[[InsideInside]] The History

December 2002.

The Interview.

Interviewers: > > Prisoners: >>> Derek Lennon /Dean Hallion /Kevin Burke. Interviewee: > > Prison officer: >>> Max Brohan.

Producers: > > Teachers: >>> Margaret Sweeney /Eileen Dwyer.

‘‘Dean, Derek and Kevin, thanks for inviting me to this interview to discuss St. Patrick’s History as I have seen it emerging to the present time. There is no doubt that it will be of interest to your readers.

Max, how long have you worked in St. Patrick’s Institution?Dean I’m going to go back a little bit further to take us to the first Prison environment I actually worked in. It was the late 70s’ in Napoleon’s Nite Club, the most notorious ‘Speak-Easy’ of its era, situated in Dublin’s North Inner-City on Rutland Place, a dimly lit alleyway just off Parnell Square. I was a bouncer there for two years. Every weekend it served as a meeting place for members of the Capital’s Criminal Underworld whose access to other Discos was denied. Riots were commonplace, fights second nature to them.

When I joined the Prison Service in 1980, I was stationed in St. Patricks, and not in the least bit surprised to see most of the youths from Napoleons were in and out of here for serious offences. I have been here ever since, over 22 years now. I served as the class officer on D2 for ten years (1981-1991) and when D2 closed down for renovations, three years as the D3 class officer (1991-1994).

What in your opinion is the role of a prisoner?Derek lets put it this way. Prisoners have many roles to play in this community, all of them important in their own right; whether it’s cleaning, painting, kitchen duties, attending chess lessons, gym, football courses, school, library and workshops or as you two are doing working on this Christmas edition of the prison magazine. In other words the script is ‘Go with the Flow’. Of all the jobs, the top job traditionally was `Top-Cat`. One would work their way up the ladder from class cleaning duties to the position of `Top-Cat`, often referred to as the `Enforcer`. This post commanded respect from all quarters.

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here were countless Top-Cats on D2-Class in the old days. Amongst the more notorious of these were Marious (Ringo) Howe, Mario (Fletcher) Felloni, Michael (Mika the

Pimp) Donoghue, Brian (Ryco) Hollywood, Derek (The Skunk) Martin, Paul (The Driver) Kavanagh, Thomas (The Bomber) Clarke, Alan (The Scribe) Croghan, Dermot (Esser) Fitzpatrick, late of P.A.C.E. and the book ‘The Joy’, Charles (The Blagger) Kirkwood, Eddie (The Bulldog) Doran, Jimmy (The Rammer) Doona, and Mark (Salo) Sallinger to name but a few. Yes, infamous gangsters of that era, tough ‘Enforcers’.

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What do you mean by tough ‘Enforcers’ Max?These were the old days Kevin, the toughest days in jail and D2 well, was the best class there ever was, there will never be another one like it. These young men (Enforcers) got the job done…[ ]…;‘‘What do you mean Max, ‘got the job done’? What job?’’ Well you know, ‘What happens on the Mile stays on the Mile’. Lets just leave it at that, shall we?

Max, what are the most dramatic changes you have seen in St. Patrick’s in the last ten years?Well Dean in relation to this question I have to say that prisons serve many functions and the functions change with time. Imprisonment protects society from the criminal activities of those who are in prison for the length of time that they are there. All we can do here is treat inmates humanely and encourage them by means of education, programs, and workshops to steer them away from anti-social behaviour when released. To get a proper perspective of the many changes that have occurred I’ll take you on a trip down memory-lane, to the 80’s in fact, which saw the first dramatic change in St. Patrick’s in my opinion. This was the very welcoming arrival of the first female prison officers ever to be stationed in a male prison in this country. I suppose the time was around 1987; yes I’m definite of that. This introduction brought an improvement in the general environment and reduced the level of abnormality in prison life, both for inmates and prison staff alike.

1988: April saw prison officers forced to go on strike for the first time in our history. The Gardaí and the Defence Forces replaced us for a full month and took over the running of the jail. After the initial unrest (rioting) emergency tactics were deployed. Mr.`Niceguy` Garda was sent for: “Give them what they want” was the shout! Free shop orders and as much grub (chips) as one could eat just to keep them on side. Prisoners had a great time: -they certainly put on a lot of weight that month that’s for sure. Some still say that this is where the phrase ‘Holiday Camp’ came from.

he period of the 90’s was most dramatic. D3 landing closed for renovations with the whole area fully modernized. The cells T

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were upgraded to a high standard, which included in cell sanitation, a sink unit with hot and cold running water, a duvet supplied, modern heating and lighting, the `butler’s` bell, and a night-light commonly known as the ‘Blue Light’.

1991: September we witnessed the re-opening of D3 class, now updated, and fully modernized. Particularly pleasing was the end to the dreaded slopping-out procedure: no more chamber pots and no queues at the end of the landing where most fights would invariably break out. D2 (affectionately known as Coronation Street for many years) and D1classes now closed down for the same treatment. I had served as the class officer on D2 since 1981 (10 years); during this period the inmates earned the reputation as having the cleanest landing and cells this side of ALCATRAZ PRISON, no exaggeration! Chief Willie Kane (currently Governor of Cloverhill) asked me to take over D3 landing with my class. The response was positive. The lads on D2 anticipated this move was on, had their suitcases already packed; they knew we would move upstairs to our new assignment.

This crew fully deserved this opportunity, as they were unquestionably the best prisoners St. Patrick’s ever had during that era. I served as D3 class officer for three years. This modernization has continued since then throughout the prison, with every cell, landing and workshop refurbished to a high degree. Sure you just need to go over and have a look at the new B1 and B2 landings (near completion) to see what I mean.

1992: In October of that year a new concept was introduced for recreation periods: The introduction of formal chess lessons for prisoners in the old library-room situated (in the B recreation hall). This activity proved so popular that in a short time the room was full to capacity (22) seven nights a week. Chess has been the most popular of all the activities available to inmates during recreation time, and still remains so to this day especially considering its only run on a part time basis. Well Mr.Hegarty (Hego) of the Drug Free Division’s Gymnasium would probably disagree with me on that point. You know visitors to the main block and inmates often ask me, “How come we don’t have a full time chess workshop in here?” I say to them, “Why don’t you ask the Governor?” There’s no doubt it would be a most successful enterprise, certainly worth a go. Our chess room is often referred to as the ‘Gymnasium of the Mind’; you might say a refinery of sorts.

1993: D1 and D2 reopened and the female prisoners moved in. For many years the female prison was situated on B1 and the Annex.

1995: Inmates entered a chess team to play in the Leister Senior Chess League, the ‘Bodley Cup’. First time ever that a prison chess team competed in an outside league against civilians anywhere in Europe. The first football teams were invited in to play against the lads (Hego’s Heroes) as far as I can remember.

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eptember 1996 saw The President’s Award Scheme (The Gaisce, a self-improvement programme for youths) introduced here for the first time through Governor John O’Sullivan by Ms.Jane Keen, (Senior Welfare/ Probation officer), Mr.Tom Duffy (Principal of the Education Unit), Mr. Jim O’Rourke (Assistant Principal), Mr.John Quinn (Literacy teacher), Ms.Joanna Gallagher, Ms.Eileen Burke, Ms.Orla O’Reilly (education/ school), and prison officers A.C.O. J.O’Donoghue, A.C.O.Gerry Bracken (currently chief in Cloverhill Prison), Mr.G.Hegarty (P.A.L./gym instructor /football coach) and myself. We were the first prison in the State to have inmates participating in this most prestigious award. In response, over one hundred prisoners signed up for the Gaisce Awards, and during the following six months studied books in their chosen subjects of self-improvement and personal development. Once again another first for the lads of St Patrick’s Institution.

*** O n Tuesday May 20 th 1997 we held our first Gaisce Award’s

Ceremony. *** This inaugural momentous occasion was the presentation of the Gaisce Bronze Certificates to the boys. The event was held in the library-room, filled to capacity with many dignitaries present for the occasion. Mr.Damien Richardson the then Shelbourne Football Club Manager, winners of the FAI League and Cup double (1996 /97 season), and two players of that victorious team were also present along with their Winner’s Cups. The Russian Professional Chess Grandmaster Mr.Alexander Baburin along with his manager Mr.Michael Crowe (Irish Chess Academy) were also present as were the dignitaries from the Gaisce President’s office. This was a most fantastic achievement by the boys where they were again great ambassadors for St. Patrick’s Institution.

Later that year our new library-room was officially opened after the extensive indexing of books undertaken by Ms.Claire Scanlon, Senior Librarian with the Dublin Prisons Library Service: Prison officers Mr.L.Jacob (nowadays of Cloverhill Prison), Mr.P.Jordan, Mr.G.O’Farrell, Mr.M.O’Brien, Mr.D.Farrell, Mr.P.Caldwell, two dedicated inmates and myself. The following years saw so many changes, too many to mention in this short interview. Springing to mind was the expansion of the Probation and Welfare Service, which has seen a significant development in the provision of care for offenders both inside and outside of St.Patricks. We now have two female welfare officers in Miss Nicola Flanagan and Miss Lena Twomey, providing this much needed service; for many years there was only the one, [see footnote]. Prison officer Miss Jackie O’Leary and her team, led by officer Miss Leanne Gaffney ably assist them. This wheel of success is kept spinning by it’s solid hub, the ever reliable Mrs.Renee Kenny (the secretary) who works diligently in the background.

(Miss Flanagan and Miss Twomey have moved on [2003] and been replaced by Miss Rachel Lillis [2003] and Miss Siobhán Connor. Miss Siobhán Traynor is currently the trainee 2004)

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ell, October 1998 saw two further chess teams, A and B enter the leagues. This time the Leinster School’s Senior Chess League with the requirement to play, an inmate

must attend regular school classes. Mr.Tom Duffy (the School Principal), was fully supportive of this extraordinary venture supplying the lads with brand new tournament size chess sets and chess clocks, in gratitude for proudly flying the flag for Tom’s school. Once again another first for the young men of St.Patrick’s. I often think that given the proper support on the outside, these lads would turn away from crime and drugs. I have observed over the years how intelligent they can be and if circumstances had been different for them, who knows…? Amazingly we had three independent chess teams competing in the Leinster Senior Chess Leagues with distinction, capturing many scalps along the way including those of some of Ireland’s International players. Not bad going for a bunch of lads that society had given up on.

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I would like to take this opportunity to express gratitude to the chess coaches and the management of that era. In particular for the hard work and effort put in by prison officers Mr.M.A.Behan (medics /metal shop), Mr.J.Tully, Mr.S.Dunne (remands), Mr.T.Pierce (Unit), Mr.G.Pimlott (paint & décor. section), Mr.K.Mulhern, Mr.T.O’Connor, Mr.P.Caldwell (school), Mr.T.Cryan, Mr.B.Legghio, Mr.T.Ward (trades), Mr.D.Farrell (classes), Mr.M.O’Brien, Mr.G.O’Farrell (library) and Mr.J.Murray (currently A.C.O. in Castlerea Prison). A special thanks to Governor John O’Sullivan, Deputy Governor Willie O’Mahony, Chief Willie Kane (at present governor of Cloverhill Prison), Chief W.Davies and Chief H.MacLennan, A.C.O. G.Bracken (currently Chief in Covehill), A.C.O. M.Kavanagh (currently Chief in Mountjoy), A.C.Os Jim.O’Donoghue, Robert Roche, Eamon McCann and Joe Joyce (Chief in Wheatfield Prison), for their endeavours in accommodating the coaching sessions and the visiting teams. Also to Mr.T.Duffy, Mr.J.O’Rourke, Ms.Orla O’Reilly, Ms.Eileen Burke, Ms.Eileen Dwyer Ms.Geraldine Meehan and Mr.J.Quinn (school) for all their help and support during this time. Also a grateful appreciation to ‘Art & Crafts’ teacher Miss Deirdre Cunningham (school) for creating all our fantastic chess posters.

The late 90’s saw the females move from the D division to their new prison, the ‘Dochás Center’. Thankfully the screaming has ceased:-this screaming out the windows to the lads, “Hey are yizz lis-nin?, can yizz hear me?, are yizz lis-nin or whaa?” This madness would go on and on throughout the night. In comparison St.Patricks is very quiet now, almost as if it’s asleep?

Governor Sean Lennon opened the first Drug Free Wing in the Irish Prison system, the D Division on 22nd November 2000. No doubt that this has been a benefit to those who needed a drug free environment to serve their time. The introduction of the nets covering the recreation yards has also played its part in keeping the flight of drugs into St.Patricks to a minimum; but I think if it wasn’t for the professionalism and the vigilance of my colleagues working in these yards, St. Pats` would be awash with drugs and I’m not just talking soft drugs here. Often in the yards officers have to engage in arm to arm combat with the pushers and the addicts just to retrieve those drugs that manage to slip through the net from time to time. I’d also like to say that in my opinion this effort, beyond the call of duty, often goes unappreciated.

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eedless to say, no nets required over the D Yard:-Chief MacLennan and A.C.O.J.O`Donoghue have assembled a great team of dedicated staff to

look after the offenders there. It`s where officer Miss M.Mullen leads the way, shining the torch through the darkness for those to safely follow. Ably assisted here by prison officers Mr.D.Farrell, Mr.D.Brunton, Mr.N.Kirwin, Mr.P.Munroe, Mr.S.O’Brien, Miss C.Kearney, Mr.D.Mc Hugh, Mr.P.Dunne, Mr.G.Hegarty etc. They continually attend courses to better understand the drug culture so as to be in an enlightened position to further the cause.

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It was a great honour for St.Patricks when the ‘Government-Jet’ flew Chief H.MacLennan and officer Mr.N.Kirwan first class to Belgium to speak about this success story. This conference was held in Brussels where our representatives were Internationally praised for these endeavours.

2001: We also saw the *** re-entry of the Gaisce Awards.*** Introduced on this occasion by Miss Marion Irwin (Gaisce), Prison officers Mr.G.O’Farrell /Mr.M.O’Brien (library) and Mr.G.Hegarty (D wing gym): Miss Lena Twomey & Miss Nicola Flanagan (Probation & Welfare) [see footnote] and Ms.Eileen Burke (Education Unit), culminating in the Award’s Ceremony held in the library this year. Dignitaries were invited, as were family members of the lads who participated. They were each presented with their Bronze Award Medals and Certificates. The President apologized for not attending as she was abroad, but sent her congratulations to all connected with this project. Inmates Pádraig Dunne, Stephen McDonnell, Éoin Fleming and Michael McDonald were the recipients of the Bronze Award on this occasion. Pádraig and Stephen are still with us.

Christmas of that year Governor Lennon certainly had his finger firmly on the pulse once again when he introduced television sets to every cell on the drug free division. Perhaps as a reward for their Trojan efforts to stay away from drugs. A nice Christmas present don’t you think? Fries for breakfast every Sunday and an enhanced diet at other meal times. I’ll put it like this, ‘If you believe you receive, If you don’t you won’t’, (Old Chinese proverb).

Earlier this year (2002) we saw Governor Lennon extend his compassion to the other prisoners. Yes that’s right Kevin, you got it in one, and a TV set for everyone in the audience. He also introduced brighter and better colour schemes replacing the traditional mustard and eggshell varieties. The official opening of Mr.Hegarty’s Gym on DI and the continuing football coaching sessions he introduced has had a great impact on the physical well being of the inmates on the Drug Free D Division. Here the very popular Miss S.Galvin, a noted footballer in her own right, ably assists him, as does the renowned P.E. instructress Ms.Bridget Mc.Keever. Look the list goes on and on. Sure as we speak all the landings are being supplied with electric razors, complements of the Governor. No don’t laugh lads, honestly its true.

(Miss Flanagan and Miss Twomey have moved on and replaced by Miss Rachel Lillis and Miss Siobhán Connor. Miss Siobhán Traynor is currently the trainee..2004).

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overnor Lennon has also given us the use of the comfortable library-room three nights a week for our chess and checkers

lessons: We meet on Monday, Wednesday and Friday evenings (5.25pm.---7.15pm.), refreshments and sweets supplied. The Governor assures me that these nights are sacrosanct. Prison officer Miss Jackie O’Leary (of the library /welfare parade) our number one female chess coach excels at these sessions and is tops with the inmates that attend. Prison officers Mr.M.Earls and Mr.G.Pimlott (of the paint & décor.section),Mr.K.Mulhern /Mr.T.O’Connor and Mr.P.Caldwell (of the school), Mr.M.A.Behan (medics), Mr.M.O’Brien /Mr.G.O’Farrell (of the library) our top male chess coaches also excel, and are well respected by the lads they teach. There are also another thirty-four officers listed on the coaching panel.

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Over the time you have been here have you seen the same offenders returning to crime?Derek in relation to this question I have this to say. On many occasions I bump into ex-prisoners whose sons would be serving time here in St. Pats. Invariably they say to me, “Mr. Brohan (there were no first names in those days) my son is up there with you in the `Borstal`, he isn’t a bad lad just gone a bit wild. Will you keep an eye on him; keep him away from the drug pushers. I’d appreciate that. Get him on to the chess program. I often think of the old days on D2; they were great times there on Coronation Street, but it’s sad that a lot of the lads of D2 have died from the ‘Virus’. Anyway got to go now Mr.Brohan, I have a life now, straightened myself out.” Call me Max, everyone else does I’d say. “OK Mr.Brohan I will, I’ll see you around.” So not only do I see the same offenders returning time and time again, but also their sons. Seems a never-ending cycle for some unfortunates, don’t you think?

By the way are you aware that you three are the first prisoners to interview a prison officer for the magazine? That this is the first ever prisoner's magazine published here? Well you are and this is another first here in St.Patricks. Congratulations you’re doing great job, a milestone for yourselves and the Education Unit.

Before I go I want to wish you three a very Merry Christmas, and especially to teachers Ms. Margaret Sweeney and Ms.Eileen Dwyer who produced this magazine; To art teacher Miss Deirdre Cunningham for creating all of our colourful chess posters in recent years, and to all the readers of this Christmas edition.

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isten you guy I can’t answer any more questions right now; my throat feels sort of dry as if it’s back in the Sahara. Thanks

anyway for the opportunity to share with you my experiences by way of this interview and ‘Good Luck’ with the Magazine.

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“Here Max, have a drink of spring water (ha-ha-ha-ha)”. Are you for real Dean? You should be on the D wing ( drug Free Division ). I need something stronger than that: I’m off to the pub for a few beers. Pity you can’t make it all the same, well that’s jail for you in the End.‘‘Don’t worry Max; you never know there might be a sup of hooch knocking around. Anyway have a nice Christmas Max, and thanks again for the interview.’’

No problem lads…anytime’’.

End of Interview.

_________________________with compliments27th June 2004

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