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hainrih biolis fondSi 2010 wlis
3 noembers gamarTuli sajaro diskusia
Temaze:
`nafic msajulTa instituti
saqarTveloSi~
ZiriTadi momxseneblebi:
gigla gulaSvili _ eqsperti,
saqarTvelos axalgazrda iuristTa
asociacia
oTar kaxiZe _ iusticiis saministros
analitikuri departamentis ufrosi
kaxa wiqariSvili _ sasamarTlo
administrirebis da menejmentis
reformis proeqtis xelmZRvanelis
moadgile, DPK Consulting. avtori
wignisa: ,,nafic msajulTa sasamarTlo
(dasavluri sistemebis mimoxilva)~
vaxtang xmalaZe _ eqsperti,
sazogadoebrivi sakonstitucio komisiis
wevri
giorgi SavliaSvili _ saqarTvelos
uzenaesi sasamarTlos mosamarTle
moderacia: mindia ugrexeliZe
2
mindia ugrexeliZe _ mogesalmebiT yvelas. is sistema, romelic
Tanamedroveobas Seesabameba, jer kidev ar aris Camoyalibebuli da vin icis, kidev
ramdeni dro dagvWirdeba. amitom Tqveni azri, monawileoba, SekiTxvis Tu kamaTis
saxiT, am Temebze msjelobisas Zalian mniSvnelovania. miuxedavad imisa, rom
konstituciuri cvlilebebi ukve miRebulia, konstituciuri procesi
saqarTveloSi araTu ar damTavrebula, SeiZleba iTqvas, rom axla iwyeba. is
gagrZeldeba manam, sanam ar CavTvliT, rom mivuaxlovdiT mainc srulyofilebas,
Tumca srulyofili qveyanaze araferi ar aris. gansakuTrebiT vafaseb axalgazrda
qarTvel iuristTa monawileobas am procesSi. did madlobas movaxseneb Cvens
ucxoel kolegebsac.
sakiTxi, romelzec dRes visaubrebT, bevrnairad SeiZleba iyos warmoCenili.
es aris gagrZeleba Cveni Sexvedrebisa saqarTvelos konstituciaze. imitom rom,
mogexsenebaT, sasamarTlo sistema nawilia konstituciis, da amave dros im axali
kanonmdeblobis, romelic amaswinaT Sevida ZalaSi.
msoflioSi sami ZiriTadi samarTlebrivi sistema arsebobs. erT-erTi maTgani
mxolod profesional mosamarTleebs iyenebs. amisi yvelaze TvalsaCino magaliTi
saerTaSoriso sasamarTloebi iqneba. meore sistemaa is, romelic iyenebs Sefenebis
instituts da is ZiriTadad germaniaSi gvxvdeba. es sistema gulisxmobs damxmare
mosamarTleebs. nafici msajulebi maTgan imiT gansxvavdebian, rom isini
araprofesionali momsamarTleebi arian da ar sargebloben yvela im uflebiT,
riTic sargebloben profesionali mosamarTleebi. iseve rogorc, profesionali
mosamarTle ar sargeblobs yvela im uflebiT, riTic sargeblobs
araprofesionali msajuli. SeiZleba iTqvas, rom nafic msajulTa sasamarTlo
warmoadgens or sasamarTlos erT saxuravs qveS. erTia faqtebis sasamarTlo,
meorea normebis Semfardebeli sasamarTlo. nafici msajulebi mxolod faqtebze
msjeloben, mosamarTle warmarTavs sasamarTlo process da normebs Seufardebs.
rac Seexeba saxalxo msajulebis instituts, igive Sefenebis instituts, iq,
marTalia, araprofesionalebi arian, magram isini sargebloben yvela im uflebiT,
riTic sargebloben profesionali mosamarTleebi. isini erTnairad pasuxismgebelni
arian da erTnairad monawileoben rogorc faqtebis dadgenaSi, ise normebis
SefardebaSi.
ra gza unda airCios saqarTvelom, rom xeli Seuwyos jansaRi, efeqtiani,
swrafi da moqnili, samarTliani marTlmsajulebis sistemis damkvidrebas. nafic
msajulTa instituts momxrec bevri hyavs da mowinaaRmdege _ kidev ufro meti.
isic sainteresoa, ra xdeba msoflioSi, nafic msajulTa raodenobis gazrdis Tu
piriqiT, Semcirebis tendenciaa. axla ukve momxseneblebs movusminoT, pirvels,
baton gigla agulaSvils gadavcem sityvas.
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gigla agulaSvili _ sisxlis samarTlis saproceso kodeqsi minda Sevafaso
rogorc wingadadgmuli nabiji demokratiis gzaze da adamianis uflebebis dacvis
TvalsazrisiT. ra Tqma unda, erTia kanonSemoqmedebiTi procesi da kanonis
gamoyenebis procesi. vnaxoT, praqtika ras gvaCvenebs, magram vfiqrob, rom msgavsi
tendenciebi Seuqcevadia da imedi maqvs, es procesi praqtikazec aisaxeba.
nafic msajulTa sasamarTlosTan dakavSirebiT minda movixmo jefri
abramsonis, cnobili samarTlis profesoris sityvebi: `nafic msajulTa
sasamarTlo demokratiis rogorc saukeTeso, aseve yvelaze uaresi monapovaria.~
anu, am instituts aqvs udidesi SesaZleblobebi, magram aqvs safrTxeebic. rogor
iqneba realizebuli es SesaZleblobebi da safrTxeebi, bevrad aris damokidebuli
imaze, vin da rogor axorcielebs am process. ramdenadac CemTvis cnobilia,
ramdenime weliwadia, prokurorebi, mosamarTleebi, advokatebi seriozul
swavlebas gadian imisaTvis, rom msgavs procesze gamosasvlelad unar-Cvevebi
SeiZinon. magram erTia treningebi da meorea konkretuli saqmeebi da konkretuli
adamianis bedi. cota maSfoTebs es sakiTxi, magram mainc imedi maqvs, yvelaferi
kargad iqneba. ra Tqma unda, mowinaaRmdegebis mier argumentad moyvanili iqneba is,
rom Cven patara qveyana varT, rom es Zviri procesia, rom nafici msajulebi ver
erkvevian mtkicebulebebSi, sxvadasxva Tanamedrove eqspertizebis arsSi da
SesaZloa, Secdoma dauSvan da a.S. TiToeul am arguments aqvs pasuxi. Tu
braldebis da dacvis mxare mecnieruli eniT davuwyebT laparaks nafic msajulebs,
isini bunebrivia, verafers ver gaigeben. magram normaluri komunikaciis damyarebis
SemTxvevaSi maTTvis yvelaferi gasagebi iqneba.
londonis centralur sasamarTloSi da prokuraturaSi yofnisas vnaxe, rom
arsebobs specialuri organo, romelic iuristebis mier Sekrebil mtkicebulebebs
,,Targmnis~ adamianur enaze da am saxiT awvdian nafic msajulebs. vnaxe ra Sedegi
miiRweva amiT da rogori iolad gasagebi SeiZleba iyos Tundac rTuli
eqspertizebi da saqmeebi.
nafic msajulebs `Tavisuflebis guSagebs~ uwodeben. isini arian adamianebi,
romlebsac SeuZliaT gaakontrolon xelisufleba da uari Tqvan usamarTlo
kanonis aRsrulebaze. gagaxsenebT kvakerebis saqmes, rodesac naficma msajulebma
Tqves, rom uars acxadeben usargeblo kanonis gamoyenebaze. magram saqarTvelos
sinamdvileSi minda moviyvano erTi muxli, sisxlis samarTlis kodeqsis 372-e
prima muxli, romelic gulisxmobs mowmisa da dazaralebulis mier arsebiTad
urTierTsawinaaRmdego Cvenebis micemas. rodesac es muxli Semodioda, iniciatorTa
argumentebiT, is gamoyenebuli iqneboda moZalade policielebis winaaRmdeg. anu,
Tu policieli cemda dazaralebuls an braldebuls, da igi amis Sesaxeb miscemda
Cvenebas, Semdeg xSirad gadaTqvamda mas. am muxlis mixedviT mas gadaTqmis ufleba
erTmeoda. am muxlis TvalsazrisiT, Cemi azriT, katastrofuli mdgomareobaa.
marTalia, Cemi profesiis gamo ver viqnebi nafici msajuli, magram rom vyofiliyav,
albaT vaiZulebdi parlaments am muxlis gauqmebas. profesionali mosamarTleebi
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im motivaciiT, rom maTi moqmedeba kanonieria, miiReben im tipis gadawyvetilebebs,
rogoric aris, vTqvaT, ar visunTqoT ramdenime saaTis ganmavlobaSi, Tuki aseTi
kanoni iarsebebs. magram nafici msajulebi aseT SemTxvevaSi ar dagvsjian. yovel
SemTxvevaSi, amis SesaZlebloba nafic msajulebTan ufro metia, vidre
profesional mosamarTleebTan.
Tan maqvs statistikuri monacemebi, romlebic gamoqveynebulia saqarTvelos
uzenaesi sasamarTlos vebgverdze. aq aris 2008 da 2009 wlis monacemebi. 2009
wels ganxilul iqna 15911 sisxlis samarTlis saqme 18778 piris mimarT, 2008
wels _ 17978 saqme 21287 piris mimarT. 2009 wels msjavrdebulia 99,6%, 2008
wels _ 98,5%. gamarTlebulia 0,1%.
maqvs masalebi, romlebic asaxavs Sua aziaSi nafic msajulTa institutis
saqmianobas. iseve rogorc ruseTSi, yazaxuri modeli kritikas ver uZlebs Tundac
im nawilSi, rom uzenaes sasamarTlos SeuZlia verdiqtis gauqmeba. miuxedavad
amisa, yazaxeTSi ganaCenebis 8%-ze meti aris gamamarTlebeli, ruseTSi es procenti
kidev ufro metia. dRevandel ruseTSi gamamarTlebeli verdiqtebi 15%-s aRwevs.
mindia ugrexeliZe _ gmadlobT. strasburgis sasamarTlom amaswinaT
ganixila `taskes saqme belgiis winaaRmdeg~ da brZana, rom nafic msajulTa
sasamarTlo am SemTxvevaSi ver CaiTvleba namdvil sasamarTlod, imitom rom iq
araferi dasabuTebuli ar aris.
modiT, SevecadoT pasuxi gavceT aseT seriozul SekiTxvebs.
oTar kaxiZe _ moxaruli var, rom aseT saintereso diskusiaSi
monawileobis saSualeba meZleva. uinston CerCilma aRniSna, rom `saukeTeso
argumenti demokratiis winaaRmdeg aris xuTwuTiani saubari saSualo
statistikur amomrCevelTan~, rac bunebrivia, rogorc argumenti demokratiis
winaaRmdeg ver gamodgeba, radgan imas, Tu ra aris samarTliani an usamarTlo,
gansazRvravs Tavad sazogadoeba. sazogadoeba afasebs, ramdenad samarTliania
kanoni, ramdenad samarTliani iyo sasamarTlo am kanonis Sefardebisas an
gamoyenebisas. amitom Zalian mniSvnelovania sazogadoebis CarTuloba da
monawileoba marTlmsajulebis ganxorcielebis procesSi.
MmTavari gamowvevebi or nawilad SeiZleba davyoT: gamowvevebi, romlebic
ukve dadga sxvadasxva qveynebis winaSe, da axali gamowvevevi, romlebic droTa
ganmavlobaSi warmoiSva. jer axal gamowvevebze visaubreb. baton mindias
daveTanxmebi, evrosasamarTloSi gadacemulia saqme, romelic exeba nafic msajulTa
verdiqtis dasabuTebulobas. mxedvelobaSi maqvs gamamtyunebeli verdiqti, vinaidan,
rogorc mogexsenebaT, gamamarTlebeli verdiqti gasaCivrebas ar eqvemdebareba.
nafic msajulTa sasamarTlos SemoReba mxolod kanonis erTi an ori
muxlis CaweriT ar Semoifargleba. am yvelafris ukan aris seriozuli samuSaoebi,
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romlebic erTi mxriv dakavSirebulia sasamarTlos menejmentTan da am institutis
gamarTulad funqcionirebasTan. meore mxriv, saWiroa Sesabamisi dokumentacia.
kerZod, nafic msajulTa kiTxvari, romelic dakavSirebulia nafic msajulTa
SerCevis sxdomasTan. es aris erT-erTi umniSvnelovanesi etapi. aseve
mniSvnelovania instruqciebi da verdiqtis formebi, romlebic nafic msajulebs
gadaecemaT. instruqciebi aris dokumenti, romelic mxareTa monawileobiT dgeba
mosamarTlis mier. is Seicavs zogad nawils da SeiZleba saerTo iyos yvela
saqmisTvis. aseve Seicavs konkretul sakiTxebs, romlebic dakavSirebulia
konkretul danaSaulTan, romelsac ganixilavs sasamarTlo. am instruqciebiTa da
verdiqitis formebiT unda aviciloT Tavidan is momenti, romelmac Tavi iCina
`taskes saqmeSi~. kerZod, msajulebma mSralad ar unda Tqvan, rom maT sjeraT,
rom am adamianma es Caidina. damnaSaveobis momenti unda gaiSalos verdiqtis
formaSi da instruqciebiT naTlad unda iyos ganmartebuli imisaTvis, rom naficma
msajulebma am kiTxvebze pasuxis gacemiT faqtobrivad daasabuTon verdiqti. es
mniSvnelovani gamowvevaa CvenTvis da Cven SevimuSaveT instruqciebi, samodelo
varianti da verdiqtis formebi konkretuli danaSaulebis mixedviT dacvis mxaris
uSualo CarTulobiTa da monawileobiT.
rac Seexeba rTul saqmeebs, vgulisxmob sabanko TaRliTobebs,
kiberdanaSaulebs, specifiur sabuRaltro-safinanso danaSaulebs, pilotur
reJimSi aseTi tipis saqmeebs nafici msajulebi ar ganixilaven, magram mainc
gasaTvaliswinebelia. am SemTxvevaSi albaT eqspertebze unda gakeTdes aqcenti. rac
mTavaria, msajulebs gasageb enaze unda ganemartoT, raSi vdebT brals moqalaqes,
romelic zis braldebulis skamze. nafici msajulebi am moqalaqis adgilze
warmoidgenen Tavs, braldebulsac aqvs imedi Tavisnairebis. igi elis misi
saqcielis gagebas.
am axali gamowvevebis garda arsebobs tradiciuli problemebi, romlebic
dakavSirebulia nafic msajulTa sasamarTloze SesaZlo zewolasTan, nafici
msajulebis mimarT muqaraze, mediis SesaZlo gavlenaze maTze, magram am yvelafers
aqvs Tavisi Sesabamisi dazRvevis meqanizmebi, romlebic asaxulia saproceso
kodeqsSi. am problemebs yvela erTad unda gavumklavdeT, mTeli sazogadoeba,
arasamTavrobo seqtori, saxelisuflebo wreebi.
mindia ugrexeliZe _ didi madloba, magram rac Cven gvainteresebs, imaze
jer ver mivaRwieT pasuxs. amitom gTxovT, konkretul kiTxvas vupasuxoT: ratom
gaxda saqarTveloSi saWiro nafic msajulTa institutis SemoReba. saqarTveloSi
arsebobda raRac sistema. magaliTa sabWoTa kavSiris dros arsebobda asesoratis,
saxalxo msajulebis instituti. es sistema Semdeg Seicvala profesional
iuristTa sasamarTloTi. axla isev icvleba sistema. mainteresebs Tqveni xedva,
ratom gaxda aucilebeli nafic msajulTa institutis SemoReba.
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oTar kaxiZe _ Sevecdebi vupasuxo am kiTxvas. zustad da kompetenturad
ver gamovxatav sakanonmdeblo organos pozicias. es argumentacia ganmartebiT
baraTSi warmodgenili gaxlavT da moicavs Semdeg momentebs: saerTo samarTlis
qveynebisTvis damaxasiaTebeli SejibrebiTi procesis nawili, nafic msajulTa
sasamarTlo, rodesac gvyavs mosamarTle, romelic aris miukerZoebeli arbitri da
ar monawileobs mtkicebulebebis gamokvlevis procesSi.
mindia ugrexeliZe _ magram iq, sadac ar aris nafic msajulTa instituti,
ar aris SejibrebiTi procesi?
oTar kaxiZe _ axali saproceso kodeqsis miRebamde CvenTan ar yofila
SejibrebiTi procesi. vinaidan, Cemi azriT, SejibrebiTi procesi ar gvaqvs,
rodesac advokati mimarTavs prokurors da gamomZiebels SuamdgomlobiT
sagamoZiebo procesis Catarebaze. SejibrebiTi procesi arc maSin gvaqvs, rodesac
mosamarTle kiTxavs mowmes da mowmis pasuxi aucileblad aZlevs romelime mxares
xels, da mosamarTle uneburad ixreba romelime mxarisken. SejibrebiToba ar
gvaqvs, rodesac dazaralebulia mxare da dacvas uwevs or bralmdebelTan
gamklaveba da arc maSin aris SejibrebiToba, rodesac mosamarTle raRac
mtkicebulebebs gamoTqvams.
Mmeore sakiTxi, ris gamoc mniSvnelovania nafici msajulebis institutis
SemoReba, aris sazogadoebis CarTulobis uzrunvelyofa marTlmsajulebis
ganxorcielebis procesSi.
Semdegi sakiTxia danaSaulis winaaRmdeg brZolis saqmeSi sazogadoebis
mxridan pasuxismgeblobis aReba sakuTar Tavze. sazogadoebis CarTuloba aris
sazogadoebis interesis dakmayofileba, meorea, rodesac sazogadoebam
pasuxismgebloba unda aiRos.
aseve mniSvnelovani sakiTxia marTlmsajulebis sistemis mimarT da kanonis
uzenaesobis mimarT rwmenis amaRleba sazogadoebaSi.
gigla agulaSvili _ CamoTvlil argumentebs veTanxmebi. bolo wlebis
sociologiuri kvlevebi aCvenebda, rom sasamarTloebisadmi, profesionali
mosamarTleebis mier ganxorcielebuli marTlmsajulebisadmi ndobis reitingi 4%-
is farglebSi iyo. axla viTareba SedarebiT ukeTesia. erTxel erT-erT kvlevaSi
paradoqsuli situacia iyo _ kanonier qurdebs da sasamarTloebs Tanabari ndobis
reitingi hqondaT.
kaxa wiqariSvili _ miuxedavad imisa, rom nafic msajulTa institutTan
dakavSirebiT konstituciaSi cvlileba jer kidev 2004 wels Sevida, kiTxva,
gvWirdeba Tu ara es instituti, da ratom Semogvaqvs igi, mainc aqtualuria.
ramdenime sakiTxi minda gamovyo.
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rodesac Tvals gadavavlebT saerTaSoriso literaturas nafic msajulTa
sasamarTlos Sesaxeb, gansakuTrebiT, rodesac SevxedavT amerikul gamocdilebas,
vnaxavT Semdegs. aris aseTi avtori, saerTaSoriso eqsperti nafic msajulTa
sferoSi, gansakuTrebiT SedarebiTi mimoxilvis kuTxiT, neil bigmari, romelic
ambobs, rom msoflioSi aris nafic msajulTa sistemis gauqmebis an Semcirebis
tendencia.
mindia ugrexeliZe _ es tendencia yvelasTvis cnobilia, sxva ufro
mniSvnelovani eqsperti aravin gaxsendebaT?
kaxa wiqariSvili _ amave avtoris TqmiT, amerikaSi es instituti imitom
aris Rrmad fexmokidebuli, rom amas amyarebs amerikis SeerTebuli Statebis
konstitucia, romelic mogexsenebaT, Zalian stabiluria, aseve amerikeli xalxis
undobloba saxelmwifos mimarT. anu, amerikeli xalxi imdenad ver egueba
saxelmwifos dominirebas marTlmsajulebaze, rom mas boWavs nafic msajulTa
meSveobiT.
nafic msajulTa institutis SemoRebiT Cvenc vaRiareT, rom ar vendobiT
saxelmwifos da gvinda Cvensa da saxelmwifos Soris iyos moqalaqe, anu msajuli.
ra tendenciebTan modis SeusabamobaSi nafic msajulTa sasamarTlo _
marTlsamjulebis efeqturobis da ekonomikurobis principTan, riskenac midis
Tanamedrove msoflio. ekonomikurobis principi Zalian mniSvnelovania da
gulisxmobs menejmentze orientirebul midgomas. es ki imas niSnavs, rom rac
SeiZleba naklebi resursiT meti saqme gavakeToT. marTlmsajulebaSi xdeba
ekonomikurobis principis win wamoweva. magaliTad, aris ramdenime rekomendacia
evrosabWos farglebSi, romelis mixedviTac, saqme sasurvelia ganixilos ara
kolegiam, aramed erTma mosamarTlem.
meore tendencia marTlmsajulebis kuTxiT mTel msoflioSi aris
marTlmsajulebis profesionalizacia. evrosabWos aqvs rekomendaciebi am kuTxiT,
rom moxdes mosamarTleTa specializeba viwro profesionalizaciis mixedviT.
nafic msajulTa sasamarTlo orive princips ewinaaRmdegeba, magram mTavari
argumenti, rac am instituts amyarebs, rogorc Cans, aris undobloba saxelmwifos
mimarT. meore da Zalian mniSvnelovani, aris sazogadoebis CarTuloba. veTanmxebi
im azrs, rom SejibrebiTobis principi nafic msajulTa institutSi gamokveTilia.
rac Seexeba TviTon sisxlis samarTlis process, saxelwifom faqtobrivad
Tqva, rom mas aRar aqvs WeSmaritebis dadgenis funqcia da WeSmariteba xalxma
unda daadginos.
SeiZleba bevri argumenti arsebobs nafic msajulTa institutis winaaRmdeg,
magram me mainc mxars vuWer saqarTveloSi nafic msajulTa institutis danergvas,
imitom rom CvenTan marTlmsajulebis mimarT sazogadoebrivi cnobireba unda
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amaRldes, da radgan amdeni xnis ganmavlobaSi ver movaxerxeT iseTi sasamarTlos
Seqmna, romelsac xalxi endoboda, marTlmsajuleba TviTon xalxs unda gadavceT
da am gziT avamaRloT ndoba sasamarTlo xelisuflebis mimarT.
mindia ugrexeliZe _ didi madloba. radgan avtoritetebze Camovarda
saubari, mec davasaxeleb ramdenime mecniers. aris aseTi frangi mecnieri Jan
prabeli, romlis SedarebiTi samarTali saqveynod aris cnobili. Tavis cnobil
naSromSi `SedarebiTi sisxlis samarTali~ Jan prabeli ambobs: `dRes naklebad
gamoiyeneba araprofesionalTa monawileoba, me-19 saukunidan Tmobs poziciebs’’.
misive TqmiT, igi `regressac ganicdis~. sxvagan wers, rom `Jiuris SemoReba
marcxiT damTavrda~. es yvelaferi imiT aris saintereso, rom Cven unda
davelaparakoT sakuTar Tavs da viRacis SekveTiT ar unda vimoqmedoT.
bunebrivad Cndeba kiTxva, Tuki Semcirebis tendencia midis, Cven ratom
Semogvaqvs axla es instituti. vidre am kiTxvaze naTel, damajerebel pasuxs ar
gavcemT, manamde ndobaze laparaki zedmetia.
Semdegi avtoria ieSeki. is gaxlavT Zalian didi germaneli mecnieri da isic
igives ambobs.
giorgi SavliaSvili _ aq dasaxelda argumentebi, romelTa gamoc sisxlis
samarTlis axali saproceso kodeqsi iqna miRebuli. amaze mniSvnelovani ZiriTadi
argumentebi Cemi azriT ar arsebobs. kidev erTxel unda gavimeoro ZiriTadi
sakiTxebi: is, rom sazogadoebas saqarTveloSi uWirs samoqalaqo pasuxismgeblobis
aReba. adamiani, rodesac xdeba nafici msajuli, valdebulia aiRos samoqalaqo
pasuxismgebloba sakuTar Tavze. gadawyvetilebis miRebis Semdeg pirnaTeli unda
iyos sakuTari Tavis, RmerTis da ojaxis winaSe. amaswinaT Catarda imitirebuli
sasamarTlo procesi nafici msajulebis SerCevis efeqturobis Sesamowmeblad. Cemi
azriT, es procesi warmatebuli iyo. nafici msajulebi, miuxedavad imisa, rom
procesi imitirebuli iyo, Zalian gulisxmierni iyvnen.
Zalian mniSvnelovania aseve samarTlebrivi azrovnebis ganviTareba, rac
drouli da saWiroa saqarTveloSi. nafic msajulTa institutis SemoReba
samarTlebrivi azrovnebis amaRlebis donis erT-erTi efeqturi meTodic gaxlavT.
xSirad amboben, rom mosamarTlem ar miiRo swori gadawyvetileba, da mas zemdgom
instanciaSi asaCivreben. rodesac adamianebi Tavad miiReben monawileobas
sasamarTlo procesSi, mixvdebian ratom xdeba aseTi gadawyvetilebebis miReba.
rac Seexeba imas, ramdenad gamarTlebulia am institutis SemoReba, an
rogoria nafic msajulTa sasamarTlosadmi midgoma msoflioSi, geTanxmebiT, arian
qveynebi, sadac aRar aqvT nafic msajulTa instituti. magram amisi mizezi
ZiriTadad is iyo, rom nafici msajulebis mier miRebuli gadawyvetilebebi xSir
SemTxvevaSi usamarTlo an dausabuTebeli iyo. amaze SeiZleba gamoiTqvas sxvadasxva
mosazrebebi. ver vityodi, rom amerikis SeerTebul StatebSi nafic msajulTa
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instituti an ar ver muSaobs. amerikel xalxs demokratiis ganviTarebis erT-erT
mniSvnelovan bazisad miaCnia nafic msajulTa institutis arseboba. swored es
gamocdileba gvaZlevs safuZvels, rom nafic msajulTa institutma unda imuSaos
saqarTveloSi da unda miviRoT is dadebiTi Sedegebi, razec aris orientirebuli
misi SemoReba.
mindia ugrexeliZe _ didi madloba. piradad me miCndeba kiTxva,
araprofesionalma msajulma profesionali mosamarTlis saqmianobaze metad rogor
unda aamaRlos samarTlebrivi kultura.
kidev erTi SekiTxva maqvs, oRond darbazSi Sekrebili sazogadoebis mimarT.
amerikis SeerTebuli Statebis sazogadoeba Tuki raimeTi amayobs, es aris
damoukideblobis deklaracia. es aris jefersonis mier dawerili araCveulebrivi
dokumenti, romelic Semdgom safuZvlad daedo amerikis SeerTebuli Statebis
mTel politikur cxovrebas. es dokumenti aris imis dasabuTeba, Tu ratom
gadawyvita cametma koloniam, rom inglisis mmarTvelobisgan daeRwia Tavi.
amerikelebi imiT amayoben, rom maT ubralod ki ar ganacxades amis Sesaxeb, aramed
daasabuTes kidec TavianTi gadawyvetileba. dasabuTeba aris umniSvnelovanesi
elementi ndobis asamaRleblad. amitom gekiTxebiT, rodis ufro amaRldeba
sasamarTlo verdiqtisadmi da gadawyvetilebisadmi sazogadoebis ndoba, roca
dasabuTebulad ityvian vinmeze rom damnaSavea an ar aris damnaSave, Tu
dausabuTeblad?
axla baton vaxtang xmalaZes movusminoT.
vaxtang xmalaZe _ didi madloba. is, ris Tqmasac vapireb, aris im codnis
da dafiqrebis Sedegi, rac am sakiTxze mifiqria. ar vapireb avtoritetebis
moxmobas. sasamarTlo sistemis mizani samarTlianobis miRwevaa. yvelaferi
danarCeni aris is saSualebebi, romlebmac unda mogvces SesaZlebloba, mivaRwioT
simarTlis dadgenas. rogori sistemac ar unda movigonoT, yvelas eqneba Tavisi
dadebiTi da uaryofiTi mxareebi. yoveli axali institutis SemoRebas moaqvs
raRaca dadebiTi Sedegebi da SesaZloa, man uaryofiTi riskebic gaaCinos. amitom,
rodesac raimes SemoRebas vapirebT, unda aviRoT saswori da avwondavwonoT es
yvelaferi. SevxedoT, romeli gadawonis da is avirCioT.
sayovelTaod cnobilia is, rom nafic msajulTa institutis SemoReba
aZvirebs sasamarTlos xarjebs, zrdis samarTlianobis miRwevis xarjebs da ufro
xangrZlivs xdis process. magram piradad CemTvis es yvelaze naklebad uaryofiTi
mxarea. Tu meqneba didi albaToba imisa, rom am sistemis SemoReba xels Seuwyobs
samarTlianobis miRwevas, mzad var, rogorc gadasaxadebis gadamxdeli, es fuli
gadavixado.
rodesac saubari iyo am sistemis SemoRebis aucileblobaze, argumentad iyo
moyvanili SejibrebiTobis uzrunvelyofa. mec viziareb im azrs, rom nafic
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msajulTa sasamarTloSi SejibrebiTobis procenti maqsimumamdea ayvanili. Tumca,
aqve imasac vityvi, rom tradiciul sasamarTloebSic, procesi SesaZloa imgvarad
iyos organizebuli, rom SejibrebiTobis xarisxi maqsimumade iyos gazrdili. imis
Tqmac, rom am SejibrebiTobis drosac SesaZlebelia mosamarTlem gadaxaros joxi
romelime mxares, es aqac SesaZlebelia. aviRoT magaliTad iseTi SemTxveva,
rodesac mosamarTle ambobs, rom mxareebis mier moyvanili esa Tu is mtkicebuleba
ar unda miiCnion mtkicebulebad da unda daiviwyon. magram warmoidgineT, rom
nafici msajuli var da es ukve movismine, rogor fiqrobT, CemSi ar datovebda
kvals ukve mosmenili? is ar imoqmedebs Cems saboloo gadawyvetilebaze?
araprofesionalizmze saubrisas gaviTvaliswinoT, rom bevri ram
SefasebiTia. kanonSi weria, rom raRac aris danaSauli, magram Cemi cnobierebisTvis
is ar aris danaSauli, an Zalian umniSvnelo danaSaulia da is sxva moqmedebiT
aris gamowveuli. aseTi cnobiereba ar aris CvenSi? da is ar imoqmedebs verdiqtze
xelis moweris dros? da amiT xom ar miviRebT iseT Sedegs, rom damnaSave
gamarTldes da udanaSaulo daisajos? imitom rom es piriqiTac SeiZleba iyos.
raRac SeiZleba kanoniT ar iyos danaSauli, magram Cemi msoflmxedvelobiT
danaSaulad mimaCndes. ase rom Teoriulad sworia, rom am procesSi sazogadoebis
CarTviT is sakuTar Tavze iRebs pasuxismgeblobas, magram ritorikul kiTxvas
davsvam: gana sazogadoeba arCevnebis saxiT CarTuli ar aris saxelmwifo
xelisuflebis formirebis procesSi da gana amiT sazogadoebis pasuximgebloba
gazrdilia?
rac Seexeba marTlmsajulebisadmi ndobis amaRlebas, es kodeqsi jerjerobiT
erTi muxlis mixedviT amoqmeddeba. am muxlis mixedviT albaT statistikurad
SegviZlia vTqvaT, ramdenia danaSaulis raodenoba. weliwadSi daaxloebiT 25-30
TbilisSi. e.i. gamodis, rom nafici msajulebi daaxloebiT 30 saqmeSi Caerevian,
danarCen 15 aTas saqmeSi _ vera. ramdenad Seuwyobs es xels ndobis amaRlebas. 90-
iani wlebis bolos, roca sasamarTlos pirveli reforma daiwyo, maSindel
gamokiTxvebs Tu naxavT, daaxloebiT 2003-04 wlamde ndobis xarisxi sasamarTlos
mimarT izrdeboda. mere daiwyo kleba. vnaxoT, ramdeni iyo gamamarTlebeli
gadawyvetileba procentulad. rogori iyo im periodSi da imis mere. anu, mizezebi
sxvagan unda veZeboT.
erT argumentze ar yofila saubari, magram bevrjer momismenia mis Sesaxeb.
is, rom gansasjelsa da xelisuflebas Soris dgas nafic msajulTa sasamarTlo,
aris garkveuli garantia imisa, rom xelisuflebis zemoqmedeba samarTlis
aRsrulebaze Semcirebuli iqneba. magram ramdenad varT garantirebulni imisagan,
rom Tu xelisufleba Tavs uflebas aZlevs zemoqmedeba moaxdinos mosamarTleze,
romelsac aqvs dacvis kanonismieri bevri garantia, amisgan Tavis dacva nafici
msajulebiT gvinda, romlebze zemoqmedebis gacilebiT meti SesaZlebloba aqvs
xelisuflebas?
11
da bolos, iseT patara qveyanaSi, rogoric saqarTveloa, CvenSi arsebuli
cnobierebis, mentalobis gaTvaliswinebiT, ramdenad iqneba nafici msajulebis
gadawyvetilebebi obieqturi.
mindia ugrexeliZe _ didi madloba. axla ukve SegiZliaT SekiTxvebis dasma.
kanoni ukve miRebulia, axla kargi iqneba iseT Temebze saubari, romelic Cvens
sazogaodebas daexmareba am procesSi CarTvaSi.
Tako faradaSvili, Jurnali `liberali~ _ rogorc cnobilia,
sazogadoebaSi arsebobs garkveuli Temebis mimarT winaswarganwyobebi. magaliTad
homoseqsualebis, ieRovelebis mimarT. ramdenad iqneba gansasjeli daculi imisgan,
rom nafic msajulTagan vinmem gadawyvetilebis miRebisas ar ixelmZRvanelos aseTi
winaswarganwyobebiT.
meore SekiTxva exeba ganaTlebis dones. rogor unda gansajon naficma
msajulebma aseTi rTuli sakiTxebi.
aseve mainteresebs, qveynebSi, sadac amcireben nafic msajulTa ricxvs, ra
gaxda amisi mizezi?
giorgi SavliaSvili _ aseTi sakiTxebi unda gamoikveTos nafic msajulTa
SesarCev sxdomaze. am sxdomaze pasuxis gacemis dros adamianebi valdebulebi arian
iyvnen gulwrfelebi da obieqturebi. SemTxveviTi SerCevis wesiT SerCeul
adamianebs egzavnebaT kiTxvari, romelsac pasuxi unda gascen. maTi pasuxebis
gacnobis Semdeg orive mxares aqvs ufleba am adamianis midrekilebebis gamo misi
acileba moiTxovos. es acileba SeiZleba iyos dausabuTebeli.
oTar kaxiZe _ Tu braldebuls ar unda nafici msajulebi, veravin
daaZalebs, rom misi saqme naficma msajulebma ganixilon. garda amisa, nafici
msajulebis korpusi pirdapir saxlidan ar modis sasamarTloze. isini jer
eswrebian SesarCev sxdomas, sadac mxareebi sruli SejibrebiTobis pirobebSi
utareben maT gamokiTxvas.
giorgi CxeiZe _ Cemi SekiTxva exeba mosamarTles. Zalian bevrs saubroben
nafici msajulebis rolze da Zalian mcires mosamarTlis rolze am procesSi. am
Temaze ar msjeloben. me Tu mkiTxavT, mosamarTlis roli izrdeba. Tumca
saqarTveloSi dRes iuristebis umravlesoba miiCnevs, rom mosamarTlis roli
mcirdeba.
CemTvis gansakuTrebiT saintereso iqneboda uzenaesi sasamarTlos
mosamarTlis mosazreba am sakiTxze.
giorgi SavliaSvili _ geTanxmebiT, xSirad gaigonebT imis Sesaxeb, rom
axali saproceso kodeqsiT mosamarTlis roli dakninebulia. magram Tu am
sakiTxebs CavuRrmavdebiT, vnaxavT, rom izrdeba mosamarTlis pasuxismgebloba da
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Sesabamisad, rolic. misi pasuxismgebloba pirvel rigSi imiT izrdeba, rom man
unda uzrunvelyos SejibrebiTobis principis dacva.
gasaTvaliswinebelia isic, rom mas Zalian mcire dro aqvs imisTvis, rom
nafic msajulTa kandidatebs da SemdgomSi ukve nafic msajulebs misces
samarTlebrivi sakiTxebis Sesaxeb aucilebeli ganmartebebi.
giga Wkadua, studenti _ mainteresebs, ramdenad aris daculi nafici
msajuli zewolisgan da meore, Tu aris cnobili imis Sesaxeb, rom nafic msajuls
angarebis mizniT gamoeyenebinos esa Tu is verdiqti.
oTar kaxiZe _ nafici msajulis mimarT ganxorcielebuli muqara an misi
sicocxlis winaaRmdeg mimarTuli nebismieri qmedeba umkacresad iqneba dasjili. am
mimarTulebiT sisxlis samarTlis politikis saxelmZRvanelo principebSi,
romlebic daamtkica iusticiis ministrma, xazgasmulia, rom nafici msajulis an
nafici msajulobis kandidatis winaaRmdeg ganxorcielebuli nebismieri moqmedeba
umkacresad iqneba dasjili, miuxedavad imisa, Tu vin ganaxorcielebs am qmedebas,
xelisuflebis warmomadgeneli Tu sxva dainteresebuli piri. amave dros iseve
rogorc mosamarTlesTan, nafic msajulTanac komunikacia saqmesTan dakavSirebiT
akrZalulia.
vaxtang xmalaZe _ me gansxvavebuli mosazreba maqvs. Cemi azriT, im
garemoSi, romelSic vcxovrobT, nafici msajulis dacvis xarisxi Zalian dabalia.
ar vgulisxmob mxolod xelisuflebis mxridan zemoqmedebas. es SeiZleba iyos
mezobeli, naTesavi, axlobeli. dameTanxmebiT, rac unda maRali iyos sanqcia
nebismier danaSaulze, ar gvicavs imisagan, rom es danaSauli mainc moxdes. aseve,
isic, rom nafic msajulze zemoqmedeba dasjadia, ar gvicavs imisgan, rom aseT
zemoqmedebas ar hqondes adgili.
kavkasiis media skolis studenti _ yofil patimars Tu aqvs ufleba gaxdes
nafici msajuli?
mindia ugrexeliZe _ amaze pasuxi cxadia. is, rom odesRac patimari iyavi,
arafers niSnavs, sasjelis moxdis Semdeg aseTi adamiani uTanabrdeba sxva
moqalaqeebs, xdeba misi resocializacia da mosamarTlec SegiZlia gaxde, araTu
nafici msajuli.
kavkasiis media skolis studenti _ Tuki sasamarTlo ganixilavs imave
tipis saqmes, ris gamoc aqvs sasjeli moxdili am adamians, maSin rogor iqcevian?
mindia ugrexeliZe _ ra Tqma unda, aseT SemTxvevaSi ar aris sasurveli am
adamianma miiRos monawileoba procesSi.
oTar kaxiZe _ es aris erT-erTi pirdapiri safuZveli am piris
acilebisTvis.
13
maia xuciSvili, `axalgazrda iuristTa asociacia~ _ miuxedavad imisa, rom
saxelmwifos mier moqalaqeebisTvis nafic msajulTa institutis Sesaxeb
darigebul bukletebSi Zalian kargad aris ganmartebuli es procesi, moqalaqeebi
mainc xSirad gvekiTxebian, gavrceldeba Tu ara nafic msajulTa sasamarTlo maT
mimarT damdgar ganaCenze.
batonma oTarma Tqva, rom mosamarTlis mxridan naTlad unda iyos axsnili
intruqciebi. magram ra garantia gvaqvs, rom nafici msajulebi swored ise gaigeben
Tqvens naTqvams, rogorc etyviT?
oTar kaxiZe _ garantiebi, ra Tqma unda, ar gvaqvs. Tumca intruqciebi
muSavdeba mxareTa monawileobiT, CarTulobiT.
giorgi CifCiuri, `saqarTvelos axalgazrda konstitucionalistTa
asociacia~ _ Cemi azriT, yvelaze seriozuli riski imaSi mdgomareobs, rom
iuristebs ufro metad movuwodebT gaxdnen kargi oratorebi da ara
profesionalebi. vinc kargi oratori iqneba, is moigebs Tormeti nafici msajulis
guls.
mindia ugrexeliZe _ es absoluturad gasagebi da realizebuli safrTxea
da araerTi magaliTis moyvanac SeiZleba. mWevrmetyvelebis ganviTarebam
WeSmaritebis dadgenas SeiZleba SeuSalos kidec xeli.
maia xuciSvili, `axalgazrda iuristTa asociacia~ _ SekiTxva maqvs nafic
msajulTa socialur garantiebTan dakavSirebiT. kanonSi Cadebulia, rom sajaro
samsaxuris warmomadgenlebs unarCundebaT samsaxuric da anazRaurebac. magram es
ar aris gaTvaliswinebuli kerZo seqtoris SemTxvevaSi. xom ar irRveva amiT
adamianis uflebebi?
mindia ugrexeliZe _ am sakiTxze iyo ganmartebebi. ra Tqma unda,
sirTuleebi iqneba, gansakuTrebiT roca saqme kerZo seqtors exeba. rasakvirvelia,
saxelmwifom unda uzrunvelyos aseTi sakiTxebi kerZo seqtorTan mimarTebaSic.
oTar kaxiZe _ SesaZloa momzaddes kanonproeqti, romlis mixedviTac, iseve
rogorc rezervists unarCundeba samsaxuri, SeunarCundes igi nafic msajulsac.
minda im dazRvevis meqanizmebze visaubro, romlebic kodeqsSi devs. batonma
vaxtangma aRniSna, ra xdeba im SemTxvevaSi, rodesac nafici msajuli Seityobs
mtkicebulebis arsebobis Sesaxeb, magram es dauSvebeli mtkicebulebaa. kodeqsSi
devs norma, romelic aZlevs mosamarTles saSualebas gaauqmos gamamtyunebeli
verdiqti, Tu igi mtkicebulebaTa erTobliobas ewinaaRmdegeba. anu, braldebulis
interesebi aqac daculia.
14
vaxtang xmalaZe _ me vgulisxmobdi mtkicebulebas, romelic braldebulis
gamarTlebisTvis aris wardgenili da mosamarTlem igi dauSvebel mtkicebulebad
cno.
oTar kaxiZe _ Tu kanonis darRveviT aris mopovebuli gamamarTlebeli
mtkicebuleba, is mainc dasaSvebad CaiTvleba. am SemTxvevaSi braldebulis
kanonieri interesebia amosavali wertili. rodesac braldebuli iseTi
avtoritetia, SeuZlebelia miukerZoeblobis uzrunvelyofa, saqmis ganmxilveli
sasamarTlos gadawyvetilebiT, aseve uzenaesi sasamarTlos Tavmjdomaris
TanxmobiT, SesaZlebelia, aseT saqmeze saerTod ar Catardes nafic msajulTa
sasamarTlo da saqme mosamarTlem ganixilos.
yvelaze mniSvnelovani kritika dRes batoni vaxtangisgan movismine, rodesac
man dasva kiTxva, ratom unda exebodeT nafic msajulebs mxolod 109-e muxli.
imitom rom logikurad sazogadoebisgan unda modiodes iniciativa, rom yvela
muxlze vrceldebodes nafic msajulTa sasamarTlo.
xelisuflebas aRmoaCnda politikuri neba, rom marTlmsajulebis
aRsrulebaSi CarTos sazogadoeba da sazogadoebam es aucileblad unda gamoiyenos,
unda moiTxovos misi gavrceleba sxva muxlebzec, sxva raionebzec. Cven vawarmoebT
cnobierebis amaRlebis kampanias da Catarebuli kvlevis Tanaxmad, mosaxleobis
86% dadebiTad aris ganwyobili am institutis mimarT, 40%-mde mosaxleobisa
Tavad aris mzad, rom iyos nafici msajuli. es aris damoukidebeli socoilogiuri
kompaniis mier Catarebuli kvlevis Sedegebi da adasturebs am kampaniis
efeqturobas. imeds gamovTqvam, rom es instituti warmatebiT imuSavebs Tqveni
monawileobiT da daxmarebiT.
mindia ugrexeliZe _ didi madloba Cvens momxseneblebs. diskusia
dasrulebulia.