plainfield plan commission december 4, 2017 7:00 pm · plainfield plan commission december 4, 2017...

1 Plainfield Plan Commission 12-04-17

PLAINFIELD PLAN COMMISSION December 4, 2017

7:00 PM

Mr. Smith: Alrighty, it’s 7:00pm. And this would be the Plainfield Plan Commission, December 4th. Welcome. Would you call the roll and determine a quorum? Mr. Klinger:

Mr McPhail- here Mr Philip- here Mr. Bahr- here

Mr. Smith- here Mr. Brandgard -here

Mr. Slavens- here Mr. Kirchoff- here

Everybody is present and accounted for. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIENCE Mr. Smith: Thank you, thank you. Please join in the Pledge of Allegiance. APPROVAL OF MINUTES Mr. Smith: What we have before us would be the minutes of November 6th meeting. If you all have the opportunity to review those, Any corrections, Additions? Mr. Smith : On the minutes before us November 6th, I do have one small correction, I think it's on page 7. Mr. James should be identified as the Director Of the planning department Not the director of the Town Hall. Mr. Klinger: We’ll get that noted. Mr. Smith : Also on page 15 In the middle of the page An attribution to me but I don't think I said that I think someone else did say that, I remember the words, But I don't think it was me. I wonder if it might have been Mr. Kirchoff. So that would be a change on page 15th, other than that, anyone else? Mr. Kirchoff: Motion to approve minutes Mr. Philip : Second Mr. Smith: A motion and a second, All in favor please? Group: Aye PUBLIC HEARINGS


Mr. Smith : Looking on the agenda this evening we don't actually have any public hearings. We do have the Civil matters to discuss though so I might ask the town attorney If you would have administer the oath of testimony. OATH OF TESTIMONY Mr. Smith : Will move past the petitions for public hearing since we don't have any this evening. OLD/NEW BUSINESS

Mr. Smith : The Redevelopment commission Has been working for some time I guess on a Redevelopment of the downtown And we'd like to hear about it. Mr. James : Good evening, Yes, this plan has been in the works For some time now and they're at the point, They're ready to take it to the Town Council But before they wanted to do that, they wanted to bring the plan commission up to date. Context has been Popping up but this plan together and so Context is here tonight and they're going to go over the plan with you. Mr. Prazeau: Evening commissioners, my name is Fred Prazeau, with Context Landscape Architects. Many of you have been at those our joint session as well as at some public hearings. Tonight, I'm going to take a few minutes and really focus on the Proposed plan itself and the implementation strategy that are starting to come from that So kind of the back third of that process If you want to go back to anything you've heard in inventory or analysis or any of the conceptual or schematics of the developments we can certainly do that as well. We’ll start with some of some big picture things. Why study downtown? That's the question we start with at all our meetings. Really the comprehensive plan that you developed identified the specific need for this sub-area downtown to be evaluated in great detail. So that's really Where our contract started. There's also been a great amount of public interest in kind of creating a downtown district That has the voice of Plainfield That really is about what your constituents would want to see, downtown be and not necessarily What private development would want to do to you if they have their way. And then lastly, there is already private development interest that's happening in your community so it's making sure that you're ahead of that. The court tenants, we go through these with staff frequently We kind of check our work as we go along to make sure that as we're making land planning decisions, we are really using those guiding tenants that drive those, to create highly walkable, pleasant downtown core of a destination. To enhance Connectivity to public green assets and green spaces, White Lick and the overall corridors. To balance parking needs, for Existing and proposed conditions. Parking is one of the most essential Things of a plan like this. To make sure it serves both the businesses you already have as well as the businesses you were trying to attract. Forecasting infrastructure To make sure that the right-of-way needs Throughout the district Are attended to. That's both new development that needs to happen, as well as Making sure you're up to par with the current infrastructure that you have. To ensure the materials form in character again align With Plainfield voice, I used the phrase a moment ago, and then make sure we transitioned the scale of new development into existing neighborhoods the right will create the contest for that, will actually take a look at some of that tonight. Let me pull a couple of images up. So, to go quickly, and feel free to interrupt me any time that suits you, these are the primary districts and the proposed areas, so that Village District, That Main Street Corridor is in the maroonish color. The neighborhood District or in the gold color. The village district Is in that teal or blue color, obviously parks are in the, Green So you can see what those are. This is the overall plan, we are going to zoom into this, so you don't have to strain your eyes, so this is really that entire red boundary, right? That was the study area that he pursued, and then we kind of gone into detail on a block-by-block basis Throughout that whole District And many of you have been with us to go through those details. So, I think I'm just going to take a few minutes and talk About the highlights of this, and we’ll come back to any questions you may have. So, Mill Street Is perpendicular, it's really a pivot Point. So, when you talk about doing it downtown plans like this, you often Start with well what are our assets and certainly US40 is an asset to this project Also it's rather treacherous and can be a hindrance in some ways. So, when you are trying to create this highly walkable, connected downtown where it is pleasant, getting over a from Main Street and sometimes you an appropriate part of that plan, so a recommendation has


been to pivot off of US40 and to create a district That has that quaint Village type feel that can create ambiance that matches your restaurants, boutique shops and those types of things that people like to see. So, a couple things Mill Street, you see that corridor and its improvement as it runs north and south, you also notice Krewson, redevelopment and strengthened as a core, we have to be able to move the infrastructure and the cars and the people that we are proposing to densify the district, so that’s really important. One of the big finds of the plan was, Krewson as a corridor can create this small pocket park that then opens up to a new pedestrian bridge that can cross the creek. So, you create this green spine, this backbone of that village, that’s really important. No surprise to any of you that Crossing US40 Can be rather treacherous, so we've got a nice pedestrian bridge here. That does serve a purpose certainly but what that plan seeks to do, when you think about that way finding that intuitive process Being able to get downtown Because we can get under US40, it’s important to have an additional Pedestrian Bridge That allows you and your family to get that downtown core Without having you crossed US40, it’s a choice that you can make. That's a really important part of that plan. I’m actually going to toggle forward a couple of Slides And then come back. So, scale, I talk about transition of Scale. there's a couple of diagrams we use when we do that. So, along US40, having a little bit taller building, 3-4 stories is not uncomfortable at all, right? It matches what you would expect to happen downtown. But as we pivot and come north off of US40, we can’t keep that scale high just because we can create the density you have to make sure it fits into the neighborhood concept. So, I’ll go another slide forward, we’ve talked in our public meeting about this before, you may have heard me do this before, so you can tune me out if you have. So those kind of 4 and 5 story buildings that we talked about Are kind of on the right end of that diagram, and then on the left are those detached single-family that might be in the neighborhoods today. So, we have to be very intentional when we’re doing a plan like that, to step that scale down intentionally, proportionally, and thoughtfully. So, let’s go back to this diagram. So, when you see the maroon buildings here, those are buildings that might be 3 or 4, maybe even 5 stories when it’s appropriate. But as we move south to north, you start to see that the building might be a 3 or 4, might be a 2 or 3, this might be a 1 or 2 and then by the time you’re down here these are all 1story buildings. does that make sense? As you transition? I’ll say the same thing happens, when you come from west to east, as we want to see again, those buildings maybe have some scale, and density, but we’d like to see those be 3 or 4 stories that come down to 2 or 3 stories, that match the 1 and 2 story houses. So, this is just a quick massing model and sketch up, nothing more than that, just building blocks. So, I’m going to point to that same area I just was on plan, that’s right here. So, you can see where you might have a 3 or 4 story building that comes down to a 2 or 3 story building, that comes down to that existing stock, those existing houses. It’s important to get the scale right, and be as compatible as possible. As far as the rest of this particular model here, you can start to see some of those proposed green spaces and open spaces along the creek. These kind of target developments throughout the most pivot part of Mill. these are very likely where you’ll see your first private development interests, where they’ll want to have the benefit of the traffic, you know, the 23,000 cars that are coming along US40, but they also want to have that walkable, beautiful core that Mill Street can start to create and Krewson and reinforce.so let’s talk about that a little more. So certainly images, well what might that village feel like, what might that development look like? So, we start to talk about those precedent images here, I’m just going to point to a couple of them. You know one of the drawings and diagrams has pointed to, you know a parking lot, actually right here, it’s just east of us right here tonight. So, this is a parking lot and a lawn space. So as far as, again, matching that parking need, you really feel like you’re going to see a parking deck in that location. If you can see kind of the end caps, there, the little white boxes on the end of that there, what we’re seeing happen in the mixed use development world right now, is you’re seeing projects that look a lot like this, that’s actually at Butler, a new parking structure at Butler that’s been wrapped with restaurants, Scotty’s Brewhouse, a nice breakfast restaurant, to where the skin of that building really makes that parking garage, not be a parking garage, as far as it’s compatibility to its neighbors. So certainly, as we’ve worked really hard as Jim mentioned we’ve been working with staff on this, this is our 13th month, this is our 15th public session we’ve had in this process. Tonight, we’ve gone through all of these little nuggets of needs throughout the plan. I’m just going to toggle through them, I’m not going to talk about each of them, but what kind of street improvements might be appropriate, sidewalks, what kind of condition are the existing sidewalks, and maybe future sidewalks, what those might want to be. Thinking about traffic controls, intersection improvements, alley improvements that might be appropriate. The connectivity, we’ll think about multi-modal, so walking, biking, those types of things. Street parking, and then certainly urban forestry, the street trees, the backbone of those, so really, we’ve zoomed in and studied each of those elements, when you think about an infrastructure perspective and what we need to effectuate the change we want to see. And I will not bore you with cross sections of streets, but we went through


every street inside of that corridor, or inside of the district looking at before and after conditions. Do we have the appropriate amount of right of ways, and if we do, what might the cadence of sidewalks and drive isles and parking lanes look like to get that right? Scott spent a lot of time with us to make sure we’ve gotten that on board. Mr. Smith : Do most of the streets have enough right of way? Mr. Prazeau: Yeah, I think most of them do. Krewson is one where we’ve looked where we could do a little bit of widening. Actually, I might go back to the plan for that for a moment. See the gold boxes there? So, one of the things that’s really important when you’re working on a redevelopment plan inside what is an historic district or some contributing houses to an historic area, is we’ve been very careful to look at, if you’re going to widen Krewson, which direction do you want to go to have the least impact right? So, in this case we’ve done that analysis and moving to the south to widen that is the most appropriate way. In that case there would be three, what we would consider to be contributing homes, that would be worthy of thinking about how those are protected. So that plan, what it does is, you’ve got some nice bones if you will, of an older neighborhood. Not every house is historic in that zone, but you’ve got some land that would be very appropriate, to take historic homes, as necessary and to be able to move or relocate those to a context that they fit seamlessly into. So, we think that’s an important part of the plan. I know I went so fast, I didn’t mention it earlier, but it is important. Those won’t be the only three homes in the district over time that that will happen for, right. You might have a developer, or two or three that say I need to take this block down to get a project built and you might have a homeowner that might be interested in that type of opportunity. Great question. Other questions before I flip to the phasing plan? We can always come back to this, but I want to make sure we talk about… Mr. Kirchoff: We need to talk about suggested ideas of what those building would be. Mr. Prazeau: so, in this particular plan, the kind of maroon color, in the box, inside of those, we talked about parking structures being able to be wrapped, right. So, what you see with apartments that are being built in mixed use kind of vertically integrated projects where you might have some retail 1st floor, and then you have 2nd floor, 3rd floor, maybe 4th floor residential. Those are about the size of those postage stamps projects, so think about some of the things you may have seen, maybe a Collins, or a Browning or a Buckingham, those kinds of things. Apartment buildings that are 130 to maybe 200 units, those are about the size. That doesn’t mean this is a conceptual plan, it’s not a perfect plan but it starts to talk about what might be the next steps you might start to see from a developer. So those projects would be again, that kind of 3 or 4 stories, likely with a parking structure wrapped inside of those. When those kinds of projects come before a plan commission, or an RDC council, you often see the developer wanting some help with getting the parking structure partially paid for. The reason that happens is, what they’ll do is, that structure that’s in the midst of that building, albeit they need 3 levels of parking, but it’s really cost effective to build 4 because the building is tall enough to screen and wrap that, and that might provide you some opportunity to have some public parking to be able to support events and programs that you might want to have downtown. So that’s really, really common on in the market right now. To the other question on the table, the teal building, there’s actually two. Would it be a surprise to any of you if I told you you’re busting at the seams in this building? We’ve got people working in hallways, we had some discussions about working out of closets a little bit ago. So, its thinking about well what might some transition area space look like to take some of that pressure off. And maybe at some point that includes reworking spaces like this, maybe you have a better council chamber that’s in a better location, but can you get effective and efficient good office use there. That larger teal building is really a study of what kind of destination opportunities could we create in the downtown district, that again, have people come park their car and spend the afternoon? They want to walk, they want to shop, they want to go to a nice restaurant, but they’re going to be here for a few hours. One of that is creating opportunities where there’s something of a theme and a character that fits. So, a lot of times when we’ve had public sessions folks have come and said, hey, I know that the town is interested in repurposing the theatre, but it’s really too small to be a theatre that can be used in today’s more modern way, right? That capacity isn’t there. But is there an opportunity to perhaps have a performing arts center of some size where you could have civic functions happening in the downtown court. So that’s really what those, those are going to be the first projects, and that was really the segue that Bill teed up to the implementation plan, so I’m going to flip to that for just a


moment. Alright, so, what we like to do when we’re working on plans like this is really make sure as a commission you understand that this is a 15-20 year plan. These things don’t happen overnight. There’s really an organic process that unfolds. Another thing that’s really important to understand is that it’s really market driven. You’re trying to set up and encourage private development, right? The private market works on a pace that works for them. Sometimes that’s faster than you want, sometimes it’s slower, and it will certainly be affected by market trends, right? We are in a good cycle now, there will be some dips and some changes over time. But we want to make sure that we’re making good investments, good public investments that encourage the right type of private investment. So as far as pace goes, you’re going to notice one thing that the RDC mentioned earlier, for phase 1 I put a 1-3 year notation on it, this is our best hunch from what we see happening in the market right now. When projects and plans like this are developed you’re going to likely see, that’s that parking structure we talked about, end-capped, that’s a performing arts center or perhaps a first mixed used project depending on where it’s at. We’re starting to look at the first leg of Mill Street being developed and at the end cap of that village core and then the start of that Krewson corridor. We’re also showing what would be some circulation roadway and sidewalk improvements both on the south and north sides of Main Street. As that 2nd phase comes in, and I’ll come back to that timeframe in a just a minute, but as that 2

nd phase comes in, you’re likely to see, once Mill Street as a corridor

is strengthened, you’ll start to see some building blocks take shape, some mixed use and some vertically integrated projects. You’ll see some folks with town home, or brownstone type projects. Want to have their folks looking out over the creek, right? That’s a really valuable space when you’re thinking about that redevelopment project. And then what you’ll notice in phase 2 is, that village core, that pocket park and that connection to that pedestrian bridge is solidified and Krewson is extended throughout. Phase 3 really starts to grow north. Again, you start to have some of those projects take shape. You start to see some of those repopulated historic contributing homes. And in phase 4 you start to see the building blocks of what might be some repurposing happening along Main Street, as well as that kind of smaller infrastructure, those transition area zones and public green space that would happen. Now the RDC asked a really important question earlier, which was. How do you know its going to be 1-3 years? That really varies a lot, right? We’ve got some communities, that are really trying hard, I’ll use an example. Yorktown right, we’ve done a plan about a year ago, we finished a plan for Yorktown. Well they’re trying to create something that didn’t really exist before, right. They’re trying to create energy and synergy in a place that’s kind of bored with it to be honest, they’re having to work a little harder. They don’t have a lot of TIFF funding, their tool box is a lot thinner than yours is, we’ve got some other communities that may be a little bit more parallel. Certainly Fishers, and after they finished their plan with us in 2012, they had some resources and have been aggressive, really aggressive. So right now, they are 5 years in that 2012 plan, it’s 2017 now, but they’re over halfway complete with the infill and vision of that total plan.my guess is in 8-10 years they will have outgrown their 20 year plan. So, what’s that mean to you? so for you guys because you do have some tools at your disposal, I think you’ll be able to kind of drive the schedule a little bit more than some communities, if you so choose. I think you’ll be able to be more choosy about where your public infrastructure goes and what that means. I also think you already have private development, I know you already have private development interested in downtown. You’re not trying to create demand. You’re trying to plan ahead of that demand. So, you’ve got a lot of things going for you. so, my guess is that, that 1-3 years is probably going to be a 1-2 for you, and then it will just be a question of how fast the market then starts to drive right? Because it will be the private investment that takes the lead after that. So those are the four basic phases. We’d be happy at any level of the tale that you’d what to go through both implementation or the plan. We can again, rewind to any point that you’d like. Mr. Smith : Have you thought about a waterfront, along the creek? You mentioned the town homes. Perhaps, along in there. I wonder about the big picture, the big view, it may be a bit of a dream, create a waterfront along in there. Mr. Prazeau: Yeah. I think, not only have we been thinking about that, I don’t think that is a far-fetched dream. I think once you start to clear out a few sheds and you have control of the land that is adjacent, on the east side of the creek, I think you’re going to see that be some of the most valuable land in the entire district, because it’s such a beacon for those developers. Their tenants are demanding that kind of connectivity and walkability, so it’s really going to be important. A reason I went back to this diagram, is there’s some precedent images. Some images that we’ve talked about in committee, that’s in South Carolina. So, there’s a lot of projects that you see reengage those waterfronts. This is a terrific example of that. Where a previously underserved, under utilized corridor gets


development, and we clipped it, so you can’t see it, but these are brownstones and apartment buildings on the left that are up about 6 feet in the air, above the trail, so that there’s some semi-private separation that happens there, vertically and horizontally. It very definitely matters. Then you end up getting a multi-use path or a greenway that activates everything that’s happening along that corridor. And those are the units that are in demand. You might get a nice bridge that crosses the creek to again, activate both sides. So not only are we thinking about it, but I think that’s going to be an important part of the puzzle for you guys. Mr. Smith : Who would do an event center? You talked like that might be an early phase thing. Is that the sort of thing you’re thinking as a town project, or is that something a developer crew would take on? Mr. Prazeau: We see that happen in a variety of different ways. I’m going to speak to Brownsburg for a moment, you’re familiar, I’m sure with what they have pursued. They actually are now looking at a recreation center, community center, recreation center to try to anchor their downtown development. They figured out that just having apartment is not going to cut it, there’s going to have to be a destination, right? We talked about theme, and kind of the use of what that core or that energy of what that town looks like. For them I think that’s maybe the direction they’re going to go. I think you have an opportunity with what is happening in Hendricks County, when you think about civic opportunities, I think a performing arts center could do a lot of great things for downtown. It creates that destination opportunity. Folks that a coming with maybe a little bit if disposable income that want to do some shopping, what to eat at a nice restaurant, want to frequent the businesses. So, I thank that again, that is not the only answer, but I think that that is one opportunity that is there. Whether the cart and the horse are in line, I think timing and schedules are really up to you, its what you’d like to see happening. Mr. Brandgard: I think public or private, it all depends on how it all falls out. We need to do something with this building, so how do we make that work? And it will be a partnership with some. Mr. Klinger : It’s probably not one or the other, it’s probably both. Mr. Kirchoff : You know the fire stations in going to be repurposed here, in the next, less than a year, so that will be a potential site for us. How do we make sure that what we do here doesn’t hurt our east side business community? Mr. Prazeau: So that’s a great question and I know retail coach has dealt a little bit with that so ill talk from my perspective in the plan. So, the types of businesses that are created typically in that village atmosphere are very different than what you would see at a Perry Crossing or at kind of a big box area. The folks that they’re looking for, their constituents are very, very different. So, they’re looking for small coffee shops, bike shops, boutique restaurants, probably not chains. you’re not going to get an Arby’s, downtown in a core, in a first level of a building, you’re going to get a Metro Diner, you’re going to get something like that. I also think, and I should have mentioned this earlier, you have some really valuable retailers and restaurateurs that are downtown right now. Some of them are going to see their land values increase enough that it might warrant them considering the best and highest use of their properties is what they’re doing today. But what I think also that you’re going to find, that there’s going to be those mixed used developers that are going to want an anchor restaurant in their building on that first level, that are going to be real excited about having a breakfast place or what have you that wants to fit into that plan. So, they will have a place for them in the puzzle, they’re not going to be displaced by this process Mr. : I’ve seen a little bit of some Facebook, where some of the people who have homes, especially north of US40, they’re uncertain, they’re concerned. You know, what’s this mean to us? You know, I just spent a lot of money remodelling my kitchen, you know, what’s going to happen to us? That’s the level that they’re thinking and so what thoughts do you have for these folks? Mr. Prazeau: yeah, so, a couple things. We always try to reinforce what I mentioned earlier, how organic and extended the process is. So, it literally, the answer is most of the time, the conceptual plan will only take shape if and when the private sector determines that’s really warranted. We have had, to your point, we’ve had folks come to the public meeting saying…


Mr. Smith: Probably the same thing Mr. Prazeau: Well not only what you mentioned, buy coming to us saying, I’m ready to come back downtown, and then we’ve had a couple people that said, I just bought a house a year ago that I though might be worth about what I paid for it for the foreseeable future, and I think you may have just created a situation for me, that I want to be here 3-4 years, and by that time, I may have doubled or tripled the value of my house, thank you for doing that because I could have never created that kind of value with out a plan like this. So, will be a mixed value, there’s going to be that kind of activity that happens. Mr. Smith: But we don’t want to be Broad Ripple, I don’t think. Mr: Prazeau: I don’t think you’re going to have that. If Broad Ripple had 23,000 cars coming through it on US40 I think they’d be a little bit different too. I don’t think you’ll see that. I also think you have an opportunity, you think about work force housing, you’ve got a lot of business that are within a stone’s throw of here, they’re going to be a little bit different than maybe, the market of Fishers, we talked about them as looking for, right? So, you’re going to have more varied price points. The reason why I emphasize that, I think that’s really part of a healthy community, because you see, let’s use Indianapolis as an example, every one of the mixed-use projects that are happening downtown is driven by luxury apartments. Marble countertops, stainless steel appliances, they look pretty much the same. At some point they will have saturated that market and there will not be different levels. I think you’ve got an opportunity that the demand is there at both middle, high and low income. I think it’s be really nice to see the diversity of the happen, so that folks that are downtown, in a maybe different way than the question you asked, folks that are downtown can have a place to stay without being pushed out. Mr. Brandgard: You hit on something. I think that part of what makes Plainfield work, it that we’ve got a various strata of incomes in the community and everybody works together regardless of their income. So, I mean as long as we can keep that going, that makes for a better community. We certainly don’t want to harm it. Mr. Prazeau: I agree. One young lady came to, gosh it was probably July, she came to one of the public sessions, it was an open house, so the boards are up, we’re not doing a presentation, we’re there one on one to talk, and she said I just signed a lease a month ago, it’s going to be at least 11 months before you finish. I said I can promise you it’s going to be more than 11 months. So, I do think Robin your point is very valid, I think if we’re thoughtful and we plan ahead throughout this, again because you have more tools in the tool box than maybe some, you could actually effectuate the right type of development that meets those price points a little quicker than some communities can. Mr. : And as we do this, we’ve got to recognize what is here so we won’t be driving people out to where they can’t go anywhere else. there’s some large communities that have done than and they’re in trouble. Mr. Prazeau: I agree. This is a slight tangent to the question that you mentioned. You know there will be dome hold outs, there always are, in any given block, in any given area. The development community is pretty good at working around that. They’ll right size a project to fit the land that they have, or if they get kin of tired of it, they’ll just pay the silly, ridiculous amount that they want for the house. I promise that happens. But let’s not kid ourselves that that’s not going to happen here right? On a similar note, you know, not everyone will be anxious to see change. That will happen. But, you know, our original contract for this project started out with the comprehensive plans a guidance that said whether this sub-area needed to be analysed in more detail. You’ve got a tremendous public process, you’ve got a lot of great input, a really good comprehensive plan. So, when we signed our original contract for this project, we were going to have four public meetings to supplement what the comprehensive plan had already done. We got a few months into that and staff said, you know what, let’s go robust. So RDC says, you know what, we take that recommendation seriously and this is, tonight, I think out 15

th

public session. So, I think we have listened, we’ve adapted, we’ve changed the plan along the way. Will it make everyone happy? Probably not. But again, it is a conceptual plan. It’s not all knowing, so things will happen that will change over time, but it gives you a roadmap. It sets a level of quality, vocabulary that you feel like are appropriate, and you work on a case by case basis with the development world and you see where it goes.


Mr. Smith: What are your next steps, and then how does the Plan Commission fit into it? Mr Prazeau: So, I’ll answer the first half of that and then I’ll let Tony and Andrew go from there. So, the RDC approved thee plan. So, the draft plan has been approved. The conceptual plan. Mr. Kirchoff: We’ve had conversations with people being concerned about people saying, look what you’re going to do to downtown. And we say, no it’s only a concept. Mr. Prazeau: It looks a little too real for some folks, and I completely understand that, right? So, Bill was very careful tonight to make sure that the approval earlier with RDC, we will be re-titling the plan to read Conceptual Downtown Redevelopment Plan. And that’s very accurate, that is a very important step. Mr. Klinger: I think we’re going to have some more conversations later this week about messaging, how do we deliver the message to the public about this conceptual plan Mr. Brandgard: Surprisingly, I’ve had several people who have said that they either saw this on Facebook or the town website or somewhere and they said good move. I have not heard any negative comments from people just walking up, and this is people I don’t know. Mr. Klinger: Yeah I think throughout there you mentioned the 15

th public meeting. Some of those were public

meetings and some of those were you know very active and getting people out. You know at the farmer’s market you had such a crown that I couldn’t even get up to say hi to you. the vast majority of the comments were all very positive. Obviously, there were some folks that had some specific concerns, particularly people who lived in the area, who had concerns about how does it impact me. I’m really kind of surprised actually that we didn’t have more negative comments than we did. The vast, vast majority of it was very positive and people seem to think we’re headed in the right direction. Mr. Prazeau: I would concur, that’s been our experience. Bruce, in January, the implementation process, there will be some study of cost. Cost analysis, cost benefit study. Courtney from Veridus is here tonight, Tim Jenson and Courtney will be helping lead that process. So, we’ll get into the nuts and bolts, the bean counting of it to figure out what that looks like. That’s important. As a body like yours is starting to look at priorities. So those are the next steps. Mr. Smith: And at some point, I think a while ago you said you might need some new ordinances or things like that? Mr. Prazeau: yeah, there’s probably some zoning overlays to reinforce some again, vocabulary scale, those types of things. We don’t want to re-write your ordinance, but some overlay documents to kind of use some precedent images, use some diagrams, we can reinforce that, get you what you’re looking for. Mr. Klinger: yeah there will be some implementation pieces that will be coming back to the Plan Commission. And certainly, as we get into actual projects, those will be coming to the Plan Commission as well. So, I just want to make sure everyone understands the concept and is on board with the concept, so as those plans come in, we’ll be able to address those individually. Address the individual needs and concerns of each project. Mr. Prazeau: For what it matters, I had chalked up the smooth process that you all just described, as really the hard work you guys have done with staff, all of the commissions and bodies. There’s a lot of overlap, not only do you have folks that sit on multiple committees, but the amount of staff and leadership from the town that comes, to our public meetings is amazing. We’ve not had that before. Normally there’s one or two elected officials in the room. I’m not sure we’ve ever had less than six or seven. And staff has certainly been out in force, so, I assumed a lot of that is that you’re meeting folks in the community about and about and you’re able to message that with us. So, messaging is going to be really important moving forward and we’re ready to help.


Mr. Smith: Any more questions at this point? Will you be back in the beginning of next year? Mr. Prazeau: I suspect that we’ll be involved in both the overlays and the implementation. Mr. Smith: But we don’t know that for sure. Mr. Prazeau: I’m kind of counting on it. Mr. Smith: well I’m sure between your leadership and with the leadership Joe can provide, we’ll be on course. And we’ll be in sync with the Redevelopment Commission. Mr. Prazeau: Thanks so much, appreciate your time. Thanks everybody. Mr. Smith: Also, old/new business we have a proposed Amendment. Mr. James: I’ve been approached by some businesses in the industrial district about putting in bus shelters. Several of their employees ride the buses to work. So, we didn’t have any standards to allow bus shelters, or we didn’t have an approval process. So, what we did, we already had the Article 3.10, the ROW Overlay District, so we just added some standards to that article. That’s what is before you tonight. Amendment to Article 3.10 to include these bus shelter standards. Hopefully you’ve had a chance to look them over. What we would do, is we would approve a master plan that would be approved by the Plan Commission that would approve all of the locations and the bus shelter standards and then each individual bus shelter would then be approved with an improvement location permit with administrative approval. And then we also included some provisions for waivers in case there’s specific circumstances, like a right of way or utility conflicts where we might need some waivers. We did include provisions for waivers and then if for some reason we couldn’t get a shelter in a right of way, we also then put in an exception, that bus shelters would then be permitted as an accessory structure on that specific business’ property and those would be approved with an ILP in full compliance with these standards. Hopefully you’ve had a chance to look them over and you think we’re headed in the right direction. Mr. Smith: Is the picture we’re seeing up there, is that the definitive design for these shelter developments? Mr. James: Once we approve the approval process, the next step would be selecting what type of bus shelter we’d like to put out. So, the committee decided on this particular design as an example of different options. You could have a red frame, you could have a metal frame, a red roof or just a clear roof, a red roof with the silver, metallic frame and then the standard Plainfield logo, “P” on the shelters. So that’s the next step, deciding on what the bus shelters would look like. So, you know, we have to consider cost, how much would each shelter cost, as far as these panels, if we have to put in a larger bus shelter because we’re getting a lot of riders at a particular stop, then all we have to do is buy more panels to expand it. Mr. Smith: Is the standard size, if I was reading it correctly, are they basically about 5x8ft? There’s a lot of dimensions that are listed on that. Mr. James: Yeah, that would be the standard size, which could be increased with the additional panels if needed, longer or deeper. Also, we’ll select the benches, the furniture, standard signs, garbage cans, things like that. Mr. Daniel: Joe, you want comments on this, so you can act on this right away? Mr. : Yeah we’d like comments. And then hopefully after we get your comments, we can bring it back in January and we’ll do the public notice and it’s be at the public hearing in January. Do you just want to email me your comments? I guess that’d be the best way to do it. Mr. Smith: Will the town be paying for these or is this a town cost?


Mr. James: We don’t know yet. Mr. Kirchoff: I guess the only comment I has was that where it says the town is going to ask for some businesses… and I put or allowing them to be installed, so it isn’t necessarily us. Because we’ve already had… you’ve been working on this thing… and then we’d work out the reimbursement or whatever. I don’t know that we were necessarily, it has to be us… Mr. Smith: On your map of locations, one of them seems to be in the far right, is that still inside the town? Mr. Kirchoff: That’s the connector for Bridgeport Road Mr. McPhail: These are the current stops right? Mr. James: Yep, that’s correct. The current stops on the two routes that we have. Mr. Smith: So these locations are approximate, I guess. Mr. Philip: They’re subject to change. Mr. James: Right. Mr. Smith: Well because we could have new buildings built, and workforces moved around. Mr. Kirchoff: Well, and ridership impacts that. Mr. Smith: And even the building out there, outside of town, at the connection line, maybe we could encourage that design as the same design as our stops, I don’t know. Mr. McPhail: In all this red, and I really like the red, are there any improvements in paint and things to keep it from fading so much? Have we seen any improvements in that type of stuff? Mr. James: Yeah, that’s something we could look at. Mr. McPhail: You know, like our way finding signs. We’ve had a lot of fading in all of those. Mr. Brandgard: Yeah, we really need to do something with the way finding signs. Mr. McPhail: We need to look for a product that doesn’t fade. We’re having a fading problem. Mr. Brandgard: I think Joe has some budget dollars for next year. Mr. James: Yeah, and then Lee Faulkner with TKO, I think he’s got another product that we can consider. So, I’ll get with Wade and update those numbers for you. Mr. Brandgard: Maybe they have a wrap we can put on them, because the color in the wraps tend to hold up a lot better than the paint. Mr. Smith: So you have what you need tonight? General consent, I think we’re all liking the start. Mr. Smith: We have a couple of Invitees this evening.


Mr. James: Yeah, fist one is, an establishment out on Main Street, they’ve been putting up an illegal banner advertising, I think half price off on Wednesdays, when it’s got to be associated with a town sponsored event. As of today, they had it down, but it comes and goes so we’ll just keep an eye on them. Our next one is Larkin Collision out here on Vestal Road and Main Street. They’ve got trash dumpsters located in between the building and the street that are not in trash enclosures. We haven’t actually talked to Mr. Larkin, we haven’t been able to contact him, but we did talk to a manager out there and he said that what we thought were trash dumpsters, were actually used to store auto parts. So, I’ve got Terry checking the development plan that was approved for Larkin Collision to see if it did show a trash enclosure on site plan. Mr. Slavens: We just dropped my wife’s car off there tonight and they’re still in between the buildings and Vestal Road and there appears to be a trash container out in the middle with the lid open. Mr. Kirchoff: I can tell you the neighbors view it as a trash enclosure because it’s blowing over into their yard. Mr. James: We’ve got other businesses like that, older businesses that maybe when they started using dumpsters, trash enclosures weren’t required but now they’ve got exposed trash dumpsters like that so I guess I need to get with Mel and see if we can still require them to build a trash enclosure to hide these dumpsters. Mr. Kirchoff: There’s one on site. These dumpsters used to be in that trash enclosure. And then they were saying that they’re no longer in there and that’s why its blowing over into his yard. So, there is one in that back building attached to it. Mr. James: OK, well we’ll get back with them. I’m going to update you on some other violations. 332 Pickett, we had to look at this back in September, a young lady was here representing Ms. McDonald, and she gave us a plan that they would follow to get the property cleaned up, but come October it hadn’t been cleaned up. No progress was made so you ordered us to send a citation. We sent the citation October 10

th, the deadline was November

25th

, but we got a call last week from the police department, saying that they made 3 arrests at the residence for growing and selling drugs. So, the police department called me to see if we wanted to take a look at the property. So, Terry went and looked at it and he said inside the house was a mess, especially in the basement where they were actually growing the illegal drugs. So, we called the health department, they tried to get in Friday, they couldn’t get in. The young lady that was here that night, she’s actually one of the ones that got arrested. She had a baby, couldn’t care for the baby so they had to call child protective services, but anyway. Now what I’d like to do now that the deadline is passed for the citations is get a court order to get the property cleaned up. So, with your consent, we’d move forward with that. Mr. Smith: That’s the usual procedure? Mr. James: Yes. The other route is to declare it a nuisance, but maybe to get the court order to have it cleaned up would be the easier rouse. Mr. Smith: Do we have consent on that? Group: Yes. Mr. James: Walmart, they had 14 storage containers, they do this every year for the holiday season to store merchandise. They had them on the west side of the parking lot, we sent them a notice. We were able to work with corporate headquarters. They’re going to move the 10 in the west parking lot by December the 21

st. I told

them they could keep the 4 that are on the back-property line, but next year we’re going to have to work out a plan with them to prevent this from happening again. And we’re also going to keep working with them on the truck parking.


Mr. Kirchoff: Along that line, I don’t know what it is, Dickies and Burlington or whatever. I think Walmart’s so full they’re overflowing into that one. Mt wife said well look, now they’re parking in that one for overnight parking. And Marsh is another one as well. Mr. Kirchoff: That’s a good point. Mr. James: Yeah, we’ll get with the owners of the property and tell them about the ordinance that exists and see if we can’t work out a plan with the police department to get that taken care of. Mr. Smith: I wonder if this is a simple, no truck parking sign that we can post. Mr. Brandgard: We can’t do that on private property unless they sign up to put a sign up so we can enforce that ordinance. Mr. James: I got a call this afternoon from the engineer that has been working on the Walmart project, the parking lot out there next to their existing building in AllPoints. They’re looking at plans to moving ahead with the building for AllPoints 7. This would be the building that would contain a lot of their bulk items. They submitted an ILP for a 1.1 million square foot building. They said the footprint of the building would stay the same. We took the building to DRC because it didn’t have to go to the Plan Commission because it wasn’t within 60 feet of a residential district or a gateway corridor. Now because they want to use this building for the bulk items, they need a building that’s 150ft tall. The height maximum in the I2 is 75ft. so they would need a variance in order to go 150ft. they said they would need that for ¾ of the building. Mr. Smith: How big is the footprint? Mr. James: 1.1 million square feet. Mr. Kirchoff: And Joe, while we’re doing that, will they be close enough that they don’t have to worry about the airport in height? Mr. James: No I don’t think so. Mr. Kirchoff: OK Mr. James: Here’s AllPoints, and this is their existing building, number 3, number 7 would go right here, number 8 is currently under construction right here. Mr. Smith: 8’s a normal sized building. Mr. Daniel: 7’s going to be the tall one? Mr. James: Yes Mr. Kirchoff: But it will still be between two so you’ll be able to see the rooftop. Mr. Philip: Except for it will be twice as tall as everything around it. Mr. James: Yes it will be three times as tall. The current buildings are about 50ft tall. So, they just want to know if we can support a variance for that height. Mr. Brandgard: Before I go there, I need to understand what it is going to look like. Mr. Kirchoff: Yes, they give us some rendering in relationship to the problem.


Mr. James: I have one more thing. Clancy’s Mobile Home Park, behind Donatos, some potential new owners are looking at buying it. They want to replace the 60ft mobile homes with 80ft units, mobile homes. We have allowed mobile home parks to replace mobile homes in the Deerfield and Clarks Creek behind the Walmart. Mr. Daniel: but they’re not legal, non-conforming are they? The others? Mr. James: Yes. They way you can look at it is, are they increasing the legal non-conformity? They did have three campers in there and we told them that is not a campground and the campers had to go, so they are taking out the campers. Mr. Brandgard: that’s a small area to be putting 80ft ones in. There’s be fewer units I suppose. Mr. James: They would be better looking units. There’s about 7 or 8 pads back there. One pad has not been used in a while and you can’t even tell it’s a pad anymore. Mr. Klinger: So wouldn’t that be essentially a re-plat if they’re changing the number of units? Mr. James: Well they’re not increasing the number, it would still be fewer number of homes than the number of pads that they have. Mr. Klinger: Does that mean that mobile homes are not passing over multiple pads though? Mr. Kirchoff: Can they give you a layout of what that would look like? Mr. Brandgard: Yeah, compared to what it is to date. Mr. James: Yes. Mr. Klinger: I guess my point is, that sounds like a fairly substantial change. If it’s in legal non-conforming use I don’t know if they can make that substantial of a change. Mr. Daniel: Usually, if you’re not expanding the outer boundaries of a business like that, you’re OK, within reason. Now if you start substantially increasing the volume, and things like that, sometimes you can cross a line. But as long as you’re not changing the outer dimensions of the actual business, you’re usually OK. Mr. Kirchoff: That’s why I’d like to see it before, if they could do that. Mr. James: OK, we’ll ask for that. Mr. Kirchoff: I think that’s fair. Mr. James: OK, that’s all I have Mr. Smith: Alright, anything else for the good of the cause? Mr. McPhail: Did we adopt the Downtown Redevelopment Plan? Mr. Philip: No, not ours to adopt. It was for Town Council to adopt. Mr. Smith: We are adjourned.

plainfield plan commission december 4, 2017 7:00 pm · plainfield plan commission december 4, 2017...

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