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The Book of The Book of RevelationRevelation

Avon Christadelphian Ecclesia Avon Christadelphian Ecclesia Midweek Bible ClassMidweek Bible Class

Thursday, May 24, 2007Thursday, May 24, 2007

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How Should We Work to How Should We Work to Understand Revelation?Understand Revelation?

Since…most brethren believe that the Since…most brethren believe that the “continuous-historic” (CH) view is the correct “continuous-historic” (CH) view is the correct way to understand Revelation…way to understand Revelation…

And…since the CH view was the view of And…since the CH view was the view of Brothers John Thomas and Robert Roberts…Brothers John Thomas and Robert Roberts…

And…since the CH view is the view generally And…since the CH view is the view generally held by the brethren typically invited to held by the brethren typically invited to speak at the MWBS and at events like last speak at the MWBS and at events like last weekend’s Indiana Fraternal Gathering…weekend’s Indiana Fraternal Gathering…

Perhaps this class should just present the Perhaps this class should just present the basic arguments in favor of the CH view and basic arguments in favor of the CH view and then provide a handy CH Bible-marking chartthen provide a handy CH Bible-marking chart

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However:However: Even ifEven if the CH view is the correct way to the CH view is the correct way to

understand Revelation, it is inherently complicated understand Revelation, it is inherently complicated and “intellectual”. (Note: this is and “intellectual”. (Note: this is notnot an argument an argument against CH in any way…it’s just a fact.)against CH in any way…it’s just a fact.)

The CH view has made some serious mistakes, as The CH view has made some serious mistakes, as admitted even by its supporters. (Note: this admitted even by its supporters. (Note: this doesn’t just mean that we throw the CH view in doesn’t just mean that we throw the CH view in the trashcan.)the trashcan.)

There are other views currently held by a number There are other views currently held by a number of Christadelphians. of Christadelphians. Even if Even if these other views are these other views are wrong (and wrong (and at leastat least one of them must be!), they one of them must be!), they nonetheless make some observations that should nonetheless make some observations that should be heeded.be heeded.

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So…So…

Let’s begin by talking about the history of the Let’s begin by talking about the history of the CH view as presented by Brother John Thomas.CH view as presented by Brother John Thomas.

Today’s class will provide an overview Today’s class will provide an overview understanding of the history of the CH view understanding of the history of the CH view among Christadelphians, as well as a brief among Christadelphians, as well as a brief overview of the history of alternative views.overview of the history of alternative views.

This discussion over the next few weeks is the This discussion over the next few weeks is the best way to understand both Revelation and best way to understand both Revelation and the various views about Revelation.the various views about Revelation.

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Bro. John ThomasBro. John Thomas

1832 – shipwreck and vow1832 – shipwreck and vow 1844 – Challenged William Miller’s 1844 – Challenged William Miller’s

prophetic arithmetic (see chart next prophetic arithmetic (see chart next slide)slide)

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1847 – JT baptized “as a 1847 – JT baptized “as a Christadelphian”Christadelphian”

1848 – JT lectures in Britain1848 – JT lectures in Britain 1849 – JT publishes 1849 – JT publishes Elpis IsraelElpis Israel 1862-1868 – JT publishes 1862-1868 – JT publishes EurekaEureka

– 1868 – JT publishes 1868 – JT publishes Exposition of DanielExposition of Daniel

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From From Elpis IsraelElpis Israel

Publisher’s Preface, 14Publisher’s Preface, 14thth edition, edition, Christadelphian Magazine 1983. The book Christadelphian Magazine 1983. The book is reprinted as in the 1903 edition.is reprinted as in the 1903 edition.

““The third part of the book deals with The third part of the book deals with prophecy in relation to world affairs. Here prophecy in relation to world affairs. Here understanding was influenced by an understanding was influenced by an expectation of the Lord’s early advent, expectation of the Lord’s early advent, which proved premature, and much that which proved premature, and much that has now to be treated with reserve derived has now to be treated with reserve derived from this outlook.”from this outlook.”

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Now, there has never yet existed a single Now, there has never yet existed a single dominion, contemporary with the toe-dominion, contemporary with the toe-kingdoms, and of course comprehending kingdoms, and of course comprehending them in its jurisdiction, which could claim them in its jurisdiction, which could claim to be represented by Nebuchadnezzar’s to be represented by Nebuchadnezzar’s image. In order, then, to prepare for the image. In order, then, to prepare for the catastrophe, the image which is now in catastrophe, the image which is now in antagonistic parts, antagonistic parts, must be confederated;must be confederated; in other words, a dominion must arise in other words, a dominion must arise before the setting up of the kingdom of before the setting up of the kingdom of God, which shall rule over the toe-God, which shall rule over the toe-kingdoms, and the Turkish and Persian kingdoms, and the Turkish and Persian territories, till it meets the British Power territories, till it meets the British Power in the East. …in the East. …

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The description of the dream says that The description of the dream says that the feet were smitten; and “the feet were smitten; and “thenthen was was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces and the gold, broken to pieces togethertogether””; thereby intimating that the ; thereby intimating that the breaking of the power of the ten breaking of the power of the ten kingdoms would precede that of the kingdoms would precede that of the conjoint destruction of all the other conjoint destruction of all the other parts. That when they are conquered, parts. That when they are conquered, the dominion of the conqueror will be the dominion of the conqueror will be overturned by the revelation of power overturned by the revelation of power from above. …from above. …

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I shall be able to show, from I shall be able to show, from other other parts of the prophetic wordparts of the prophetic word, that the , that the power destined to play the power destined to play the conspicuous part indicated above is conspicuous part indicated above is Russia. That it will dominate all the Russia. That it will dominate all the ten kingdoms, subdue Turkey, and ten kingdoms, subdue Turkey, and incorporate Persia into its empire; incorporate Persia into its empire; but that when it has reached its but that when it has reached its zenith, it will in turn be precipitated zenith, it will in turn be precipitated into the into the abyssabyss, and its , and its dominiondominion suppressed for suppressed for a thousand yearsa thousand years. . (pp. 327-328)(pp. 327-328)

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[The St. Bartholomew’s Day] massacre [in [The St. Bartholomew’s Day] massacre [in 1572] was 1572] was 1,260 years1,260 years from the from the separation established between State-separation established between State-church Christians, and church Christians, and the remnant of the the remnant of the Woman’s seedWoman’s seed. In 312–313, the . In 312–313, the man childman child was was born of the Womanborn of the Woman as the military as the military chieftain destined to chieftain destined to cast the pagan cast the pagan dragon out ofdragon out of the Roman the Roman heavenheaven. … . … Constantine and his successors “Constantine and his successors “ruled the ruled the nations with a rod of ironnations with a rod of iron””; and united in ; and united in adulterous alliance, an apostasy from adulterous alliance, an apostasy from apostolic Christianity to the kingdom of apostolic Christianity to the kingdom of the world. …the world. …

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Thus, a Satanic system was Thus, a Satanic system was established, which persecuted all “established, which persecuted all “who who kept the commandments of God, and kept the commandments of God, and had the testimony of Jesus Christhad the testimony of Jesus Christ””.. The The troubles of troubles of the witnessesthe witnesses commenced commenced with the institution of State with the institution of State Christianity, and they will not cease Christianity, and they will not cease until every State Religion is abolished until every State Religion is abolished from the earth.from the earth.

This Bartholomew massacre of 1572 This Bartholomew massacre of 1572 marks the epoch of the terminating of marks the epoch of the terminating of the testimony of the two witnessesthe testimony of the two witnesses. (p. . (p. 346)346)

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Thus, Oct. 18th, 1685, became the epoch Thus, Oct. 18th, 1685, became the epoch of of the death of the witnessesthe death of the witnesses. The war had . The war had been long, but been long, but the Beastthe Beast had subdued had subdued them at last. The voice of testimony them at last. The voice of testimony against Papalism in Church and State was against Papalism in Church and State was silenced. The stillness of death pervaded silenced. The stillness of death pervaded not France only, but Europe likewise; and if not France only, but Europe likewise; and if I were called upon to point out the darkest I were called upon to point out the darkest period of Bible Christianity from the time of period of Bible Christianity from the time of Constantine to the present time, I should Constantine to the present time, I should point to the interval from the revocation of point to the interval from the revocation of the Edict of Nantes [in 1685] to the the Edict of Nantes [in 1685] to the breaking out of the French Revolution in breaking out of the French Revolution in 1789. During this time the holy city was 1789. During this time the holy city was laid low, and laid low, and the symbolic witnesses lay the symbolic witnesses lay dead, though unburieddead, though unburied. (p. 350). (p. 350)

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The ApocalypseThe Apocalypse as a whole is a as a whole is a miniatureminiature representation of “representation of “the things which are, and the things the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafterwhich shall be hereafter””;; that is, of things in existence that is, of things in existence while John was in Patmos, and of the things shortly to while John was in Patmos, and of the things shortly to happen after he wrote, and until the setting up of the happen after he wrote, and until the setting up of the kingdom. Everything is exhibited on a smaller scale kingdom. Everything is exhibited on a smaller scale than the reality; and the time of the symbols is in than the reality; and the time of the symbols is in keeping with them. Thus, multitudes of witnesses are keeping with them. Thus, multitudes of witnesses are reduced to two; and the years of their prophesying to reduced to two; and the years of their prophesying to days. It would have been a violation of the fitness of days. It would have been a violation of the fitness of things to have made them testify for 1,260 years, things to have made them testify for 1,260 years, because this is far beyond the duration of human life, because this is far beyond the duration of human life, which is the rule of speaking in the case. So in which is the rule of speaking in the case. So in indicating the time of their unburied state, the real time indicating the time of their unburied state, the real time must be expressed in accordance with the physical must be expressed in accordance with the physical laws. A dead body might lie in the open air for “laws. A dead body might lie in the open air for “three three days and a halfdays and a half” ” without disappearing; but not three without disappearing; but not three years and a half, or three months and a half. Hence, the years and a half, or three months and a half. Hence, the symbol required the smallest possible period symbol required the smallest possible period capable of capable of expressing the real timeexpressing the real time of their political non-existence; of their political non-existence; and that is “and that is “three days and a halfthree days and a half””. (p. 357). (p. 357)

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The time that elapsed between their death in 1685, The time that elapsed between their death in 1685, and their resurrection in 1790, was 105 years. This is and their resurrection in 1790, was 105 years. This is a period contained in three lunations and a half, on a period contained in three lunations and a half, on the day for a year principle. the day for a year principle.

This consideration led Mr. Bicheno, a Baptist Pastor in This consideration led Mr. Bicheno, a Baptist Pastor in Newbury, England, in 1793, to conclude that Newbury, England, in 1793, to conclude that lunarlunar days were intended. Taking the Jewish month of 30 days were intended. Taking the Jewish month of 30 days, Mr. Bicheno found that three-and-a-half times days, Mr. Bicheno found that three-and-a-half times thirty, or 105 days (years), gave just the interval from thirty, or 105 days (years), gave just the interval from the death of the witnesses in 1685 to their political the death of the witnesses in 1685 to their political resurrection in 1790, in the time of the Great French resurrection in 1790, in the time of the Great French Revolution. Mr. Bicheno, though cloudy on some Revolution. Mr. Bicheno, though cloudy on some points, was nevertheless, sufficiently sound to be points, was nevertheless, sufficiently sound to be regarded as one of the witnesses. He did well in regarded as one of the witnesses. He did well in stirring up his own generation to the study of the stirring up his own generation to the study of the Apocalypse; and in discovering for us the true import Apocalypse; and in discovering for us the true import of the “of the “three days and a halfthree days and a half””. We thank our Heavenly . We thank our Heavenly Father for raising up such witnesses.Father for raising up such witnesses. (pp. 357-358)(pp. 357-358)

[Publisher’s Footnote:] The preceding two paragraphs [Publisher’s Footnote:] The preceding two paragraphs have been re-written on the basis of have been re-written on the basis of EurekaEureka, a later , a later work by the author of work by the author of Elpis IsraelElpis Israel..

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The restoration of the Jews is a work of The restoration of the Jews is a work of time, and will require between fifty and time, and will require between fifty and sixty years to accomplish. …sixty years to accomplish. …

The truth is, there are two stages in the The truth is, there are two stages in the restoration of the Jews, the first is before restoration of the Jews, the first is before the battle of Armageddon; and the the battle of Armageddon; and the second, after it; but both pre-millennial. second, after it; but both pre-millennial. (pp. 440, 441)(pp. 440, 441)

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There is, then, a partial and primary There is, then, a partial and primary restoration of Jews before the restoration of Jews before the manifestation, which is to serve as the manifestation, which is to serve as the nucleus, or basis, of future operations in nucleus, or basis, of future operations in the restoration of the rest of the tribes the restoration of the rest of the tribes after he has appeared in the kingdom. after he has appeared in the kingdom. The pre-adventual colonization of The pre-adventual colonization of Palestine will be on purely political Palestine will be on purely political principles; and the Jewish colonists will principles; and the Jewish colonists will return in unbelief of the Messiahship of return in unbelief of the Messiahship of Jesus, and of the truth as it is in him. (p. Jesus, and of the truth as it is in him. (p. 441)441)

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I know not whether the men, who at present I know not whether the men, who at present contrive the foreign policy of Britain, entertain contrive the foreign policy of Britain, entertain the idea of assuming the sovereignty of the Holy the idea of assuming the sovereignty of the Holy Land, and of promoting its colonization by the Land, and of promoting its colonization by the Jews; their present intentions, however, are of no Jews; their present intentions, however, are of no importance one way or the other, because they importance one way or the other, because they will be compelled, by events soon to happen, to will be compelled, by events soon to happen, to do what, under existing circumstances, heaven do what, under existing circumstances, heaven and earth combined could not move them to and earth combined could not move them to attempt. The present decisions of “attempt. The present decisions of “statesmenstatesmen” ” are destitute of stability. A shooting star in the are destitute of stability. A shooting star in the political firmament is sufficient to disturb all the political firmament is sufficient to disturb all the forces of their system; and to stultify all the forces of their system; and to stultify all the theories of their political astronomy. The finger theories of their political astronomy. The finger of God has indicated a course to be pursued by of God has indicated a course to be pursued by Britain which cannot be evaded, and which her Britain which cannot be evaded, and which her counsellors will not only be willing, but eager, to counsellors will not only be willing, but eager, to adopt when the crisis comes upon them. …adopt when the crisis comes upon them. …

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The decree has long since gone forth The decree has long since gone forth which calls upon the Lion of Tarshish which calls upon the Lion of Tarshish to protect the Jews. Upwards of a to protect the Jews. Upwards of a thousand years before the British thousand years before the British were a nation, the prophet addresses were a nation, the prophet addresses them as the power which at them as the power which at ““evening-tideevening-tide” ” should interest should interest themselves in behalf of Israel. (p. themselves in behalf of Israel. (p. 442)442)

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From From Exposition of DanielExposition of Daniel ““I heard”, said [Daniel], “but I understand I heard”, said [Daniel], “but I understand

not: then said I, O my Lord, when the end not: then said I, O my Lord, when the end of these?” that is, of the time, times, and a of these?” that is, of the time, times, and a half? He was told the reason why he could half? He was told the reason why he could not obtain the information sought; that it not obtain the information sought; that it was “because the words were closed up was “because the words were closed up and sealed till the time of the end”; which and sealed till the time of the end”; which was tantamount to saying that when the was tantamount to saying that when the time of the end should arrive, the time-time of the end should arrive, the time-words would be no longer closed up and words would be no longer closed up and sealed. … On a previous page I have sealed. … On a previous page I have shown that a time has been present with shown that a time has been present with us for several years” (p. 107)us for several years” (p. 107)

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““Judah’s seven times will terminate Judah’s seven times will terminate in the AD 1892; and Babylon’s AD in the AD 1892; and Babylon’s AD 1908. …forty years to be deducted 1908. …forty years to be deducted from the seven times of Babylon for from the seven times of Babylon for the period during which … This the period during which … This brings us back from AD 1908 to AD brings us back from AD 1908 to AD 1868. … The Lord, then, will have 1868. … The Lord, then, will have come as the Ancient of Days at some come as the Ancient of Days at some time soon after 1868.” (pp. 112-114)time soon after 1868.” (pp. 112-114)

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““Taking the resurrection then, soon Taking the resurrection then, soon after AD 1868” (p. 115)after AD 1868” (p. 115)

““These thirty years war are the last These thirty years war are the last years of Micah’s forty … and years of Micah’s forty … and beginning therefore about AD 1878.” beginning therefore about AD 1878.” (p. 119)(p. 119)

““How highly important is this How highly important is this exhortation now, seeing that in a exhortation now, seeing that in a very short time the resurrection will very short time the resurrection will have transpired.” (p. 121)have transpired.” (p. 121)

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From “Publisher’s Note”From “Publisher’s Note”

““It will be apparent to the careful It will be apparent to the careful reader of this work that the reader of this work that the expectations of its author concerning expectations of its author concerning the precise date of the coming of the the precise date of the coming of the Lord … were premature. Some have Lord … were premature. Some have regarded this as a reason for regarded this as a reason for rejecting the whole exposition. This rejecting the whole exposition. This is a mistaken view.”is a mistaken view.”

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Other Christadelphian Other Christadelphian InterpretationsInterpretations

Since the days of Brother Thomas, Since the days of Brother Thomas, there have been repeated “updates” there have been repeated “updates” to the CH view by leading brethren.to the CH view by leading brethren.

Brother Harry Whittaker (ca. 1976) Brother Harry Whittaker (ca. 1976) Revelation: A Biblical ApproachRevelation: A Biblical Approach

Brother Alfred Norris (ca. 1982) Brother Alfred Norris (ca. 1982) Apocalypse for EverymanApocalypse for Everyman

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Lord willing…Lord willing… Next week: a summary look at the continuous-Next week: a summary look at the continuous-

historic system of understanding as presented in historic system of understanding as presented in Apocalypse EpitomisedApocalypse Epitomised by Brother H.P. Mansfield. by Brother H.P. Mansfield. (To be done without “cheerleading” either for or (To be done without “cheerleading” either for or against)against)

In two weeks: a similar look at the system of In two weeks: a similar look at the system of understanding proposed by Brother Harry Whittaker understanding proposed by Brother Harry Whittaker in his book, in his book, Revelation – A Biblical ApproachRevelation – A Biblical Approach..

In three weeks: a similar look at the system of In three weeks: a similar look at the system of understanding proposed by Brother A.D. Norris in understanding proposed by Brother A.D. Norris in his book, his book, Apocalypse for EverymanApocalypse for Everyman..

Beyond: directed discussion about how to work Beyond: directed discussion about how to work through an understanding of the Book of Revelation, through an understanding of the Book of Revelation, given the thoughts presented in the above systems given the thoughts presented in the above systems of understanding.of understanding.

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Why consider various Why consider various schemes?schemes?

Even ifEven if the “continuous-historic” scheme is the “continuous-historic” scheme is correct, and we ought to reject the schemes correct, and we ought to reject the schemes proposed by Brothers Whittaker and Norris, proposed by Brothers Whittaker and Norris, nonethelessnonetheless they make a number of points that they make a number of points that merit serious consideration. (compare JT on “Mr. merit serious consideration. (compare JT on “Mr. Bicheno re. 3½ lunations”)Bicheno re. 3½ lunations”)

Christadelphians Christadelphians do havedo have differing opinions about differing opinions about these matters.these matters.

You can’t reject as false something that you don’t You can’t reject as false something that you don’t understand, nor can you convince somebody to understand, nor can you convince somebody to leave that approach if you don’t understand it.leave that approach if you don’t understand it.

Reputable brothers in favor of CH have clearly Reputable brothers in favor of CH have clearly made mistakes (JT, RR, CCW, etc.), and CH keeps made mistakes (JT, RR, CCW, etc.), and CH keeps getting “updated”.getting “updated”.

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Two Related Questions:Two Related Questions:

What does Brother Dean believe? What does Brother Dean believe? (i.e. – which “scheme” does Brother (i.e. – which “scheme” does Brother Dean endorse?)Dean endorse?)

Where is Brother Dean taking the Where is Brother Dean taking the class?class?

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What does Dean believe?What does Dean believe? You have a right to know.You have a right to know. I have major problems with Brother I have major problems with Brother

Harry’s framework.Harry’s framework. I like the CH approach but have a number I like the CH approach but have a number

of problems with it. I also like ADN’s of problems with it. I also like ADN’s approach but have a number of problems approach but have a number of problems with it.with it.

Please note: the CH approach and the ADN Please note: the CH approach and the ADN approach end up in much the same approach end up in much the same position (although with MAJOR differences position (although with MAJOR differences regarding the details of what will happen regarding the details of what will happen around the time of Christ’s return).around the time of Christ’s return).

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Where is this class going?Where is this class going?

Increase general level of Increase general level of understanding of the book of understanding of the book of Revelation, and, to a lesser extent, Revelation, and, to a lesser extent, end-time prophecy.end-time prophecy.

Increase knowledge of and respect for Increase knowledge of and respect for the different views about Revelation the different views about Revelation among Christadelphians.among Christadelphians.

Encourage humilityEncourage humility when speaking when speaking about end-time events. about end-time events.

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Last thoughts:Last thoughts:

Class outcome:Class outcome:– (a) Christ will return in the year ____(a) Christ will return in the year ____

Or Or – (b) Christ will return shortly after CNN (b) Christ will return shortly after CNN

reports that __________ is invading ________reports that __________ is invading ________ Next week: “Next week: “Apocalypse EpitomisedApocalypse Epitomised

Epitomised”. Please read the Epitomised”. Please read the handouts. (Distribute notebooks with handouts. (Distribute notebooks with handouts)handouts)