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Going beyond the information given:
Understanding other minds
Rebecca Saxe
BCS
QuickTime™ and aH.263 decompressor
are needed to see this picture.
What do you see?
Watch and then write.
Do the words you used indicate:
- Gender?
- Goals or desires? (e.g. wants, tries)
- Emotions? (e.g. happy, afraid)
- Personality traits? (e.g. bully)
Going beyond the information given
Going beyond the information given
A hand reaching for a bottle
His intention: to drink the liquid
He believes the liquid is poison
He wants to die
Etc.
He believes Juliet is dead
A “biological” motionWhat we see:
What we understand:
For understanding other minds:
(a domain of mostly invisible entities!)
FICTION
False Beliefs
Going beyond the information given
Unobservable Beliefs (& False Beliefs):
- Not much it feels like to be “believing”
e.g. that today is Wednesday
that drought destroys crops
that your grandmother is older than me
that I have a liver
For understanding other minds:
(a domain of mostly invisible entities!)
Going beyond the information given
Unobservable Beliefs (& False Beliefs):
- Not much it feels like to be “believing”
- Especially true for false beliefs:
For understanding other minds:
(a domain of mostly invisible entities!)
So where does the concept of “belief” come from?
Which of your current beliefs are false?
Going beyond the information givenSo where does the concept of “belief” come from?
“Theory of Mind”
DESIRES
ACTIONS
--- The World ---
BELIEFS
What evidence?
- certain kinds of failed prediction
Going beyond the information givenSo where does the concept of “belief” come from?
“Theory of Mind”
Sally
Anne
Where will Sally look for her ball?
3 years old:
“In the box.”
Going beyond the information givenSo where does the concept of “belief” come from?
“Theory of Mind”
Sally
Anne
Where will Sally look for her ball?
5 years old:
“In the basket.”
Going beyond the information givenSo where does the concept of “belief” come from?
“Theory of Mind”
ACTIONS
DESIRES
--- The World ---
BELIEFS
Three year olds:
Perfect copy of real world
Five year olds:
“Representation” of real world
FRAME-WORK Theory
Sally will look for her ball…
Romeo will kill himself…
People vote for Bush…
Going beyond the information givenSo where does the concept of “belief” come from?
“Theory of Mind”
ACTIONS
DESIRES
--- The World ---
BELIEFS
What evidence?
- certain kinds of failed prediction
- “self-explanation”- How people talk
-Talking about past events
- Gossips about absent people
Going beyond the information givenSo where does the concept of “belief” come from?
“Theory of Mind”Adam Gopnik: Of course Luke didn't have to be told whom they were looking at down there, and why; we both could see it plain as day. They were watching the Rookie, pitching his way out of another pinch.
Yet I began to wonder: What picture did he summon up when, night after night, he heard the words Polo Grounds, full count, all the way to the backstop? [...]
He had never been to a baseball game, never seen a bat or a glove, never been inside a ballpark or even watched a ball game on television. [...] No one Luke knew played baseball, no one talked about it; the words and situations were pure language, pure abstract lore. [...]
But now I said "Polo Grounds" or "full count" and the words called up in my son a powerful reaction.
Going beyond the information givenSo where does the concept of “belief” come from?
“Theory of Mind”Deaf children:
- of non-signer vs native-signer parents
Theory of Mind
OR
1. Meta-representation
2. Inhibit reality, respond to belief
3. Falseness Photograph
Camera
Going beyond the information givenSo where does the concept of “belief” come from?
“Theory of Mind”Deaf children:
- of non-signer vs native-signer parents
- NOT delayed on false photograph tasks
Going beyond the information givenSo where does the concept of “belief” come from?
“Theory of Mind”
ACTIONS
DESIRES
--- The World ---
BELIEFS
What evidence?
- certain kinds of failed prediction
- “self-explanation”- How people talk
- A special neural mechanism just for understanding minds?
Going beyond the information givenSo where does the concept of “belief” come from?
“Theory of Mind”Healthy brains:
False Belief storiesSusie parked her sportscar in the driveway. In the middle of the night. Nathan moved her car into the garage to make room for his minivan. Susie woke up early in the morning.
She expects to see in the drivea sportscar a minivan
False Photo storiesA volcano erupted on this Caribbean island three months ago. Barren lava rock is all that remains. Satellite photographs show the island as it was before the eruption. In the photos the island is
covered inrock
vegetation
Going beyond the information givenSo where does the concept of “belief” come from?
“Theory of Mind”Healthy brains:
False Belief stories False Photo stories
In 90% of individual subjects:
-0.8
-0.4
0
0.4
0.8
1.2
-4 0 4 8 12 16 20 24 28
BeliefPhoto
Right temporo-parietal junction
Standard Photograph Map
Control
Autistic
Going beyond the information givenSo where does the concept of “belief” come from?
“Theory of Mind”Autistic children:-> Suggests that “Theory of Mind” is not just about general intelligence
-> A disanalogy from scientific theories?
Going beyond the information givenSo where does the concept of “belief” come from?
“Theory of Mind”
ACTIONS
DESIRES
--- The World ---
BELIEFS
An intuitive Theory?
- control and predict the world
- generate explanations, satisfy need for knowledge
- domain specific?
- special neural mechanism?
Going beyond the information given
ACTIONS
DESIRES
--- The World ---
BELIEFS
An intuitive Theory?
Non-Theory alternative?
Is there any alternative hypothesis?
“Cells that read minds”?
"Mirror neurons allow us to grasp the minds of others not through conceptual reasoning but through direct simulation. By feeling, not by thinking."
An alternative hypothesis:A class of cells in monkey MOTOR cortex:
GraspMotor prep.
Response during OBSERVATION:
… same action specificity!
Intensity
Time
A common code for own and other’s actions...
Hand muscle
Watching someone else’s hand moving
Arm muscle
Arm moving
Muscle response
An alternative hypothesis:
“Feeling” someone else’s feelings...
1. Being touched:
2. A video of someone else being touched
Brain response:
An alternative hypothesis:
“Feeling” someone else’s pain...
Own pain:
Significant other’s pain:
An alternative hypothesis:
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
Let’s take a break
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
Four arguments against:
- A specific thought experiment
- An argument from neuroscience
- An argument from error
- An argument from success
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
What would a mirror
neuron do?
ACTIONTHOUGHTS
Thought experiment:
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
Four arguments against:
- A specific thought experiment
- An argument from neuroscience
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
An argument from neuroscience:
A group of brain regions involved in “Theory of Mind”
Anatomically and functionally distinct from the “Mirror system”
Your friend Louis is getting very high grades in high school. He is taking AP Biology, AP Chemistry, AP Calculus, and AP Biochemistry.
After he graduates Louis wants to study medicine and his ambition is to become a neurosurgeon.
While you are having a drink together, he tells you that he just received a letter informing him that he was accepted to a premed program at a prestigious university.
* Will Louis have positive or negative feelings with regards to his acceptance?
positive / negative
Background
Mental State
Outcome
Feeling Question
(see Terwogt and Rieffe 2003).
A recent experiment:
Your friend Louis is getting very high grades in high school. He is taking AP Biology, AP Chemistry, AP Calculus, and AP Biochemistry.
After he graduates Louis wants to study medicine and his ambition is to become a neurosurgeon.
While you are having a drink together, he tells you that he just received a letter informing him that he was accepted to a premed program at a prestigious university.
* Will Louis have positive or negative feelings with regards to his acceptance?
positive / negative
Background
Mental State
Outcome
Feeling Question
Scan Details
N = 12 naïve native English speaking, American middle class;
3T scanner, whole brain coverage, slices = 4mm, TR =2
+ Localiser
Story details- matched for word length- counterbalanced both whether the character feels positive or negative, and the side of the correct response. - counterbalanced versions of each story
6.3 s
6.3 s
7.4 s
(Saxe & Wexler, 2005).
4 s
A recent experiment:
Delayed:
Immediate:Time
Background:Mental state info
delayed 6 s
-0.4
0
0.4
0.8
1.2
1.6
-4 -2 0 2 4 6 8 10 12 14 16 18 20 22 24 26 28
immediatedelayed
RTPJ response delayed 6 s?In individual
subject RTPJ ROIs (p<0.05
corrected)
P < 0.01, paired-samples t-test
(Saxe & Wexler, 2005).
A recent experiment:
Your friend Louis/Jason is getting very high grades in high school. He is taking AP Biology, AP Chemistry, AP Calculus, and AP Biochemistry.
After he graduates Louis wants to study medicine and his ambition is to become a neurosurgeon.
Your friend Louis/Jason comes from a very rich family. There is an unbroken tradition in his family that the sons don’t work for a living. They live on the inheritance and do whatever they like.
“Normal”
“Familiar”
“Foreign”2 x 2 design:Validated by a survey after the scan
N = 12 naïve native English speaking, American middle class;
3T scanner, whole brain coverage, slices = 4mm, TR =2
A recent experiment:
Your friend Louis/Jason is getting very high grades in high school. He is taking AP Biology, AP Chemistry, AP Calculus, and AP Biochemistry.
After he graduates Louis wants to study medicine and his ambition is to become a neurosurgeon.
Jason never wants to work in his life. He’d much rather live on his parents’ money, and not bother with college or job.
Your friend Louis/Jason comes from a very rich family. There is an unbroken tradition in his family that the sons don’t work for a living. They live on the inheritance and do whatever they like.
Your friend Andrew/Paul, from high school, lives in Philadelphia. He and his wife have always had an excellent relationship. They almost never fight.
Paul once confided in you that he would find it fun if his wife, outside of their marriage, started a relationship with another man.
Andrew once confided in you that he really hates the idea that his wife might have an affair. Monogamy is very important to him.
Your friend Andrew/Paul, from high school, and his wife have become involved with a cult. Within their cult, extramarital relationships are accepted and occur often.
“Unusual”
“Normal”
“Familiar”
“Foreign”2 x 2 design:Validated by a survey after the scan
N = 12 naïve native English speaking, American middle class;
3T scanner, whole brain coverage, slices = 4mm, TR =2
A recent experiment:
Familiar - Normal
Familiar - UnusualForeign- Normal
Foreign-Unusual
Familiar - NormalForeign - Unusual
Familiar - UnusualForeign- Normal
RTPJ recruitment: predictions during Mental State
1. LIKE ME - NOT LIKE ME
Other minds are represented relative to subject’s own mind.
RTPJ response is correlated with how “like me” the other mind is.
2. TRYING TO MAKE SENSE
Other minds are represented as internally coherent wholes.
RTPJ response reflects interaction of background and mental state
A recent experiment:
Mental States: (6 - 12 sec)
-0.2
0
0.2
0.4
0.6
0.8
1
1.2
Familiar Foreign
NormalUnusualBackground (0 - 6
sec):
0
0.2
0.4
0.6
0.8
1
1.2
Background
FamiliarForeign
• During MS, interaction of Background and Mental State, p<0.01
= TRYING TO MAKE SENSE
RTPJ recruitment:
= No sig. effects
Just for Beliefs and Desires
A recent experiment:
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
Four arguments against:
- A specific thought experiment
- An argument from neuroscience
- An argument from error
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
An argument from error:
Adam Gopnik: "Hey, look, that's the Chief" I announced proudly, opening the old baseball encyclopedia at his bedside. He paused, looked at the picture, looked back at me - peering in, for a moment - and then he got a funny, guilty smile on his face that I had never seen there before.
"Oh," he said, peering intently at the picture. "I thought it was his mother."
"What do you mean?" I said, surprised.
"I mean, I knew it was - but I thought it was. I mean I knew it was a man... but I thought he was the mother," he continued, stumbling a little. "I thought it was his mother."
ACTIONS
DESIRES
--- The World ---
BELIEFS
Three year olds:
Perfect copy of real world
Five year olds:
“Representation” of real world
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
An argument from error:
Three year olds:
Perfect copy of real world
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
An argument from error:
The “Appearance - Reality” distinction:
It looks like a rock.
It feels and moves like a sponge.
What will it look like to the next child, when he comes in?
Three year olds:
Perfect copy of real world
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
An argument from error:
The “Appearance - Reality” distinction
Sources of Knowledge
It is the red or green ball?
It is the hard or soft cat?
Which puppet knows whether
One touches:
One looks:
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
An argument from error:
The “Appearance - Reality” distinction
Sources of Knowledge
Three year olds just bad at mirroring?
Theory-based errors in adults?
Milgram: The “teacher” was led into an adjoining room in which an elaborate electrical control panel was placed. Switches on the control panel were labeled with voltage indicators in increasing order from 15-450 volts. Several switches were also labeled as "Extreme-Intensity Shock," "Danger - severe shock," and the highest voltage switch was labeled "XXX."
The “teacher” was instructed to read a pre-selected, randomly ordered list of word pairs to test the pupil's ability to correctly match words. Whenever the pupil answered incorrectly, the teacher was instructed to throw one of the switches, starting at the lowest voltage and progressing to the higher voltages. About midway through the series of switches, the "pupil" would complain loudly that he wanted to stop, kick the wall, and scream. At the highest levels of shock the pupil would remain silent.
An alternative hypothesis:
Theory-based errors in adults?
Milgram: 15-450 volts.
How high would you go?
How many people would go to the highest level?
Predictions: only criminals and psychopaths go over 115 volts
Reality: 65% of subjects go to 450 volts
An alternative hypothesis:
Theory-based errors in adults?
What proportion of the household errands do you do?
What proportion will your partner or roommate claim that he/she does?
An alternative hypothesis:
Theory-based errors in adults?
0
50
100
% Positive % Negative
What people think
What their partnersexpect them to think
Real minds: Salience
Theory of Mind: Self-serving bias
An alternative hypothesis:
Theory-based errors in adults
Are we all just “bad” mirrors?
Inaccuracy vs Bias
Example from intuitive physics:
Impetus Theory of Motion
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
Four arguments against:
- A specific thought experiment
- An argument from neuroscience
- An argument from error
- An argument from success
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
Argument from success:
Understanding states that one has never experienced: Kelli
When Kelli was 3.5 years old:
Show me the back of your pants.
An alternative hypothesis:Do we use “mirror neurones,” instead of an intuitive theory, to understand other minds?
Argument from success:
Understanding states that one has never experienced: Kelli
When Kelli was 4.5 years old:
Can you hide the car, so Mommy won’t see it?
A congenitally blind adult defines “to notice”:
To see something that comes into your view. But not only to see it, but to perceive it and understand it. You could sit on this rocking chair and not notice the colour of it at all
Going beyond the information given
ACTIONS
DESIRES
--- The World ---
BELIEFS
An intuitive Theory?
Non-Theory alternative?
Arguments against feeling instead of thinking:
• Specific counterexample
• Neuroscience
• Error
• Success
Going beyond the information givenTopics to think about:
- Can neuroscientific evidence help us evaluate cognitive theories?
- Will the “Theory of Mind” brain regions be recruited when blind people reason about other people’s visual perception?
-What is the mechanism of Theory change?
- Is there a real change of Theory around 4 years? Note: Adults have similar problems in more complex situations - “the curse of knowledge”.
- Do pre-verbal infants have theories?
Going beyond the information given
One final thought:
“I know you think you understand what you thought I said, but I don’t think you realise that what you
heard was not what I meant.”~ Daniel Greenspan