minutes of the customer interaction meeting · pdf fileicf zonal railways rites ltd/rdso 1...

MINUTES OF THE CUSTOMER INTERACTION MEETING HELD AT ICF ON 29TH

AND 30TH

OF APRIL 2014

Members Present

ICF ZONAL RAILWAYS RITES LTD/RDSO

1 Pankaj Kumar CME 1 R Manimaran Dy.CME/HQ/SR 1

Anil Kumar Jain

P Suresh GM/RITES/Southern

Region 2 S G Hundekari CEE 2 M A Rafeeq Dy.CME/C&W/SC/SCR

3 L C Trivedi CPM 3 S Ramachnadran SME/C&W/HQ/SR 2 Anil Kumar

Jain

GM/RITES/Southern

Region 4 N K Toppo CME/QA 4 Sanjay Kumar CDO/BBS/ECoR

5 S Srinivas CDE/Mech 5 Uday Kumar CDO/DBG/ECR 3 P K Srivastava Dy.Direction/RDSO

6 S P Vavre CDE/Elec 6 P K Singh CDO/JBP/WCR

7 S K Paswan CWE/S 7 R K Sharma CDO/JP/ADI/NWR

8 K S Jain CWE/F 8 Rakesh Chandra CDO/LKO/NR

9 R Veerasekaran Dy.CME/Design-II 9 Sudhangshu Mallik CDO/MFP/ECR

10 M E Srinivasan Dy.CME/Fur 10 S M Sakil Ahmed CDO/VSKP/ECoR

11 P Sivaraman Dy.CME/Bogie 11 R T Selvam ACMT/PL/WR

12 D Neelakantan Dy.CME/Design-I 12 Chandra Bhan ADME/C&W/GKP/NR

13 S Rajendran Dy.CME/QC 13 M Vamsikanth ADME/HQ/TVC/SR

14 P K Patnaik ADME/Santragachi/SER

15 Alam AWM/KGPW/SER

16 E Sundaramurthy SSE/C&W/HQ/SR

17 B Srinivas SSE/C&W/SCR

18 Suresh Kumar SSE/Chg/AGC/NCR

19 Anil Kumar SSE/NR

20 A K Shukla SSE/NR

21 P Ravindran SSE/TVC/SR

1

Reporting Railways SWR/Aug'13, CR/Aug'13, SWR/Jan'14 Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Side Buffer

Brief Account of

Problem

Buffer face plate wears out frequently and spindle rod rotates

freely. Cases of buffer casing /socket crack are very high

Action taken/Drawing

No.

New specification is made in line with specification for axle box

housing. New specification ICF/ MD/SPEC-252 Dt. 10-08-2013 has

been issued with the following salient features: Material has been

upgraded to IS 1030-98: 230-450W which has higher mechanical

properties. Radiography test on 10% of buffers of each batch

offered for inspection. Ultrasonic test on 100% of buffers of each

batch offered for inspection. Destructive test on 2% of buffers of

each batch offered for inspection to examine casting defects like

porosity, blow holes, shrinkage, slag inclusion etc.

Implementation status

of the modification in

the coaches

All new supplies are as per this specification. 200 Nos. of Side

Buffers are received as per new specification

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

Advice to all rlys to adopt this new Spec.- Already advised as per

CDE.

WR- insufficient Heat treatment is the main reason for the cracks –

Temp and timing not maintained properly. Should be of 100%

pearlite structure.

RITES – RDSO DRG. Covers all the 3 parameters- testing are being

done as per RDSO DRG and ICF spec.

RLYS – Jagadamba quality is very poor.

CME instructed CDE to review all the vendors including testing

facility of the vendor.

CME asked Rlys to maintain vendor-wise records, analysis the

failure vendor-vise / where the failure occurred.

Feedback to be given to ICF, RDSO & RITES.

Remarks ---

2

Reporting Railways SR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

ALL/Door

Brief Account of

Problem

The main doors of 2010 year built coaches are getting corroded

prematurely in the first POH itself.


No.

A proposal to switch over to Stainless Door for FAC is under

vetting. Tender for Stainless Door for Non-AC Coaches has been

finalized.

Drg. No. 140-5-1-021 Dt.22/10/2010 – For Non-AC Coaches

Drg. No. 329-5-1-030 Dt.05/03/2014 – For AC Coaches



the coaches

Tender under Finalization.

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

CPM -> No FRP doors to be used.

CWE/S-> 50% of Non AC this year, within next year 100% SS doors.

CDE-> asked to ensure proper fitment.

CDO/VSKP-> pivot failure due to corrosion of Z angle is the main

reason for door failure.

Remarks ---

3

Reporting Railways SWR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

First AC/Furnishing/Ladder

Brief Account of

Problem

In First AC, top climbing ladder is not convenient. After the second

step, the passenger is required to turn and sit on the berth. The

ladder position is to be changed to a convenient location.


No. Prototype Staircase type footstep has been approved.



the coaches

Prototype is under Trial.

Drawing is under issue, PDC June 2014.

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

CME desired that this should be expedited and the first coach to

be shown to him with this new type of staircase.

Dy CME DESIGN- 1 No, ready - to be approved.

Remarks ---

4

Reporting Railways CR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

WCB/Flooring

Brief Account of

Problem

Seepage of water from kitchen area over battery box and air brake

components leading to corrosion of under frame and it mountings


No.

Sloped flooring with trench provided vide Drg.No. WCB 4-4-1-401

alt ‘r’ dt.11-10-13 has been issued.



the coaches

Implemented from November 2013 (Shell No. WCB 490 onwards)

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 --

Remarks --

5

Reporting Railways SR/Aug’13, SCR/Aug’13, CR/Aug’13, SWR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All/Flooring

Brief Account of

Problem Defects on pasting of PVC floor sheets in toilet area.


No.

An alternate material like Polymerized PVC flooring as per RDSO

Specn. C-9704-1997 has been tried.



the coaches

Implemented in FAC coaches in February 2014 as a trial measure.

Another 10 Coaches will be tried In the first week of May 2014.

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

Process to be out-sourced.

Rly- peeling gives ugly look.

Decision- All AC coaches will be of polymerized lav floor

Remarks ---

6


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Modular Toilet

Brief Account of

Problem

Renewal of sole bar / head stock causes lot of difficulties in

modular toilet coaches and FRP inlay coaches.


No.

Decision has been taken to provide SS Modular toilets in all AC

Coaches as per the minutes of meeting for the implementation of

stainless steel modular toilets in FAC (20-Berth), ACCW and ACCN

coaches held on 02/07/2013 at CWE/Fur/Conference room.

Drg.Nos. 524-6-3-202, 524-6-3-203, 524-6-3-204, 524-6-3-205,

524-6-3-206 – Feb 2012.



the coaches

Implemented

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

Feedback reg. SS modular toilet is required from Rlys.

Rlys-> SS is better. But plumbing is difficult.

Dy Design- Al. composite pipe is being used, so, chances of leak are

very less.

CDO shakkel. ->LHB Taps are prone to theft. 70% of taps are

missing during first run. Rlys do not have spares. Vendors are not

suppling small quatity.

Dy Design asked the Rlys to furnish their qty of requirement, so

that ICF can combine the requirement with ICF requirement.

Rlys->Gravity cock is good.

Remarks ---

7

Reporting Railways SCR/Aug'13, CR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

AC & Non-AC Sleeper Coaches/Lavatory/Lav. Inlay

Brief Account of

Problem Stagnation of water in Toilets


No.

Additional pressing is given in the inlay to minimize the drumming

effect there by reducing the chances of water pockets. Drawing

has been issued vide drawing No.ICF/STD-4-1- 011 alt ‘e’ dt.11-12-

13.



the coaches

Improved design has been cut in from the existing order of M/s.

Costal Steels and the firm has supplied 100 Nos. Fitment in

progress. Future procurement will be with improved design.

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

Rly wanted the cut-in date for new inlay.

CDE-> integrated support from bottom of the with inlay and

antiskid tiles above inlay are in design anvil.

Remarks ---

8

Reporting Railways SR/Aug ‘13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

NON - AC/Lav Window Assy/Banjo Shutter

Brief Account of

Problem

Banjo shutters in toilets in GS are easily removed by passengers

and toilet is used for travelling.


No.

Rivet Size increased to Dia 8 mm in the revised Drawing No.077-5-

5-030 alt ‘d’ dt.13-01-14.



the coaches

Will be implemented from 2015-16, through upcoming

procurement cycle after consuming the available stock.

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 Cut in date? Dy. FUR agreed for revised rivet size.

Remarks

To be followed by Production/Fur

Vide letter No.MFPL/160/7 Dt.16/05/2014, stores department has

been advised to advice the suppliers to modify the rivet size in the

existing PO Nos.071314651804 and 071314651821.

9


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/AIR BRAKE/200L AUX. RESERVOIR

Brief Account of

Problem 200L Auxiliary reservoirs are getting corroded in first POH itself.


No.

Already switched over to SS reservoir vide drg.No.ICF/STD-3-5-065

dated 30-11-09.



the coaches

Implemented

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

SR- why 200 ltr, 150 is sufficient.

CDE- Safety related item – advised SR to write to RDSO. Asked to

give calculation.

Remarks ---

10

Reporting Railways SWR/Aug'13, SR/Jan'14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

NON-AC/FURNISHING/DUST BIN

Brief Account of

Problem

Dust bin cover securing arrangement in Non-AC coaches is giving

problem during service.


No.

ICF has started to provide Stainless steel Dust Bins in place of FRP

in some of the newly turned out coaches. Will be provided in all

the coaches after duly taking care of the stock and dues of the FRP

Dust Bins.



the coaches

Implemented

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

Design to be improved with easily cleanable and more volumunues

dust bin design.

FAC also to be provided with dust bins.

Remarks Design to study further.

11

Reporting Railways SCR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Air Brake

Brief Account of

Problem

Due to continuous dynamic vibrations, ferrule joints of cut off

angle cocks are getting failed due to leak in en-route and causing

detention to trains.


No.

Additional support needs to be introduced for securing the cut off

angle cocks, as provided in LHB coaches. Drg. Modified. Drg.

No.329-3-5-031 dt. 12/07/2013 introduced bracket for clamping

the Angle Cock with Headstock. Feedback on the same expected

from Rlys.



the coaches

Implemented from October 2013

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

100% implemented.

Nuts to be designed such a way that can be accessed from outside-

Remarks after FUR visit.

Remarks Design to study further.

12


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Inlay

Brief Account of

Problem

Single Piece SS Commodes are to be provided as the welded

commodes are getting corroded and working out of Foot Seats.


No.

ICF is following single piece design vide drawing No.ICF/STD-4-1-

011 alt Nil dated 03-09-2010 Already implemented from 2011

onwards.



the coaches

Implemented

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 ---

Remarks ---

13


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

WCB/Partition frame/Partition Mesh

Brief Account of

Problem

Cleaning and maintenance of Partition mesh in aisle of Pantry car

is difficult. Gives shabby appearance.


No.

Mesh is replaced with tubes vide drawing No.203-1-0-503 alt ‘d’

dated 02-09-2013.



the coaches

Implemented from Nov. 2013 (Shell No. WCB 490 onwards)

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 12 shells turned out

Remarks ---

14


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

SGGS/Lavatory/Window

Brief Account of

Problem

Window Glass in GS Lavatory is being damaged by passengers

travelling in lavatory. Existing design of Sealed Window or Two

Piece Frosted glass may be changed to conventional grill and

removable glass in GS/SLR.


No. ICF design is Banjo type with window bars which is a better design.



the coaches

Implemented

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

15

Reporting Railways SWR/Aug'13, SCR/Aug'13, SCR/Jan'14, SWR/Jan'14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

AC & Non AC Sleeper/Seat & Berth/Backrest

Brief Account of

Problem

There are various type of arrangements provided for securing back

rests in sleeper and AC coaches. Securing arrangement to be

standardized for easy maintenance and positive locking.


No.

Back rest securing arrangement has been standardized. New

standardized design drawings issued Assembly Drg. No. 201-61-

601 alt ‘t’ Dt. 2/2013 Drg.No. 140-6-1-008 alt ‘f’ Dt.10/2011(For

Backrest lock for transverse berth of AC & Non AC coaches)



the coaches

Implemented from Dec- 2013

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

16

Reporting Railways SCR/Aug'13, SWR/Jan'14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/LAVATORY/Drain out pipe

Brief Account of

Problem

Wash basin drain out pipe is located just above the BIO tank and

drain water is falling on tanks.


No.

Design of drain out pipe location modified and implemented.

Drg. No. 140-6-3-084 Dt.05/02/2014.



the coaches

Implemented on 12/03/2014 in First AC (Shell Nos. 120, 119, 121)

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 To be implemented in all the coaches

Remarks PDC 21/05/2014

17


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Lavatory/Drain out pipe

Brief Account of

Problem

Drain water from lavatory splashes over the Bogie / Under gear

components when the train is in run leading to corrosion


No.

Elimination of drain holes in pan type lavatory, Implemented vide

drawing No. 140-4-1-011 alt ‘c’ dated 02/2012



the coaches

Implemented from October 2013.

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 No further modification required.

Remarks No further modification required.

18


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Lavatory/Lav. Chute Fixing Arrangement

Brief Account of

Problem

Lavatory chute securing bolts are getting corroded during service.

It is very difficult to use spanner for dismantling the M12 screws

due to deposit of human waste in the surrounding area. During

POH the bolts are removed by Gas Cutting. After gas cutting the

threaded holes are no more usable.


No.

Drg No. 077-6-3-483 alt ‘c’ dated 08/2013 is issued with

elimination of tapped holes and introduction of through holes



the coaches

Implemented from October 2013

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

19


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Lavatory/Gravity Cock

Brief Account of

Problem

The LP Sheet gets damaged while attending the gravity cock / APD

during POH


No.

Since pilferage problem is not normally observed, APD for gravity

cock is eliminated vide drawing No. SCN 8-6-3-805 alt ‘a’ dated

09/2013



the coaches

Implemented from December 2013

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

20

Reporting Railways SR/Aug'13 Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

SLRD/Underframe/Solebar

Brief Account of

Problem Solebar sagging at Luggage area in SLRD coaches


No.

Thickness of the sole bar is increased from 5mm to 8mm. Drawing

No. SLR2-1-1-252 issued in June 2013



the coaches

Implemented from October 2013. (Shell No. SLRD 828 onwards)

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 87 shells turned out till date – CWE/S

Remarks ---

21


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

JS COACHES/Seat/Seat Securing Bolts

Brief Account of

Problem

Seat securing bolts- broken / loose in JS Coaches (Bolted to

compreg sheet only, due to Insufficient length of bolts used

during fitment, 3.15 against 5 mm thickness of back pieces used &

Bolts getting broken during unscrewing due to corrosion)


No.

Bolt material changed to Stainless Steel. (Specification IS 1367 (P-

14) 1984, A2-70). Revised Drawing No. 253-6-1-201 alt ‘P’ issued

on 13-01-2014.



the coaches

Implemented from Feb 2014.

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

22


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

Non - AC/FDB/FDB Cover

Brief Account of

Problem

Insertion of waste materials into FDB in Non AC Coaches leads to

fire accidents


No.

FDB cover has been modified by providing angles. Drawing

No.GS5-4-4-501 alt ‘d’ issued on 18-09-12.



the coaches

Implemented from October 2013.

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 CPM- All the Rlys are to be intimated by Design.

Remarks

---

23

Reporting Railways SWR/Aug'13 Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All /Furnishing/Coach Indication Board

Brief Account of

Problem Indication boards - Brackets to be provided inside the coach.


No.

Brackets provided vide Drg.No. 140-43-001 Dt.05/2012 for GS/SCN

coaches



the coaches

Implemented from June 2012

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

24


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Air Brake

Brief Account of

Problem

PEASD spindle connection with resetting wire rope is with a "Z"

type flat which is getting damaged due to its complicated design.


No.

Modified design is already implemented vide Drg.No.268-3-5-755

alt ‘c’ dt.01-11-2010. (Bracket Drawing No.ICF/STD-3-5-069)



the coaches

Implemented from 27/05/2012

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

25

Reporting Railways SR/Aug'13, SWR/Aug'13, CR/Aug'13, SWR/Jan'14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Bogie Assy/Axle Box Rubbing Pad

Brief Account of

Problem

Bolt and nut of diamond shape modified 'A' dimension pad (crown

clearance) cannot be attended in pit-lines during rake

maintenance if worked out.


No.

Design modified vide Drawing No.T-0-1-650 alt Nil dt.28-03-13.

Sent to RDSO. RDSO suggested vide their Lr.No.MC/ICF/BD dt.10-

07-2013 for trial fitment in 50 coach sets.



the coaches

Under Procurement ( Demand No. 02/14/2049 - 1600 Nos.

Demand No. 02/14/2050 - 800 Nos.)

Will be implemented from Aug’ 14.

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 To be implemented

Remarks CWE/S to give cut in.

26


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

WCB/Fan Assy

Brief Account of

Problem

Mounting arrangement of Exhaust fan on roof in WCB coaches - to

be reviewed


No.

The mounting arrangement has been modified vide Drg No. 159 16

401 alt ‘J’ Dt. 07-09-2013



the coaches

Implemented from December 2013 (shell No. WCB 490 onwards)

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

27


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

SGSCN/Seats & Berths/Seats & Berths

Brief Account of

Problem

Bending/breakage of lower berths of sleeper coaches at the center

portion due to weak structure


No.

Frame for Transverse seat strengthened with 5 Nos. of ‘Z’ section

numbers instead of 4 Nos. of flats. Drawing No.201-6-1-602 alt Nil

dt.21-11-2002.



the coaches

Implemented

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

28


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

SCN/Seats & Berths/Seats & Berths

Brief Account of

Problem SCN Middle berth hinges to be converted to Pivot Design


No.

Introduced Pivots in place of Hinges. Drawing No.201-6-1-604

27.02.2013.



the coaches

Implemented

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

29


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Emergency Window

Brief Account of

Problem

Radium type emergency window indication boards may be

provided in all coaches for better visibility in darkness.


No.

Fluorescent luminous stickers have been provided to indicate the

location of the emergency window. However, drawing will be

issued to provide luminous stickers in the emergency window also.



the coaches

Implemented

Minutes of the


Remarks Drawing to provide luminous stickers in the emergency window is

under issue. PDC June 2014.

30


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

GS, SLR/Luggage Rack

Brief Account of

Problem Rivets fixing wooden planks in luggage racks are getting sheared


No.

For GS coaches, luggage rack is provided with stainless steel as

against MS with wooden Compreg Plank as per drawing No.LGS-6-

2-001 dated 09/2010.



the coaches

Implemented

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

31


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

AC Coaches/Furnishing/Emergency Window

Brief Account of

Problem

Emergency glass breaking hammer box may be integrated to coach

body and flush type one instead of existing separate box mounted

on surface of the wall at the entrance


No. Already implemented



the coaches

Already Implemented

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

32

Reporting Railways SR/Aug'13, CR/Aug’13, SCR/Jan'14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Furnishing/Bottle Holder

Brief Account of

Problem

Present nylon wire bottle holder size is smaller. Bottle holder may

be relocated below the snack table.


No.

The latest Bottle Holder Size is sufficient. Provision of bottle

holder below the snack table drawing is issued (140 64 028 alt ‘a’)



the coaches

Implemented

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

33

Reporting Railways CR/Aug'13, SCR/Aug'13, SCR/Jan'14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Furnishing/Magazine Bag

Brief Account of

Problem

Problems in Magazine and Bottle holder fixing. To provide back

pieces of bigger size. Rugged and smooth design is required.


No.

Back pieces of bigger size are provided for magazine bag and

bottle holder.



the coaches

implemented

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

34


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Air Brake

Brief Account of

Problem All brake piping to be modified to seamless pipes


No. Implemented vide specification No.ICF/MD.Spec.166



the coaches

Implemented from year 2008

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

35


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Bogie Assy/Wheel Set Assy

Brief Account of

Problem

The length of Roller bearing end locking screws to be standardized

to 50 mm.


No. Drg. already issued vide drg. No. WTAC 2-0-2-304 dt.10-11-2010.



the coaches

Implemented

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

36

Reporting Railways SCR/Aug'13, SR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All/Under Frame/Sole Bar

Brief Account of

Problem

Heavy corrosion of sole bar within 5 years. 11 mm holes provided

in the turn under gets chocked and does not drain water


No.

Drain Hole size increased to Dia. 50 mm from Dia.11mm. Drawing

No.201-1-4-604 alt ‘b’ 02/12.



the coaches

Implemented from Feb 2014 (Shells on belt - SCN 4242, GS 5831,

SLRD 870)

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

Do not compromise quality on account of manufacturing

difficulties / increased productivity. Problems of User Rlys are to

be taken as top priority.

Remarks ---

37


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Bogie Assy/BOGIE SIDE FRAME

Brief Account of

Problem

Repeated occurrence of bogie side frame crack at bottom flange &

propagated upwards to web and partially cracked top flange in ICF

/ RCF bogies. Crack is occurring in between the axle box guide &

suspension strap lug.


No.

The issue addressed by ICF by removing welding of heat affected

zone at suspension strap area. Drawing No.WTAC 3-0-3-402 Dt. 27-

08-03



the coaches

Implemented

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

38


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Furnishing/Magazine Bag

Brief Account of

Problem

Material Spec. for SS rod of magazine bag may be revised to

commercial quality.


No.

Already revised. Drg.140 64 031 Alt ‘c’ Dt 10/2013. Material

modified from AISI 304 to AISI 202 with finish 2B



the coaches

Implemented

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

39


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

JS Coaches/Seat /Non – AC Chairs

Brief Account of

Problem

Aisle width found less by 20 to 50mm as against 450mm Passage

gap between seat pillar on floor is found 630 mm against 674 mm

specified


No.

One arm rest removed to maintain the specified gap.

Drg. No.329-6-1-036 Alt ‘b’ Dt.24/08/2006.



the coaches

Already Implemented

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

40

Reporting Railways CR/Aug'13, SCR/Jan'14, SR/Jan'14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

Non-AC/Roof/Ventilator

Brief Account of

Problem

Biscuit wrappers, waste papers, tea cups inserted by passengers

into the ventilator grill while sitting on the Luggage rack which can

cause fire accident


No.

Introduced stainless steel wire mesh as per RDSO

Lr.No.MC/CRN/REH dated 20-09-2012. Drawing No.036-1-6-817 alt

‘e’ 07/2013 issued



the coaches

UL No. 08 30921665 01 01 Under procurement. Tender opened on

24-02-2014

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

Cut-in from this month – CWE/S

CDO shakkel-> mesh may clogg

SCR/DME - To be cleaned periodically.

Remarks Production/Shell to ensure.

41


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Shell Assy/Footstep

Brief Account of

Problem Premature corrosion in footstep support channel


No.

Footstep support channel materials changed to Stainless Steel vide

Drawing No.140-2-4-001 alt P dt.18-01-14.



the coaches

Will be implemented from 2014-15, through upcoming

procurement cycle.

Minutes of the


Remarks CWE/S to give cut in.

42


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Air Brake/S.S Wire rope for manual release of Distributor

Valve

Brief Account of

Problem

Wire ropes for manual release of distributor valve, getting

corroded and get cut in service


No.

Bi-metal corrosion at the soldered joint is the reason of failure.

New Drg. No. GS5-3-5-506 alt ‘d’ Dt.21.01.2014 is issued for wire

rope of Stainless Steel with ferrule type joint The mounting

arrangement has been modified vide Drg No. 159 16 401 alt ‘J’



the coaches

Will be implemented from second half of 2014-15, through next

procurement cycle duly taking care the stock and dues.

Minutes of the


Remarks Production/Fur to ensure.

43


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Bogie Assy/Shock Absorber

Brief Account of

Problem

Split pins provided on bolt-nut used for fitment of shock absorbers

are either broken or corroded. During POH, it's difficult to

dismantle


No.

Nyloc Nut instead of Bolt-nut-split pin fitted on 150 Coaches as a

trial measure from Mar. to June 2013. Results found to be

satisfactory.



the coaches

Will be implemented from 2014-15 on regular basis

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 To be implemented.

Remarks Drawing under issue, PDC 30/05/2014.

44


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All/Lavatory/Lavatory Inlay

Brief Account of

Problem

While flushing out, water is coming out of the commode pan and

flowing on the lavatory Vinyl floor.


No.

New type of wall protector introduced. Additional step has been

introduced in the lavatory inlay to avoid water splashing on the

lavatory floor. Drg. No. ICF/STD 4-1-011 alt ‘e’.



the coaches

Under Implementation

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

100 nos. received from M/S Costal Steel, Chennai have been fitted

in the existing coaches.

Remarks For future procurement advice has been sent to AME/MPO/Fur on

18/12/2013.

45

Reporting Railways CR/Aug'13, SCR/Aug'13, SWR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

Non-AC/FRP Window/Emergency Window

Brief Account of

Problem

FRP Louvre shutter for Emergency Window is frequently damaged

by miscreants, Alternate Material to be provided. APD for

emergency window in Non AC coaches may be suitably modified

as most of them are getting damaged during first trip itself.

Emergency Window grill in Non AC coaches : Passengers are lifting

the grill by breaking the seal, lock pin and FRP housing for resting

their arm on the window sill. Running coaches with these grills in

open condition is unsafe for passengers. Mumbai division

modified the existing arrangement by shifting the grill from inside

to outside facilitating adequate space for resting the arm. This may

be implemented in future design of Emergency window in Non- AC

caches.


No.

New design of shutters received from RDSO with wire mesh

outside. RDSO asked the suggestions and comments about the

new design and the same has been given vide letter

No.MD/FUR/W&D/98 Dt.21.01.2014. Breakage will be taken care

in this design. Will be implemented after taking care the stock and

dues.



the coaches


Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

RDSO has to give final design.

CPM- we can go for SS Louvres for Emergency window.

Remarks New drawing to be issued by Design

46


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

SGSLR/Shell Assy/Body Bolster

Brief Account of

Problem

Body Bolster lifted cases are reported recently in SLR coaches to

be studied in detail.


No.

This problem reported in the coach No. SR SGSLR 97770 which is

RCF built Coach. So far this type of cases are not reported in any of

ICF built coaches. In the last Customer Interaction Meeting, CR

reported body bolster seating/rubbing on bogie in some GS

Coaches. Rly asked provision of air spring in all mainline coaches.

RDSO conducted trial with air spring in mainline coaches and the

oscillation trials gave good response. However, without FIBA

Device (Failure Integrated Brake Adjusting Device – the design of

the same is yet to be finalised by RDSO), if the air spring fails at

the speed of 90 kmph it will be very disastrous. All Rlys are

requested to write to RB regarding the usage of air spring in main

line coaches.



the coaches

Not pertaining to ICF Coach. With regard to Air Suspension in

conventional coaches. the issue is pending with RDSO

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 Not ICF Coach.

Remarks ---

47


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Shell /Floor Side Moulding

Brief Account of

Problem

Floor Side moulding (curved plate) to be provided in stainless steel

instead of MS in pantry cars and other coaches also.


No.

Drawing (No.140-1-0-040/col II 2004) has already been modified

with stainless steel (AISI 301)material instead of IRS M-41, which is

same as trough floor.



the coaches


Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 Production shell to ensure

Remarks New forming tool is required to manufacture Stainless Steel Floor

Side Moulding. Advised design to issue drawing for the press tool.

48


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

SGSCZ/Furnishing/Seat Arrangement

Brief Account of

Problem

Face to face design of seats in SCZ coaches against bus type 3

seater. Seat area, space below seat and leg space are less in BUS

type 3 seater (post 2003 SCZ Coaches). Securing arrangement for

BUS type 3 seater is not maintenance friendly - post 2003 SCZ

Coaches. Cushion/ rexine renewal problem due to Non -

detachable back rest - BUS type 3 seater in SCZ Coaches


No.

Design has been reverted back to face to face seating arrangement

Drg.No.297-61-601 alt ‘g’, Dt.12/2012. New seat design

(Ergonomic profile and Frame with Stainless Steel Material) has

been introduced. Will be implemented from 2014 -15 onwards.



the coaches


Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 June onward with face to face design – CWE/F to confirm.

Remarks

Production/Fur to ensure.

49

Reporting Railways SCR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All/Furnishing/Lavatory Door

Brief Account of

Problem

Inside toilet, door entrance beading worked out in most of the

coaches.


No.

It has been decided to provide all the mouldings with Stainless

Steel material. PO awaited for Tender Nos. 07/14/2003,

07/14/2005, 07/14/2004. PO issued 07/14/2002/2002

Dt.14/04/2014, 07/14/2006/1169 Dt.28/03/2014.



the coaches


Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

CDE-> to be implemented invariably.

CRWS Bhopal is using SS

Remarks Production/Fur to ensure.

50


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Air Brake

Brief Account of

Problem

There is no provision to isolate BP and FP in case of damage to

branch pipe in Guards compartment. Isolation cocks may be

provided at suitable location.


No.

Provision has been included in the drawing No. 242-35-209 Alt ‘a’

Feb 2014. Under implementation.



the coaches


Minutes of the


Remarks ---

51

Reporting Railways SR/Aug'13, SCR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

SGSCN/Seat & Berth/Seat & Berth

Brief Account of

Problem

Long seat securing seat wings (Chair Angle – Sidewall side) and

studs are getting corroded frequently, either alternate non

corrosive material or protective coating to be used in non-AC

coaches. Seat / berth legs are getting corroded, either alternate

non corrosive material or protective coating to be used in non-AC

coaches.


No.

Since all the other structural materials are of IRS M-41, presently

only Chair Angle Material cannot be switched over to Stainless

steel. ICF/Production has been advised vide letter No.

MD/D/PAINTS/73 Dt.23.04.2014 to paint all the structures up to

window level with the anti-corrosive paint to Specn.

RDSO/M&C/PCN/123.



the coaches


Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

Production Sheet to implement.

Rlys to be informed to follow the same during maintenance.

Remarks Design has been advised to issue modified drawing as this item is

an outsourced item.

52


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

ACCZ/Seats/Seats

Brief Account of

Problem

Different designs of AC Chair Car Chairs cause maintainability

problems like removing the Chairs completely even for attending

minor defects


No.

Design of chairs has been revised and standardized. Modified

specification ICF/MD/119 Rev.03 Dt.16/04/2014 has been issued

with wider snack table, approved brands of reclining mechanism

(gas springs), S.S. seat frames, Sturdy stoppers for the reclining of

back rests and snack table etc. CME has approved the

procurement as per the new specification and the same is under

progress.



the coaches


Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 Procurement process under progress.

Remarks ---

53


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Partition frame/Partition frame

Brief Account of

Problem

All Lavatories and door way partition pillars are getting corroded

frequently. Lavatory partition walls getting corroded


No.

To combat corrosion, skirting is being provided to avoid seepage of

water during washing. Reasons of water seepage and corrosion to

be studied by the maintenance depot. Workshops to ensure

proper sealing periodically. Since all the other structural materials

are of IRS M-41, presently only Chair Angle Material cannot be

switched over to Stainless steel. ICF/Production has been advised

vide letter No. MD/D/PAINTS/73 Dt.23.04.2014 to paint all the

structures up to window level with the anti-corrosive paint to

Specn. RDSO/M&C/PCN/123.



the coaches


Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

Areas where more corrosion occurs has to be painted with

anticorrosive 123 paint.

Rlys to be advised to follow the same during maintenance.

Remarks

Design has been advised to include application of anti-corrosive

paint to Specn. RDSO/M&C/PCN/123 in the drawing as partition

pillar is an outsourced item.

54

Reporting Railways SR/Aug'13, SWR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

GS, SLR/Luggage Rack

Brief Account of

Problem

Increased height of luggage rack in the GS coaches causing

inconvenience to aged passengers, not able to lift their luggage

and stack. Further it decreased the gap between the rack and

ceiling where unreserved passengers climb over occupy the

luggage rack for lie-down and keep their foot on ceiling and

making it shabby. Often damage the roof limpet sheets to stuff

garbage inside which is hazardous and may cause fire accidents.

Hence the joints in the roof shall be made foolproof to avoid

misusing the same. Damage to weld mesh partition and Limpet

celling due to higher level location of luggage rack - post 2007 GS

& SLRD


No.

The location (height) of luggage rack is as per RDSO instruction.

The matter will be discussed in the next CDE Conference and

decision to revert back to the old location will be taken

accordingly.



the coaches

Design/Drg. is under review

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 CDE-> will issue drg.

Remarks ---

55

Reporting Railways SR/Aug'13, SCR/Aug'13, SWR/Aug'13, CR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

GS , SLRD /Partition & Roof Ceiling/Weld Mesh Partition

Brief Account of

Problem

Luggage rack top wire mesh panel wires are coming out of frame.

Possibility of using old model diamond type wire can be explored.


No.

Drg. No. 285 10 502 & 503 are under issue with diamond type

(expanded type) mesh.



the coaches


Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 Drg to be issued with diamond type

Remarks Design to issue drawing

56

Reporting Railways SR/Aug'13, SCR/Jan'14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

Non - AC/Lavatory/Lav Door

Brief Account of

Problem Damage of Al. ventilators of Lav. Doors


No.

The damages are due to pilferage/Vandalism Material to be

changed from Al. to SS. Problems have been studied. Change over

to MS will lead to corrosion problem. Hence it is proposed to

change over to SS design. Drawing will be issued in the end of May

‘14 for Sturdy Structured Ventilators of Stainless Steel Material.



the coaches


Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 Go for SS

Remarks Design to issue drawing

57


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

ALL/BATTERY BOX

Brief Account of

Problem Premature corrosion in battery box


No.

In IGBT DEMU, new design of SS battery box has been already

implemented. It is considered for providing similar design in other

mainline coaches also.



the coaches


Minutes of the


Remarks ---

58


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

SCZJS/ELECTRICAL/Emergency Light

Brief Account of

Problem No. emergency celling lights in JS


No. Drawing will be issued in May 2014.



the coaches


Minutes of the


Remarks ---

59

Reporting Railways SWR/Aug'13, SCR/Aug'13 CR/Aug'13, SCR/Jan'14, SWR/Jan'14,

SR/Jan'14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

AC & Non – AC Sleeper Coaches/Seats & Berths/Seats & Berths

Brief Account of

Problem PU coated ladder - Peeling off and forms sharp edges


No.

RDSO has sent new set of drawings for ladder for AC and Non-AC

vide their Lr.No.MC/CB/MM dated 19-12-2013 for comments and

the same has been given vide letter No.ICF/MD/FUR/W&D/98

Dt.21.01.2014. It had been decided in the last Customer

Interaction Meeting to go in for LHB type ladder (Only Steel) in ICF

Coaches also. But as per the Inspection Note of MM Visit to ICF on

09/01/’14 & 10/01/’14 (Sl. No.32) the ladders for upper berths in

LHB Coaches should preferably be covered with PU Foam as an

injury free feature.



the coaches

RDSO Item, the point has been highlighted to Mr.Srivatsav,

Dy.Director/RDSO who was present in the meeting.

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

RDSO item

Remarks ---

60

Reporting Railways SWR/Aug'13, SCR/Aug'13, SCR/Jan'14, SR/Jan'14, CR/April ‘14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Furnishing Work/Paneling – LP Sheet

Brief Account of

Problem

LP Sheet - Crack/breakage. As the marking of manufacturer’s

initials are on the back side of the sheet it is not possible to trace

the manufacturer without disassembling the panels for initiating

warranty claim. Coaching Depots are complaining that they do not

have sufficient man power to disassemble the panels and the

coach is forced to run in service until the next POH


No.

This is Fire Retardant Property Item controlled by RDSO. RDSO had

been addressed vide letters Nos. MI/13-A/Gl Dt. 02/08/2012 and

No.MI/73 Dt. 21/11/2012.



the coaches



Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

CWE -> indentification ot be given in front side.

CDE/Mech - Aesthetic will be spoiled.

Remarks ---

61

Reporting Railways SR/Aug'13, SWR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Seats & Berths/DTPB - Densified Thermal Bonded

Polyester Block (Recron)

Brief Account of

Problem

DTPB cushions are getting compressed within first POH. AC

Coaches berth cushion looses their strength and cushioning ability

after 8-10 months


No.

DTPB (Densified Thermal Bonded Polyester Blocks) is used as

cushioning material which has the problem of permanent setting.

It has been noted that items introduced for fire retarndancy

resulted in peeling also aesthetic and comfortable level has gone

down. RDSO has already been requested to develop better

cushioning material.



the coaches



Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 RDSO item

Remarks ---

62

Reporting Railways SR/Aug'13, SCR/Jan'14, SWR/Jan'14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Plumbing Work/Side Filling Pipes

Brief Account of

Problem

Water leaking from side filling pipes. Corrodes head stock top

flange, centre stiffener in many coaches. Shifting of side filling

pipe position to be explored


No.

New pipe design introduced Drg. No.248 63 004 as per CAMTECH

design. The feed back from the railways will be highlighted to

CAMTECH



the coaches



Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

Dia difference between old design pipe and new design pipe is the

reason for leak. Rlys are using same dia for both.

To be streamlined.

Remarks Railways to give feedback.

63

Reporting Railways CR/Aug'13, SWR/Aug'13

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Bogie Assembly/Hytrel Washer

Brief Account of

Problem Hytrel washers - crack


No.

All Rlys are requested to give the failure data with age and supplier

details.



the coaches



Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 Rlys are requested to give feedback.

Remarks ---

64


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Bogie Assy/Brake Gear Bushes

Brief Account of

Problem

Manufacturer initial and year of manufacture is not traceable and

getting defaced on run in the brake gear bushes within 9 months.

Hence raising warranty claim is very difficult. Specific

clause/condition to be stipulated in the RDSO specification with

the marking should be permanent and clearly visible up to the

condemnation period of brake gears for raising necessary warranty

claims.


No.

The issue of marking has been highlighted to RDSO vide letter No.

MD/D/BB/45 Dt.23/04/2014.



the coaches



Minutes of the


Remarks ---

65


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Sleeper Coaches/Seats & Berths/Seats & Berths

Brief Account of

Problem

Fixed type LHB design may be adopted for Snack Table with bottle

holder below the table.


No.

In the last meeting Rlys were of the opinion that the provision of

snack table and Magazine Bags in SCN Coaches to be avoided. As

such, the Rlys were requested to write to RDSO. Vide inspection

Note of MM at RCF on 25.01.2014, the LHB snack table to be

made foldable and the magazine bags may be inscribed in the side

panel (point No.1.0 A(c)).



the coaches

ICF design is foldable type.

Foldable type to continue

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 Foldable type to continue

Remarks ---

66

Reporting Railways SWR/Aug'13, CR/Apr ‘14, SWR/Apr ‘14, ECoR/Apr ‘14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All/PAINTING

Brief Account of

Problem

Fading, peeling off, improper application are noticed in the

exterior painting of coaches. In 2011 &12 manufactured coaches,

roof is getting corroded. The thickness of paint is found sufficient.

The reason may be due to poor surface preparation. Also the roof

surface in curved portion above rain water gutter is having plenty

of dents.


No.

Now all the coaches are being painted in automatic paint both

from 2012 onwards. As per the instruction of CME, M/s.Vibgyor

conducted a Quality Audit and the report is under study. The copy

of the report is enclosed as annexure-I.



the coaches

Under Study

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

ICF painting is superior- most of the Rlys.

WR- some coaches are received with paint peeled condition.

CMP-> feedback reg. LHB painting to be given by user Rlys.

Shops to ensure separate treatment for IRS M41 and SS shells.

CPM- we are heading towards paint less coach design soon. Paint

audit report to be enclosed.

Remarks Action by Production/Fur

67


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/FURNSHING/FAN Assembly

Brief Account of

Problem

In AC coaches, fan is infringing with the curtains. Fan to be

relocated.


No.

Due to space restriction it is technically not feasible. Moreover in

the light of the recent Fire Accident in Nanded Express on

28/12/2013, CRS/Southern Circle had recommended that Railway

should do away with curtains in gangway portion of AC Coaches.

RB vide letter No. 99/M(C)/141/21 Dt.07.04.2014 has instructed

to remove the aisle side curtains in the 3rd

AC Coaches (window

curtains to continue) and the same has been implemented.



the coaches

Not technically feasible

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

68


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Shell Assy./Under Frame

Brief Account of

Problem

Lifting pads are not provided with stopper arrangement as done in

MG coaches to avoid slipping of jib tackles during lifting also

elongated holes can be provided on the lifting pad for pulling the

coaches with rope during traverser shunting.


No.

Lifting pad with stopper arrangement is technically it is not

feasible. In the last customer interaction meeting CR reported

rubbing of lifting pad with one of the bogie frames of an AC Coach.

CR was requested to do further investigation about the same and

submit the report for further study by ICF. The report is yet to be

received.



the coaches

Not technically feasible

Minutes of the


Remarks ---

69


Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All/Flooring

Brief Account of

Problem

Adhesive material spilled over the Vinyl sheet, excessive adhesive

is no being removed resulting in adhesive stain in Vinyl sheet and

chequered plate


No.

Quality issue. Down the line instructions has been given to the

staff concerned to be more careful during PVC Flooring.



the coaches

Quality Issue

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014 CME/QA - Let us take a drive

Remarks ---

70

Reporting Railways SCR/Aug'13, SCR/Jan'14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

All Types/Flooring/PVC Flooring

Brief Account of

Problem PVC Flooring joint defects


No.

Based on the customer complaints, manufacturing and Quality

control have been improved. No joints shall be allowed in the

Lavatory and passage. Drg. Modified to avoid/minimize the

number of joints in the pathway. All the hot air welders are

trained at TTC in view of the complaints. Further strict Quality

Control will be exercised during manufacturing and inspection. To

avoid drumming sound in lavatory inlay, additional stiffeners with

additional step have been introduced. Drg. No. ICF/STD-4-1-011 alt

‘d’ dt.22-02-13. Stacking of PVC material in ICF has been improved

(vertical instead of horizontal stacking). Complaint has been

received from SCR only. SCR has been requested to study the

problem further and submit a report for further action at ICF.



the coaches

Quality Issue

Minutes of the

Meeting April 2014

Shops are using coloured wires for welding for improve aesthetic

look, Anabond application around lav pan

In metro coaches 2 pack adhesive system used for PVC joint, that

has to be tried for other coaches also.

Training given to artizans and identified some special tools. ICF has

indented for the same.

Remarks ---

71

Reporting Railways SCR/Aug'13, SWR/Jan'14

Type of

Coaches/Major

Assy./Specific Item

Non AC/Window/Window Sill & Sidewall Sheet

Brief Account of

Problem

Almost all windows manifest gap at sill level, between sidewall

sheet & window resulting in rain water seepage. Putty filling by ICF

does not last long


No. Template is being used during window sill assembly.



the coaches

Under Trial

Minutes of the


Remarks This is a quality issue. Shell to ensure the same.

New points to be discussed in the next Customer Interaction Meeting

Sl.

No.

Reporting

Railways

Specific Item

InvolvedBrief Account of Problem

Action taken/Possible

Solutions

Implementaion

StatusAction by Minutes of the Meeting April 2014 Remarks

1ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)

ALARM RESETTING

WIRE ROPE

In Non-AC coaches, the Alarm resetting rope is

provided at one side of end wall. Incase of chain

pulling by passengers, the en-route Driver and Guard

face difficulty as they have to go through the coach to

reach the other side for resetting. This causes

hardship and also extra detention time. Provision for

resetting of PEASD on both side of the end wall is

required.

Design to be reviewed -- Design Design to be reviewed

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

2ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)

MAIN DOORS,

WINDOW BARS

In Main doors, the window bars are provided at close

frequency. Hence during washing, brush can not

reach the glass surface and it is difficult to clean these

glasses. Hence it is suggested that the Window Bars

are to be provided at a distance same as other

windows of the coaches. Further the window is at a

very lower level and this prevents passengers to view

from inside. Design may review elimination of

window by glass at upper level, same as Non-AC LHB

coaches.

Design to be reviewed -- DesignDesign to be reviewed

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

3ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)

DRAW GEAR

SUPPORT BRACKET

It is observed that the Outer Head stock bracket

housing for the Draw Gear Assembly get corroded

within short period of service. Procedure for surface

treatment of these structural members to be

reviewed and necessary preventive action to be taken

Under Study/To take

action-- Design

Corrosion during 1st POH. To be studied

by design.

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

4ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)

DESIGN

MODIFICATION OF

GAS CYLINDER

SECURING

BRACKETS

The bracket provided to hold the gas cylinders in

Pantry cars get damaged/ distorted during handling

by pantry car staff. The present steel brackets may

please be altered by flexible member of sufficient

strength to clamp these cylinders.

Under Study/To take

action-- Design Chain type or fencing type required.

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

5ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)

PARTITION WALL

BETWEEN

LUGGAGE

PORTION &

PASSENGER AREA

There are frequent cases of damage of partition wall

between luggage portion and passenger area by

miscreants. The metal plates of partition walls are

found cut to pilfer material by miscreants. Hence it is

suggested that the steel plate used in partition wall

may please be replaced by channel type corrugated

sheet of sufficient thickness to prevent such cases

Under Study/To take

action-- Design

Corrugated / thick sheet to be provided.

Provision of LP sheet not required so that

any opening made by the miscreants can

be easily detected. Design to study the

problem

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

Minutes of Customer Interaction Meet April 2014 - New Points

Sl.

No.

Reporting

Railways

Specific Item



Solutions

Implementaion


6ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)EQUALIZING STAY

There are cases of failures of Equalizing stay during

service. Even there are cases of en-route detachment

of coaches due to Equalizing stay failure. The bracket

holding the Equalizing stay and the equalizing stay

unit get bend during service and it becomes virtually

impossible to remove the long pin to replace the

defective member. The coach has to be detached and

given sick line attention. Design and fitment of this

member to be reviewed.

Design to be reviewed -- Design

i). CR design to be adopted.

Ii). Forged design given by RDSO

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

7ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)

CEILING DAMAGE

IN CN COACHES

BELOW THE

WATER TANK

In some trains there are frequent cases of intentional

damages of toilet ceiling of CN coaches below the

water tank. These damages are caused by miscreants

in en-route. The material is used for ceiling below the

water tank is limpet sheet. Design may replace the

limpet material by other material of better strength

to prevent damages.

8ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)

WRAPPERS, TEA

CUPS AND PAPER

ITEMS INSIDE

ROOF CEILING

Ceiling provided below the roof sheet is of limpet

material in GS/SLR coaches. Passengers occupying

space on luggage rack used to tear these sheets at the

joints and insert wrappers, tea cups and paper items.

These are vulnerable to fire accidents. Limpet being

soft material, easily get damaged by miscreants.

Further it is very difficult for Depot to repair these

ceiling damages. Hence roof ceiling of GS/SLR coaches

may please be provided with alternate material of

higher strength and with minimum joints to prevent

such intentional damages by passengers.

9ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)

LUGGAGE DOOR

HANDLE DESIGN

The luggage door handle of SLR coaches are

protruded inside, which prevent the door to slide

incase of overloading of volumetric space. The inner

handle of the luggage door to be designed ‘Sunk-in’

type to arrest this problem.


i) Sunk in type handle required. Design to

study.

ii) Imported Rollon make rollers to be

used.

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

10ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)

AXLE BOX CANTED

& GRAZING

In recent years, there is increase in the cases of

canted and grazing of primary suspension unit with

wheel. In East Coast Railway nearly 40% of cases of

sick marking of coaches during primary examination

is due to above reason. Further due to canting the

collars of rear cover of the Axle Box assembly get

damage and metal particles get contaminated in

grease.ICF being manufacturing unit, may re look into

the modification done in primary suspension like use

of hytrel washers etc. and take measures to prevent

such cases and thus increase the coach reliability &

reduce the down time

RDSO Items --Design/

RDSO

Due to Hytrel washer problem.

RDSO to be advised.

Copy of the letter givn to RDSO to be

given to ICF by Rly.

20% Kharagpur workshop.

40% ECoR.

Uneven packing in bogies is also one of

the reasons.

Canting leads to the rear cover damage

CR, SER & ECoR is requested to give

feedback.

To be refereed

to RDSO

Vie CDE/Mech`s Note no.

MD/F/Paneling/97 dated 12-05-2014, it is

proposed to provide SS paneling in

toilets, roof , doorways and on side wall

from floor to winodw sill level.

One GS & one SCN coach will be

furnished as per Drg. GS5 43 504 alt 'a'

and based on the experience on

prototypes, further modifications

required if any, will be carried out in

drawings for regular implementation.

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.


Sl.

No.

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Railways

Specific Item



Solutions

Implementaion


11ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)

LIQUID SOAP

CONTAINER

The liquid soap container design is very flimsy & the

cap is not an integral part of the unit, hence it is

missing in every trip. Plunger type container with APD

arrangement may please be provided in AC coaches.

Design to be reviewed -- Rlys Rlys are requested to provide their own Rlys to provide.

12ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)Main Door

Main doors are supported on the lower foot step

bearing which houses the door pivot , the pivot piece

welded on a plate. The plate gets corroded and the

door comes out of its sheet. These cases are frequent

and cause inconvenience to passengers during

service. Hence arrangement for holding the door

pivot may suitably modified to arrest this problem.

Under Study/To take

action-- Design Design has been changed.

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

13ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)Upholstery Cloth

ACCUMULATION OF DUST IN BERTH FOLD - Berth

folds in AC coaches form deep pocket due to

excessive Rexene provided. This causes accumulation

of dust, dirt and it is difficult to clean regularly. It is

suggested to provide lesser length Rexene so that the

fold remain aligned with berth surface.

Design to be reviewed -- Design New type is being used.

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

14ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)DUSTBIN

INCREASE IN DUSTBIN SIZE - The dustbins provided in

AC coaches is of lesser volume and do get filled in

frequent interval. Hence, it is suggested to provide

bigger volume dustbins with facility to accommodate

either below the wash basin or at the passage

between the toilets near vestibule.

-- -- Rlys In every 6 hours bins should be cleared. Closed

15ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)WINDOW CURTAIN

The slider type curtain arrangement in windows of AC

coaches is not durable and difficult to function. This

arrangement may please be replaced with ring type

arrangement suspended from tube.

-- -- -- ICF is using ring type Closed

16ECoR(CDO/Wa

ltiar)

Incase any change in design of any component /

assembly ICF should inform user railways in advance

the drawing, the source of supply etc. so that material

can be procured in time to meet the requirement the

moment coach is put into service

-- -- Design To be informed --

17 SCR Safety Wire Rope Safety rope is taking load of bio tank Design to be reviewed -- Design

Washer size to be increased.

The problem has been addressed in the

newly turned out coaches.

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

18 SCR Chain with Split PinWorking out of chain from rubber beading while pull

due to lesser thickness of split pinDesign to be reviewed -- Design Washer size to be increased

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

19 SCR Retention tankMisalignment of Bio-tank inlet with commode outlet

pipe-- -- Prod. FUR Furnishing Div. to Check --

Sl.

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20 SCR FurnishingCollapsible shutters are provided for linen room

instead of panel doorsDesign to be reviewed -- Design To be studied

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

21 NR Chairs

Six LHB chair cars ( COACH NO 13877,13876,13151,

13452, 13153, 13154 LWFCZAC’S ) was received in

the year 2013 from ICF by DLI Division and following

defects are observed:

In coaches 13876 NR/ LWFCZAC & 13877 NR/

LWFCZAC, foundation bolts were not available in the

seats causing uprooting of seats from its base. These

were attended by the firm, M/s Flexo Foam under the

supervision of SSE/ICF.

Seat cushions of said manufacturer are very hard &

appearance of seat upholstery is not up to the mark.

Reclining mechanisms of foot rests are getting

defected and rubber pads of their paddles are also

getting loosed.

Rubber pad of arm rests are getting torn and their PU

paint are also getting worn out.

Reclining gears of seats are getting free and they do

not sustain locking of back rest.

Knobs of snacks tables are getting uprooted.

Spring mechanisms for folding of roller blinds are

getting weak and retainers of roller blinds are also

uprooted.

The compartment & vestibule doors are getting

jammed due to serration on their guide rods and pull

handles of compartment doors are also getting

broken from their base.

Under warrantee attention of the concerned firms

needs improvement.

Quality Issue -- Prod. FUR Furnishing Div. to improve quality. --

22 NR Lav. Pan

Problem of water splashing from toilet pans is

observed due to small size of pan in modular toilets.

Therefore water accumulates on the toilet floor.

Under/To be

Implemented-- Design

The problem is already addressed by

Introducing new type of inlay.

Point No. 44 above.

closed

23 NR Sliding DoorDefective Sliding doors

Failure of reverse mechanism

Under Study/To take

action-- Design Design to study

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

24 NR Upholstery Cloth

Loose skinning (wrinkling) of oil cloth

on berth and seatsUnder Study/To take

action-- RDSO Data to be provided to RDSO by Rlys --

25 NR Linen Room Door Defective linen luggage doorUnder Study/To take

action-- Rlys Data to be provided to ICF by Rlys --

Sl.

No.

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Specific Item



Solutions

Implementaion


26 NR Window Glass

Suggestions: Sealed window glass Units should be

interchangeable.

New units are of different dimensions.

COACH NO 13158,13159AC CHAIR CARS SIZE-

1220X762X25.5 WHILE PEREVIOUS SIZE WAS

1220X752X25.5

Under Study/To take


To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

27 NRBrake Cyliner

Arrangement

Problem of improper releasing of bogie mounted

brake cylinders was observed in M/s stone India Ltd.

make cylinders. Brake cylinders were changed by DLI

Division and letter to ICF in this regard was sent by

letter no. 672-TRS/O/ICF/M-II/6 dated 18/07/2012.

In the month of April 2014, again two coaches have

been detached for the above mentioned problem of

M/s Recon makes BC. Brake cylinders have been

changed.

Under Study/To take

action-- Design Rlys to give more data on this --

28 NR Roller Bearing

Roller bearing failure of coach no. 134197 WR/GS

within 100 days of commissioning caused other end

detachment of coach at NZM after termination of

train no. 12917 on 08/06/2013.

Built - ICF 03/2013

Return - 02/2015

Bearing make – FAG

No. - 22326 C3 – F2, 09/12, R422 H.K.

Quality Issue -- QA

Bearing failed due to Cage failure.

Warranty claim accepted and

replacement given to AMV workshop by

the Firm.

Closed

29 NR Magazine bag

To be bolted from both side of the seat panel – may

hamper with the anti-injury feature.

In CME conference decided to do away with the

magazine bag in SCN – RDSO to take action

Under Study/To take

action-- --

Not technically feasible -may hamper

with the anti-injury feature.Closed

30 NRWater bottle

holderFixing arrgt to be strengthened.

Under Study/To take

action-- -- Back pieces are already provided Closed

31 NR Flush valve

Prone to theft

Rlys want PTFE materialUnder Study/To take

action-- Design At present SS is provided

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

32 NR Lav. Doors

Lower pivot corrosion.

ICF design is hinge type only. Not Pertaining to ICF -- -- -- Closed

33 WR Bogie frame WR 4795 bogie top flange worn-outUnder Study/To take


To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

34 SR Roof Assy. Roof leak in SR ACCW 11057Under Study/To take

action-- --

Seam welding opened up due to vibration

ICF staff attended the complaint at TVC. Closed

Sl.

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Implementaion


35 SR

Mobile pouch,

magazine bag &

head rest

Giving up of mobile pouch, head rest Under Study/To take

action-- --

Dy CME SR-> As per RB instruction all the

magazine bags to be removed from SCN

coaches.

Rlys are requested to write to RDSO

Closed

36 SR Roof Assy.

SR ACCW 13055, ICF on 26.9.13 was marked sick for

water seepage through incomplete welding of

mounting bracket welded on to AC duct opening of

RMPU(Roof mounted AC package unit)

Under Study/To take

action-- --

Water leaked through the ac duct flange

which was stitch ( skip) welded to the

duct wall.

Drawing revised with full welding .

ICF staff attended the complaint at TVC.

Closed

37 SR

Brake beam wire

rope hole

elongation

Elongation of wire rope safety bracket pin hole.

Thickness of the plate to be increased and nylock

bolts to be used in place of pin and cotter

(Coach No: CN 97313 PWL 05/09/12, RD: 04/14)

Under Study/To take

action-- -- Bolt with Nylock nut implemented Closed

38 SR Axle box Assy.

Axle box getting canted wearing of hytrel washer. The

limit of radial clearance of bearing in service to be

reduced

(SR SLR 95714 PWP 31-01-13, RD:09/14)

Under Study/To take

action-- RDSO

Hytral washer problem.

Rlys are replacing the hytral washers on

conditional base. CAM TECH manual does

not give any instruction regarding

replacement period.

Rlys are measuring the reduction in

height and replacing.

Suggestion from SR : Radial clearance of

bearing in service to be reduced.

Rlys are requested to write to RDSO and

RB

Informed to

RDSO

representative.

39 SR Axle box Assy.

Grease oozing out from rear cover. Quality and

dimensional perfection of rear cover and felt rings to

be ensured.

Under Study/To take

action-- Rlys

Rlys to give correct facts and figures to

RDSO. --

40 SR Brake Gear Bushes

Elongation of brake gear lever pin holes and Wearing

of pin number 3 Due to poor performance of brake

gear bushes

Under Study/To take

action-- Rlys

Rlys are requested to write to RDSO, RB

with a copy to ICF & RCF indicating

vendor wise, vintage wise failure analysis

--

41 SR Draw gear pins Draw gear head less pin moving upUnder Study/To take

action-- Rlys

A split pin introduced to arrest the

upward movement.

Rlys are requested to give an analysis

report.

--

Sl.

No.

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Solutions

Implementaion


42 SR Wheel

Wheel grooving on account of brake binding.

Composite brake block material quality to be

improved

Under Study/To take

action-- Design

SR to write RDSO and ICF.

SR to give vendor names of faulty BMBC

to CME/ICF

SR initiatives:

1. Made the BMBC stroke 40mm against

32 mm to reduce brake binding- number

of brake binding cases came down.

2. Found that the new BMBC components

are not as per Drg. Eg. Plunger pin 2mm

against 4mm.

3. Checks introduced for endurance and

stroke length while POH of BMBC

4. 3 way cutoff cock introduced for BMBC

cutoff

- this feature is in-bulit in ICF design.

in ICF design, the cutoff valve is with an

exhaust port which will open to the

atmosphere while BMBC cutoff.

5. While accepting new BMBC from trade

samples to be tested for specified stroke

length.

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

43 SRDash pot

protection tube

Dash pot protection tube - Continuous welding

required.

Drawing call s for continuous welding.

Most of the coaches are with PTFE only.

Under Study/To take

action-- --

Drawing calls for continuous welding.

Most of the coaches are with PTFE only. Closed

44 SR Bogie safety strap.

Giving up of safety stem with U bracket from bogie.

Stay base to be strengthened by giving proper

stiffeners and quality of welding to be ensured.

Under Study/To take

action-- Rlys

The coach mentioned is 10 years old old

coach.

Since the crown clearance adjusting

arrangement in the bogie image shown is

very old design, revised during year -- ,

the bogie also seems to be very old. Also

swapping of bogie during POH is

happening, without getting the bogie no.

identifying the manufacturer is not

possible.

SR is requested to give bogie details for

study the problem.

--

45 SR Glass shutter.

Glass shutter assembly dropping on run causing

injury to passengerUnder Study/To take

action-- QA

QA to check.

Rlys-> Quality of M/S Century polymers

is very bad.

--

46 SRVentilator below

AC berth-

Ventilator provided under long berths of AC coaches

near power panel side acts as thorough passage for

rats

Under Study/To take

action-- Design To be studied and relocated --

47 SR Luggage doorsDropping of luggage door from its guides:- To prevent

this a bolt is welded on side pillar as shown

Under Study/To take

action-- Design CR modification to be studied --

Sl.

No.

Reporting

Railways

Specific Item



Solutions

Implementaion


48 SRBackrest locking

arrgt.Giving up of back rest securing latch

Under Study/To take

action-- Design

Serrations are damaging the berth holes.

Alignment issues --

49 SERHead stock

corrosion

While attending 2nd POH of 2009 built coaches at

KGPW, it is observed that majority of the coaches

need to be attended with heavy to medium corrosion

repairs. On testing by CMT/KGPW it is found that

metal composition of structure members does not

contain Cu, Ni or Cr and not complied with IRS-M-41-

97.

Metallurgical composition of structural members to

be reviewed and altered for imparting corrosion

resistant properties.

Under Study/To take

action-- --

Supplier of the head stock assembly

M/s.Neha Enterprises to be delisted.

--

50 SERDouble ferruble

fittings

Compression fittings are not as robust as thread

joints. They should be used in applications where the

fittings will not be disturbed and not subjected to

flexing or bending. The air brake pipe line joints in

LHB coaches are of ferrule joint type. Because of the

intrinsic weakness of the joint there have been

several incidences when the joint opened out in the

running train on being external hitting during run.It is

therefore proposed to replace the ferrule joints to

conventional threaded joints

Under Study/To take

action-- Rlys

Threaded joint for SLR & WLRRM

Rlys to write to RDSO with a copy to ICF &

RCF.

CDE->Use of indigenous MS products

with SS pipe is the cause of failure.

CME-> Go for imported DFF

Rlys to write to

RDSO

51 SERBio- toilet Safety

wire rope

It is observed that the safety wire ropes of Bio-toilets

are fitted tightely to the bio-digester tanks. Therefore

they act as load bearing members and no more as

safety wire rope. It should be ensured that there

must be a gap between the wire rope and the tank.

Under Study/To take

action-- --

Now the problem is corrected.

Rlys are requested to convey the coach

nos.Closed

52 SER CBC Coupling

Non-interchangeability of CBC Components-As per

RDSO’s spec. C-K009 (Rev.2), Para 3.3, ‘all

components of the coupler shall be interchangeable

with corresponding parts of other couplers. In

practice it is found that only two components, namely

‘rotary lock lift assembly’ and ‘uncoupling bar (sliding

bar)’ are interchangeable between the two

manufacturers and rest of the components are not

interchangeable.

Both the manufacturers have made their unique

design and fitment maintaining the operational

dimensions only. This creates problem in open line

maintenance as all maintenance points have to keep

material for both OEMs

Under Study/To take

action-- --

CDE/Mech - Different manufactures have

their own design hence

interchangeability is not there

Closed

Sl.

No.

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Specific Item



Solutions

Implementaion


53 CRSE/NCRRotary Jn. Box

Panel

Wide gap between the panel and Rotary Junction Box

which is a potential fire safety.Design to study -- Design

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

54 CDO/LKO AC Chair Car

Due to defacing/deficit of manufacturers name plate

on the Seats it is difficult to find out the

manufacturers of the seats.

Design to study -- Design To study

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

55 CDO/LKO AC Chair Car Material assistance from ICF is required (Seats) CWE/S & CWE/F -- -- CWE/S & CWE/F to study --

56 CDO/LKODropping of lav.

Doors

Due to weak base channel on which hinges of doors

are screwed.

Size of door hinge should be increased to 4" from 3"

to increase number of screws/hinges.


To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

57CDO/BBS/ECo

RPaint

The paint of the coaches received from the ICF gets

faded with in a span of one year. Further the paint

gets peeled out and a crack also develops causing

ugly look of the coach. Hence the quality of the paint

is to be ensured to avoid the above problems.

Rlys to provide the

name of the firm-- CWE/FUR To study --

58CDO/BBS/ECo

RDUST BIN

The link mechanism of the Dust Bin provided beneath

the wash basin is frequently getting damaged and not

user friendly. Hence alternative is to be developed to

surmount the above problem.

New Stainless steel

Dust bin is introduced-- Design To study

To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

59CDO/BBS/ECo

RWINDOW GLASS

Different sizes of window glasses are being provided

in AC coaches and it varies every year. This causes lot

of problems for the Depots during maintenance.

Hence window glasses are to be standardized so that

the maintenance can be done with minimum

inventory.


To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

60CDO/BBS/ECo

R

BRAKE

EQUIPMENT

In ICF coaches DV, Isolating cock of DV and Isolating

cock of brake cylinder are fitted at different locations

of the coach. But in LHB coaches all these are fitted in

one location (Panel Mounted Braking System) making

it easy to operate. Hence in ICF coach fitment of all

these at one location on Panel Mounted Braking

System may be considered for easy operation.


To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

61CDO/BBS/ECo

RPLUMBING

IN ICF AC coaches connection between centrifugal

pump and water tank is with GI pipe line but in LHB

coaches the connection between centrifugal pump

and water tank is with stainless steel wire mesh

protected flexible pipe, which is easy for

maintenance. Hence the same may be considered for

ICF AC coaches also.


To be discussed

in the next

Customer meet.

Sl.

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Specific Item



Solutions

Implementaion


62CDO/BBS/ECo

R

Now a day when we purchase a motor cycle, they

provide a user catalogue for the convenience of the

user but the same is not being done in case of these

coaches. Hence it causes a lot of problems at ground

zero during maintenance. Hence user catalogue

containing specification, drawing number and source

of supply is to be provided with every coach for easy

procurement of spares for better maintenance.

Zonal Railways can

download the Rolling

Stock Certificates for

the individual

coaches.

-- -- -- closed

minutes of the customer interaction meeting · pdf fileicf zonal railways rites ltd/rdso 1...

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