs, there's a reason why I use an X-H1 over a DSLR, but I love OVFs too, there's place in this world for both.Like1 month agopermalinksnapasnapa

This lens almost makes me want to sell all my gear and get a Pentax system :/OK, I was only being facetious. It is good to see Pentax is still trying to stay in business.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkClass AClass A

Perhaps think again?

It looks like the new HD D-FA* 85/1.4 beats the Zeiss Otus 85/1.4 at MTF measurements:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/16-pentax-news-rumors/404671-hd-pentax-d-fa-85mm-f-1-4-sdm-aw-23.html#post5004093Like1 month agopermalinkdrummercam

The important point this lens proves is that Ricoh//Pentax, as underestimated as they too often are, has been able to keep a top-quality production line intact in spite of a dwindling market for cameras versus phone cameras, slow release pace, COVID-19, etc. I admire their high quality tenacity very much.ReplyUnlike1 month agopermalinkhikerdoc

Is that price not a couple hundred dollars lower than speculation just a couple days back? Good news for numbers of admirers who may now be thinking; Maybe, just maybe I could actually make this work!ReplyLike1 month agopermalink

zakariazakaria

What a piece of art! I have dfa*50mm and I'm sure this will surpass it .This lens brings up the prestige of Asahi OpticalReplyLike1 month ago*permalinkMyRealityMyReality

The prestige is still there for Pentax MF or 6x7 users. Those old 6x7 lenses were used by a lot of pros and still are used by some today.Like1 month agopermalinkOiche

Art? What would you call the Hubble Space Telescope then? A great engineering achievement or the finest painting? :)Like1 month agopermalinkCamera ConspiraciesCamera Conspiracies

Now try a camera that shoots video.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkClass AClass A

I wanted to upgrade my life to become a vlogging vidiot, but Stacey wouldn't let me.Like1 month agopermalinkNexUser

Class A, video isn't only vlogging.Like1 month agopermalinkClass AClass A

@NexUser

For Kasey it is.Like

1 month ago*permalinkdabhanddabhand

Why - I'm a landscape photographer - don't shoot video.Like1 month agopermalinkaris14aris14

I like both Stacey and Kasey...Like1 month agopermalinkMikeyBugs95MikeyBugs95

To be fair, Pentax cameras CAN shoot video. But video isn't their primary focus so they don't devote a whole divisions worth of resources into improving it much beyond what it is now. If you want to see a camera that DOESN'T shoot video, look at the Nikon Df.Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

Why? use the right tool for the job. Primary function of a Pentax camera is to take stills.Like1 month agopermalinkdrummercam

This is primarily a FF portrait lens, so I'm guessing probably indoor use mainly. But Pentax has become so adept at their weather resistance features that it is now second nature to build it into all their lenses.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkPhotodog2

85mm is my second favorite FL (next to 40mm) and I don't even shoot portraits. It's a great FL for landscapes and architecture with little distortion. It's also great for outdoor shots of pets. I use it a lot in dog parks, and a perfect walk-around FL for flowers and man made details around the neighborhood or city.Like1 month agopermalinkdrummercam

Thanks, Pdog2. I'm sure you use 85mm to good effect, but personally I'm not charmed by 85 as a walkaround. I do shoot urban environmental details, but I want a zoom for that to give me more framing options for things the sharpness of which I'm not overly concerned. 85 for me is a much

nearer subject range, for several reasons.Like1 month agopermalinkJensR

I use my DFA 100/2.8 Macro for landscapes and it's compact enough as a walkaround. I guess the 85/1.4 would allow me to focus my landscape photos at quarter moon rather than full moon, but that's a lot of bulk and money for that.;)I have no doubt that this lens takes amazing astro and landscape photos, but I think it's fair to say that these won't be the standard applications.I think Pentax will only produce new star lenses that are also AW, simple as that.Like1 month agopermalinkTheLastMan

Some of my best landscape and townscape photos have been taken when I have forgotten that I have left a telephoto on my camera, and not found out until I pulled it from the bag! It forces you to take a different perspective. Usual culprit is when I leave my DA 50-300 on my APS-C camera, which isn't too bad, but a couple of times it has been the DFA 100.Like1 month agopermalinkMHshooter

2x the price of Sigma's Art lens, almost and 6 times the price of a MF Samyang. I guess it'll be less expensive at retail at some point?ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkHowaboutRAW

MHshooter:

And Sigma has given up making new Pentax K mount lenses.

So why bother to bring up Sigma. Not sure how many FF SigmaARTs were ever made for the Pentax system. There are a few SigmaART APSC lenses for the Pentax system.Like1 month agopermalinkweihaowang

Why bother to bring up Sigma? Maybe to remind new buyers to think twice before they join the Pentax camp?Like1 month agopermalinkMelatonin

Did you really bring up Samyang??? Samyang is not even autofocus which is a necessity if you

make money doing this.Like1 month agopermalinkPDL

@weihaowangSo who appointed you to the Camera brand Police? Is it really any skin off of you that Pentax has finally released this lens?Like1 month agopermalinkMHshooter

Problem with Pentax and companies like Olympus / Panasonic is that when they bring these kinds of lenses out, they may actually believe there is a core group of professionals using the brand who will fork-over this kind of money. There probably aren't. Pentax/Olympus/Panasonic are not Nikon/Canon/Sony so they'll be selling the few copies of these lenses they do to a scant few enthusiasts. The price could be explained as what is needed to make any profit off such a lens, very small economies of scale, hence, it's costlier than even Nikon's 85mm. At least the suggested price is.Like1 month agopermalinkBNapa

@MHshooter, I agree with your argument.

What I could never understand is why a Sony which is selling in the 1000s of units is priced almost the same as Pentax which is going to sell in the 100s. The only answer I come up with is that Sony is printing money (by overcharging) while Pentax is struggling to keep the doors open. Canon and to a lesser extent Nikon have been known to gauge their users ever since I can remember. I guess that is the price you pay to use their system. Pentax, on the other hand, has priced their cameras and the lenses in a price range (low cost bodies, market price lenses) making them barely profitable to stay in business.

The irony of it all is that given the current economic situation, no one is immune to a collapse in sales, not even mighty Nikon or Canon.Like1 month agopermalinkNexUser

And 19x more expensive than Canon 50mm f1.8! :)Like1 month agopermalinkpanther fan

@Melatonin

Haha these days are long over. Samyang makes quite a few AF DSLR lenses and they have an amazing lineup of mirrorless AF lenses

They are actually quite famous for their mirrorless AF 85mm F1.4Like1 month agopermalinkweihaowang

Well, as a Pentax user, I warn others who would like to join this camp.Like1 month agopermalinkMHshooter

I've owned a few Pentax's like the Q, K-01, K10D, K20D, K3 and K2S. I like Pentax, but there is such a thing as "best destiny" and I don't think the pro-end is it. It sure wasn't for Olympus, though like we might have here, it did spawn some expensive lenses that are still popular today on the used market.Like1 month agopermalinkAlex Sarbu

There is a difference between informing people about the few third-party lenses, and "warning" them to stay away from the brand.Neither has the place here.Like1 month agopermalink(unknown member)

Quality costs, simple as. Look at the prices of its predecessors and see how they are holding up.Like1 month agopermalinkMHshooter

That was a case of no other real choices, the used cost of the old 85mm f/1.4. Though I'm sure it was a good lens. It's like when they discontinued the 35mm f2.0, prices went as high as $700.00.Like1 month agopermalinkforpetessakeforpetessake

Those large sexy lenses are just like pornography, they look desirable but have questionable utility. So I'd rather have a lowly Samyang 75/1.8, which weigh almost nothing and fits any pocket.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkwhawhawhawha

I agree with you. They would be of use either to people doing some serious studio photography or

as trophy gear for well heeled amateurs. I too would buy the Samyang as it would make more sense in the real world scenarios I’d use it in, but I’m still happy to see much maligned Pentax coming out with such beautiful equipment.Like1 month agopermalinkLeandros S

Indeed, fine art nude and boudoir photography are likely areas of application for this lens... (as well as portrait, wedding and whatnot)Like1 month agopermalinkquiquae

Does the Samyang 75mm have a K mount version?

No?

Then why are you bringing it up?Like1 month agopermalinkwy2lam

On the K mount this exists: https://www.google.com/search?q=pentax+77mmLike1 month agopermalinkmasklayermasklayer

What about the DA 70 limited, with an APSC body? I do prefer smaller lenses to, but I imagine for some, performance and ruggedness will be worth it.Like1 month agopermalinkfocal yokel

That 77 Limited is one great piece of glass.Like1 month agopermalinkOiche

Samyang vs Pentax * lens = Tom Hanks vs Mike Tyson for a boxing match

I do have the Samyang 14mm f2.8 though, for night/astro use only.Like1 month agopermalinkJensR

masklayer - FWIW, the DA70/2.4 is really a nice lens on the K1. Corners are not super great wide

open, but it's one of my favourite lenses on the K1. I finally bought it for that purpose after using it on a roll of film 12 years ago or so...Like1 month agopermalinkmasklayermasklayer

JensR - good to know, I don't have a K-1, and I'm not planning on going full frame any time soon, but I kind of want that lens, so it's good to know it would still be usable if I ever did upgrade.Like1 month agopermalinkwhawhawhawha

Truly beautiful lens as usual from Pentax and, as with all their high end numbers, the quality will be there.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkKurgo

Just realised this lens weighs more than the Sigma Art 85mm. What a chunky piece of glass.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkangerdanangerdan

It's even lighter than the Zeiss Milvus 85/1.4Like1 month agopermalinkPocketPixelsPocketPixels

Looks like a beautiful beast. Glad to see Ricoh do more for the full-frame lineup. I'm still happily APS-C with my K-S2, but if I ever do upgrade, nice to see the pro lenses grow.

Sidenote: C'mon editors, ★ isn't that hard. Promise. type "&#9733" supported by most web browsers.ReplyLike1 month ago*permalinkJochenIs

&#9733i can copy paste your ★ but how do i use that code?Like

1 month ago*permalinkforpetessakeforpetessake

Both people who want this lens will be able to buy it soon.Like1 month agopermalinkdavid_sladek

@forpetessake might still be more people than will laugh to your joke attempt ;)Like1 month agopermalinkJon555

Entering &#9733 plus a semi-colon gets me a * at least in fields Win10 Chrome controls (e.g. Google search)... doesn't seem to here...&#9733;Like1 month ago*permalinkmatsonfamily

I think from a marketing perspective, they should rename the star lenses to have star, not ★ in them. Too difficult to find on a mobile device and mobiles are more popular than desktop. People read the news on those devices, and share from those devices.Like1 month agopermalinkLeandros S

Concave front elements are overall rare and interesting. Intrigued for sure, looking forward to finding out how it performs.ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkforpetessakeforpetessake

Not that rare. They tend to accumulate more dirt at the center of the front element and are less convenient to clean. So I guess manufacturers avoid this design.Like1 month agopermalinkLeandros S

I can think of only three other examples off the top of my head, and I've never owned one in my 20+ collection of lenses. So by my standards, they're quite rare. I suspected they would be difficult to clean, but the craze the last few years has been to emphasise optical performance rather than convenience. Lenses weighing more than 1kg at focal lengths where one would not usually expect this.

FWIW, the 50mm equivalent renders a gorgeous image, but it's similarly big and heavy.Like1 month agopermalinkKharanKharan

Designing totally "new" lenses is hard, and as such, most new products are derivatives of older formulae... which happen to use convex front elements. But concave front elements have existed for a long time, including the 7-element Ultron variant introduced by A.W. Tronnier sometime in the '50s, that was later used by Carl Zeiss AG for the Rollei QBM mount 50mm.

Asahi/Pentax were, curiously, the only Japanese optics maker to seriously explore the Ultron design. Most of their competitors actually settled for the famous Zeiss Sonnar and Planar formulae, with modifications, naturally. Maybe this design is a great-great-great grandchild of their designs from the '60s? I know that there was at least one Ultron-derived 85mm Takumar lens.Like1 month agopermalinkdrummercam

@ "forpetessake "[Concave front element] Not that rare. They tend to accumulate more dirt at the center of the front element and are less convenient to clean."

Wow! If ever there were a perfect DPReview "complaint" about a Pentax product, that is surely it! I expect it to be copied and pasted into the review.Like1 month ago*permalinkZiginox

Wasn't one of the Sony FE lenses concave? I think the 55mm 1.8Like1 month agopermalinksilversalts

@drummercam: CZ Ultron 1,8 50mm is a prime legacy example of a concave front element lens. I have it in m42 mount for use on Pentax DSLR’s (with OEM Pentax M42 > K Adapter). I’ve never had a problem with dirt accumulation, and this new Pentax lens has the Aerobright ll dirt and smudge resistant coating on the front element. You are looking for a problem where none exists.sUnlike1 month ago*permalinkOld Cameras

Current Sony-Zeiss 55/1.8 is concave, Nikon Z 50/1.8S also. I have the early Canon FD 35/2.0 which is concave AND radioactive. Just a little radioactive. Others too but overall not many.Like1 month agopermalinkvietnam74

They do that to reduce the number of elements in the light path and reduce the weight of the lens down. May also get more corner sharpness too.Like1 month agopermalinkdrummercam

@silversalts -- It was "forpetessake" who was looking for a problem where none exists, not me. Please read again. I'm familiar with Pentax's Super Protect coating, and can attest that it is very effective. The suggestion that front element concavity pools dirt in the center was absurd. Nonetheless, my suggestion that such an absurd comment resembles the things that DPR concocts against Pentax -- I'll stand by that until I see their review of this lens and the upcoming APS-C body.Like1 month agopermalinkClass AClass A

@forpetessake

The Zeiss Otus 85/1.4 and Milvus 85/1.4 also have concave lens front elements. The Zeiss and Pentax engineers obviously don't know what they are doing; if only they had you in their teams.Like1 month ago*permalinkAbrasiveReducer

This is about showing how smart you are. Common sense tells you that in the unlikely event you neglect to put a filter on your $1900 lens, keeping it clean will be no different from a lens with a convex element.Like1 month agopermalinkcosinaphilecosinaphile

first to say .... how nice ... pentax has that special something .ReplyLike1 month agopermalinkMyRealityMyReality

I thought it was Leica that had that special "something" to match the price.Like1 month agopermalinkBNapa

@MyReality, let's not forget the Otus line from Zeiss!!

Like1 month agopermalink