case 5:11-cv-00360-olg-jes-xr document 597-13 filed 02/02 ... · court reporter: scott l. wallace,...

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UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURTFOR THE DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA

STATE OF TEXAS,

Plaintiff,

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UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, etal., Defendants.

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Docket No. CA 11-1303

Washington, D.C.January 25, 2012

AFTERNOON SESSION - DAY 7 TRANSCRIPT OF MOTION HEARING PROCEEDINGS BEFORE THE HONORABLES ROSEMARY M. COLLYER and

BERYL A. HOWELL, UNITED STATES DISTRICT JUDGES

APPEARANCES:

For the Plaintiff: MATHEW H. FREDRICK, Special CounselSTACEY NAPIER, Senior Counsel to theAttorney GeneralJ. REED CLAY, Senior Counsel to theAttorney GeneralANGELA V. COLMENERO, AssistantAttorney GeneralOffice of the Attorney General ofTexasP.O. Box 12548Austin, TX 78711-2548

ADAM K. MORTARA, Esq.ASHLEY C. KELLER, Esq.JOHN M. HUGES, Esq.Bartlit, beck, Herman, Palenchar &Scott, LLPCourthouse Place54 West Hubbard StreetChicago, IL 60610

Case 5:11-cv-00360-OLG-JES-XR Document 597-13 Filed 02/02/12 Page 1 of 130

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2APPEARANCES: Cont.

For the Defendants: TIMOTHY F. MELLETT, Trial AttorneyBRYAN L. SELLS, Trial AttorneyOLIMPIA E. MICHEL, Trial AttorneyDANIEL J. Freeman, Trial AttorneyU.S. Department of Justice950 Pennsylvania Avenue, NWWashington, DC 20530

For the Intervenor JOSEPH GERALD HEBERT, EsquireDefendants: J. Gerald Hebert, P.C.

191 Somervelle street,Suite 405Alexandria, VA 22304

JOHN M. DEVANEY, EsquirePerkins Coie700 13th Street, NW, Suite 600Washington, DC 2005-3960

JOHN K. TANNER, Esquire3743 Military Road, NWWashington, DC 20015

NINA PERALES, EsquireMexican American Legal Defense & Educational Fund, Inc.1100 Broadway, Suite 300San Antonio, TX 78205

ALLISON J. RIGGS, EsquireSouthern Coalition for Social Justice1415 West Highway 54, Suite 101Durham, NC 27707

JOSE GARZA, Esquire7414 Robin Rest DriveSan Antonio, TX 98209

Court Reporter: SCOTT L. WALLACE, RDR, CRROfficial Court ReporterRoom 6503, U.S. CourthouseWashington, D.C. [email protected]

Proceedings reported by machine shorthand, transcript produced by computer-aided transcription.


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AFTERNOON SESSION, JANUARY 25, 20121(1:43 p.m.)2

THE COURTROOM CLERK: Be seated, please, and come to 01:43PM 3order. 01:43PM 4

JUDGE COLLYER: All right. I want you to know that I'm 01:43PM 5starting my fourth pad. 01:43PM 6

What's happening next, Ms. Perales? 01:43PM 7MS. PERALES: Your Honor, the Latino Task Force defendant 01:43PM 8

intervenors will present Dr. Engstrom for a ten-minute direct. 01:43PM 9JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you. 01:43PM 10Dr. Engstrom. 01:43PM 11

(DR. RICHARD ENGSTROM, DEFENDANTS' WITNESS IN THE CASE, 01:43PM 12SWORN) 01:43PM 13

MS. PERALES: Your Honor, I have a demonstrative exhibit, 01:43PM 14which we have shared with the other parties, and having received 01:43PM 15no objection, we are going to distribute to the Court Defendant's 01:44PM 16Exhibit 799. 01:44PM 17

JUDGE COLLYER: All right. You can give it to Ms. White. 01:44PM 18Thanks. 01:44PM 19MS. PERALES: It is Defendant's 799. And it is rather 01:44PM 20

large and, although knowing that laminating things in this case 01:44PM 21can sometimes lead to disastrous results, we did laminate it for 01:44PM 22the Court's use, and we'll take our chances. 01:44PM 23

01:43PM 2401:43PM 25


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DIRECT EXAMINATION OF DR. RICHARD ENGSTROM01:43PM 1BY MS. PERALES:01:43PM 2

Good afternoon, Dr. Engstrom. 01:45PM 3 Q.

Good afternoon. 01:45PM 4 A.

Please state your name for the record. 01:45PM 5 Q.

Richard L. Engstrom. And the surname is spelled 01:45PM 6 A.

E-N-G-S-T-R-O-M, as in mother. 01:45PM 7MS. PERALES: For the record, Dr. Engstrom's reports, 01:45PM 8

which are also his prefiled direct, are Exhibits 725, 726 -- 01:45PM 9these are Defense Exhibits -- and 747. Dr. Engstrom's CV is 01:45PM 10Defense Exhibit 727. There is also some redundant material that 01:45PM 11we filed that is Defense 728, but we are not asking the Court to 01:45PM 12review that because the findings are already encompassed in 725, 01:45PM 13726 and 747. 01:45PM 14BY MS. PERALES:01:45PM 15

Dr. Engstrom, could you please give the Court a short 01:45PM 16 Q.

summary of your academic work since receiving your Ph.D. 01:46PM 17JUDGE COLLYER: Please don't. Forgive me. We really 01:46PM 18

thank you. We don't need to take your precious ten minutes. We 01:46PM 19understand, sir. 01:46PM 20

There is no contest to his expertise. You can go ahead. 01:46PM 21MS. PERALES: May I establish the background of his work 01:46PM 22

in Section 5 matters, Your Honor? 01:46PM 23JUDGE COLLYER: Yes, but quickly. 01:46PM 24

BY MS. PERALES:01:46PM 25


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Quickly, Dr. Engstrom, if you can give a quick summary of 01:46PM 1 Q.

your recent experience in Section 5 matters. 01:46PM 2Recent experiences, sure. I prepared a report on 01:46PM 3 A.

racially polarized voting and retrogression for the South 01:46PM 4Carolina State Senate, which was included in a Section 5 01:46PM 5submission this year. They received preclearance. 01:46PM 6

I also, a few years ago, did a report opposing an 01:46PM 7election system change in Fayetteville, North Carolina. That 01:46PM 8went in as an opposition to a change, and that change -- again, 01:47PM 9administrative preclearance -- that change was denied or refused 01:47PM 10preclearance. Excuse me. 01:47PM 11

And I worked earlier this year, I worked with Loui- 0-- 01:47PM 12excuse me -- the Mississippi State Senate and House on its 01:47PM 13Section 5 issues as an advisor. No plan was adopted in that 01:47PM 14process, so there was never any Section 5 submission, 01:47PM 15administrative or judicial.01:47PM 16

But the previous decade, I also worked for Mississippi 01:47PM 17and I prepared reports for their House and Senate, and I'm happy 01:47PM 18to report that it was -- I believe it was the first time either 01:47PM 19chamber in Mississippi received preclearance on their first 01:47PM 20effort. 01:47PM 21

Thank you, Dr. Engstrom. 01:47PM 22 Q.

Did you look at racially polarized voting in this case? 01:47PM 23I did. 01:47PM 24 A.

And can you briefly summarize your findings. 01:47PM 25 Q.


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Yes. I found racially polarized voting, looking at 01:47PM 1 A.

general elections, democratic primaries and republican 01:48PM 2primaries, in eight settings across the State of Texas. Those 01:48PM 3were seven large counties and a 52-county area of South Texas. 01:48PM 4

And what did you find? 01:48PM 5 Q.

That voting in all eight areas was racially polarized. 01:48PM 6 A.

JUDGE COLLYER: Did you say "52 counties"? 01:48PM 7THE WITNESS: I believe it's 52 counties. They were 01:48PM 8

analyzed as South Texas, not 52 counties individually, but as a 01:48PM 9group in South Texas. 01:48PM 10BY MS. PERALES:01:48PM 11

And did you also look at some urban counties as well that 01:48PM 12 Q.

were not in South Texas? 01:48PM 13Oh, yes. I looked at Dallas, El Paso, Bexar, Tarrant, 01:48PM 14 A.

Travis, Nueces, Harris. If that's seven, then I've said all of 01:48PM 15them. 01:48PM 16

Thank you, Dr. Engstrom. 01:48PM 17 Q.

I'd like to cover your conclusions now with respect to 01:48PM 18your analysis of possible retrogression in the state House map. 01:48PM 19Can you share your findings with us? 01:49PM 20

Yes. I believe there are 33 ability-to-elect districts 01:49PM 21 A.

in the benchmark plan, and I think there are only 31 in the 01:49PM 22adopted plan. 01:49PM 23

And can you explain which districts you believe are no 01:49PM 24 Q.

longer ability-to-elect districts? 01:49PM 25


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House District 33 and House District 117. 01:49PM 1 A.

All right. And did you find any offset to this loss of 01:49PM 2 Q.

ability elsewhere in the plan? 01:49PM 3No.01:49PM 4 A.

Now, moving on now to the approach that Dr. Alford took 01:49PM 5 Q.

in this case, can you explain briefly your conclusions on the 01:49PM 6methodology used by Dr. Alford? 01:49PM 7

Well, I think Dr. Alford's methodology is flawed for two 01:49PM 8 A.

essential reasons. One is that he -- in evaluating the 01:49PM 9benchmark plan, he totally ignores all of the elections to the 01:49PM 10state legislative seats associated with the districts in the 01:49PM 11benchmark plan. So there's no analysis of what happened in what 01:50PM 12we call endogenous elections. Those are, as a general matter, 01:50PM 13the most probative elections to talk about an ability to elect 01:50PM 14to a state legislative seat. 01:50PM 15

On the -- and then also -- I would say also, the other 01:50PM 16part of the analysis, the use of the endogenous -- excuse me -- 01:50PM 17exogenous elections, but the other elections. Dr. Alford 01:50PM 18looked -- he doesn't look at whether districts are 01:50PM 19ability-to-elect, but rather, in effect, how many elections you 01:50PM 20can project would be elected, based on the exogenous elections. 01:50PM 21So it's not using exogenous elections to identify ability to 01:50PM 22elect, but rather to go further, and that is to say -- answer a 01:50PM 23different question, I should say. And that is: How many 01:50PM 24elections are likely to be elected, based on the results of the 01:51PM 25


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exogenous elections? I think that is pushing exogenous election 01:51PM 1evidence further than is appropriate. 01:51PM 2

Dr. Alford, in your -- Dr. Engstrom. I did that in the 01:51PM 3 Q.

last trial true, too. 01:51PM 4Dr. Engstrom, in your Section 5 work, what has your 01:51PM 5

method been to evaluate possible retrogression in a 01:51PM 6redistricting plan? 01:51PM 7

You compare the districts within the benchmark plan, you 01:51PM 8 A.

count up the number that are ability-to-elect, and then you do 01:51PM 9the same, in effect, for the other districts. Now, I look at 01:51PM 10them specifically district to district within the benchmark and 01:51PM 11the adopted. But -- and so, I identify the adopted districts; 01:51PM 12then I look at exogenous elections in the -- excuse me -- in the 01:51PM 13benchmark districts when they elect a white candidate. It is 01:52PM 14their choice -- a white candidate of their choice. 01:52PM 15

I do that to convince myself that they do have the 01:52PM 16ability to elect a Latino candidate of their choice as well, and 01:52PM 17that is evidenced through the exogenous elections. And then I 01:52PM 18compare that ability with exogenous elections to see if there is 01:52PM 19retrogression from district to district in the adopted plan. 01:52PM 20

And just to conclude, your analysis is one that looks at 01:52PM 21 Q.

districts discretely in evaluating ability to elect? 01:52PM 22Yes. 01:52PM 23 A.

MS. PERALES: Thank you. I pass the witness. 01:52PM 24JUDGE COLLYER: That was exactly ten minutes. 01:52PM 25


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MS. PERALES: Thank you, Your Honor. 01:52PM 1JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you. 01:52PM 2

CROSS-EXAMINATION OF DR. RICHARD ENGSTROM01:52PM 3BY MR. HUGHES:01:52PM 4

Good afternoon, Dr. Engstrom. 01:53PM 5 Q.


My name is John Hughes. If you'll bear with me one 01:53PM 7 Q.

moment, I need to hook up my computer. 01:53PM 8You said "Hughes"? 01:53PM 9 A.

Yes. John Hughes. Nice to meet you. 01:53PM 10 Q.

You, too. 01:53PM 11 A.

JUDGE COLLYER: You can call him Hodge if you want. 01:53PM 12BY MR. HUGHES:01:53PM 13

Yes. I have two names, Dr. Engstrom. 01:53PM 14 Q.

I think it may have taken me longer to set up than I have 01:54PM 15questions for you, Dr. Engstrom. But I've put on the screen I 01:54PM 16guess what we marked Plaintiff's Exhibit 187, but this is also 01:54PM 17Defense Exhibit 799, which is the laminated chart that you 01:54PM 18provided to us. 01:54PM 19

Do you see that on the screen? 01:54PM 20Yes, I do. 01:54PM 21 A.

And what you have -- I just want to review very briefly 01:54PM 22 Q.

with you -- 01:54PM 23There's a crosshair in the middle that's not part of the 01:54PM 24 A.

chart. That's your computer. 01:54PM 25


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That's my cursor, Dr. Engstrom. 01:54PM 1 Q.

What I would like to review with you very briefly, just 01:54PM 2what you have on the chart, which is this column here 01:54PM 3(indicating). It says "GE win-loss." 01:54PM 4

What does that column refer to? 01:55PM 5The exogenous general elections in which the Latino 01:55PM 6 A.

candidate of choice won a majority of the votes. 01:55PM 7So that's exogenous -- that's reconstituted election 01:55PM 8 Q.

analysis in the benchmark districts, right? 01:55PM 9Right. 01:55PM 10 A.

Okay. For general election, right? 01:55PM 11 Q.

Correct. 01:55PM 12 A.

And then over here (indicating), you have a similar 01:55PM 13 Q.

column for the enacted plan, which is, again, reconstituted 01:55PM 14election analysis, based on exogenous elections for the enacted 01:55PM 15or adopted plan, right? 01:55PM 16

That's correct. 01:55PM 17 A.

And that's what your -- the only thing that you have as a 01:55PM 18 Q.

point of comparison in the enacted or adopted plan to compare to 01:55PM 19the benchmark is the reconstituted exogenous election analysis, 01:55PM 20right? 01:55PM 21

Well, there are other things to compare. You have HVAP, 01:55PM 22 A.

CVAP, SSVR, the incumbent's name. But this does have the 01:56PM 23exogenous elections, although my text does entail who was 01:56PM 24elected in these districts in the endogenous elections and 01:56PM 25


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whether they were candidates of choice. 01:56PM 1But just to be clear, the endogenous piece of the 01:56PM 2 Q.

analysis is limited to what happened in the benchmark plan, 01:56PM 3because you can't run reconstituted election analysis for an 01:56PM 4endogenous election in an enacted plan, right? 01:56PM 5

I hope I didn't misspeak. I was saying what -- I include 01:56PM 6 A.

what happens in the endogenous elections in determining ability 01:56PM 7to elect. 01:56PM 8

For the benchmark? 01:56PM 9 Q.

For the benchmark. 01:56PM 10 A.

And in the enacted plan, setting aside demographic data, 01:56PM 11 Q.

the functional election analysis that you look at is exogenous 01:56PM 12reconstituted elections, right? 01:56PM 13

Right. There are no endogenous elections in these 01:56PM 14 A.

districts at this point in time. 01:56PM 15That's what I wanted to establish. And the number of 01:56PM 16 Q.

elections that you looked at in the general -- for the general 01:57PM 17election, which is your functional election point of comparison, 01:57PM 18were seven elections, right? 01:57PM 19

Correct. Over the last three election years. 01:57PM 20 A.

Okay. 01:57PM 21 Q.

Election years, not calendar years. The last three 01:57PM 22 A.

elections in which state legislative seats were up. 01:57PM 23So you looked at the '06, '08 and 2010 election cycles, 01:57PM 24 Q.

picked seven elections out of those, and those were what you 01:57PM 25


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used to determine whether, in terms of functional election 01:57PM 1analysis, a district was, in your words, a performing or ability 01:57PM 2district in the enacted plan, right? 01:57PM 3

Well, the seven that you say I picked are all seven that 01:57PM 4 A.

were on the ballot involving a choice between Latino and 01:57PM 5non-Latino candidate or candidates. 01:57PM 6

So it wasn't I just picked seven. I mean, they were all 01:57PM 7of them, with the exception of, I believe, one, maybe a 01:57PM 8democratic primary for governor or something, where there were 01:58PM 9two Latino candidates that each of them received less than 01:58PM 10four percent of the votes.01:58PM 11

But I just -- I think we're agreeing. What you used for 01:58PM 12 Q.

general elections to examine whether, in terms of election 01:58PM 13performance, a district was performing or not, in your parlance, 01:58PM 14in the enacted plan were these seven elections, and if it was 01:58PM 15four or more, it would be performing and three or less would be 01:58PM 16not performing; is that right? 01:58PM 17

Okay. But that's not the classification of whether 01:58PM 18 A.

endogenous elections are -- what an endogenous election shows. 01:58PM 19For these districts, I do examine who won the elections, all 01:58PM 20right, so you're excluding -- when you say exogenous for that 01:58PM 21purpose, no, I do endogenous as well. 01:58PM 22

Let me explain the exogenous. As I said, if it's a white 01:58PM 23candidate that is elected, then I look at the exogenous 01:59PM 24elections to convince myself that they do have the ability to 01:59PM 25


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elect within that district, based on what we see in the 01:59PM 1exogenous elections. And that's because I do believe that the 01:59PM 2opportunity -- the ability has to include the ability to elect 01:59PM 3from within your own group if that is your preference. 01:59PM 4

And I think what you're now talking about is whether or 01:59PM 5 Q.

not a district is an ability-to-elect district in the benchmark 01:59PM 6plan, right? 01:59PM 7


And what I'm asking you is: What you used for functional 01:59PM 9 Q.

election analysis to determine whether a district was an 01:59PM 10ability-to-elect district in the enacted plan was the 01:59PM 11reconstituted exogenous election analysis, right? 01:59PM 12

Well, I see -- whether it retrogressed from the benchmark 01:59PM 13 A.

plan. In other words, I have exogenous elections. I can look 01:59PM 14at the exogenous elections in the benchmark and the other and 02:00PM 15adopt it to compare them, to see if the ability to elect that I 02:00PM 16have identified has been impaired by the new district.02:00PM 17

And what you're looking at in the new district, again, is 02:00PM 18 Q.

the exogenous data, right? 02:00PM 19Comparing it to exogenous data in the other for purposes 02:00PM 20 A.

of seeing retrogression. 02:00PM 21Right. And that's the -- 02:00PM 22 Q.

And I conclude that there are 31 in that sense. 02:00PM 23 A.

And just for the record, the two that you believe 02:00PM 24 Q.

retrogressed were 33 and 117, correct? 02:00PM 25


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But you do not believe that 35 retrogressed, do you? 02:00PM 2 Q.

No. Actually, it was a little improved. 02:00PM 3 A.

Okay. And you do not believe that 41 retrogressed, do 02:00PM 4 Q.

you? 02:00PM 541? 02:00PM 6 A.

Yes, sir. You show four to three here -- 02:01PM 7 Q.

I don't think it took it out of the ability-to-elect 02:01PM 8 A.

category. 02:01PM 9Okay. And one last question. In your exogenous 02:01PM 10 Q.

elections that you used, did you use some where the Latino 02:01PM 11candidate -- where there was a Latino republican against an 02:01PM 12Anglo democrat? 02:01PM 13

In the racially polarized voting analysis, yes, but not 02:01PM 14 A.

in this, because the racially polarized voting analyses say they 02:01PM 15wouldn't be candidates of choice in general elections. 02:01PM 16

MR. HUGHES: Thank you, Dr. Engstrom. Pass the witness. 02:01PM 17JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you. Anything further? 02:01PM 18MR. SELLS: Yes, Your Honor. I have some questions. 02:01PM 19JUDGE COLLYER: All right. Be quick. 02:01PM 20MR. SELLS: Bryan Sells on behalf of the United States. 02:01PM 21

CROSS-EXAMINATION OF DR. RICHARD ENGSTROM02:02PM 22BY MR. SELLS: 02:02PM 23

Good afternoon, Dr. Engstrom. How are you?02:02PM 24 Q.

Good afternoon, Mr. Sells. 02:02PM 25 A.


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Just a few questions for you. I want to clarify for the 02:02PM 1 Q.

record some of the data you used in your analysis. 02:02PM 2You did two kinds of analyses, multivariate and bivariate 02:02PM 3

analyses, correct? 02:02PM 4In the racially polarized voting analysis, that is 02:02PM 5 A.

correct. 02:02PM 6And you used citizen voting age population data for your 02:02PM 7 Q.

multivariate analysis, correct? 02:02PM 8Correct.02:02PM 9 A.

And you got that at the VTD level from the Texas 02:02PM 10 Q.

Legislative Council, right? 02:02PM 11I believe that was the source. 02:02PM 12 A.

Okay. And now for your bivariate analyses, you used 02:02PM 13 Q.

Spanish surname turnout data, correct? 02:02PM 14For the 2010 elections. 02:02PM 15 A.

Okay. But you did use Spanish surname turnout data? 02:02PM 16 Q.

For the 2010 elections, because we were able to get that 02:02PM 17 A.

data. It was difficult, took extra efforts, but yes, we 02:02PM 18acquired that data, put it in usable form, and I relied on it. 02:02PM 19

Where did you get that data? 02:02PM 20 Q.

From the Secretary of State's office, I believe. 02:03PM 21 A.

Did you place a request to the Secretary of State? 02:03PM 22 Q.

Well, the people I -- the party did. I mean, yes, I 02:03PM 23 A.

asked for it. I pushed for it, and they made numerous requests, 02:03PM 24as I recall, and finally, we were able to get it in a form that 02:03PM 25


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we could then convert it into precincts. 02:03PM 1So the Secretary of State keeps data on Spanish surname 02:03PM 2 Q.

turnout in the Secretary of State's files, correct? 02:03PM 3Well, I believe the records are for the current list of 02:03PM 4 A.

registered voters, but I was looking at a 2010 election, 02:03PM 5November 2010. By the time we got it, it wasn't very old, so I 02:03PM 6deemed it reliable to look at a November 2010 election. 02:03PM 7

Are you familiar with Geographic Information Systems, 02:03PM 8 Q.

also known as GIS systems? 02:03PM 9Well, I'm familiar with them. I don't consider myself an 02:04PM 10 A.

expert on GIS per se. 02:04PM 11Have you used Maptitude in the past? 02:04PM 12 Q.

Oh, yes. 02:04PM 13 A.

And that is a GIS system software, correct? 02:04PM 14 Q.

It taps into GIS information, yes. 02:04PM 15 A.

Do you know if Spanish surname turnout data, such as the 02:04PM 16 Q.

SSTO data you got from the Secretary of State, could be imported 02:04PM 17into a GIS system like Maptitude? 02:04PM 18

I would think so. I have to say that, basically, I've 02:04PM 19 A.

retired from drawing plans. I mean, I can do it, I will do it, 02:04PM 20but I think they could have it done with much less expense than 02:04PM 21hiring me to do it, frankly. And so I basically don't do it, 02:04PM 22but I've used Maptitude in the past. I drew plans after the 02:04PM 232000 census. And certainly in Maptitude at that time, and I 02:04PM 24would assume today, you can input that data into the VTD data 02:04PM 25


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and move it in and out of districts and things like that. Sure, 02:04PM 1that's standard software. 02:05PM 2

JUDGE HOWELL: Can I just make sure I understand. So this 02:05PM 3SSVR turnout data that was obtained from the Secretary of State 02:05PM 4office, was that on a precinct-by-precinct basis or a VTD basis? 02:05PM 5

THE WITNESS: I believe it was a precinct-by-precinct, 02:05PM 6which is essentially VTD basis. VTDs are called Vote Tabulation 02:05PM 7Districts. They're part of the census, and they're the census 02:05PM 8replication of a voting precinct. Now, it may not be -- 02:05PM 9

JUDGE HOWELL: I understand that. 02:05PM 10THE WITNESS: Okay. 02:05PM 11JUDGE HOWELL: Sorry. I misspoke. So it wasn't the 02:05PM 12

precinct basis? 02:05PM 13It wasn't the precinct basis? 02:05PM 14THE WITNESS: Yes. 02:05PM 15JUDGE HOWELL: Okay. 02:05PM 16THE WITNESS: We got information -- we got that 02:05PM 17

registration list and it identified who had voted in which 02:05PM 18precincts, whether they had voted, whether -- and I believe 02:05PM 19even -- well, whether they had voted in previous -- the previous 02:05PM 20election. So it was flagged on there. And that identified 02:06PM 21Latino surnames -- Spanish surnames as well. 02:06PM 22BY MR. SELLS:02:06PM 23

And your bivariate analyses that used SSTO would match 02:06PM 24 Q.

that up with election returns to run your EI analysis? 02:06PM 25


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Yes, it did. 02:06PM 1 A.

But going back to Maptitude, once one imports SSTO data 02:06PM 2 Q.

into Maptitude, can one then shade for turnout within the GIS 02:06PM 3system? 02:06PM 4

Shade thematically. 02:06PM 5 A.

Thematically. 02:06PM 6 Q.

Colors or things, like for categories of turnout 02:06PM 7 A.

percentage, things like that? 02:06PM 8Correct. 02:06PM 9 Q.

Yes.02:06PM 10 A.

So you could see visually on a map a high Spanish surname 02:06PM 11 Q.

turnout precinct might be a dark color and a low Spanish surname 02:06PM 12turnout precinct could be a light color? 02:06PM 13

Yes. 02:06PM 14 A.

Okay. Turning to Ms. Perales' nice chart, I see at the 02:06PM 15 Q.

bottom that you used the Red 206 report -- 02:06PM 16JUDGE COLLYER: Which is Defendants' 799. 02:07PM 17MR. SELLS: Thank you, Your Honor. Defendants' 799.02:07PM 18

BY MR. SELLS: 02:07PM 19You used the Red 206 report to determine who won or lost 02:07PM 20 Q.

in the seven elections that you analyzed; do I understand that 02:07PM 21correctly? 02:07PM 22

Almost. It's to determine whether a candidate got a 02:07PM 23 A.

majority of the votes, so you could win with a plurality in 02:07PM 24Texas, both the primary and the general election. 02:07PM 25


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Okay. 02:07PM 1 Q.

And some of the primaries may have multiple candidates in 02:07PM 2 A.

them. 02:07PM 3Now, for the proposed plan, you also relied on the Red 02:07PM 4 Q.

206 reports from the Texas Legislative Council, correct? 02:07PM 5Correct.02:07PM 6 A.

Do you know how the Texas Legislative Council accounts 02:07PM 7 Q.

for precinct splits when it prepares the Red 206 report? 02:07PM 8I thought it was based on proportionality, the size of 02:07PM 9 A.

the splits, and then allocating votes in a proportional way. 02:08PM 10Have you undertaken any analysis to determine whether the 02:08PM 11 Q.

split precincts in the proposed plan affect the results that are 02:08PM 12reported in Red 206? 02:08PM 13

Whether the -- 02:08PM 14 A.

Whether the precinct splits in the proposed plan affect 02:08PM 15 Q.

the election results that are reported on Red 206. 02:08PM 16JUDGE COLLYER: The question really is, sir, if you move 02:08PM 17

the district around and you break up a precinct, knowing that the 02:08PM 18majority of your Hispanic population is going to end over here 02:08PM 19and the majority of your Anglo population is going to end over 02:08PM 20there, and then you later divide it up as if it were 50/50, 02:08PM 21you're getting a false response. 02:08PM 22

THE WITNESS: You will get some errors. 02:08PM 23JUDGE COLLYER: Did you know that? Or did you correct for 02:08PM 24

it? 02:08PM 25


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THE WITNESS: Well, no. Every expert I know of working in 02:08PM 1this case doing retrogression is using the same source, including 02:09PM 2the Department of Justice's expert. 02:09PM 3

JUDGE COLLYER: Are they using the TLC? 02:09PM 4THE WITNESS: Sorry? 02:09PM 5JUDGE COLLYER: Are they using the Red reports or whatever 02:09PM 6

they're called. 02:09PM 7THE WITNESS: To my knowledge, yes. 02:09PM 8JUDGE COLLYER: Without that adjustment? 02:09PM 9THE WITNESS: Yes. 02:09PM 10JUDGE COLLYER: Without -- 02:09PM 11THE WITNESS: Yes, to my knowledge. I think everybody is 02:09PM 12

relying on what the Legislative Research Council provided. 02:09PM 13BY MR. SELLS:02:09PM 14

And certainly, Dr. Engstrom, you took that data at face 02:09PM 15 Q.

value, correct? 02:09PM 16Well, that's the reaggregated data we have to work with. 02:09PM 17 A.

Okay. Shifting topics now, back to your multivariate 02:09PM 18 Q.

analysis, did your multivariate analysis based on citizen voting 02:09PM 19age population data include Asian citizens? 02:09PM 20

Well, yes, because we're dealing with Hispanic citizen 02:09PM 21 A.

voting age and total voting age, so Asian citizens would be 02:09PM 22included in the total voting age. 02:09PM 23

Okay. But your multivariate analyses don't analyze Asian 02:09PM 24 Q.

citizens separately, do they? 02:10PM 25


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That's because there's insufficient presence of Asians in 02:10PM 1 A.

these areas to really do cross-level inference; by that, I mean 02:10PM 2going from precincts to estimates of the distribution of votes 02:10PM 3across candidates by group. You can do it for Latinos, you can 02:10PM 4do it fairly well for African-Americans, but not, to my 02:10PM 5knowledge, for Asians. It would be inappropriate, I believe, to 02:10PM 6try to pretend like you could get estimates, reliable estimates 02:10PM 7of Asian-American voting behavior at the precinct level. 02:10PM 8

And so, if one looked at your prefiled direct testimony 02:10PM 9 Q.

and your multivariate analyses, the Asian citizens are lumped in 02:10PM 10that other group in your analyses, correct? 02:10PM 11

Correct. And I identify how much of the other group is 02:10PM 12 A.

Anglo in my report. 02:10PM 13So, your multivariate EI analysis doesn't allow you to 02:10PM 14 Q.

make any conclusion with regard to Asian voters, and 02:11PM 15specifically Asian voters in Districts 137 or 149, does it? 02:11PM 16

That would be -- well, I didn't -- 137 and 149? 02:11PM 17 A.

Correct. 02:11PM 18 Q.

I -- in the areas I analyzed -- I mean, they were large 02:11PM 19 A.

counties in the 52 counties in South Texas. I don't -- I mean, 02:11PM 20there's very little Asian population percentage-wise in those 02:11PM 21areas, and so I don't believe it's reliable data for estimating 02:11PM 22Asian-American voting behavior. 02:11PM 23

So you haven't examined whether there's enough variation 02:11PM 24 Q.

in Harris County specifically, have you? 02:11PM 25


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Have I looked at it specifically? 02:11PM 1 A.

Correct. 02:11PM 2 Q.

Well, I don't remember the number. I do remember the 02:11PM 3 A.

Hispanic percentage, I believe. I mean, I don't remember it. I 02:12PM 4saw it. I'm sorry. 02:12PM 5

I'm just trying to determine whether you have 02:12PM 6 Q.

specifically looked at Harris County or even the areas covered 02:12PM 7by Districts 137 or 149 to determine whether it was possible, 02:12PM 8using citizen voting age population, to get reliable estimates 02:12PM 9for Asian voters. You haven't done that analysis, have you? 02:12PM 10

I haven't -- I haven't attempted to get those estimates. 02:12PM 11 A.

I'm very convinced that the methodology I used would have very 02:12PM 12large confidence intervals around those estimates. 02:12PM 13

Okay. I want to make sure I understand the scope of your 02:12PM 14 Q.

analysis, and I think that's where you were just leading. 02:12PM 15Do I understand correctly that the scope of your analysis 02:12PM 16

was county-wide in the seven counties that you mentioned and 02:12PM 17region-wide in the South Texas region that you mentioned? 02:12PM 18

Right. There are eight areas for which I did racially 02:12PM 19 A.

polarized voting analyses. These are the areas that involve all 02:13PM 20of the House districts with the ability to elect for Latino 02:13PM 21voters. So, I didn't go out into areas where there are very few 02:13PM 22Latinos, but these cover most of the Latino electorate in the 02:13PM 23State of Texas, and I did each of those areas, yes, the seven 02:13PM 24counties and the South Texas area. 02:13PM 25


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But you didn't run any analyses specifically within 02:13PM 1 Q.

Districts 137 or 149 and limit it to either of those two 02:13PM 2districts, did you? 02:13PM 3


And so you don't know whether, for example, 02:13PM 5 Q.

Representative Scott Hochberg was the preferred candidate of 02:13PM 6choice of Hispanic voters in House District 137, do you? 02:13PM 7

No, I don't believe I do. 02:14PM 8 A.

And you also don't know whether Representative Hubert Vo 02:14PM 9 Q.

was the preferred candidate of choice of Hispanic voters in 02:14PM 10House District 149, do you? 02:14PM 11

I do not know that. 02:14PM 12 A.

MR. SELLS: Those are all my questions. 02:14PM 13JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you very much. 02:14PM 14Is there any other question for this witness? 02:14PM 15MR. HEBERT: No, Your Honor. 02:14PM 16JUDGE COLLYER: All right. Thank you very much. Thank 02:14PM 17

you, Doctor. It's nice of to you come. 02:14PM 18MR. FREEMAN: Your Honors, Dan Freeman on behalf of the 02:15PM 19

United States. 02:15PM 20The United States would next like to call Representative 02:15PM 21

Scott Hochberg. 02:15PM 22Representative Hochberg's direct testimony was prefiled on 02:15PM 23

the first day of trial. However, in order to clarify the record, 02:15PM 24I would just like to note that the five screen shots that were 02:15PM 25


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included with his testimony in the prefiling last week were, 02:15PM 1unfortunately, filed in the reverse order. Therefore, the page 02:15PM 2that is Document 161-2, page 29 is actually screen capture 1, 02:15PM 3page 28 is screen capture 2, et cetera. 02:15PM 4

JUDGE COLLYER: We know exactly what "backwards" means. 02:15PM 5Thank you. 02:15PM 6

MR. HUGHES: Just trying to clarify the record, Your 02:15PM 7Honor. 02:15PM 8

JUDGE COLLYER: Representative, if you could come over 02:15PM 9here, please, sir. 02:15PM 10(REPRESENTATIVE SCOTT HOCHBERG, DEFENDANTS' WITNESS IN THE 02:15PM 11

CASE, SWORN) 02:15PM 12MR. HUGHES: Mr. Mortara decided I had to do everything 02:16PM 13

today. 02:16PM 14JUDGE COLLYER: I can't imagine why he would do that. You 02:16PM 15

should take it as compliment. 02:16PM 16CROSS-EXAMINATION OF REPRESENTATIVE SCOTT HOCHBERG02:16PM 17

BY MR. HUGHES: 02:16PM 18Representative Hochberg, hi. I'm John Hughes and I just 02:16PM 19 Q.

have a few questions for you, but I need to hook up my computer 02:16PM 20first, so just bear with me. I probably should have left it 02:16PM 21from the last time. 02:16PM 22

JUDGE COLLYER: Lawyers didn't used to bring computers. 02:16PM 23It's the most astonishing thing. 02:16PM 24

THE WITNESS: I am one of the few legislators who do not 02:16PM 25


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bring an iPad onto the floor, and my staff is continually 02:16PM 1frustrated that they have to print things out on paper for me. 02:16PM 2

JUDGE COLLYER: That would not be true in Mr. Hughes' 02:17PM 3office. 02:17PM 4

MR. HUGHES: I don't have an iPad, but I do rely on my 02:17PM 5laptop. 02:17PM 6BY MR. HUGHES:02:17PM 7

Good afternoon, Representative Hochberg. I won't take 02:17PM 8 Q.

much of your time. The Court has encouraged us to just be very 02:17PM 9focused in the limited time we have here. 02:17PM 10

I did want to ask you to come here today so that we could 02:17PM 11cover one issue that was raised in your prefiled direct 02:17PM 12testimony -- 02:17PM 13

JUDGE COLLYER: And the first would be your name. 02:17PM 14MR. HUGHES: Oh, I'm sorry. This odd cross-examination 02:17PM 15

procedure. 02:17PM 16BY MR. HUGHES:02:17PM 17

But why don't you introduce yourself to the Court, 02:17PM 18 Q.

please. 02:17PM 19Okay. My name is Scott Hochberg. I'm the state 02:17PM 20 A.

representative currently in District 137 in the Texas House. 02:17PM 21And just for -- since we've been focussed on the State of 02:17PM 22 Q.

Texas for the last two weeks, where is your district? 02:17PM 23Southwest side of Houston, an area known mostly as 02:17PM 24 A.

Sharpstown and Gulfton. It sort of straddles Highway 59, coming 02:17PM 25


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from the west loop to the beltway. 02:18PM 1And your district is in Houston, which is also in Harris 02:18PM 2 Q.

County, right?02:18PM 3Yes. 02:18PM 4 A.

And how long have you served in the Texas House of 02:18PM 5 Q.

Representatives? 02:18PM 6It will be 20 years at the end of this term. 02:18PM 7 A.

So since the early '90s? 02:18PM 8 Q.

1993. 02:18PM 9 A.

And then even for a few years before that, I think I saw 02:18PM 10 Q.

in your direct testimony that you had worked for a 02:18PM 11representative of the House as early as 1991? 02:18PM 12

That's correct. I served one term as a staffer. 02:18PM 13 A.

Okay. Now, with that in mind, we've brought you here to 02:18PM 14 Q.

ask you about one issue that was raised in your prefiled direct 02:18PM 15testimony, that was also referenced in the Department of 02:18PM 16Justice's trial brief, so we wanted to talk to you about it. 02:18PM 17And before we do, I notice that your prefiled direct testimony 02:18PM 18was in a -- kind of a question-and-answer format, and I wonder 02:18PM 19if you could tell us who was asking you the questions that you 02:18PM 20were answering? 02:19PM 21

I think it was Mr. Freeman. 02:19PM 22 A.

Okay. And I'd like to show you an exchange that you had 02:19PM 23 Q.

with Mr. Freeman during that, and I'll see if I can call it up 02:19PM 24on the screen. 02:19PM 25


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Do you see the testimony on the screen? 02:19PM 1Yes, sir. 02:19PM 2 A.

And do you -- you were asked: "Did the committee 02:19PM 3 Q.

hearings comply with the five-day posting rule?" 02:19PM 4Your answer was: "No."02:19PM 5And then you were asked: "How often do such waivers 02:19PM 6

occur concerning major bills?" 02:19PM 7And your answer was: "Rarely."02:19PM 8That's your testimony, right? 02:19PM 9That's part of it, yes. I think there were a couple 02:19PM 10 A.

other lines that put some wrapping around that. 02:19PM 11Okay. And that is true. I think they occurred on an 02:19PM 12 Q.

earlier page, and if you'd like to summarize that so we have it 02:19PM 13all in mind, please do so.02:19PM 14

To the extent I remember what the testimony was, it's -- 02:19PM 15 A.

there are exceptions to what I said. If a major bill is coming 02:20PM 16over from the Senate and they've already held extensive hearings 02:20PM 17and it's later in the session, we might routinely waive the 02:20PM 18posting rule or may not even have a hearing in the House.02:20PM 19

But the basic point of this is that for major House 02:20PM 20 Q.

bills, the five-day posting rule is rarely suspended, right? 02:20PM 21That's correct. 02:20PM 22 A.

And perhaps for the benefit of the Court, the five-day 02:20PM 23 Q.

posting rule is a rule that requires a five-day notice of any 02:20PM 24public hearing held by a House committee or subcommittee, 02:20PM 25


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correct? 02:20PM 1That's correct. On a bill, on a specific bill. 02:20PM 2 A.

On a specific bill. And it can be what's called 02:20PM 3 Q.

suspended -- 02:20PM 4Right. 02:20PM 5 A.

-- with the consent of two-thirds of legislators that are 02:20PM 6 Q.

present, right? 02:20PM 7That's correct. 02:20PM 8 A.

And the point as it relates to this case, as I understand 02:20PM 9 Q.

it -- please correct me if I'm wrong -- is that the five-day 02:20PM 10posting rule was suspended in connection with the House 02:20PM 11redistricting bill, the bill for redistricting House districts. 02:21PM 12And the point there is that that's a procedural irregularity 02:21PM 13related to the passage of that piece of legislation, as compared 02:21PM 14to other legislation passed by the House; is that -- 02:21PM 15

I think that's fair. I don't want to get into detail 02:21PM 16 A.

over the word "irregularity," but it's not what I would have 02:21PM 17expected. 02:21PM 18

Okay. Based on your experience --02:21PM 19 Q.

Experience in the House. 02:21PM 20 A.

-- since 1991 in the House, right? 02:21PM 21 Q.

Right. 02:21PM 22 A.

Okay. And -- but you agree with me that the rule, the 02:21PM 23 Q.

five-day posting rule, is frequently suspended every session, 02:21PM 24right? 02:21PM 25


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Yes. 02:21PM 1 A.

Hundreds of times a session, right? 02:21PM 2 Q.

I wouldn't know if it was hundreds. That sounds like a 02:21PM 3 A.

lot. But you wouldn't suspend it on the budget and you wouldn't 02:21PM 4suspend it on other major pieces of legislation where you would 02:22PM 5anticipate there would be significant public testimony. 02:22PM 6

Okay. Now, one thing I learned, since I'm not from 02:22PM 7 Q.

Texas, but one thing I've learned since being involved in this 02:22PM 8case is that Texas has a really great open records system for 02:22PM 9its public records, including a great Website for the Texas 02:22PM 10Legislature. 02:22PM 11

You're familiar with that, right? 02:22PM 12Yes. 02:22PM 13 A.

And one of the things that would be reported on that 02:22PM 14 Q.

Texas legislative Website would be the history of what happened 02:22PM 15to various bills; is that right? 02:22PM 16

Absolutely. 02:22PM 17 A.

Okay. And what I'd like to do is to go with you to that 02:22PM 18 Q.

Website and check and see how frequently the five-day posting 02:22PM 19rule has been suspended this term, and look at some other 02:22PM 20information. That's something we can do on the Website, right? 02:22PM 21

JUDGE COLLYER: In which term do you mean? Do you mean -- 02:22PM 22this is a legislature that only meets every other year, right? 02:23PM 23So you really mean last term? 02:23PM 24

MR. HUGHES: I do, Your Honor. Thank you. And I should 02:23PM 25


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know that by now. 02:23PM 1JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you. 02:23PM 2

BY MR. HUGHES:02:23PM 3And this is the Website. Do you see it there on the 02:23PM 4 Q.

screen? 02:23PM 5I do. 02:23PM 6 A.

And if you go down here, we can go to "Bill search," 02:23PM 7 Q.

right? 02:23PM 8Yes. 02:23PM 9 A.

And do you see where it says "82(R)"? 02:23PM 10 Q.

Yes, sir. 02:23PM 11 A.

That refers to the regular session of the Texas 02:23PM 12 Q.

Legislature in this past year, 2011, right? 02:23PM 13Right. 02:23PM 14 A.

And that's the term during which the redistricting bills 02:23PM 15 Q.

that we're talking about were at issue, right? 02:23PM 16Yes. 02:23PM 17 A.

And if we go over here to "Action criteria," we can see 02:23PM 18 Q.

"Posting rule suspended," and "H" stands for House, right? 02:23PM 19Correct. 02:24PM 20 A.

And if we search under that, would you agree with me that 02:24PM 21 Q.

this public record shows there were 342 instances in the last 02:24PM 22term in the Texas House where it shows the posting rule was 02:24PM 23suspended? 02:24PM 24

Do you see that? 02:24PM 25


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Yes. 02:24PM 1 A.

And would you agree with me that the posting rule, just 02:24PM 2 Q.

looking at the very first few items here on the Website, that it 02:24PM 3was suspended for a bill related to -- you said the budget, it 02:24PM 4wouldn't be suspended, but the very first thing that it's 02:24PM 5suspended is a supplemental appropriations bill, which, of 02:24PM 6course, is not the main budget bill, but it's related, right? 02:24PM 7

It's related, but it's not the main budget bill. 02:24PM 8 A.

All right. And then looking down, we see there was a 02:24PM 9 Q.

controversial bill passed last term, Informed Consent on 02:24PM 10Abortion, it appears it was suspended -- five-day posting rule 02:24PM 11was suspended for that as well? 02:25PM 12

It was. 02:25PM 13 A.

And you see that right above that -- do you recall there 02:25PM 14 Q.

was a bill passed through the House related to making certain 02:25PM 15criminal sanctions in connection with human trafficking? 02:25PM 16

Yes.02:25PM 17 A.

And that was a major bill sponsored by one of your 02:25PM 18 Q.

colleagues from Harris County, right --02:25PM 19Yes. 02:25PM 20 A.

-- Representative Thompson? 02:25PM 21 Q.

That was an important piece of legislation, right?02:25PM 22It was an important piece of legislation. 02:25PM 23 A.

And the five-day posting rule was suspended for that 02:25PM 24 Q.

important piece of legislation? 02:25PM 25


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I don't know if what we're seeing is a five-day posting 02:25PM 1 A.

rule suspension on an initial hearing, on a one and only 02:25PM 2hearing. I don't know if this, particularly on HP 15 -- and my 02:25PM 3memory -- we'd have to look this up -- may have been it was 02:25PM 4subsequent to the initial hearing. And, of course, HP 15 was 02:25PM 5a -- was declared an emergency by the governor, and so it was, 02:25PM 6by the governor's demand, on a fast track. 02:25PM 7

Okay. So in instances where there is time pressure, it's 02:26PM 8 Q.

not uncommon, even on major bills, to suspend the five-day 02:26PM 9posting rule, right? 02:26PM 10

I don't know whether I can say that or not. Without 02:26PM 11 A.

really reading it, without doing a study of that, I'm not sure I 02:26PM 12can say that. I mean, I think it's important to point out that 02:26PM 13you came up with 342 bills -- 02:26PM 14

I don't see the top of the screen anymore. 02:26PM 15Oh, yes. Yes, sir. That's what we came up with. 02:26PM 16 Q.

And we pass somewhere in the range of 1,500 bills, and we 02:26PM 17 A.

hear significantly more than that. So I would argue that even 02:26PM 18342 is relatively -- is a relatively small number for the normal 02:26PM 19practice of the House, even if all of these were determined by 02:26PM 20you to be major bills. 02:26PM 21

And I'm not representing that. If you went through the 02:26PM 22 Q.

list, I'm sure we could find some that we all agree are not 02:26PM 23major. But you do agree -- 02:27PM 24

It's still a relatively small number, compared to the 02:27PM 25 A.


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incredible number of bills that we hear. If we're passing 1,200 02:27PM 1to 1,400 in that five-month period, and most of what we hear 02:27PM 2doesn't get passed, I don't know how many bills we have for 02:27PM 3hearing, but I bet it has to be in the 3,000 range. 02:27PM 4

Just so -- I understand your testimony, Representative 02:27PM 5 Q.

Hochberg, but I just wanted to make sure we all understand 02:27PM 6what's happening here, is that for some of these major bills 02:27PM 7that we've looked at, some hearings related to those bills, the 02:27PM 8rule has been suspended, even just this last term, right? 02:27PM 9


All right. And now, you've been in the Texas House, 02:27PM 11 Q.

you've already told us, since 1993, and so that means you were 02:27PM 12there in 2001, the last time there was a decade-related 02:27PM 13redistricting? 02:27PM 14

I was. 02:27PM 15 A.

And there was a mid-decade redistricting since then, but 02:27PM 16 Q.

I won't ask you about that. 02:28PM 17Not applying to us. That was Congressional. 02:28PM 18 A.

Okay. Right. In 2001, which party was in charge of 02:28PM 19 Q.

the -- which party had the majority of the seats in the Texas 02:28PM 20House in 2001? 02:28PM 21

Democrats. 02:28PM 22 A.

Okay. And you were -- you've been a democrat the whole 02:28PM 23 Q.

time you've been in, right?02:28PM 24Yes. 02:28PM 25 A.


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All right. And in 2001, of course, you were at least 02:28PM 1 Q.

somewhat involved with redistricting, at least as it pertains to 02:28PM 2your district, right? 02:28PM 3

Well, yeah. I looked at the maps that were being drawn, 02:28PM 4 A.

sure. 02:28PM 5And I'd like to look with you on the same Website to see 02:28PM 6 Q.

what happened with the five-day posting rule for redistricting 02:28PM 7when the democrats were in charge. 02:28PM 8

And one thing we can do is we can look at "Bill subject 02:28PM 9matter" and "Redistricting" is one of those subject matters, 02:28PM 10right? 02:29PM 11

Yes, sir. 02:29PM 12 A.

And we can go back over to our "Action criteria" -- 02:29PM 13 Q.

JUDGE COLLYER: It's right in the middle. 02:29PM 14MR. HUGHES: Yes. Thank you, Your Honor. 02:29PM 15

BY MR. HUGHES:02:29PM 16And then we need to choose the correct session, so we 02:29PM 17 Q.

need to go back to 2001, regular session, right? 77(R)? 02:29PM 18I think so. 02:29PM 19 A.

And then we hit "Search." Did I just goof it up? No. 02:29PM 20 Q.

And we show in 2001, when the democrats were in charge, 02:30PM 21the five-day posting rule for the bill related to the 02:30PM 22composition of the districts of the Texas House of 02:30PM 23Representatives, the rule was suspended in 2001, right? 02:30PM 24

That seems to show that. I don't, again, know whether 02:30PM 25 A.


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that was for the first and only hearing or whether that was for 02:30PM 1subsequent hearings. 02:30PM 2

But we could look here and see that history, right? 02:30PM 3 Q.

Yes. 02:30PM 4 A.

And it would show -- 02:30PM 5 Q.

And you may have already done that. 02:30PM 6 A.

-- how many times it was suspended and so forth, right? 02:30PM 7 Q.

Sure. 02:30PM 8 A.

And your testimony here in this case is that it was 02:30PM 9 Q.

suspended for one of the hearings that was held for the Texas 02:30PM 10House of Representatives map, correct? 02:30PM 11

I'm sorry? 02:30PM 12 A.

Your testimony as it relates to 2011 is that the five-day 02:30PM 13 Q.

posting rule was suspended for one or two of the hearings that 02:30PM 14were held later in the process for -- related to the Texas House 02:30PM 15map, right? 02:30PM 16

I thought that -- it was -- they were the only hearings 02:30PM 17 A.

after the proposed final map was made available. 02:31PM 18And that's what I'm referring to. 02:31PM 19 Q.

Yes. 02:31PM 20 A.

That's what you're talking about, right? 02:31PM 21 Q.

Yes. 02:31PM 22 A.

And you also testified that you were in the House in -- 02:31PM 23 Q.

you weren't elected, but you were working for a representative 02:31PM 24in 1991. And again, which party was in charge or had the most 02:31PM 25


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elected officials in the Texas House in 1991? 02:31PM 1Democrats. 02:31PM 2 A.

And redistricting cycle occurred in 1991, right? 02:31PM 3 Q.

Right. 02:31PM 4 A.

And we can look on here and see what happened in 1991 in 02:31PM 5 Q.

terms of whether the five-day posting rule was suspended in 02:31PM 61991, right? 02:31PM 7

If it goes back that far, yes. 02:31PM 8 A.

And this shows there are two entries. One at the bottom 02:32PM 9 Q.

is not about the Texas House of Representatives, but the top 02:32PM 10one, again, shows that in 1991, for the redistricting cycle that 02:33PM 11occurred then, that the five-day posting rule was suspended when 02:33PM 12the democrats were in charge related to hearings on the bill for 02:33PM 13the Texas House of Representatives, right? 02:33PM 14

Yes. 02:33PM 15 A.

Okay. And you didn't check this before you came to 02:33PM 16 Q.

testify today, did you? 02:33PM 17No.02:33PM 18 A.

But you could have, right? You could have done what I 02:33PM 19 Q.

just did, right? 02:33PM 20Yes. Sure. 02:33PM 21 A.

And the Department of Justice could have done what I just 02:33PM 22 Q.

did, right? 02:33PM 23Right. 02:33PM 24 A.

And if we hadn't done it together today, no one would 02:33PM 25 Q.


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know that, just like in 2011, the five-day posting rule, when 02:33PM 1the democrats were in charge for redistricting, was suspended in 02:33PM 22001 and 1991, right? 02:33PM 3

What I don't know is whether it was for the only hearings 02:33PM 4 A.

after a final bill was released. But you may know that, but we 02:33PM 5haven't seen that yet. 02:34PM 6

And so I can't speak to what the process was in 1991 02:34PM 7because I was a staffer and I wasn't paying attention to these 02:34PM 8sorts of details in 1991. I believe what I testified to was 02:34PM 9that major bills rarely have a suspension on their main hearing. 02:34PM 10

So, what we see here is -- the first time a bill is 02:34PM 11 Q.

publicly released -- I've learned this -- is called the "first 02:34PM 12reading," right? 02:34PM 13

The first time a bill is sent to the committee, it's 02:34PM 14 A.

called a "first reading." 02:34PM 15Okay. And so, what we see here -- we can go down.02:34PM 16 Q.

You're looking at four considerations, so you're going to 02:34PM 17 A.

need to go down quite a bit. Yeah. You need to go down. 02:34PM 18There we go. So then right here, we see what we're 02:34PM 19 Q.

talking about, which is "Posting rule suspended" right before a 02:35PM 20public hearing, right? 02:35PM 21

That's right. But you also see a public hearing a month 02:35PM 22 A.

before. 02:35PM 23But there were public hearings related -- in 2011 before 02:35PM 24 Q.

the map was publicly released, right? 02:35PM 25


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I don't know. Not the map that became the Harris County 02:35PM 1 A.

map, no. 02:35PM 2But my only point is it was suspended in 1991 and 2001; 02:35PM 3 Q.

it was also suspended in 2011? 02:35PM 4That's correct.02:35PM 5 A.

Thank you. 02:35PM 6 Q.

JUDGE COLLYER: Are there any more questions for this 02:35PM 7witness? 02:35PM 8

MR. HUGHES: There are no further questions from Texas. 02:35PM 9JUDGE COLLYER: Right. Are there any more questions for 02:35PM 10

this witness? 02:35PM 11MR. FREEMAN: Your Honor, we just have brief redirect. 02:35PM 12

And again, this is Daniel Freeman on behalf of the United States. 02:35PM 13REDIRECT EXAMINATION OF REPRESENTATIVE SCOTT HOCHBERG02:35PM 14

BY MR. FREEMAN:02:35PM 15Representative Hochberg, I just have a couple quick 02:36PM 16 Q.

questions to see if we can clarify a few things. 02:36PM 17Mr. Hughes put a few bills up in front of you that he 02:36PM 18

described as important bills on which the five-day posting rule 02:36PM 19was waived. However, when does the Texas legislative session 02:36PM 20end, the regular session? 02:36PM 21

Roughly, the end of May, 140 days after it starts. 02:36PM 22 A.

Roughly the end of May. And so do you recall when those 02:36PM 23 Q.

two bills were -- those two hearings were dated that Mr. Hughes 02:36PM 24put in front of you for the abortion bill and the budget bill? 02:36PM 25


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Well, the abortion bill was very early in the session 02:36PM 1 A.

because it was emergency legislation. 02:36PM 2Do you recall the hearing dates that he put in front of 02:36PM 3 Q.

you? 02:36PM 4I don't. 02:36PM 5 A.

MR. FREEMAN: Mr. Hughes, if we could still have access to 02:36PM 6those exhibits. 02:36PM 7

MR. HUGHES: It's the Internet, but -- 02:36PM 8MR. FREEMAN: Would you accept my recollection if I were 02:36PM 9

to repeat them? 02:36PM 10MR. HUGHES: I suppose. 02:36PM 11MR. FREEMAN: Well, we need your exhibits, sir, if I can 02:36PM 12

do proper redirect. 02:37PM 13MR. HUGHES: It's the Internet. We do have exhibits 02:37PM 14

marked. Would you like me to come up there and hook up my 02:37PM 15machine? 02:37PM 16

JUDGE COLLYER: Either that or give him an exhibit that's 02:37PM 17marked. 02:37PM 18

MR. HUGHES: I'll hook up my machine. 02:37PM 19JUDGE COLLYER: You understand that what's on the Internet 02:37PM 20

and you've just shown to the witness is not in the record? 02:37PM 21MR. HUGHES: I do. And I do have marked exhibits showing 02:37PM 22

all that, and I -- 02:37PM 23JUDGE COLLYER: So why don't you just let him see your 02:37PM 24

marked exhibits? 02:37PM 25


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MR. HUGHES: I don't have a printed copy of those, Your 02:37PM 1Honor. 02:37PM 2

JUDGE COLLYER: You have a marked exhibit, but you don't 02:37PM 3have one to give to the Court? Well, that's helpful. 02:37PM 4

MR. HUGHES: We will be providing it to the Court, Your 02:37PM 5Honor. I just neglected to bring a copy. 02:37PM 6

JUDGE COLLYER: Well, there's a lawyers room across the 02:37PM 7hall. You can go print it out there. 02:37PM 8

MR. HUGHES: We will at the next break, Your Honor. 02:37PM 9MR. FREEMAN: If we could get the list of bills that you 02:38PM 10

showed to Representative Hochberg concerning waivers in the last 02:38PM 11legislative term. 02:38PM 12

MR. HUGHES: Is that all you're going to need? 02:38PM 13MR. FREEMAN: That's all I'm going to need from you. 02:38PM 14

BY MR. FREEMAN:02:38PM 15Now, if you look -- hopefully, this can refresh your 02:38PM 16 Q.

recollection. Can you tell me what date the last action on that 02:38PM 17bill was, related to consent to an abortion? 02:38PM 18

JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you, Mr. Hughes. 02:38PM 19MR. FREEMAN: Thank you, sir. 02:38PM 20JUDGE COLLYER: Go ahead. 02:38PM 21THE WITNESS: I'm sorry. The last action was -- the last 02:38PM 22

action was 5-19. 02:38PM 23BY MR. FREEMAN:02:38PM 24

And could you tell me the day of the last action on the 02:38PM 25 Q.


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supplemental appropriation concerning which there was a waiver? 02:38PM 16-16. 02:38PM 2 A.

And do you recall when the waiver was concerning the 02:38PM 3 Q.

redistricting bill? 02:39PM 4Just before Palm Sunday, because the hearing was on Palm 02:39PM 5 A.

Sunday, so that would have been April something. 02:39PM 6Okay. And is it fair to say that these waivers occurred 02:39PM 7 Q.

far later in the legislative session or during a special session 02:39PM 8called by the governor? 02:39PM 9

No, it wouldn't have been during a special session called 02:39PM 10 A.

by the governor if it shows up here. What you are seeing is the 02:39PM 11last action is likely the day that the governor signed it or let 02:39PM 12it go into effect without his signature, so you sort of have to 02:39PM 13back up to see the last House action. 02:39PM 14

But the supplemental appropriation would have been very 02:39PM 15late because, if I remember correctly, we sort of back-filled 02:39PM 16that from the budget once we got the budget done. It had to 02:39PM 17hold until the budget was finished. 02:39PM 18

I don't remember the circumstances on the delay on HP 15. 02:39PM 19Now, you testified earlier in your prefiled direct that 02:40PM 20 Q.

it's possible that a waiver can occur when there's already a 02:40PM 21hearing set on a related subject, and so people would be ready 02:40PM 22and have the same types of witnesses available. Does this 02:40PM 23information that Mr. Hughes showed you let you know whether the 02:40PM 24waiver occurred to place these bills on a related hearing? 02:40PM 25


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No.02:40PM 1 A.

Okay. Do you recall how many hearings there were for the 02:40PM 2 Q.

House redistricting in 2001? 02:40PM 3No.02:40PM 4 A.

If we could pull up Defense Exhibit 811, if we can 02:40PM 5 Q.

refresh your recollection on that. 02:40PM 6And if we could scroll down just a little bit, this is an 02:40PM 7

e-mail from Bonnie Bruce to Chairman Solomons. 02:40PM 8MR. HUGHES: Your Honor, I object to using this on 02:40PM 9

redirect, an e-mail that I don't believe Representative Hochberg 02:40PM 10has ever seen. 02:41PM 11

JUDGE COLLYER: He's asking a question. He's not -- this 02:41PM 12is redirect of his own witness. He's allowed to ask him this 02:41PM 13question. 02:41PM 14

This is -- what is the number of this exhibit? 02:41PM 15MR. FREEMAN: This is Exhibit 811, Your Honor. 02:41PM 16JUDGE COLLYER: All right. This is Defense Exhibit 811. 02:41PM 17

It's been accepted into evidence. You can ask him a question. 02:41PM 18MR. FREEMAN: Your Honor, I just need to use it to refresh 02:41PM 19

his recollection. If we could actually -- 02:41PM 20JUDGE COLLYER: You can refresh his recollection with 02:41PM 21

anything, you know. I was taught once you could refresh 02:41PM 22recollection with a plate of spaghetti. So what are we 02:41PM 23refreshing recollection with? 02:41PM 24

MR. FREEMAN: If we could proceed to the next page, I just 02:41PM 25


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needed to get the e-mail header from this page.02:41PM 1BY MR. FREEMAN: 02:41PM 2

And if you could read the first paragraph, sir. 02:41PM 3 Q.

The one labeled "1, parenthesis." 02:41PM 4 A.

Yes. Just read it to yourself since you're refreshing 02:41PM 5 Q.

recollection. 02:41PM 6Okay. I've read it. 02:41PM 7 A.

And, sir, now does this help you recall how many 02:42PM 8 Q.

committee hearings there were concerning the House redistricting 02:42PM 9bill in 2001? 02:42PM 10

Well, it doesn't help me recall, but I believe the 02:42PM 11 A.

information that's in front of me. It says it was considered 02:42PM 12in -- in, actually, five hearings. 02:42PM 13

And so is it consistent, then, with your testimony that a 02:42PM 14 Q.

single waiver would not have been atypical on a major bill if 02:42PM 15there had already been four prior hearings? 02:42PM 16

Yes. 02:42PM 17 A.

MR. FREEMAN: That's all. Thank you, Your Honor. I pass 02:42PM 18the witness. 02:42PM 19

JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you. The witness is done. 02:42PM 20Yes, sir? 02:42PM 21MR. HUGHES: May I get my computer back? 02:42PM 22JUDGE COLLYER: Yes, sir, you may get your computer back. 02:42PM 23Thank you very much, Representative Hochberg, for coming. 02:43PM 24THE WITNESS: Thank you. 02:43PM 25


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JUDGE COLLYER: All right. Who's the next witness? 02:43PM 1MR. MORTARA: Your Honor, just a matter of procedure. 02:43PM 2

Mr. Devaney would like to have his expert, Dr. Ansolabehere, do 02:43PM 3his ten minutes and then after that, we're prepared to have 02:43PM 4Mr. Interiano. 02:43PM 5

JUDGE COLLYER: All right. 02:43PM 6MR. MORTARA: In Mr. Interiano's exam, he will be using 02:43PM 7

RedAppl, and we would -- what we intend to do is to project his 02:43PM 8use of it on your screens while he's using it from the witness 02:43PM 9box -- we have the capability to do that here -- and to also 02:43PM 10record on video everything he does and then mark it as an 02:43PM 11exhibit. We have that capability. 02:43PM 12

JUDGE COLLYER: I don't have an objection to that unless 02:43PM 13somebody else does. 02:43PM 14

MR. MORTARA: Mr. Sells is going inspect the computer 02:43PM 15prior to, which is why I was going to suggest that when 02:43PM 16Dr. Ansolabehere is done, we take a break to allow for that 02:43PM 17inspection, and -- 02:43PM 18

JUDGE COLLYER: We're taking a break at 3:00. 02:43PM 19MR. MORTARA: Okay. 02:43PM 20JUDGE COLLYER: Let's go ahead, please. 02:43PM 21

(DR. STEPHEN ANSOLABEHERE, DEFENDANTS' WITNESS IN THE CASE, 02:44PM 22SWORN) 02:44PM 23

MR. DEVANEY: Good afternoon, Your Honor. John Devaney on 02:44PM 24behalf of the Gonzalez intervenors. 02:44PM 25


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JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you, sir. 02:44PM 1DIRECT EXAMINATION OF DR. STEPHEN ANSOLABEHERE02:44PM 2

BY MR. DEVANEY: 02:44PM 3Dr. Ansolabehere, good afternoon. We will move quickly. 02:44PM 4 Q.

And let me begin by saying or asking, you're a professor at 02:44PM 5Harvard; is that correct? 02:44PM 6


In Government? 02:44PM 8 Q.

In the Department of Government. 02:44PM 9 A.

JUDGE COLLYER: And could you give us your full name and 02:44PM 10spell your last name, please, sir.02:44PM 11

THE WITNESS: Steven Daniel Ansolabehere, 02:44PM 12A-N-S-O-L-A-B-E-H-E-R-E. 02:44PM 13

JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you, sir.02:44PM 14BY MR. DEVANEY:02:44PM 15

And your analysis in this case is set forth in 02:44PM 16 Q.

Exhibit 724, which is both your initial and supplemental 02:45PM 17reports, and you focus on the Congressional plan; is that 02:45PM 18correct? 02:45PM 19


And you conclude that there are how many minority ability 02:45PM 21 Q.

districts in the benchmark plan? 02:45PM 2211. 02:45PM 23 A.

And do you include Congressional District 25 in that 02:45PM 24 Q.

analysis? 02:45PM 25


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I do. 02:45PM 1 A.

What conclusion do you reach about retrogression with 02:45PM 2 Q.

respect to the Congressional plan? 02:45PM 3The number of districts in which blacks and Hispanics 02:45PM 4 A.

have the ability to elect their preferred candidates in general 02:45PM 5elections in benchmark plan C100 is 11, and it's reduced to ten 02:45PM 6in the proposed Plan C185. So there's a reduction in the number 02:45PM 7of districts in which minorities can elect their preferred 02:45PM 8candidates. 02:45PM 9

Have you also calculated the percentage of minority 02:45PM 10 Q.

ability districts in the benchmark plan versus the proposed Plan 02:45PM 11C185? 02:45PM 12

Yes. 34 -- in Plan C100, blacks and Hispanics could 02:45PM 13 A.

elect their preferred candidates in 34 percent of the districts, 02:45PM 14and in C185, they can elect in 28 percent of the districts. 02:46PM 15

Now, in contrast to that decrease in percentage, what has 02:46PM 16 Q.

been the increase in minority population since 2000? 02:46PM 17The black and Hispanic population combined increased by 02:46PM 18 A.

3.3 million people statewide out of 4.3 million people total 02:46PM 19increase in the State of Texas. So that's a seven percent -- 02:46PM 20that translates into a seven percentage point increase in 02:46PM 21Hispanic and black population as a percentage of the total 02:46PM 22population of Texas. 02:46PM 23

Have you analyzed -- 02:46PM 24 Q.

JUDGE COLLYER: What percentage of the growth? 02:46PM 25


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THE WITNESS: Three-quarters. 75 percent of the growth. 02:46PM 1JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you. 02:46PM 2

BY MR. DEVANEY:02:46PM 3Have you analyzed how many minorities in Texas have lost 02:46PM 4 Q.

their ability to elect the candidate of their choice with 02:46PM 5respect to the Congressional plan -- under proposed C185? 02:46PM 6

Approximately 780,000 blacks and Hispanics reside in 02:46PM 7 A.

districts under Plan C100 -- C185 in which they no longer have 02:47PM 8the ability to elect their preferred candidates. 02:47PM 9

Briefly -- I emphasize briefly -- describe how you 02:47PM 10 Q.

calculated that number. 02:47PM 11That is easily seen in Attachment 8 to my supplemental 02:47PM 12 A.

filing. And what I did is I classified all the districts 02:47PM 13following the standard approach to retrogression, and each 02:47PM 14district is termed either a minority ability-to-elect district 02:47PM 15or not. And then I counted the populations of the black and 02:47PM 16Hispanic in each of the districts under 100 -- C100 and under 02:47PM 17C185. 02:47PM 18

And how did Districts 23, 25 and 27 factor into your 02:47PM 19 Q.

analysis that 780,000 have lost their ability to elect? 02:47PM 20C23, most of those Hispanic and black voters lose their 02:47PM 21 A.

ability to elect because of the retrogression that occurred 02:48PM 22there. C -- Plan C100's District 27, which is somewhat 02:48PM 23different from Plan C185's District 27, was taken apart, and 02:48PM 24Nueces County is taken out of 27 in the old plan and becomes 02:48PM 25


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part of the new plan, C1- -- Congressional District 27. 02:48PM 1Nueces County has a population of approximately 300,000 02:48PM 2

people total, 240,000 Hispanics in Nueces County. That county 02:48PM 3is put into a district that new 27 is no longer a district where 02:48PM 4Hispanics have the ability to elect their preferred candidate, 02:48PM 5so all 240,000 Hispanics in Nueces no longer have the ability to 02:48PM 6be represented or elect candidates of their choice. 02:48PM 7

And then CD 25, that county -- that area is rooted in 02:48PM 8Travis County. It was sort of the seat of that County -- of 02:49PM 9that district. And CD 25 has been completely reoriented so that 02:49PM 10there's a black population in the center of Austin; the district 02:49PM 11is sort of shifted or swirled around that, and the district now 02:49PM 12runs through western Travis and all the way up to Tarrant 02:49PM 13County. It's a complete reorientation of the district. 02:49PM 14

And the result of that and other line changes is that 02:49PM 15there are approximately 100,000 blacks and Hispanics in Travis 02:49PM 16County who no longer reside in districts where they had the 02:49PM 17ability to elect their preferred candidates. 02:49PM 18

I'm putting before you what is Attachment 7 to your 02:49PM 19 Q.

supplemental testimony. Let me just ask you a foundational 02:49PM 20question, and that is: Have you analyzed general election and 02:49PM 21primary election data for Travis County and for CD 25? 02:49PM 22

I have. 02:49PM 23 A.

What conclusions have you reached about whether there's a 02:49PM 24 Q.

coalition district both in CD 25 and within Travis County 02:50PM 25


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itself? 02:50PM 1JUDGE COLLYER: In the benchmark? 02:50PM 2MR. DEVANEY: Yes, in the benchmark. Thank you. 02:50PM 3THE WITNESS: In the benchmark plan, CD 25 in general 02:50PM 4

elections functions as a coalition or a crossover district, 02:50PM 5depending on the terminology one uses. In that district, a large 02:50PM 6majority of blacks and Hispanics vote for the same candidate. 02:50PM 7They have a clear preference for that candidate. That's borne 02:50PM 8out in my report and also in Dr. Engstrom's report. The whites 02:50PM 9split their vote fairly evenly in the county. There is 02:50PM 10sufficient crossover voting among the whites that the blacks and 02:50PM 11Hispanics in Travis County generally, but also in CD -- current 02:50PM 12CD 25 have the ability to elect their preferred candidates in the 02:50PM 13general elections. 02:50PM 14

The primary is a somewhat different story. There, there 02:50PM 15seems to be a pretty equal level of power sharing. What I've 02:50PM 16done is I've taken all primary elections in Travis County from 02:51PM 172006 forward from the Texas Legislative Council, and examined for 02:51PM 18each primary election who was the preferred candidate of the 02:51PM 19blacks, the Hispanics and the whites. It's not always the same 02:51PM 20group. It shifts around. And then I've calculated what percent 02:51PM 21of the vote the preferred candidate received for each group, and 02:51PM 22then calculated what percentage of the time did that candidate 02:51PM 23win. 02:51PM 24

And the concern with primary elections is whether or not 02:51PM 25


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minorities are locked out. It's sort of the old Smith v Albright02:51PM 1concern about whether they're being locked out of the electoral 02:51PM 2process because of the primaries. And as -- what I found in 02:51PM 3that, and that's Attachment 6, I believe, in my supplemental 02:51PM 4report, is that 75 percent of the time, the Hispanic preferred 02:51PM 5candidate wins in the primary, 75 percent of the time the black 02:51PM 6preferred candidate wins in the primary, and 75 percent of the 02:51PM 7time, the white preferred candidate wins in the primary. 02:51PM 8

You have an interesting pattern of shifting coalitions 02:52PM 9across the different groups, so they've figured out how to do 02:52PM 10power sharing. And I think there are some others who have spoken 02:52PM 11to the politics inside the county that sort of echoes that same 02:52PM 12fact. I'm presenting some statistical foundation for that. 02:52PM 13BY MR. DEVANEY:02:52PM 14

We're about to enter the lightning round. 02:52PM 15 Q.

JUDGE COLLYER: Isn't 75 percent and 75 percent and 02:52PM 1675 percent more than 100 percent? 02:52PM 17

THE WITNESS: It's different coalitions each time. 02:52PM 18JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you. 02:52PM 19Okay. Go on. 02:52PM 20

BY MR. DEVANEY:02:52PM 21We're entering the lightning round. Three minutes left 02:52PM 22 Q.

with three topics to go. 02:52PM 23Before you is Attachment 7 of your supplemental report on 02:52PM 24

the ELMO. And tell us what this represents and why you included 02:52PM 25


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it in your report, please. 02:52PM 1This is Travis County -- they can't see me.02:52PM 2 A.

This is Travis County. It's sort of in there at an 02:52PM 3angle, so it's a little hard to see. The solid black line is 02:52PM 4Travis. The orange lines are where the Congressional districts 02:52PM 5now are, so you can see five different Congressional Districts 02:53PM 6cutting through Travis County. If you follow the yellow line 02:53PM 7cutting through it, that's Interstate 35, and you can see the 02:53PM 8boundary of Interstate 35. 02:53PM 9

Right in the middle of Travis County, you see a dense 02:53PM 10purple. That's a very dense black population. That's the 02:53PM 11center of Austin, Texas. That population used to be in CD 25 02:53PM 12under the old map, that was represented by Lloyd Doggett. 02:53PM 13That's now in C- -- new CD 25. That population is connected to 02:53PM 14the rest of CD 25 through a narrow isthmus that is sandwiched 02:53PM 15between two other districts coming in, and that runs to the 02:53PM 16west, to western Travis, which is predominantly white. There's 02:53PM 17not been any division of that area of Travis County. And then 02:53PM 18you head out into the rural counties to the north, all the way 02:53PM 19up to Tarrant County. That's what happened to CD 25. 02:53PM 20

In addition, there are some other districts that come in 02:53PM 21here. CD 17 cuts in through the top. You can see a red label 02:53PM 22"17." That comes in from a northeastern district, quite aways 02:54PM 23away, and that's an arm that sticks out of that northeastern 02:54PM 24district and grabs population in northern Travis County. That 02:54PM 25


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district did not do that before. And everywhere you see dark 02:54PM 1purple is where there is substantial black and Hispanic 02:54PM 2populations being grabbed by that intrusion of 17 into Travis. 02:54PM 3

In addition, you see CD 21. CD 21 used to be where CD 25 02:54PM 4now is. And what CD 21 does is it wraps all the way down and 02:54PM 5cuts through Travis -- through Hays County and comes up and 02:54PM 6grabs some more Hispanic population from western Austin and 02:54PM 7appends that to 21. So 21, 17, 10 kind of grab around, and 02:54PM 8that's how Travis and Austin is re-divided. 02:54PM 9

I want to honor a commitment to keep this to ten minutes, 02:54PM 10 Q.

so I'm going skip one of our topics and go to the last topic, 02:54PM 11which is -- you've analyzed Dr. Alford's retrogression analysis; 02:55PM 12is that correct? 02:55PM 13

I have. 02:55PM 14 A.

And what conclusions do you reach about whether it's a 02:55PM 15 Q.

reliable way to measure retrogression -- whether there's 02:55PM 16retrogression? 02:55PM 17

It is -- it doesn't fit with the standard approach that's 02:55PM 18 A.

been used in past legal decisions, and, in fact, it seems to 02:55PM 19have the potential to lead -- yield results that actually 02:55PM 20conflict with the usual approach and the usual legal standards. 02:55PM 21

A good example that's worth thinking about, and that is, 02:55PM 22you can, with his approach, take a district that, say, votes 02:55PM 2370 percent of the time for Hispanics, reduce that down to a 02:55PM 24district that votes 20 percent of the time for Hispanics. That 02:55PM 25


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would be, under the usual classifications, a retrogression, a 02:55PM 1lost district. But you can offset that in his approach by 02:55PM 2taking five districts that are, say, 90 percent Hispanic and 02:55PM 3increasing to 100 percent voting for -- majority voting 02:55PM 4Hispanic, and offset the retrogression, the standard formula of 02:55PM 5retrogression, with some marginal improvements in districts 02:56PM 6elsewhere. 02:56PM 7

The other issue is that it's not clear what a voting 02:56PM 8right means in that context. I no longer -- we're no longer 02:56PM 9talking about an individual's voting right in a district. 02:56PM 10There's some sort of ability to transfer, and I just don't 02:56PM 11understand conceptually what that is. 02:56PM 12

And finally, Dr. Alford's report actually never does a 02:56PM 13statewide retrogression analysis. He only looks at a small 02:56PM 14subset of districts. He doesn't look at all districts at issue 02:56PM 15in the state, doesn't look at all districts that are plurality 02:56PM 16Hispanic, he doesn't look at all districts that -- throughout 02:56PM 17the entire state, which is presumably what you would want to do 02:56PM 18if you're truly doing a statewide functional analysis, because 02:56PM 19it may be the case that we see some reduction here, but it's 02:56PM 20being offset against something somewhere else in the state that 02:56PM 21we just don't see. 02:56PM 22

So I don't see that we have any evidence -- I think it's 02:56PM 23an interesting idea, but it's at this point an idea. 02:56PM 24

MR. DEVANEY: Thank you, Dr. Ansolabehere. I was hoping 02:56PM 25


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you would forget something so I could refresh you with a plate of 02:56PM 1spaghetti, because I, too, was taught that, but we'll save that 02:57PM 2for another day. 02:57PM 3

JUDGE COLLYER: See that -- now you're showing your age. 02:57PM 4Are there any questions for this witness? 02:57PM 5MR. MORTARA: No, Your Honor. 02:57PM 6JUDGE COLLYER: Any further questions? 02:57PM 7Thank you, sir. It's been very nice to meet you. 02:57PM 8The next witness. 02:57PM 9MR. MORTARA: Your Honor, the State will call Gerardo 02:57PM 10

Interiano to the stand. Could we have that break to inspect and 02:57PM 11set up? 02:57PM 12

JUDGE COLLYER: We can have that break. 02:57PM 13MR. MORTARA: How about -- we'll take five minutes of our 02:57PM 14

time, to the extent time is still being kept, although I think we 02:57PM 15will be done before lunch tomorrow. 02:57PM 16

JUDGE COLLYER: Well, I'm still keeping time, but I'm 02:57PM 17hopeful that it doesn't matter anymore. But I'm still doing it. 02:57PM 18

All right. We'll be back at quarter after 3. 02:57PM 19MR. MORTARA: Thank you, Your Honor. 02:57PM 20(Thereupon, a break was had from 2:57 p.m. until 02:57PM 21

3:19 p.m.)03:19PM 22THE COURTROOM CLERK: Be seated, please, and come to 03:19PM 23

order. 03:19PM 24JUDGE COLLYER: All right, let's go ahead. 03:19PM 25


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MR. MORTARA: The State calls Mr. Gerardo Interiano. 03:19PM 1JUDGE COLLYER: All right. Mr. Interiano, can you come 03:19PM 2

back up for us. 03:19PM 3THE WITNESS: Yes.03:19PM 4JUDGE COLLYER: Welcome back, sir. 03:19PM 5

REDIRECT EXAMINATION OF GERARDO INTERIANO03:19PM 6BY MR. MORTARA:03:19PM 7

Hello again, Mr. Interiano. 03:19PM 8 Q.


On your screen is the computer that you have at the 03:19PM 10 Q.

witness stand. There is a big record button in the lower right 03:19PM 11corner. Could you press it, please? 03:19PM 12

Yes, sir. 03:20PM 13 A.

MR. MORTARA: Your Honor, what we do with the computer 03:20PM 14will be recorded to do a digital video file which we will mark as 03:20PM 15an exhibit and submit to the Court everything that Mr. Interiano 03:20PM 16does during this examination. 03:20PM 17

JUDGE COLLYER: This is really wonderful. Wait till I 03:20PM 18describe this, really clever. Okay. 03:20PM 19BY MR. MORTARA:03:20PM 20

Mr. Interiano, there's RedAppl on your computer, and 03:20PM 21 Q.

unfortunately I was not able to connect you to the Internet so 03:20PM 22you will not be able to use DistrictViewer during this time. I 03:20PM 23hope that's okay. 03:20PM 24

That's fine.03:20PM 25 A.


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Could you please demonstrate to the Court in RedAppl the 03:20PM 1 Q.

process you used to draw the initial draft of House District 41 03:20PM 2in Hidalgo County for this session for the Texas legislature. 03:20PM 3

Sure. I'm going to start by opening a brand-new map so 03:20PM 4 A.

it's going to be a completely blank slate. As I mentioned, on 03:21PM 5the left-hand side of the screen is kind of all your different 03:21PM 6options and on the bottom is the statistics bar, so you can pull 03:21PM 7up whatever statistics you want to be looking at. So I'll start 03:21PM 8by pulling up the statistics, and I'll start first of all with 03:21PM 9the total population, and then the elections that we looked at 03:21PM 10throughout the process. 03:21PM 11

I'm going choose three statewide elections. Because we 03:21PM 12were trying to draw a republican district, we would look at a 03:21PM 13variety of elections across the ballot. One of the things that 03:21PM 14we learned once we started this process is that Governor Perry 03:21PM 15underperformed some of the other statewides, so we would want to 03:21PM 16look at the balance rather than only looking at one election in 03:21PM 17a vacuum. 03:21PM 18

JUDGE HOWELL: But the elections you chose were different 03:21PM 19from the OAG10, or were they the same as the OAG10 and the 03:22PM 20election -- 03:22PM 21

THE WITNESS: Oh, yes, ma'am. I mean, but the elections 03:22PM 22that we would choose throughout the process in many cases were 03:22PM 23whatever members wanted to look at. You now, members would come 03:22PM 24in can tell me, I want to look at this specific election, and in 03:22PM 25


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Texas because our judges run also statewide, it would vary from 03:22PM 1anywhere from whoever was up at the top of the ticket statewide 03:22PM 2to whoever was on the bottom. That, the reason being obviously, 03:22PM 3depending on how far people went down the ballot for the 03:22PM 4gubernatorial or the presidential, you'd have a much higher 03:22PM 5turnout so it would give you different types of information as 03:22PM 6far as which election you were looking at to give you a better 03:22PM 7idea of what is the best performance and what is possibly the 03:22PM 8worst performance. 03:22PM 9BY MR. MORTARA:03:22PM 10

And, Mr. Interiano, do you remember any specific 03:22PM 11 Q.

elections you were asked to look at with respect to House 03:22PM 12District 41? 03:22PM 13

Yes. Specifically, I remembered we looked at Perry, 03:22PM 14 A.

McCain, and Abbott. Abbott, being that he's the Attorney 03:22PM 15General, he does very well across the state and in South Texas 03:22PM 16he actually did particularly well. If I recall correctly in 03:22PM 172010, out of all the republican statewide officials that had a 03:23PM 18democrat running against them, General Abbott had the highest 03:23PM 19percentage. So that was a good idea of what would be the 03:23PM 20absolute best that that district would perform. 03:23PM 21

The next thing that I'm going to load is shading, and 03:23PM 22this -- I'll do the same three elections. So I'm going to shade 03:23PM 23the map based on Abbott. 03:24PM 24

And, Mr. Interiano, there are stars on the screen. What 03:24PM 25 Q.


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are those? 03:24PM 1The stars is -- so at the beginning of the process Texas 03:24PM 2 A.

Legislative Council sent out a letter to every elected 03:24PM 3officially who was going to be involved in districting so State 03:24PM 4Board of Education, House, Senate, and Congress, and asked them 03:24PM 5to confirm their residence. They then created an overlay for us 03:24PM 6and that's the overlay that you see here (indicating). If you 03:24PM 7look here on the left-hand side -- let me move this down -- 03:24PM 8you'll see that's the Congressional incumbent, Senate, House, 03:24PM 9SBOE, so that's the only information that we basically had as 03:24PM 10far as specific information that was available to us in RedAppl. 03:24PM 11So right now the highlighted portion is the House incumbents, 03:24PM 12the home addresses, as they reported them to Legislative 03:25PM 13Council. 03:25PM 14

So I'm going to zoom in on the area where 141 was -- I'm 03:25PM 15sorry, where District 41 was drawn. And once you chose the 03:25PM 16election or the item that you wanted to have shaded, then you'd 03:25PM 17go to the level, and as you can see the only two options here 03:25PM 18are county and VTD, so I'll choose VTD, and that's the shading 03:25PM 19that appears. That's not anything that I've drawn, it's just 03:25PM 20the shading in those precincts. So now I'm going to begin the 03:25PM 21process of actually drawing the district. 03:25PM 22

And as you draw, Mr. Interiano, could you tell the Court 03:25PM 23 Q.

exactly what you're doing? 03:25PM 24Sure. As you can see on the right -- left-hand side 03:25PM 25 A.


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right here, it shows the different and the intensity of all the 03:25PM 1different precincts for that specific election. So what I'm 03:25PM 2going to do is I'm going to try to pick the most republican 03:26PM 3precincts that are in this area. And as this loads you'll 03:26PM 4notice down at the bottom the statistics all change. Oh, I'm 03:26PM 5sorry. I had accidently clicked it here on county, so when you 03:26PM 6draw you have to select at what level you're drawing, and in 03:26PM 7this case I'm drawing at VTD so I will do that again. 03:26PM 8

And in each one of those, what are you doing inside each 03:27PM 9 Q.

precinct? 03:27PM 10Basically I'm just clicking on it and as I click on it 03:27PM 11 A.

I'm selecting that precinct to be a part of the district. Any 03:27PM 12portions that I miss, then I'll come back and do them again. 03:27PM 13I'm not sure why it's not doing it. 03:27PM 14

MR. MORTARA: Well, Your Honor, I was never taught. You 03:27PM 15could refresh recollection with a spaghetti plate, but I was 03:27PM 16taught never to do a live trial demonstration of any computer 03:27PM 17software. 03:27PM 18

JUDGE COLLYER: That's all right. It's interesting to see 03:27PM 19it. 03:27PM 20

MR. MORTARA: Ms. Perales says you must deselect the 03:28PM 21county, Mr. Interiano. The county that you previously 03:28PM 22accidentally selected, I believe.03:28PM 23

THE WITNESS: Oh, I see what you're saying.03:28PM 24MR. MORTARA: We have some RedAppl experts on the defense 03:28PM 25


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side table as well.03:28PM 1THE WITNESS: Thank you, Ms. Perales. 03:28PM 2Okay, so now that I click on it the statistics will change 03:28PM 3

to reflect the district. So that outline now is every portion 03:28PM 4that I selected and what I would do at this point is, obviously, 03:28PM 5go in at a more micro level and start selecting the portions that 03:29PM 6for some reason I would have missed. 03:29PM 7BY MR. MORTARA:03:29PM 8

So, for instance, did you just put a precinct back in? 03:29PM 9 Q.

Correct, I put a precinct back in. One of the precinct 03:29PM 10 A.

splits that I addressed in my earlier testimony was this one 03:29PM 11right here (indicating), because of the -- literally it's a 03:29PM 12grid, we had to go and cut in one of these precincts, and so 03:29PM 13what I did was I changed it from the VTD to the block level, and 03:29PM 14then zoom in right here (indicating) and created a thoroughfare. 03:29PM 15So right now I'm removing these blocs. I can do that. 03:29PM 16

And you're removing them from what precinct -- from what 03:29PM 17 Q.

district, rather? 03:29PM 18From District 41 into an open area. So I'll go back to 03:29PM 19 A.

the VTD, for example, and I'm going to remove this precinct 03:30PM 20(indicating). 03:30PM 21

Another one -- the other two are actually up here 03:30PM 22(indicating), and that's for example -- this is where -- and I 03:30PM 23can show you the labeling. It'll even tell you which is the 03:30PM 24members. This is Veronica Gonzales. She lives there. So what 03:30PM 25


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I did at this point is, obviously, zoomed in and I'm going to 03:30PM 1pull up the block shading. So one of the things that -- the 03:30PM 2reason why sometimes things look the way that it did is, for 03:30PM 3example, if you look at this block right here where my cursor 03:30PM 4is, it comes all the way down here. So in order for us to cut 03:30PM 5across we have to move this block rather than just going 03:30PM 6straight, which also causes us to remove that portion of the 03:30PM 7block. So in this case -- I would need to remove all of this 03:30PM 8(indicating), and then I can come down here. 03:31PM 9

This is another example. If I remove the middle one 03:31PM 10where she lives I also have to remove those other pieces. So 03:31PM 11that's -- and many times the shape of the cuts was driven 03:31PM 12because of the way that the blocs were driven. 03:31PM 13

JUDGE COLLYER: This was to have her live in or out of 03:31PM 14that district? 03:31PM 15

THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am, it was to remove her out of that 03:31PM 16district and put her into the open seat. That way you didn't -- 03:31PM 17

JUDGE COLLYER: But you removed her home. 03:31PM 18THE WITNESS: Correct. And put her home into the open 03:31PM 19

seat, that way there was not a pairing in that district that had 03:31PM 20an open seat right next to it. 03:31PM 21

JUDGE COLLYER: Right. 03:31PM 22THE WITNESS: And then on this side, you know, we got 03:31PM 23

Representative Peña's home into it as well. And it was the, you 03:31PM 24know, same process. 03:31PM 25


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So you can see right now, this is obviously not exactly 03:32PM 1what it was, but it's within the deviation. I knew that the 03:32PM 2deviation was roughly between 160,000 and 175,000, and in this 03:32PM 3district, Governor Perry got 49.3 percent of the vote; Lieutenant 03:32PM 4Governor Dewhurst, 51.13; and Attorney General Abbott, 57.2. So 03:32PM 5this was the process that we would go by, you know, in drawing 03:32PM 6the specific district. It was trying to pick things in and out, 03:32PM 7and when Representative Peña and Representative Guillen were in 03:32PM 8the room with me, they would also tell me, you know, if they had 03:32PM 9an area that they wanted because they knew the community, or if 03:32PM 10they had an area that they wanted because he had family there, or 03:32PM 11if there was a region that Representative Guillen wanted for 03:32PM 12whatever reason, that was part of the process, but 90 percent of 03:32PM 13this district was driven by purely the partisan shading that we 03:32PM 14were able to see in this -- in the different elections. 03:33PM 15BY MR. MORTARA:03:33PM 16

And, Mr. Interiano, on the western side of the district 03:33PM 17 Q.

you cut out a portion of the precinct you said to get rid of one 03:33PM 18precinct. Is it still in the district or is it out? 03:33PM 19

It is, and I'll remove it to show you. So because -- we 03:33PM 20 A.

looked and tried to figure out if corners counted as touching, 03:33PM 21and that's something that has, as far as we could tell, there 03:33PM 22was not very much case law and whether we could -- for example, 03:33PM 23in West Texas it was something that often we were wondering if 03:33PM 24there were two corners, would that be considered contiguous or 03:33PM 25


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not. And in order -- you know, and I think that out of an 03:33PM 1abundance of caution we decided that it was not, so in this case 03:33PM 2we had to cut this thoroughfare to be able to remove that 03:33PM 3precinct out. So let me zoom out, and just based on that, 03:33PM 4that's roughly what the district ended up looking like. 03:33PM 5

Before we leave House District 41, Mr. Interiano, have 03:33PM 6 Q.

you shown the Court all the precinct splits in House 03:34PM 7District 41? 03:34PM 8

No, sir. Like I mentioned, there were several other 03:34PM 9 A.

precincts, but those are the ones that I remember off the top of 03:34PM 10my head. You know, the two houses are obvious and that other 03:34PM 11democratic precinct was just one that we were trying to get out 03:34PM 12of the district and so it led to the -- to the split of the 03:34PM 13republican precinct below it. 03:34PM 14

MR. MORTARA: Unless the Court has further questions on 03:34PM 15House 41 I'd like to move on to a different topic. 03:34PM 16

JUDGE HOWELL: Well, if I could just ask about the 03:34PM 17precinct splits. Do you -- I mean, we've -- well, I've learned 03:34PM 18through the course of this about some of the difficulty it 03:34PM 19presents for local communities when there are precinct splits, 03:34PM 20and I know that there's no rule against precinct splits as there 03:34PM 21is a County Line Rule in the Texas Constitution, but did you have 03:34PM 22any understanding of a policy among map drawers or the Texas 03:34PM 23Legislative Council about precinct splits at all when you started 03:35PM 24this process? 03:35PM 25


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THE WITNESS: No, ma'am. I mean, you know, unfortunately, 03:35PM 1sometimes the precincts don't follow other lines. For example, 03:35PM 2sometimes major highways split a precinct, and then many times 03:35PM 3when I would visit with the members they thought that it was 03:35PM 4better for their constituents to know on the different side of 03:35PM 5the highway who represented rather than having these precincts 03:35PM 6that would jag and cause possibly even more confusion. 03:35PM 7

In some cases you followed city lines. Some of the city 03:35PM 8sometimes complained that, you know, if we split the cities they 03:35PM 9wanted to be kept whole. I guess part of it comes down to the 03:35PM 10fact that no one's advocating for a precinct, and you always have 03:35PM 11people advocating for, you know, on the SBOE map everybody was 03:35PM 12advocating for the school districts. The school districts were 03:35PM 13asking please don't split us up, try to keep us in as much as you 03:35PM 14can in a single SBOE district. And in this district it was the 03:35PM 15cities, the cities didn't want to be split. So you -- nobody is 03:35PM 16really in a position to ever advocate for the precincts 03:36PM 17themselves so they would often get changed for a variety of 03:36PM 18reasons, and like, you know, sometimes it was just trying to keep 03:36PM 19a straight line and we'd pick a road and follow that road. 03:36PM 20BY MR. MORTARA:03:36PM 21

Mr. Interiano, if there are no further questions on 03:36PM 22 Q.

House 41, I think we went over this a little bit the first time 03:36PM 23you were here but now the Court's had a week and a half of 03:36PM 24evidence. 03:36PM 25


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Did you ever use ethnic shading when you were drawing the 03:36PM 1House map? 03:36PM 2

No, sir. Certainly -- certainly -- well, yes, I did use 03:36PM 3 A.

ethnic shading.03:36PM 4What kind of ethnic information would you shade for? 03:36PM 5 Q.

95, 97 percent of the time it was SSVR. 03:36PM 6 A.

And why did you use SSVR shading? 03:36PM 7 Q.

Because of the citizenship questions in the State of 03:36PM 8 A.

Texas, the two numbers that we looked at were SSVR and CVAP 03:36PM 9which is citizenship voting age population. CVAP is not 03:37PM 10available either as a statistic or as shading within RedAppl. 03:37PM 11We would have to run the report periodically with Legislative 03:37PM 12Council to get that, and SSVR is a function of the election 03:37PM 13information that we had, and the one that we had available to us 03:37PM 14was SSVR. 03:37PM 15

Did you ever use Hispanic voting age population shading? 03:37PM 16 Q.

No, sir. 03:37PM 17 A.

Why not? 03:37PM 18 Q.

You know, I think David Hanna and I had several e-mails 03:37PM 19 A.

about it. Basically you can have a district where SSVR is 03:37PM 20above 50 -- I'm sorry, where the HVAP is above 50 percent but 03:37PM 21because of the citizenship issues, the SSVR or the CVAP in that 03:37PM 22district could be in the teens or in the 20s where we knew that 03:37PM 23the HVAP was not going to make a difference in a state like 03:37PM 24Texas. The number that we knew was an effective number -- and, 03:37PM 25


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again, like I said earlier, in many ways because that was what 03:37PM 1we gathered from the letter from DOJ was SSVR, so 95 percent of 03:37PM 2the time was -- was SSVR. 03:38PM 3

Could you tell the Court about an instance where you 03:38PM 4 Q.

remember drawing the map where you used SSVR shading? 03:38PM 5Yes, and specifically, that was the Harris County 03:38PM 6 A.

amendments. 03:38PM 7Could you show the Court what you did in those instances? 03:38PM 8 Q.

Sure. I'm going to close out of this, and I'm going to 03:38PM 9 A.

open H283, which was the map that was passed by the legislature. 03:38PM 10Mr. Interiano, is RedAppl always this slow? 03:39PM 11 Q.

Yes, unfortunately. So I'm going to zoom in on Harris 03:39PM 12 A.

County, and I'm going to particularly zoom in on two districts, 03:39PM 13District 148 and District 145. If you'll follow the cursor on 03:39PM 14the map, it's a little bit unclear, so I'll show you first the 03:39PM 15outline. So this right here is District 148 and it goes down to 03:39PM 16this piece right here (indicating). District 145 stretches from 03:39PM 17down here and goes all the way up here. I'm going to zoom in on 03:39PM 18this middle area first. 03:39PM 19

So that area right there is literally down to the block 03:40PM 20level. It's about three block on each side. That's how thin it 03:40PM 21gets and I'll show you why in a second when I turn on the SSVR 03:40PM 22shading. So I'm going to zoom out so you can see where the 03:40PM 23concentration of voters that are SSVR are at. So you have a 03:40PM 24large population over here and then you have some right here 03:40PM 25


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(indicating). This 143 I believe is Ms. Hernandez Luna, 145 is 03:40PM 1Ms. Alvarado and 148 is Ms. Farrar. So in order to keep both 03:40PM 2145 and 148 above the 50 percent SSVR mark, we had to cut the 03:41PM 3precincts right here (indicating), and both of them -- both 03:41PM 4districts as a thoroughfare. The goal was, you know, keeping 03:41PM 5both of the districts above that 50 percent benchmark and the 03:41PM 6only way we could do it was by splitting precincts to get to 03:41PM 7those populations and to get the districts. It would have been 03:41PM 8very easy to keep 145 wholly contained over here, but if we did 03:41PM 9that, then there was no way that 148 -- that we could get 148 03:41PM 10above that 50 percent benchmark. That's just one of the ones in 03:41PM 11148. 03:41PM 12

Another one of the ones that I was involved with is 03:41PM 13actually right up here, and this was between Ms. Hernandez Luna 03:41PM 14and Ms. Farrar. These -- let me turn on the precincts for you. 03:41PM 15So the precinct lines is this very light red line that you see, 03:41PM 16so this is a precinct over here and this is another precinct 03:42PM 17over here. This right here (indicating) is an entire community. 03:42PM 18Ms. Hernandez Luna wanted to keep that entire community in her 03:42PM 19district. Ms. Farrar was fine with that. But because of the 03:42PM 20concentration of SSVR voters in this region, if we removed that 03:42PM 21out of Ms. Farrar's district there was to way that we could find 03:42PM 22to keep it above 50 percent. I visited with her, Ms. -- with 03:42PM 23both of them, with Ms. Alvarado, to try to figure out if there 03:42PM 24was a way that all of us could work together to keep all three 03:42PM 25


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of those districts above 50 percent SSVR and we couldn't find a 03:42PM 1way to do that. So what we did is, that basically Ms. Farrar 03:42PM 2took -- we went down to the block level and we just started 03:42PM 3moving north, and until we met that 50 percent benchmark, we 03:42PM 4stopped, and we tried to keep a straight line there, again to 03:42PM 5try to facilitate it in some regard for the people that are 03:42PM 6living there, knowing who lives on what side of the -- of 03:42PM 7the county -- of the district line, and that was why those two 03:43PM 8precincts look the way that they are. 03:43PM 9

Mr. Interiano, to remind the Court, why was there a goal 03:43PM 10 Q.

to get House District 148 above 50 percent SSVR? 03:43PM 11As I said already, there was DOJ's letter that asked us 03:43PM 12 A.

to -- asked us to have 50 percent SSVR as one of the benchmarks 03:43PM 13and the other was the testimony that was given by MALDEF and by03:43PM 14Vice-Chairman Villarreal to try to get 90 and 148 above 03:43PM 1550 percent. 03:43PM 16

Was there an instance when you participated in the Harris 03:43PM 17 Q.

County -- withdrawn. 03:43PM 18Mr. Interiano, could you remind the Court at what point 03:43PM 19

you were participating in drawing Harris County? 03:43PM 20This was the day of the debate. So basically there were 03:43PM 21 A.

two amendments, one which lasted about two to -- well, both of 03:43PM 22them lasted about two or three hours to draft them. 03:43PM 23

And was there a -- was there another instance when you 03:43PM 24 Q.

were drawing Harris County during the debate where you split 03:43PM 25


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VTDs in a place that had nothing to do with SSVR issues? 03:44PM 1Yes. Let me remove the shading because it'll -- it'll 03:44PM 2 A.

make it move a little bit faster, and then I'll go back to the 03:44PM 3VTD level. So District 148, which is the one up here, is -- I'm 03:44PM 4sorry, 141 is Representative Senfronia Thompson's district. 03:44PM 5District 127, which is this one right here, is Dan Huberty's 03:44PM 6district. If you look at this precinct, it's split. And I'm 03:44PM 7going to put the block shading on there, the block outlines. 03:44PM 8That is the community in the City of Humble. Representative 03:44PM 9Thompson wanted to have that community and so did Representative 03:44PM 10Huberty. As we were drafting this amendment, the compromise was 03:44PM 11that because Representative Huberty had been very involved in 03:44PM 12the community -- I believe he was either on their school board 03:44PM 13or he was a city councilman, he had some very strong connections 03:45PM 14to Humble -- Ms. Thompson agreed to give him all of downtown. 03:45PM 15So the line that you see here literally follows all of the blocs 03:45PM 16in downtown and that's the portion that was given to 03:45PM 17Representative Huberty and the remainder was left in 03:45PM 18Representative Thompson's district. So that's an example of a 03:45PM 19precinct that was split just because of the preferences of the 03:45PM 20members. 03:45PM 21

JUDGE HOWELL: So it's clear from these three examples 03:45PM 22that you've shown us that you're aware of being able to drill 03:45PM 23down in the map to the block level and to do it with ethnic 03:45PM 24shading as well, SSVR shading, right?03:45PM 25


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MR. MORTARA: Mr. Interiano -- I can ask -- can you show 03:45PM 1Judge Howell the shading of SSVR, maybe back in Ms. Farrar's 03:45PM 2district at the block level? 03:45PM 3

JUDGE COLLYER: Well, why don't we just do it here. 03:45PM 4MR. MORTARA: We can do it here, too. 03:45PM 5THE WITNESS: We can. 03:45PM 6

BY MR. MORTARA:03:45PM 7Are there concentrations of Latino voters here? 03:45PM 8 Q.

We'll find out. So as you can see -- so -- I'll start 03:45PM 9 A.

with the shading item. The shading item is selected by 03:46PM 10population and by election, but when SSVR is a number that is 03:46PM 11driven by the Secretary of State's Office, so it's considered an 03:46PM 12election statistic. Election statistics can only be drawn down 03:46PM 13to the county in the VTD, which is why I've always said that I 03:46PM 14was not aware that you could go down to the block level on 03:46PM 15shading, because 95 percent of the time I was using SSVR, and 03:46PM 16the only level that you can go -- the lowest level that you can 03:46PM 17go on SSVR is VTD. 03:46PM 18

JUDGE COLLYER: Okay. So do that. 03:46PM 19THE WITNESS: So the shading, as you can see, is all the 03:46PM 20

same. 03:46PM 21JUDGE COLLYER: Okay. 03:46PM 22MR. MORTARA: Would Your Honor like Mr. Interiano to move 03:46PM 23

to an area of the map where it's different? 03:46PM 24JUDGE COLLYER: It was Judge Howell's question. 03:46PM 25


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JUDGE HOWELL: No, that's fine. 03:46PM 1BY MS. MORTARA: 03:46PM 2

Mr. Interiano, could you zoom out and show the SSVR 03:46PM 3 Q.

shading for more of Harris County?03:46PM 4Sure. So I'll zoom in an area where there's at least a 03:47PM 5 A.

contrast of color. So this is -- these are the block, but this 03:47PM 6is one precinct. All of the precincts are going to show the 03:47PM 7same color shading for the block level at the SSVR. You can't 03:47PM 8see shading for SSVR lower than the VTD.03:47PM 9

MR. MORTARA: Are there further questions on SSVR shading?03:47PM 10JUDGE COLLYER: No. 03:47PM 11

BY MS. MORTARA: 03:47PM 12Mr. Interiano, I'd like to talk very briefly about the 03:47PM 13 Q.

Congressional map. Who was the lead map drawer on the 03:47PM 14Congressional map? 03:47PM 15

Ryan Downton. 03:47PM 16 A.

And did you help Mr. Downton in any way on the 03:47PM 17 Q.

Congressional map? 03:47PM 18Yes. Periodically I would help him zero out two 03:47PM 19 A.

districts or three districts, whatever he needed. 03:47PM 20I think the Court knows what zero out means, but could 03:47PM 21 Q.

you explain it again just so we have it in the record? 03:47PM 22Sure. The districts had to be down to minus one person. 03:47PM 23 A.

I think there was a total of seven or eight districts that were 03:47PM 24minus one, and that was the total deviation that we could draw 03:48PM 25


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them, so we had to get them down to that -- that minute of a 03:48PM 1level of detail. 03:48PM 2

Mr. Interiano, I'd like to ask you to demonstrate the 03:48PM 3 Q.

process of zeroing out, and I'm going to ask you to do that on 03:48PM 4the Court-drawn interim map. 03:48PM 5

I'm going to close out of this and I'm going to open that 03:48PM 6 A.

map. And I apologize, it will take a little while again. 03:48PM 7And before you begin, Mr. Interiano, my question is: Is 03:48PM 8 Q.

the Court-drawn interim map already zeroed out? 03:48PM 9It's not. The Court is not required to zero out the 03:48PM 10 A.

districts but the State was. 03:48PM 11JUDGE COLLYER: And this is C220? 03:48PM 12THE WITNESS: Yes. 03:48PM 13MR. MORTARA: For the record, it's C220, the San Antonio 03:48PM 14

Court-drawn interim map -- or the first San Antonio Court-drawn 03:48PM 15interim map.03:48PM 16

THE WITNESS: So the area that I'm most familiar with and 03:48PM 17the area that Ryan eventually asked me to help him with was in 03:49PM 18zeroing out some of the populations in Bexar County. 03:49PM 19

And, Mr. Interiano, just as we're talking, we have stars 03:49PM 20 Q.

on the screen again. What are those? 03:49PM 21Right now those stars are still the House incumbents, but 03:49PM 22 A.

let me switch and show you the Congressional incumbents. So 03:49PM 23those stars right there is where the three members of Congress 03:49PM 24in San Antonio live. 03:49PM 25


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Does RedAppl enable you to show where their district 03:49PM 1 Q.

offices are? 03:49PM 2No, sir. 03:49PM 3 A.

I'm going to pull up the statistics and I'll pull up the 03:49PM 4three districts in Bexar County -- I'm sorry, the four 03:49PM 5districts. So as you can see down here, you have the four 03:49PM 6districts and then I'll pull up the statistics for them. So 03:50PM 7total population and deviation. So you can see, here's the 03:50PM 8deviation between those districts. So, you know, 20 is over 03:50PM 9216, 23 is under 261. So at this point -- oh, I'll have to turn 03:50PM 10on the labeling. So the labelling will tell us how many people 03:50PM 11are in whatever level we want, whether it's county, you know, or 03:50PM 12whatever statistic you want to use in there. So you have total 03:50PM 13population, and I'll go down to the block level, and I'll zoom 03:50PM 14in in an area, so this is between 23 and 20 right now -- 03:50PM 15

Mr. Interiano, I have a question. Where does zeroing out 03:50PM 16 Q.

usually occur in the Congressional map? 03:50PM 17We did it in the rural -- I'm sorry, in the urban areas, 03:50PM 18 A.

and the reason is you're not going to find -- you know, the 03:51PM 19precincts in the rural areas of even the major Metropolitan 03:51PM 20counties, the precincts are larger and therefore the blocs are 03:51PM 21larger so you're not going to find the zero, one, two, the 03:51PM 22single digits that you need to zero it out. The easiest place 03:51PM 23to find those lower numbers is in the very urban areas where you 03:51PM 24have a great deal of options. I wish that there was software 03:51PM 25


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that showed us where these numbers are, but in RedAppl that's 03:51PM 1not available. So as I zoom in, you'll see that this is the 03:51PM 2number of people that are in 23 and in 20 in these blocs. So 03:51PM 3what I would have to do is I'd go down the line and just follow 03:51PM 4the line -- so, for example, here I found an 84 and 20, so 03:51PM 5because 20 is the one that's overpopulated, I would move the 84 03:51PM 6into 23. 03:51PM 7

And just for the record, and for the Court's benefit if 03:51PM 8 Q.

it's not clear, this is just a demonstration, right, 03:52PM 9Mr. Interiano? 03:52PM 10

Yes, sir. So I'm going to continue and you're just 03:52PM 11 A.

trying to find the small ones, so now it's -- now I know that 03:52PM 12it's 132 that's over, and you just have to go down the line. 03:52PM 13So, for example, here's a 46 but the only way to get to the 46 03:52PM 14is if I pick up the 964, so it has to be something that is 03:52PM 15contiguous for us to be able to put it in. And the result of 03:52PM 16this is that you end up splitting probably more precincts in the 03:52PM 17process just because you're trying to find the single digit 03:52PM 18numbers. You know, you have a lot of zeroes over here, here's 03:52PM 19ten, and we would continue to go through that process until we 03:52PM 20got the districts to zero. 03:52PM 21

MR. MORTARA: Would Your Honors like Mr. Interiano to 03:52PM 22continue or do you think you have the point? 03:52PM 23

JUDGE COLLYER: I think we have the point. Do you have 03:52PM 24the point? 03:52PM 25


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JUDGE HOWELL: Uh-huh. 03:52PM 1JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you. 03:52PM 2MR. MORTARA: I have no further questions for 03:52PM 3

Mr. Interiano if the Court does not. 03:53PM 4JUDGE COLLYER: All right. Well, I'm not sure that we 03:53PM 5

might not have questions but does somebody else? 03:53PM 6MR. MORTARA: Mr. Interiano, could you hit the F10 key to 03:53PM 7

stop the recording, and we're going to begin again when Mr. Sells 03:53PM 8begins to question you. 03:53PM 9

With Your Honor's permission I will approach the computer 03:53PM 10and attend to the digital exhibit part of this exercise. 03:53PM 11

JUDGE COLLYER: Good. 03:53PM 12MR. MORTARA: Your Honor.03:54PM 13JUDGE COLLYER: Yes.03:54PM 14MR. MORTARA: I am afraid that the audio also recorded for 03:54PM 15

which I apologize. I hope that's not a problem. 03:54PM 16JUDGE COLLYER: Did we say anything embarrassing? 03:54PM 17MR. MORTARA: Not yet, Your Honor. I just want to make 03:54PM 18

clear for the record, would the Justice -- oh, Mr. Garza, would 03:54PM 19you like the audio recorded? I think fair is only fair but, Your 03:54PM 20Honor, I'll defer. 03:54PM 21

JUDGE COLLYER: It's up to you. 03:54PM 22MR. GARZA: It's of no consequence to me, Your Honor.03:54PM 23JUDGE COLLYER: It's of no consequence to Mr. Garza. 03:54PM 24MR. MORTARA: Mr. Garza, do you need the video recording? 03:54PM 25


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Are you going to ask him to use the computer or would like a 03:54PM 1video exhibit? 03:54PM 2

MR. GARZA: I am not likely to have him use the computer. 03:54PM 3MR. MORTARA: Then we'll hold this in abeyance until 03:54PM 4

Mr. Sells needs it if that's okay, Your Honor? 03:54PM 5JUDGE COLLYER: That's fine. 03:54PM 6Mr. Garza, go ahead. 03:55PM 7MR. GARZA: Yes, Your Honor. 03:55PM 8

RECROSS-EXAMINATION OF GERARDO INTERIANO03:53PM 9BY MR. GARZA:03:55PM 10

Jose Garza for the Mexican American Legislative Caucus. 03:55PM 11 Q.

Good afternoon, Mr. Interiano. 03:55PM 12Good afternoon, Mr. Garza. 03:55PM 13 A.

And I don't believe Ms. Perales is going to go ask you 03:55PM 14 Q.

questions this afternoon, so I must say, that is a beautiful 03:55PM 15tie. 03:55PM 16

Well, thank you, I'm flattered. 03:55PM 17 A.

Now, you've given -- just so the record is clear, you've 03:55PM 18 Q.

given testimony in this case at an earlier phase of the case; is 03:55PM 19that correct? 03:55PM 20

Yes, sir, that's correct. 03:55PM 21 A.

You testified in -- on direct about the -- in terms of 03:55PM 22 Q.

testifying for the State of Texas; is that correct? 03:55PM 23Yes, sir, that's correct. 03:55PM 24 A.

All right. And today you are here simply to demonstrate 03:55PM 25 Q.


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the manner in which you went about drawing the plans; is that 03:55PM 1correct? 03:55PM 2

Yes, sir. 03:55PM 3 A.

In many of the areas of the state, however, you have 03:55PM 4 Q.

testified earlier that those plans were drawn by members, and 03:55PM 5you only viewed them after they were done; is that correct? 03:55PM 6

That's correct, yes, sir. 03:56PM 7 A.

For instance in El Paso? 03:56PM 8 Q.

Yes, sir, that's correct. 03:56PM 9 A.

And you can't testify about whether maps were drawn with 03:56PM 10 Q.

racial shading to the block level when they were done by members 03:56PM 11of the legislature; is that correct? 03:56PM 12


All right. Now, you specifically testified today about 03:56PM 14 Q.

Hidalgo County and the manner in which the Hidalgo County maps 03:56PM 15were developed; is that correct? 03:56PM 16

Yes, sir. 03:56PM 17 A.

And you explained in your earlier testimony that you drew 03:56PM 18 Q.

those districts at the direction of Mr. Guillen and Mr. Peña; is 03:56PM 19that correct?03:56PM 20

Yes, correct.03:56PM 21 A.

Now, Mr. Peña, however, has given testimony in this case. 03:56PM 22 Q.

You're aware of that -- 03:56PM 23Yes. 03:56PM 24 A.

-- through deposition. And you're aware that Mr. Peña in 03:56PM 25 Q.


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his testimony said that he had very little to do with drawing 03:56PM 1the maps for Hidalgo County. You're aware of that? 03:56PM 2

Something to that effect, yes, sir. 03:57PM 3 A.

And, in fact, in his deposition he could explain of the 03:57PM 4 Q.

14 precinct cuts that were made in the map, maybe three or four 03:57PM 5of them. You're aware of that? 03:57PM 6

I was not aware of that, no, sir. 03:57PM 7 A.

Okay. So, during the -- his deposition, he was taken 03:57PM 8 Q.

through each one of the -- 03:57PM 9MR. MORTARA: Your Honor. 03:57PM 10JUDGE COLLYER: Yes. 03:57PM 11MR. MORTARA: I object. I think it's improper to impeach 03:57PM 12

one witness with another witness's fact testimony. Having said 03:57PM 13that, I don't mind if Mr. Garza describes Mr. Peña's testimony 03:57PM 14and asks Mr. Interiano what he thinks about it. I just don't 03:57PM 15think it should be shown to the witness, another witness's sworn 03:57PM 16testimony in the case. 03:57PM 17

JUDGE COLLYER: It's admitted, right? 03:57PM 18MR. GARZA: It is, Your Honor. It's Defendants' 03:58PM 19

Exhibit 785. 03:58PM 20JUDGE COLLYER: So, we're talking about showing this 03:58PM 21

witness an exhibit that's already been admitted and saying this 03:58PM 22is contrary to your testimony before, how do you explain it? 03:58PM 23

MR. GARZA: Your Honor, I think in the -- in the manner in 03:58PM 24which we are now proceeding, I think, rather than do that, 03:58PM 25


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because it's, like, 25 pages where they go -- 03:58PM 1JUDGE COLLYER: Let's not do that. 03:58PM 2MR. GARZA: I'll just -- what I'll do is I'll designate. 03:58PM 3

MALC's designation in this case has been very limited, so I'll 03:58PM 4just add the designation of Mr. Peña's deposition as contrary 03:58PM 5evidence to what Mr. -- 03:58PM 6

JUDGE COLLYER: And you can't summarize that? 03:58PM 7MR. GARZA: And you don't want me to summarize it? Oh, 03:58PM 8

no, no, no, I could summarize it and simply cite to it, 03:58PM 9certainly. 03:58PM 10

MR. MORTARA: To which we have no objection. 03:58PM 11JUDGE COLLYER: I would hope not. 03:58PM 12Sir, you couldn't say to Mr. Interiano, Your testimony is 03:58PM 13

different from Mr. Peña's who testified one, two, three and four, 03:59PM 14how do you explain that? 03:59PM 15

MR. GARZA: Excellent, Your Honor. 03:59PM 16JUDGE COLLYER: Why don't you do that? 03:59PM 17MR. GARZA: Yes, ma'am. Yes, Your Honor. 03:59PM 18

BY MR. GARZA:03:59PM 19Mr. Interiano, Mr. Peña, in fact, testified during his 03:59PM 20 Q.

deposition that he was only shown the map after it was nearly 03:59PM 21complete, rather than having any major role in this. How do you 03:59PM 22explain that in terms of your testimony that he directed the 03:59PM 23manner in which this map was drawn? 03:59PM 24

I think my testimony was that both Representative Peña 03:59PM 25 A.


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and Representative Guillen were present when this map was being 03:59PM 1drawn. I would not be able to agree with Representative Peña's 03:59PM 2comment that it was shown to him at the very end. But, as you 03:59PM 3can see today, once you drew the outline following the political 03:59PM 4data, that district looks very similar without district lines 03:59PM 5around it, to look like the final product. So if Representative 03:59PM 6Peña came in and I had a draft ready for him that looked similar 04:00PM 7to the way that it looked at the end, I could understand how he 04:00PM 8had made that comment. 04:00PM 9

And if Mr. Peña's testimony was actually that the only 04:00PM 10 Q.

person that showed him a map was Mr. Downton, you would disagree 04:00PM 11with that? 04:00PM 12

Yes, sir. 04:00PM 13 A.

Okay. And if Mr. Peña testified that he did not give 04:00PM 14 Q.

direction in terms of how the map was to be drawn, you would 04:00PM 15also disagree with that? 04:00PM 16

Yes, sir.04:00PM 17 A.

So one of you is not telling the truth under oath, if my 04:00PM 18 Q.

assumption is correct? 04:00PM 19MR. MORTARA: Objection, argumentative. 04:00PM 20JUDGE COLLYER: No, it's cross-examination. 04:00PM 21MR. GARZA: Indeed and it's gentle, even. 04:00PM 22JUDGE COLLYER: Cross-examination is argumentative. It's 04:00PM 23

okay. 04:00PM 24THE WITNESS: I -- I could not say what Representative 04:00PM 25


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Peña was referring to. I can only tell you that, in my 04:00PM 1experience, when we are drawing this district both Representative 04:00PM 2Peña and Representative Guillen were in the room. 04:00PM 3BY MR. GARZA:04:00PM 4

You've also previously testified that there wasn't any 04:00PM 5 Q.

manner in which you could draw the districts in Hidalgo County 04:01PM 6and violate the Voting Rights Act; isn't that correct? 04:01PM 7

As I think I -- if I recall correctly, I think what I 04:01PM 8 A.

said was that there was no way to draw the districts down there 04:01PM 9where they would be -- where you could create a district that 04:01PM 10was not majority/minority and as a result violate the Voting 04:01PM 11Rights Act. 04:01PM 12

And you've also testified that one of the people that you 04:01PM 13 Q.

relied on in terms of how you proceeded with this was the advice 04:01PM 14of Mr. Hanna, one of the principle attorneys at the Texas 04:01PM 15Legislative Council; is that correct? 04:01PM 16

Yes, sir. 04:01PM 17 A.

And isn't it, in fact, true that in evaluating the plans 04:01PM 18 Q.

as they were being developed, Mr. Hanna actually raised a 04:01PM 19concern about the manner in which the districts were drawn in 04:01PM 20Hidalgo County, that it raised questions of compliance with 04:02PM 21Section 5 and Section 2 of the Voting Rights Act? 04:02PM 22

I believe that he did and those were things that we 04:02PM 23 A.

looked at as well. 04:02PM 24All right. And you also testified that whenever 04:02PM 25 Q.


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Mr. Hanna raised a concern, whether it was in Hidalgo County or 04:02PM 1in Nueces County, that those concerns were addressed; is that 04:02PM 2correct? 04:02PM 3

I don't believe that I ever said that those concerns were 04:02PM 4 A.

addressed. I think that in some cases those concerns were 04:02PM 5addressed and other cases all that he would tell us was that 04:02PM 6further analysis was need. And in the areas where he said that 04:02PM 7further analysis was needed we did further analysis. So if you 04:02PM 8would consider addressing his concern by following those 04:02PM 9instruction, yes. 04:02PM 10

And did you have a discussion with him after you made 04:02PM 11 Q.

further inquiries or made changes about whether those satisfied 04:02PM 12his concerns? 04:02PM 13

I believe -- David and I would talk -- I mean, as the 04:02PM 14 A.

process moved on multiple times a day, and as we started to get 04:02PM 15the election analysis, he and I would often have conversations 04:02PM 16where I would tell him, you know, this district went from ten 04:03PM 17out of ten to eight out of ten, the one next to it went from 04:03PM 18eight out of ten to ten out of ten. So, yes, we would have 04:03PM 19conversations about that.04:03PM 20

And you were aware that he also gave testimony in this 04:03PM 21 Q.

case through deposition, are you not? 04:03PM 22Yes, sir. 04:03PM 23 A.

And are you aware that he was asked whether his concerns 04:03PM 24 Q.

with regard to Nueces County, with regard to Harris County, and 04:03PM 25


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with regard to Hidalgo County were ever resolved to his 04:03PM 1satisfaction and his answer was no, were you aware of that? 04:03PM 2

I'm not. 04:03PM 3 A.

Now, just to be clear, I don't think I need to get back 04:03PM 4 Q.

on RedAppl, but just so that the record is clear, you can do 04:03PM 5racial shading when you pull down the menu for population to the 04:03PM 6block level; isn't that correct? 04:03PM 7

That's correct, that's not something that I was aware of 04:03PM 8 A.

until I was on the stand last time. 04:04PM 9Okay. And you've also testified previously that you 04:04PM 10 Q.

spend over 1,000 hours, before the legislative session even 04:04PM 11began, training on the RedAppl; isn't that correct? 04:04PM 12

Yes, sir. 04:04PM 13 A.

And, in fact, you indicated that many people receive 04:04PM 14 Q.

training but only a select number received one-on-one training, 04:04PM 15and you received one-on-one training? 04:04PM 16

Yes, sir. 04:04PM 17 A.

And in that entire time, you want this Court to believe 04:04PM 18 Q.

that in those 1,000 hours of training on the RedAppl you never 04:04PM 19knew that racial shading could be done to the block level? 04:04PM 20

Yes, sir, and I can explain to you why. 04:04PM 21 A.

Well, let me ask you this.04:04PM 22 Q.

Sure.04:04PM 23 A.

When you pull down -- when you ask for shading based on 04:04PM 24 Q.

population, it drops down a menu; isn't that correct? 04:04PM 25


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And what you're telling the Court is that you never used 04:04PM 2 Q.

the population shading in any of your mapping? 04:04PM 3No, I'm not saying that. 04:04PM 4 A.

All right. And so when you drop-down that menu, it shows 04:05PM 5 Q.

at each level at which that shading can be done; isn't that 04:05PM 6true? 04:05PM 7

That's true, but let me clarify what happened in that. 04:05PM 8 A.

Okay.04:05PM 9 Q.

I -- what I would do is I was drawing during the 04:05PM 10 A.

process -- 04:05PM 11If you will, sir, you can -- 04:05PM 12 Q.

MR. MORTARA: Your Honor, could the witness be able to 04:05PM 13answer. 04:05PM 14

JUDGE COLLYER: No, this is cross-examination, you can 04:05PM 15redirect. That's the way it works. 04:05PM 16BY MR. GARZA:04:05PM 17

And you're aware, are you not, sir, that when you pull 04:05PM 18 Q.

down that shading, it has that you can do shade -- the 04:05PM 19population shading, that you can do shading at the county level, 04:05PM 20and at the VTD level, and at the census track level, and at the 04:05PM 21block group level, and at the block level, each one of those are 04:05PM 22shown on the map, on the screen; isn't that correct? 04:05PM 23

Yes, sir, I am now aware of that. 04:05PM 24 A.

MR. GARZA: Pass the witness, Your Honor. 04:05PM 25


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JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you, sir. Does anyone else have 04:05PM 1questions for this witness? 04:05PM 2

MR. HEBERT: Not on this side of the table. 04:05PM 3JUDGE COLLYER: None. 04:05PM 4MR. SELLS: I think we should get the video going, 04:05PM 5

Mr. Mortara. 04:06PM 6MR. MORTARA: Your Honor, with your permission could I 04:06PM 7

start the video? 04:06PM 8JUDGE COLLYER: Yes, please do so. Mr. Sells, you are 04:06PM 9

going to be quick, are you not? 04:06PM 10MR. SELLS: As quick as I can be, yes, Your Honor. I 04:06PM 11

think it shouldn't take very long. 04:06PM 12JUDGE COLLYER: Good. 04:06PM 13MR. MORTARA: Mr. Sells, with audio? 04:06PM 14MR. SELLS: Yes, please. 04:06PM 15

CROSS-EXAMINATION OF GERARDO INTERIANO04:06PM 16BY MR. SELLS:04:06PM 17

Mr. Interiano, does RedAppl have a help system? 04:06PM 18 Q.

It looks like it does, but I don't think I ever used it. 04:06PM 19 A.

Do you know how to access it? 04:06PM 20 Q.

I'm guessing it's that question mark on the right-hand 04:06PM 21 A.

side. 04:06PM 22Would you open that, please. 04:06PM 23 Q.

Sure. 04:06PM 24 A.

Do you see several options there on the left? 04:06PM 25 Q.


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Would you click on map features, please. I think you 04:06PM 2 Q.

have to double-click on it maybe to open it up. 04:07PM 3(Witness complying.)04:07PM 4 A.

And would you click on "Using Shading Information." 04:07PM 5 Q.

(Witness complying.)04:07PM 6 A.

Now, Mr. Interiano, doesn't this help text explain quite 04:07PM 7 Q.

clearly that it's possible to shade population data at the block 04:07PM 8level? You can read the entire text, if you want to.04:07PM 9

The entire text of that section or that paragraph? 04:07PM 10 A.

That -- this help section on shading. 04:07PM 11 Q.

Yes, sir, it does. 04:07PM 12 A.

But it's your testimony that in the thousands of hours of 04:07PM 13 Q.

training and use of RedAppl, you never looked at the help 04:08PM 14system? 04:08PM 15

No, sir, I didn't. That's why I would call David. 04:08PM 16 A.

Okay. Now, I'd like you to pull up H283, if you would. 04:08PM 17 Q.

And once that comes up, would you please zoom in on District 41. 04:08PM 18Sure. 04:08PM 19 A.

Now, I heard you say on direct that you almost never used 04:08PM 20 Q.

racial or ethnic shading, but that sometimes you did. Did I 04:08PM 21hear that correctly? 04:08PM 22

I said that I almost didn't and I think I did it very 04:08PM 23 A.

early on in the process, yes, sir. 04:08PM 24Okay, but you did do it at least once? 04:08PM 25 Q.


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At the VTD level, yes, sir. 04:09PM 1 A.

Okay. While this is loading, let me ask some other 04:09PM 2 Q.

questions about District 41. 04:09PM 3It's loaded if you'd like. 04:09PM 4 A.

Okay. Let's go ahead and zoom in on 41. 04:09PM 5 Q.

You said, Mr. Interiano, that you had political data on 04:09PM 6the screen and you were trying to look at, I think it was 04:09PM 7McCain, Abbott, and Perry, those three races that you recall 04:09PM 8from constructing 41? 04:09PM 9

Those were the three that I recall, but like I said 04:09PM 10 A.

before, it just depended on what the members wanted to look at. 04:09PM 11And you were successful in creating a district in which 04:09PM 12 Q.

McCain, Perry, and Abbott won, weren't you? 04:09PM 13I don't believe they did. I believe that Perry and 04:10PM 14 A.

McCain both lost. 04:10PM 15Perry and McCain and you said that Perry was the low 04:10PM 16 Q.

watermark? 04:10PM 17Yes, sir -- no, actually, I think McCain was the low 04:10PM 18 A.

watermark. 2008 was obviously a -- there was less of a turnout 04:10PM 19of republicans and republicans tended to do better in 2010. 04:10PM 20

And which Perry race did you --04:10PM 21 Q.

2010. I mean, those were three that I recalled off the 04:10PM 22 A.

top of my head. There were probably other races that he we 04:10PM 23looked at, but those were the three that most members came to me 04:10PM 24throughout the process where they were very common. 04:10PM 25


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And I thought I heard you testify that those were the 04:10PM 1 Q.

ones that you used in drawing this district? 04:10PM 2Yes, sir, those were the ones that I recall using in this 04:10PM 3 A.

district. 04:10PM 4Okay. What I'd like for you to do first is very slowly 04:10PM 5 Q.

to turn on ethnic shading on this map. Can you do that for me? 04:10PM 6Under which demographic? 04:10PM 7 A.

Let's use Hispanic VAP. 04:10PM 8 Q.

Okay. 04:10PM 9 A.

And just do it very slowly. So you're clicking on 04:10PM 10 Q.

shading? 04:11PM 11Yes, sir. 04:11PM 12 A.

And next you click on population? 04:11PM 13 Q.

Yes, sir. 04:11PM 14 A.

And now you're going to add Hispanic VAP? 04:11PM 15 Q.

Okay. 04:11PM 16 A.

What do you do next? 04:11PM 17 Q.

You go to shading and you select Hispanic voting age 04:11PM 18 A.

population. 04:11PM 19And what do you do next? 04:11PM 20 Q.

You go to level. 04:11PM 21 A.

Stop. 04:11PM 22 Q.

Okay. 04:11PM 23 A.

That's the same drop-down you would get any time you 04:11PM 24 Q.

turned on Hispanic voting age population shading, and, in fact, 04:11PM 25


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that's the same drop-down you would get any time you turn on any 04:11PM 1population shading, correct? 04:11PM 2

Any population shading, yes, sir, but as I mentioned 04:11PM 3 A.

earlier, I had never used Hispanic voting age population 04:11PM 4anywhere in the map. 04:11PM 5

And it includes shading options at the block level, 04:11PM 6 Q.

correct? 04:12PM 7In Hispanic voting age population it has -- they have 04:12PM 8 A.

since been brought to my attention that you can do that at the 04:12PM 9block level, yes, sir.04:12PM 10

These are the steps that you would go through when 04:12PM 11 Q.

shading any population, correct? 04:12PM 12Well, but as I mentioned, when we shaded we were looking 04:12PM 13 A.

at SSVR. 04:12PM 14If you wanted to shade for any population variable, these 04:12PM 15 Q.

are the items that would appear on the drop-down; isn't that 04:12PM 16right? 04:12PM 17

Yes, sir, but like I said, we did not shade using HVAP. 04:12PM 18 A.

I'd like you now to use the statistics bar at the bottom 04:12PM 19 Q.

to pull up the three races that you talked about, the Perry, 04:12PM 20McCain, and Abbott, and I'd also like you to put in the 04:12PM 21statistics bar at the bottom Hispanic voting age population. 04:12PM 22

Sure.04:12PM 23 A.

Can you do that for me? 04:12PM 24 Q.

Do you want a percentage or a total? 04:13PM 25 A.


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Percentage. 04:13PM 1 Q.

Actually, Mr. Interiano, let's do both, percentage and 04:13PM 2totals since we have enough space. We'll scroll. 04:13PM 3

Hispanic -- not Hispanic total population but Hispanic 04:13PM 4VAP and Hispanic VAP percentage.04:13PM 5

In which three elections? 04:13PM 6 A.

The three that you used when you were constructing this 04:13PM 7 Q.

district.04:13PM 8What would you like for me to do next? 04:14PM 9 A.

I'm waiting for the statistics to appear at the bottom. 04:14PM 10 Q.

For District 41? 04:14PM 11 A.

41, yes, please. Would you scroll to the right. 04:14PM 12 Q.


So, we see that Abbott in District 41 did win, Perry was 04:14PM 14 Q.

very close; and McCain did not succeed, correct? 04:14PM 15Yes, sir. 04:14PM 16 A.

Okay. That's what that information tells you -- 04:14PM 17 Q.

Yes. 04:14PM 18 A.

-- as you're drawing the district? 04:14PM 19 Q.

Now, would you turn on the partisan shading that you used 04:14PM 20when you were drawing this district. 04:14PM 21


Is it on? 04:15PM 23 Q.

Yes, sir. 04:15PM 24 A.

Okay. Are there any other statistics that were essential 04:15PM 25 Q.


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to you in the statistics bar that we should add before we start 04:15PM 1clicking on things? 04:15PM 2

If anything, I would say remove. I was never looking at 04:15PM 3 A.

either HVAP or Hispanic voting age population total. 04:15PM 4Okay. Is there anything we need to add for you to be 04:15PM 5 Q.

able to start clicking? 04:15PM 6No, sir. 04:15PM 7 A.

Okay. I'd like to model on the block level. Do you know 04:15PM 8 Q.

what I mean? 04:15PM 9Yes, sir. 04:15PM 10 A.

Or assign, I guess, is the term here. And would you 04:16PM 11 Q.

scroll with me so that the HVAP is apparent in the window that 04:16PM 12we're looking at in this statistics bar? 04:16PM 13

Yes, sir. 04:16PM 14 A.

Now, I'd like -- I don't know if this still works. Would 04:16PM 15 Q.

you unsplit -- it does not -- the precinct at the top of the 04:16PM 16screen? 04:16PM 17

Which one? 04:16PM 18 A.

I think it's Precinct 105, but -- 04:16PM 19 Q.

This one right here (indicating)? 04:16PM 20 A.

Yes, it's that one.04:16PM 21 Q.

So you want me to go back to the precinct level for 04:16PM 22 A.

assignment? 04:16PM 23No. I want you to add this block or these blocs in this 04:16PM 24 Q.

appendage -- and I can't mark -- but it's the peach-colored 04:16PM 25


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appendage just at the north end of District 41. 04:17PM 1JUDGE COLLYER: Why don't you show him. If you show him 04:17PM 2

his screen and he makes a change, it will be evident to what you 04:17PM 3pointed in the record. 04:17PM 4

THE WITNESS: You want me to add that where? 04:17PM 5BY MR. SELLS:04:17PM 6

Back into District 41 -- 40, excuse me. 04:17PM 7 Q.

That is in District 41. 04:17PM 8 A.

I'm sorry, take it out. I was right the first time, add 04:17PM 9 Q.

it back into District 40.04:17PM 10(Witness complying.)04:17PM 11 A.

Have your Hispanic numbers changed at the bottom of the 04:17PM 12 Q.

screen? 04:17PM 13I didn't see what it was previously. 04:17PM 14 A.

I'll represent to you that previously the Hispanic VAP 04:18PM 15 Q.

was 85093. 04:18PM 16Sure. 04:18PM 17 A.

Let's add it back in to District 41. 04:18PM 18 Q.


Do you see how that number changes as you click block by 04:18PM 20 Q.

block and move each block? 04:18PM 21Yes, sir. 04:18PM 22 A.

So, in fact, you don't actually need racial shading on in 04:18PM 23 Q.

order to know the impact of splitting precincts; isn't that 04:18PM 24right? 04:18PM 25


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You're assuming that you only split a precinct for 04:18PM 1 A.

demographic or political reasons. As I've mentioned, you split 04:18PM 2a precinct for a wide variety of reasons. 04:18PM 3

Mr. Interiano, I'm not assuming anything. I am asking 04:18PM 4 Q.

you: You can be aware of the racial impact of a precinct split 04:18PM 5without using racial shading, isn't that what you've just 04:18PM 6demonstrated? 04:19PM 7

Yes, sir, you're right. I think that you can. That's 04:19PM 8 A.

not something that I was aware of at this time as I mentioned 04:19PM 9before.04:19PM 10

You weren't aware that you could have a running total of 04:19PM 11 Q.

population as you clicked on blocs? Is that what your testimony 04:19PM 12is?04:19PM 13

No, sir. I said that I think you could do it. You could 04:19PM 14 A.

have a running total of population. What my testimony was, that 04:19PM 15my belief was when you were changing the shading and when you 04:19PM 16were changing, even the total VAP, I believed that when you 04:19PM 17picked the block, it did not -- that it took a -- I'll give you 04:19PM 18an example, if a block was 50 percent republican -- I'm sorry, 04:19PM 19if a precinct was 50 percent republican, my belief was that 04:19PM 20every block that you chose was going to reflect a 50 percent for 04:19PM 21the same across the board. 04:19PM 22

Since we did not use total population anywhere, with the 04:19PM 23exception of the total population statistic, that wasn't 04:20PM 24something that we ever saw. But, yes, I'm aware that you can do 04:20PM 25


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that. 04:20PM 1MR. SELLS: Your Honor, may I have a moment to consult? 04:20PM 2JUDGE COLLYER: Yes. 04:20PM 3(Discussion had off the record.) 04:21PM 4

BY MR. SELLS:04:21PM 5Mr. Interiano, which Congressional districts did you zero 04:21PM 6 Q.

out? 04:21PM 7I -- I don't recall which specific ones. Like I said, 04:21PM 8 A.

the ones that I specifically recall were San Antonio, because I 04:21PM 9was familiar with Bexar County. 04:21PM 10

Any other areas that you can remember? 04:21PM 11 Q.

Not that I recall. I'm sorry. 04:21PM 12 A.

Now, zeroing out is a painstaking process, correct? 04:21PM 13 Q.

Yes, sir. 04:21PM 14 A.

And if there were -- withdrawn. 04:21PM 15 Q.

I think I heard you testify that you don't know where 04:22PM 16district offices of the House members are on RedAppl? 04:22PM 17

I said that that was not an overlay that was provided to 04:22PM 18 A.

us in RedAppl, yes, sir. 04:22PM 19Did you know that information outside of RedAppl? 04:22PM 20 Q.

Well, sure. You could have looked up every district 04:22PM 21 A.

office for every individual member. 04:22PM 22Did you look it up? 04:22PM 23 Q.

No, sir. 04:22PM 24 A.

So, in order to remove Congressional offices, district 04:22PM 25 Q.


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offices from a district, one would have to have outside 04:23PM 1information, correct? 04:23PM 2

Well, yes, but I don't think that anybody ever went 04:23PM 3 A.

through the process of removing district offices. 04:23PM 4So, if the minority members of Congress had their 04:23PM 5 Q.

district offices removed, in your opinion, that would just be 04:23PM 6coincidence? 04:23PM 7

Yes, sir, and I'll give you an example of one where we 04:23PM 8 A.

noticed that it was coincidence. One of the -- actually, it was 04:23PM 9the absolute last amendment to the State House map, no one, 04:23PM 10including the member themselves, had noticed that their district 04:23PM 11office was left out of their district as the amendments and as 04:23PM 12the process was moving forward. Representative Alma Allen 04:23PM 13approached us on the House floor, pointed out to us that her 04:23PM 14district office had accidentally been removed. We met with the 04:23PM 15member whose district it was in, they agreed on an amendment and 04:24PM 16it was put back in. It was something that was pure coincidence. 04:24PM 17

And all of the others ones are also pure coincidence? 04:24PM 18 Q.

Yes, sir. 04:24PM 19 A.

Mr. Interiano, you drew the chairman's map, correct? 04:24PM 20 Q.

What are you referring to as the chairman's map? 04:24PM 21 A.

H113. 04:25PM 22 Q.

I put the pieces together for H113, yes, sir. 04:25PM 23 A.

And for House District 41 you drew that one as well, in 04:25PM 24 Q.

the chairman's map? 04:25PM 25


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And it's true that there were only four splits in House 04:25PM 2 Q.

District 41 in the chairman's map, correct? 04:25PM 3If that's what you're telling me. I don't recall the 04:25PM 4 A.

different phases of those changes. 04:25PM 5MR. SELLS: Your Honor, the chairman's map is Exhibit 04:25PM 6

DX660. 04:25PM 7JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you, sir.04:25PM 8MR. SELLS: Tim, do you have Plaintiff's Exhibit 164 ready 04:25PM 9

to show? 04:26PM 10MR. MELLETT: Yes.04:26PM 11MR. SELLS: Okay. Is this it?04:26PM 12MR. MELLETT: Yes.04:26PM 13

BY MR. SELLS:04:26PM 14Mr. Interiano, I'd like you to look at what was marked as 04:26PM 15 Q.

Plaintiff's Exhibit 164. 04:26PM 16(Witness complies.)04:26PM 17 A.

MR. SELLS: Mr. Mortara, do we need to stop the 04:26PM 18recording at this point? 04:26PM 19

MR. MORTARA: Yes, we can stop it. 04:26PM 20(Brief pause in proceedings.) 04:26PM 21

BY MR. SELLS:04:27PM 22Mr. Interiano, do you recognize this e-mail? 04:27PM 23 Q.

Yes, sir. 04:27PM 24 A.

And it is copied to you from Congressman Smith? 04:27PM 25 Q.


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To Eric Opiela? 04:27PM 2 Q.


And in your words, what is this dispute about? 04:27PM 4 Q.

Eric was very upset because at this point we were not 04:27PM 5 A.

listening to him anymore. He had wanted to make some more 04:27PM 6changes, we disagreed with him on the changes and what he was 04:27PM 7proposing and we decided to move in a different direction and he 04:27PM 8was frustrated with the State legislature. 04:27PM 9

And specifically, you wanted Congressional District 35 to 04:27PM 10 Q.

be above a certain threshold, correct? 04:27PM 11But I don't believe this is what this e-mail is about. 04:27PM 12 A.

35 is in the same area in general as 20 and 23 and 04:28PM 13 Q.

changes to 35 would have ripples in those districts, wouldn't 04:28PM 14they? 04:28PM 15

They would have, but what Eric was referring to in this 04:28PM 16 A.

e-mail if I recall correctly is, he had been able to get CD20 to 04:28PM 17the benchmark, which he refers to 58.1 by taking CD20 out of 04:28PM 18San Antonio and out of Bexar County, and therefore there would 04:28PM 19have been no district entirely within Bexar County. This was 04:28PM 20something that we felt was unnecessary and certainly the speaker 04:28PM 21did not support. He believed that it was important for Bexar 04:28PM 22County to continue to have this district and we told him we were 04:28PM 23not going to do what he was requesting. 04:28PM 24

MR. SELLS: Those are all my questions. 04:29PM 25


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JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you. I have some questions before 04:29PM 1you do. I don't quite understand leaving this exhibit on the 04:29PM 2screen for the moment.04:29PM 3

What was it that Mr. -- is it Opiela? 04:29PM 4THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am. 04:29PM 5JUDGE COLLYER: What was it that Mr. Opiela wanted to 04:29PM 6

accomplish by taking Congressional District 20 out of Bexar 04:29PM 7County and San Antonio? 04:29PM 8

THE WITNESS: He wanted to get it back up to that -- to 04:29PM 9the exact benchmark that it was, 58.1 SSVR. We told him that we 04:29PM 10didn't believe that, first of all, that it was necessary for us 04:29PM 11to take it -- to take it back to 58.1 because we had looked at 04:29PM 12the election analysis and we felt that the combination of those 04:29PM 13two did not provide any problems for District 20. His fear was 04:29PM 14that if you didn't take 20 back to 58.1 we would have gotten 04:29PM 15challenged by the Department of Justice, and we told him that we 04:30PM 16just didn't feel that was the case. 04:30PM 17

JUDGE COLLYER: Okay. Now, your reference there in your 04:30PM 18testimony earlier somewhere, deposition, references talking to 04:30PM 19the speaker and others. You indicate in your deposition that any 04:30PM 20time that Mr. Hanna brought something to you, it was something we 04:30PM 21discussed among ourselves on the committee. 04:30PM 22

So, who on the committee would discuss something with you? 04:30PM 23THE WITNESS: I would -- I guess I should have been clear 04:30PM 24

and said the committee staff. I would take that to Ryan Downton. 04:30PM 25


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At that point we would either go and talk to -- and when I say 04:30PM 1"committee staff," I use that very broadly. We would have 04:30PM 2included Baker Botts in those conversations, and depending on 04:30PM 3what recommendation we had with that, we'd either take it, you 04:30PM 4know, 90 percent of the time to Chairman Solomons and if the 04:30PM 5chairman felt that it was necessary taking it to the speaker -- 04:30PM 6

JUDGE COLLYER: So what you're saying is, that if a 04:30PM 7decision had to be made between A and B, either Chairman Solomons 04:30PM 8or the speaker -- Speaker Straus made that decision? 04:31PM 9

THE WITNESS: I wouldn't say that was always the case. I 04:31PM 10think that in the vast majority of the process of drawing, the 04:31PM 11decision was made by the staff. It was when it was a decision 04:31PM 12that we were not comfortable making that we would take to the 04:31PM 13members. 04:31PM 14

JUDGE COLLYER: And so you realized, therefore, that 04:31PM 15you're getting setup here? If this Court were -- and this is 04:31PM 16purely hypothetical because we haven't reached even the end of 04:31PM 17the evidence, much less the analysis -- but if this Court were to 04:31PM 18agree with the defendants that there was a discriminatory purpose 04:31PM 19behind these maps, it would be your purpose they're talking 04:31PM 20about, because you're the only witness giving us reasons for 04:31PM 21anything. Do you realize that? 04:31PM 22

THE WITNESS: I do, and I also -- I guess -- 04:31PM 23JUDGE COLLYER: I mean, Texas told us at the beginning 04:31PM 24

that their case rises and falls on your credibility. 04:31PM 25


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THE WITNESS: I do, that's quite a bit of pressure. 04:32PM 1JUDGE COLLYER: Yeah. 04:32PM 2THE WITNESS: But, and I guess if I may. 04:32PM 3JUDGE COLLYER: But, I mean, I have to say, I find it 04:32PM 4

difficult to imagine in such a intense environment that the staff 04:32PM 5made such decisions without input from the speaker and 04:32PM 6Mr. Solomons. I just -- I mean, I'm not -- that is not -- that 04:32PM 7isn't consistent with any experience I've ever had before. 04:32PM 8

THE WITNESS: I guess I would say a couple of things. I 04:32PM 9think, one, I think individuals as a whole or the public as a 04:32PM 10whole tends to be surprised about the role that staff plays in 04:32PM 11legislative offices, and I would speak coming from the 04:32PM 12Congressional side. 04:32PM 13

JUDGE COLLYER: And I don't think it's just the public as 04:32PM 14a whole, believe me. 04:32PM 15

THE WITNESS: And I'm sorry. I didn't -- I didn't mean to 04:32PM 16say that. 04:32PM 17

JUDGE COLLYER: It's okay. It's okay. I'm not insulted 04:32PM 18at that. I agree with you, but I am not the public as a whole. 04:32PM 19

THE WITNESS: But I also think that there were very few 04:32PM 20situations where there was a need to take something to Solomons 04:32PM 21or the speaker. The direction -- the directive that we had was 04:32PM 22to always have the members work it out amongst themselves. And 04:33PM 23I'll give you examples where I would often tell members, you 04:33PM 24know, ask all three members where they knew that there was going 04:33PM 25


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to be a disagreement. They would come downstairs, come into the 04:33PM 1office and they would not leave until we found a solution. 04:33PM 2

JUDGE COLLYER: But this did not include minority members? 04:33PM 3THE WITNESS: Yes, it did. I mean, I think a perfect 04:33PM 4

example of that was those amendments. 04:33PM 5JUDGE COLLYER: Okay. Now, is it right that adjustments 04:33PM 6

were made when a representative -- and I'm not sure, because the 04:33PM 7list was long, whether I'm talking House or Congressional or 04:33PM 8Representative, so I'll just say Representative, okay? 04:33PM 9

THE WITNESS: Sure. 04:33PM 10JUDGE COLLYER: When a representative said, Oh, I want the 04:33PM 11

line drawn across the street to get my granddaughter's school, 04:33PM 12can you do that, and you would say, sure, right? 04:33PM 13

THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am.04:33PM 14JUDGE COLLYER: Okay. And somebody else said something 04:33PM 15

like, I'd like the country club, I think was one of the examples, 04:33PM 16or some big business or something, I want that in my district and 04:34PM 17you'd say sure? 04:34PM 18

THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am. 04:34PM 19JUDGE COLLYER: So when -- now, I'm going to say this 04:34PM 20

wrong, Representative Johnson, the Congresswoman who was here, 04:34PM 21was that her name? Representative Johnson said I want the 04:34PM 22engine, that is, the commercial engine of my district to remain 04:34PM 23the same, you didn't say sure? 04:34PM 24

THE WITNESS: I -- I don't believe I was ever told that by 04:34PM 25


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Representative Johnson. 04:34PM 1JUDGE COLLYER: Well, that's handy. Okay. But she told 04:34PM 2

it to us and she said she told it to the map drawers, but that 04:34PM 3wasn't you? 04:34PM 4

THE WITNESS: No, ma'am. I had very early on in the 04:34PM 5process, I met with all the Congressional staffs and they -- my 04:34PM 6door was always open and I mean, I talked to Congressman 04:34PM 7Gonzales' staff. I talked to Congressman, I believe, Cuellar's 04:34PM 8staff as well. But I did not ever have a conversation with -- 04:35PM 9what Representative Johnson may have been referring to, and what 04:35PM 10would often to happen to us with regards to the Congressional 04:35PM 11map, is that very early on in the process when Eric Opiela went 04:35PM 12to go work for the Congressional delegation, it was always my 04:35PM 13understanding that he was communicating with both the republican 04:35PM 14delegation as well as the democrat delegation because they were 04:35PM 15working on a compromise map, so she might have been referring to 04:35PM 16Eric and -- when she said that she was talking about the map 04:35PM 17drawers. 04:35PM 18

JUDGE COLLYER: Except the map ended up to be the map 04:35PM 19coming out of the House, even the map for the Congress, was the 04:35PM 20map ultimately coming from the House side of the staff, you and 04:35PM 21Mr. Downton, not from the Senate side of the staff, right? 04:35PM 22

THE WITNESS: Correct, but Eric worked for the 04:35PM 23Congressional delegation. 04:35PM 24

JUDGE COLLYER: Right. Right. Now, what about the -- 04:35PM 25


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Mr. Opiela's suggestion that you design districts that have the 04:35PM 1lowest possible Hispanic turnout and the highest possible 04:36PM 2Hispanic population and thought that that was the way to do it, 04:36PM 3and it would appear that on occasion that was done because that 04:36PM 4was the result? 04:36PM 5

THE WITNESS: From -- I mean, I've seen that e-mail 04:36PM 6several times now. 04:36PM 7

JUDGE COLLYER: Right. 04:36PM 8THE WITNESS: In that e-mail -- 04:36PM 9JUDGE COLLYER: I knew you knew which one I meant. 04:36PM 10THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am. 04:36PM 11JUDGE COLLYER: It's sort of shown up again and again.04:36PM 12THE WITNESS: In that e-mail I -- 04:36PM 13JUDGE COLLYER: Somebody has an exhibit number for me, I 04:36PM 14

know. But anyway, go ahead. 04:36PM 15THE WITNESS: In that e-mail when Eric -- I think I had 04:36PM 16

been on the job less than four weeks. I told Eric I had no idea 04:36PM 17what he was talking about because I literally did not know the 04:36PM 18statistics and the numbers and the ratios that he was referring 04:36PM 19to, and I asked him and I told him he would have to explain it to 04:36PM 20me eventually. That e-mail was over three months before we even 04:36PM 21got the census data. That conversation -- 04:36PM 22

JUDGE COLLYER: Oh, you started drawing maps before you 04:37PM 23got the census data, didn't you? 04:37PM 24

THE WITNESS: No, ma'am, it's impossible, because we don't 04:37PM 25


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have anything to draw off of. I practiced and I would practice 04:37PM 1on the 2000 data, but that there's nothing -- there -- RedAppl 04:37PM 2did not have even the estimates. The only thing on there was 04:37PM 32000 and then 2010. So I did -- I was not able to even begin 04:37PM 4drawing until February. 04:37PM 5

JUDGE COLLYER: Okay. So, we're back to my basic 04:37PM 6question, which is that if we were to determine that there was, 04:37PM 7in any part of this, a purpose that was contrary to the Voting 04:37PM 8Rights Act, it would either be because you were following the 04:37PM 9direction of the members and you didn't pay any attention to the 04:37PM 10Voting Rights Act and its requirements, or that you just drew it 04:37PM 11at somebody else's behest or you drew it yourself or something? 04:37PM 12I mean, I'm trying to figure out where you really fall on this, 04:38PM 13because everybody says you're really critical, your testimony, 04:38PM 14et cetera, et cetera, but you don't tell us anything about who 04:38PM 15decided anything, and there are a lot of critical decisions here 04:38PM 16which, at a minimum have political implications, that I would 04:38PM 17think politicians would want to decide. 04:38PM 18

THE WITNESS: And I would say I don't disagree with you at 04:38PM 19any degree, but what I would say is different about this process 04:38PM 20than maybe the way the redistricting has certainly been in the 04:38PM 21State of Texas and maybe elsewhere, is the directive that was 04:38PM 22given to all the members was to protect every member. So, in 04:38PM 23that regard, the political decisions were very much limited, 04:38PM 24because the members were working together on their own districts. 04:38PM 25


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There was never a goal or an intent to eliminate anybody in the 04:38PM 1State House. And I guess I can speak to the State House because 04:38PM 2that's the one that I was the most involved in. The goal was to 04:38PM 3work with as many members as we could, and as I've said, you 04:38PM 4know, I would bet that there's probably a 130, 135 members that 04:39PM 5would be happy with their districts. I visited with them. They 04:39PM 6told me that they wished that they could vote for the map, but 04:39PM 7that they were not able to because of the pressure that was being 04:39PM 8put on them. 04:39PM 9

And -- and I -- and I don't know if I've said this before, 04:39PM 10but I also firmly believe that if at any point in time some of 04:39PM 11the members of the democratic caucus believed that the map was 04:39PM 12going to fail and that it would go to the LRB, because at that 04:39PM 13point they would have no choice. I firmly believe that member -- 04:39PM 14democratic members would have voted for the map because they knew 04:39PM 15that they were a part of the process as much as anybody else was. 04:39PM 16You know, Bexar County is a perfect example. Those members all 04:39PM 17worked together and they made decisions amongst themselves. I 04:39PM 18was there to help the members and to facilitate the process, but 04:39PM 19in Bexar County you have a delegation of seven democrats and 04:39PM 20ten -- and three republicans and we were able to get nine of the 04:40PM 21ten to sign off on a map. In Travis County we got all six. In 04:40PM 22El Paso we got five. You know, so this was very much a process 04:40PM 23where I fully believed that members were a part of it and I would 04:40PM 24hope that if you were to talk to some of those members of the 04:40PM 25


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democratic caucus they would tell you that about me. I was very 04:40PM 1upfront with them -- 04:40PM 2

JUDGE COLLYER: The members of the democratic -- I don't 04:40PM 3know all the members of the democratic caucus and we've only 04:40PM 4heard the witnesses who have been called, so I can't comment on 04:40PM 5that, but I think that you've answered my question, so I'm okay. 04:40PM 6

THE WITNESS: Okay. 04:40PM 7JUDGE HOWELL: Well, can I just follow-up because you 04:40PM 8

mentioned Bexar County. 04:40PM 9THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am. 04:40PM 10JUDGE HOWELL: And we've heard testimony about the 04:40PM 11

Somerset community in Bexar County being moved? 04:40PM 12THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am. 04:40PM 13JUDGE HOWELL: And about the comparison of voter turnout 04:40PM 14

in Somerset versus others. And did you come up with the idea of 04:40PM 15moving Somerset because of SSVR data or did -- how did that 04:40PM 16happen? 04:41PM 17

THE WITNESS: So we gave the members, for example, in 04:41PM 18Bexar County, very broad guidelines and the first of which was 04:41PM 19all ten members are going to be a part of the process and all ten 04:41PM 20members of the delegation should have the opportunity to be 04:41PM 21re-elected. We did not want, you know, for example for the seven 04:41PM 22democrats to say we want to get rid of John Garza, and so that 04:41PM 23was about it. 04:41PM 24

As we went along through the process, then we realized the 04:41PM 25


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challenges, we started putting a few more ground rules. For 04:41PM 1example, Representative Garza's district, if I recall, was 50.4 04:41PM 2or 50.7 percent SSVR, and so at what point what he was asking for 04:41PM 3was a district that took him down below 50 percent, and at that 04:41PM 4point it was actually Representative Villarreal who told him, 04:41PM 5Hey, you can't drop your district below 50 percent. 04:41PM 6Representative Garza came to me and I said, No, he's right, we 04:41PM 7need to find a way to keep your district above 50 percent, have 04:41PM 8your staff continue working and trying to find how you can get 04:41PM 9it -- how you can keep it above 50 percent and maintain your 04:42PM 10other goals in the district, and work with the members. You 04:42PM 11know, Bexar County, I think, is in many ways a microcosm of how 04:42PM 12it should have always worked. And I don't -- since being that I 04:42PM 13didn't work with all the delegations, I don't know. But what 04:42PM 14Representative Villarreal did is he asked every member to give 04:42PM 15him their ideal district. He then copied all those districts 04:42PM 16into Bexar County and he overlapped them and he turned the areas 04:42PM 17that two members wanted in red, and the areas that no member had 04:42PM 18selected in yellow. We all went into a conference room and 04:42PM 19between the members, they would get together, figure out who was 04:42PM 20going to get the areas that overlapped, who was going to get the 04:42PM 21areas that were open, and eventually came a map where, you know, 04:42PM 22nine of the ten signed and the tenth, you know, it was something 04:42PM 23that came down to one precinct. And that was the process, you 04:42PM 24know. It was a very transparent process in to how the 04:42PM 25


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delegations worked, at least to my understanding. 04:42PM 1JUDGE COLLYER: All right. Thank you, sir. 04:43PM 2THE WITNESS: No problems. 04:43PM 3JUDGE COLLYER: Do you have any questions? 04:43PM 4MR. MORTARA: I just have one, Your Honor. 04:43PM 5JUDGE COLLYER: All right. 04:43PM 6FURTHER REDIRECT EXAMINATION OF GERARDO INTERIANO04:43PM 7

BY MR. MORTARA:04:43PM 8Mr. Interiano, you were questioned by Mr. Garza and then 04:43PM 9 Q.

Mr. Sells about shading and you remember Mr. Sells said, Oh, put 04:43PM 10Hispanic shading on and then he said and then you got to select 04:43PM 11a level and "Stop," and he showed a block on there. Do you 04:43PM 12remember that? 04:43PM 13

Yes, sir. 04:43PM 14 A.

You're running along the map, you're shading for SSVR or 04:43PM 15 Q.

Attorney General Abbott at the VTD level, and let's say you're 04:43PM 16right here and you're shading for Attorney General Abbott at the 04:43PM 17VTD level, please switch now to Hispanic voting age population 04:43PM 18shading, what drop-down do you click in? 04:43PM 19

You have to first select the shading item. 04:43PM 20 A.

And do you have to see the block? 04:44PM 21 Q.

No, sir, and, in fact, that's what I was trying to tell 04:44PM 22 A.

Mr. Garza, different people draw different ways. The way that I 04:44PM 23drew is -- again, because of my -- and now I realize my false 04:44PM 24belief that it was not available to us at the block level -- 04:44PM 25


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excuse me. I never changed this portion right here 04:44PM 1(indicating). This, I always left at VTD and I would just 04:44PM 2change it here based on the population and election analysis. 04:44PM 3So, to me, I -- I used VTD. I -- you know, for example, if I 04:44PM 4was in the -- in the rural counties, I might have gone to 04:44PM 5county, but for the most part, I'm -- I -- we never looked at 04:44PM 6the rural counties because my role in putting the rural 04:44PM 7districts together was a puzzle, so the only thing that I looked 04:44PM 8at was VTD. 04:44PM 9

MR. MORTARA: Thank you, Your Honor, I have no further 04:44PM 10questions. 04:44PM 11

JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you, sir. Thank you, sir. Thank 04:44PM 12you for coming back. 04:44PM 13

THE WITNESS: Thank you for having me. 04:44PM 14JUDGE HOWELL: Uh-huh. And you're making your flight. 04:45PM 15THE WITNESS: Yes, ma'am, thank you. I'm sure my wife 04:45PM 16

will appreciate it. 04:45PM 17MR. MORTARA: I appreciate it. 04:45PM 18JUDGE COLLYER: All right. Do we have another witness? 04:45PM 19MR. MORTARA: Your Honor, for me, it's the Court's option, 04:45PM 20

if Texas will take 15 minutes of its time if you'd like to start 04:45PM 21with Dr. Handley tomorrow, Texas also is fine if the Justice 04:45PM 22Department would like Dr. Handley to give her direct right now. 04:45PM 23

MR. MELLETT: The -- Your Honor, we believe that 04:45PM 24Dr. Handley is the only witness left and we would just -- we 04:45PM 25


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would prefer to go ahead and have her all go tomorrow morning 04:45PM 1since that's when her -- that when that would have to take place 04:45PM 2with the cross-examination. 04:45PM 3

JUDGE COLLYER: All right. How much time do we think 04:45PM 4we're going to need for Dr. Handley? 04:45PM 5

MR. MORTARA: Well, Mr. Mellett has helpfully prepared a 04:45PM 6summary chart that we've agreed to and because of that, my cross 04:45PM 7has been cut by probably 25 minutes of what you see Mr. Hughes 04:45PM 8doing. I do it a little slower, the clicking. So I think my 04:45PM 9cross of Dr. Handley has been cut to an hour. I believe we'll be 04:45PM 10done before lunch. 04:46PM 11

JUDGE COLLYER: All right. Thank you very much, then. 04:46PM 12We'll break for the day. Have a good evening, everybody. 04:46PM 13

MR. MORTARA: Thank you, Your Honor. 04:46PM 14MR. MELLETT: Thank you, Your Honor.04:46PM 15MR. MORTARA: Your Honor, may I clean up the -- 04:46PM 16JUDGE COLLYER: Yes, feel free. Cleaning up is good to 04:46PM 17

do. 04:46PM 18MR. GARZA: Your Honor, the last witness is the State's 04:46PM 19

witness. I don't have any responsibility either for direct or 04:46PM 20cross. I'd like to get back to Texas to prepare for Friday's 04:46PM 21hearing. 04:46PM 22

JUDGE COLLYER: Go right ahead, sir.04:46PM 23MR. GARZA: Thank you.04:46PM 24JUDGE COLLYER: It's been nice to have you.04:46PM 25


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111

MR. GARZA: Thank you, Your Honor. 04:46PM 1JUDGE COLLYER: Thank you. Are you leaving too? 04:46PM 2MS. PERALES: Yes, Your Honor, I am. With permission, I 04:46PM 3

would have Ms. Cuoto, my co-counsel, sub in for me tomorrow so 04:46PM 4that we can -- 04:46PM 5

JUDGE COLLYER: What if we said no? What do you think 04:46PM 6about that? 04:46PM 7

MR. GARZA: We would come back in the morning, Your Honor. 04:46PM 8JUDGE COLLYER: Go right ahead. 04:46PM 9MS. PERALES: Thank you, Your Honor. 04:46PM 10JUDGE COLLYER: Anybody else leaving? 04:47PM 11MS. PERALES: One last housekeeping matter. With respect 04:47PM 12

to moving exhibits -- 04:47PM 13JUDGE COLLYER: I thought you were leaving. 04:47PM 14MS. PERALES: I am, but with questions. With respect to 04:47PM 15

moving in exhibits, must we move them in open court verbally or 04:47PM 16should we move them on paper or -- 04:47PM 17

JUDGE COLLYER: Unless there's an objection, you can 04:47PM 18submit your exhibits. If there's an objection, we need to know 04:47PM 19about it to rule on it. If there's no objection, just submit 04:47PM 20them. 04:47PM 21

MR. MORTARA: There generally will not be, Your Honor, 04:47PM 22from Texas, but I've asked Mr. Mellett and his colleagues on the 04:47PM 23other side to give us just a list of exhibits that haven't been 04:47PM 24talked about in court. We'll quickly zip through those and, 04:47PM 25


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112

given our history with lock stock, we know what the answers are. 04:47PM 1If there's something particularly alarming, we'll draw it to your 04:47PM 2attention tomorrow.04:47PM 3

MR. MELLETT: And we will provide that this evening, Your 04:47PM 4Honor. 04:47PM 5

JUDGE COLLYER: Good. That sounds fine. Good. Go home. 04:47PM 6(Proceedings adjourned at 4:48 p.m.)04:48PM 7 8 C E R T I F I C A T E

9

I, Scott L. Wallace, RDR-CRR, certify that 10the foregoing is a correct transcript from the record of

proceedings in the above-entitled matter.11

12 ---------------------------- ----------------

Scott L. Wallace, RDR, CRR Date 13 Official Court Reporter

141516171819202122232425


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113

I N D E X12

3EXAMINATIONS Page

43

DIRECT EXAMINATION OF DR. RICHARD ENGSTROM5BY MS. PERALES

CROSS-EXAMINATION OF DR. RICHARD ENGSTROM 96BY MR. HUGHES

CROSS-EXAMINATION OF DR. RICHARD ENGSTROM 147BY MR. SELLS

8CROSS-EXAMINATION OF REPRESENTATIVE SCOTT HOCHBERG 24

BY MR. HUGHES9REDIRECT EXAMINATION OF REPRESENTATIVE SCOTT 38

HOCHBERG10BY MR. FREEMAN

11DIRECT EXAMINATION OF DR. STEPHEN ANSOLABEHERE 45

BY MR. DEVANEY12

REDIRECT EXAMINATION OF GERARDO INTERIANO 5513BY MR. MORTARA

RECROSS-EXAMINATION OF GERARDO INTERIANO 7614BY MR. GARZA

CROSS-EXAMINATION OF GERARDO INTERIANO 8515BY MR. SELLS

FURTHER REDIRECT EXAMINATION OF GERARDO INTERIANO 10816BY MR. MORTARA

17

EXHIBITS18

NO. DESCRIPTION Page19

20

2122232425


01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM to 114 of 130 114 of 130 sheets

'

'06 [1] - 11:24

'08 [1] - 11:24

'90s [1] - 26:8

0

0 [1] - 5:12

1

1 [2] - 24:3; 43:4

1,000 [2] - 83:11, 19

1,200 [1] - 33:1

1,400 [1] - 33:2

1,500 [1] - 32:17

10 [1] - 52:8

100 [3] - 47:17; 50:17; 53:4

100,000 [1] - 48:16

105 [1] - 91:19

108 [1] - 113:16

11 [2] - 45:23; 46:6

117 [2] - 7:1; 13:25

127 [1] - 69:6

130 [1] - 105:5

132 [1] - 74:13

135 [1] - 105:5

137 [6] - 21:16; 22:8; 23:2, 7; 25:21

14 [2] - 78:5; 113:7

140 [1] - 38:22

141 [2] - 58:15; 69:5

143 [1] - 67:1

145 [5] - 66:14, 17; 67:1, 3, 9

148 [10] - 66:14, 16; 67:2, 10, 12;

68:11, 15; 69:4

149 [5] - 21:16; 22:8; 23:2, 11

15 [4] - 32:3, 5; 41:19; 109:21

160,000 [1] - 62:3

161-2 [1] - 24:3

164 [2] - 96:9, 16

17 [4] - 51:22; 52:3, 8

175,000 [1] - 62:3

187 [1] - 9:17

1991 [12] - 26:12; 28:21; 35:25; 36:1, 3,

5, 7, 11; 37:3, 7, 9; 38:3

1993 [2] - 26:9; 33:12

1:43 [1] - 3:2

2

2 [2] - 24:4; 81:22

20 [11] - 26:7; 52:25; 73:9, 15; 74:3,

5-6; 97:13; 98:7, 14

2000 [4] - 16:24; 46:17; 104:2, 4

2001 [11] - 33:13, 19, 21; 34:1, 18, 21,

24; 37:3; 38:3; 42:3; 43:10

2006 [1] - 49:18

2008 [1] - 87:19

2010 [10] - 11:24; 15:15, 17; 16:5-7;

57:18; 87:20, 22; 104:4

2011 [5] - 30:13; 35:13; 37:1, 24; 38:4

2012 [1] - 3:1

206 [6] - 18:16, 20; 19:5, 8, 13, 16

20s [1] - 65:23

21 [5] - 52:4, 8

216 [1] - 73:10

23 [6] - 47:19; 73:10, 15; 74:3, 7; 97:13

24 [1] - 113:8

240,000 [2] - 48:3, 6

25 [16] - 3:1; 45:24; 47:19; 48:8, 10,

22, 25; 49:4, 13; 51:12, 14-15, 20; 52:4;

79:1; 110:8

261 [1] - 73:10

27 [6] - 47:19, 23-25; 48:1, 4

28 [2] - 24:4; 46:15

29 [1] - 24:3

2:57 [1] - 54:21

3

3 [2] - 54:19; 113:4

3,000 [1] - 33:4

3.3 [1] - 46:19

300,000 [1] - 48:2

31 [2] - 6:22; 13:23

33 [3] - 6:21; 7:1; 13:25

34 [2] - 46:13

342 [3] - 30:22; 32:14, 19

35 [6] - 14:2; 51:8; 97:10, 13

38 [1] - 113:9

3:00 [1] - 44:19

3:19 [1] - 54:22

4

4.3 [1] - 46:19

40 [2] - 92:7, 10

41 [23] - 14:4, 6; 56:2; 57:13; 58:16;

60:19; 63:6, 8, 16; 64:23; 86:18; 87:3,

5, 9; 90:11, 14; 92:1, 7-8, 18; 95:24;

96:3

45 [1] - 113:11

46 [2] - 74:14

49.3 [1] - 62:4

4:48 [1] - 112:7

5

5 [7] - 4:23; 5:2, 5, 14-15; 8:5; 81:22

5-19 [1] - 40:23

50 [18] - 65:21; 67:3, 6, 11, 23; 68:1, 4,

11, 13, 16; 93:19-21; 107:4, 6, 8, 10

50.4 [1] - 107:2

114

50.7 [1] - 107:3

50/50 [1] - 19:21

51.13 [1] - 62:5

52 [4] - 6:7-9; 21:20

52-county [1] - 6:4

55 [1] - 113:13

57.2 [1] - 62:5

58.1 [4] - 97:18; 98:10, 12, 15

59 [1] - 25:25

6

6 [1] - 50:4

6-16 [1] - 41:2

7

7 [2] - 48:19; 50:24

70 [1] - 52:24

724 [1] - 45:17

725 [2] - 4:9, 13

726 [2] - 4:9, 14

727 [1] - 4:11

728 [1] - 4:12

747 [2] - 4:10, 14

75 [7] - 47:1; 50:5-7, 16

76 [1] - 113:14

77(R [1] - 34:18

780,000 [2] - 47:7, 20

785 [1] - 78:20

799 [5] - 3:17, 20; 9:18; 18:17

8

8 [1] - 47:12

811 [3] - 42:5, 16

82(R [1] - 30:10

84 [2] - 74:5

85 [1] - 113:15

85093 [1] - 92:16

9

9 [1] - 113:6

90 [4] - 53:3; 62:13; 68:15; 99:5

95 [3] - 65:6; 66:2; 70:16

964 [1] - 74:15

97 [1] - 65:6

A

A-N-S-O-L-A-B-E-H-E-R-E [1] - 45:13

Abbott [11] - 57:15, 19, 24; 62:5; 87:8,

13; 89:21; 90:14; 108:16

abeyance [1] - 76:4

ability [33] - 6:21, 25; 7:3, 14, 20, 22;


115 of 130 sheets to 115 of 130 01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM

8:9, 17, 19, 22; 11:7; 12:2, 25; 13:3, 6,

11, 16; 14:8; 22:21; 45:21; 46:5, 11;

47:5, 9, 15, 20, 22; 48:5, 18; 49:13;

53:11

ability-to-elect [8] - 6:21, 25; 7:20; 8:9;

13:6, 11; 14:8; 47:15

able [15] - 15:17, 25; 55:22; 62:15;

63:3; 69:23; 74:16; 80:2; 84:13; 91:6;

97:17; 104:4; 105:8, 21

Abortion [1] - 31:11

abortion [3] - 38:25; 39:1; 40:18

above-entitled [1] - 112:11

absolute [2] - 57:21; 95:10

absolutely [1] - 29:17

abundance [1] - 63:2

academic [1] - 4:17

accept [1] - 39:9

accepted [1] - 42:18

access [2] - 39:6; 85:20

accidentally [2] - 59:23; 95:15

accidently [1] - 59:6

accomplish [1] - 98:7

accounts [1] - 19:7

acquired [1] - 15:19

Act [5] - 81:7, 12, 22; 104:9, 11

action [6] - 40:17, 22-23, 25; 41:12, 14

Action [2] - 30:18; 34:13

add [8] - 79:5; 88:15; 91:1, 5, 24; 92:5,

9, 18

addition [2] - 51:21; 52:4

addressed [4] - 60:11; 82:2, 5

addresses [1] - 58:13

addressing [1] - 82:9

adjourned [1] - 112:7

adjustment [1] - 20:9

adjustments [1] - 101:6

administrative [2] - 5:10, 16

admitted [2] - 78:18, 22

adopt [1] - 13:16

adopted [7] - 5:14; 6:23; 8:12, 20;

10:16, 19

advice [1] - 81:14

advisor [1] - 5:14

advocate [1] - 64:17

advocating [3] - 64:11

affect [2] - 19:12, 15

afraid [1] - 75:15

African [1] - 21:5

African-Americans [1] - 21:5

AFTERNOON [1] - 3:1

afternoon [13] - 4:3; 9:5; 14:24; 25:8;

44:24; 45:4; 55:9; 76:12, 15

age [16] - 15:7; 20:20, 22-23; 22:9;

54:4; 65:10, 16; 88:18, 25; 89:4, 8, 22;

91:4; 108:18

ago [1] - 5:7

agree [8] - 28:23; 30:21; 31:2; 32:23;

80:2; 99:19; 100:19

agreed [3] - 69:15; 95:16; 110:7

agreeing [1] - 12:12

ahead [10] - 4:21; 40:21; 44:21; 54:25;

76:7; 87:5; 103:15; 110:1, 23; 111:9

alarming [1] - 112:2

Albright [1] - 50:1

Alford [4] - 7:5, 7, 18; 8:3

Alford's [3] - 7:8; 52:12; 53:13

Allen [1] - 95:13

allocating [1] - 19:10

allow [2] - 21:14; 44:17

allowed [1] - 42:13

Alma [1] - 95:13

almost [3] - 18:23; 86:20, 23

Alvarado [2] - 67:2, 24

amendment [3] - 69:11; 95:10, 16

amendments [4] - 66:7; 68:22; 95:12;

101:5

American [3] - 21:8, 23; 76:11

Americans [1] - 21:5

analyses [10] - 14:15; 15:3, 13; 17:24;

20:24; 21:10; 22:20; 23:1

analysis [38] - 6:19; 7:12, 17; 8:21;

10:9, 15, 20; 11:3, 12; 12:2; 13:10, 12;

14:14; 15:2, 5, 8; 17:25; 19:11; 20:19;

21:14; 22:10, 15-16; 45:16, 25; 47:20;

52:12; 53:14, 19; 82:7, 16; 98:13;

99:18; 109:3

analyze [1] - 20:24

analyzed [7] - 6:9; 18:21; 21:19; 46:24;

47:4; 48:21; 52:12

angle [1] - 51:4

Anglo [3] - 14:13; 19:20; 21:13

Ansolabehere [5] - 44:3, 17; 45:4, 12;

53:25

ANSOLABEHERE [3] - 44:22; 45:2;

113:11

answer [6] - 7:23; 26:19; 27:5, 8; 83:2;

84:14

answered [1] - 106:6

answering [1] - 26:21

answers [1] - 112:1

anticipate [1] - 29:6

Antonio [6] - 72:14, 25; 94:9; 97:19;

98:8

anyway [1] - 103:15

apart [1] - 47:24

apologize [2] - 72:7; 75:16

apparent [1] - 91:12

appear [3] - 89:16; 90:10; 103:4

appendage [2] - 91:25; 92:1

appends [1] - 52:8

applying [1] - 33:18

appreciate [2] - 109:17

approach [7] - 7:5; 47:14; 52:18, 21,

23; 53:2; 75:10

approached [1] - 95:14

appropriate [1] - 8:2

appropriation [2] - 41:1, 15

appropriations [1] - 31:6

115

April [1] - 41:6

area [18] - 6:4; 22:25; 25:24; 48:8;

51:18; 58:15; 59:4; 60:19; 62:10; 66:19;

70:24; 71:5; 72:17; 73:15; 97:13

areas [19] - 6:6; 21:2, 19, 22; 22:7,

19-20, 22, 24; 73:18, 20, 24; 77:4; 82:7;

94:11; 107:17, 21

argue [1] - 32:18

argumentative [2] - 80:20, 23

arm [1] - 51:24

Asian [10] - 20:20, 22, 24; 21:8, 10,

15-16, 21, 23; 22:10

Asian-American [2] - 21:8, 23

Asians [2] - 21:1, 6

aside [1] - 11:11

assign [1] - 91:11

assignment [1] - 91:23

associated [1] - 7:11

assume [1] - 16:25

assuming [2] - 93:1, 4

assumption [1] - 80:19

astonishing [1] - 24:24

Attachment [4] - 47:12; 48:19; 50:4,

24

attempted [1] - 22:11

attend [1] - 75:11

attention [4] - 37:8; 89:9; 104:10;

112:3

Attorney [4] - 57:15; 62:5; 108:16

attorneys [1] - 81:15

atypical [1] - 43:15

audio [3] - 75:15, 20; 85:14

Austin [4] - 48:11; 51:12; 52:7, 9

available [7] - 35:18; 41:23; 58:11;

65:11, 14; 74:2; 108:25

aware [17] - 69:23; 70:15; 77:23, 25;

78:2, 6-7; 82:21, 24; 83:2, 8; 84:18, 24;

93:5, 9, 11, 25

aways [1] - 51:23

B

back-filled [1] - 41:16

background [1] - 4:22

backwards [1] - 24:5

Baker [1] - 99:3

balance [1] - 56:17

ballot [3] - 12:5; 56:14; 57:4

bar [5] - 56:7; 89:19, 22; 91:1, 13

based [11] - 7:21, 25; 10:15; 13:1;

19:9; 20:19; 28:19; 57:24; 63:4; 83:24;

109:3

basic [2] - 27:20; 104:6

basis [5] - 17:5, 7, 13

bear [2] - 9:7; 24:21

beautiful [1] - 76:15

became [1] - 38:1

becomes [1] - 47:25

began [1] - 83:12


01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM to 116 of 130 116 of 130 sheets

begin [5] - 45:5; 58:21; 72:8; 75:8;

104:4

beginning [2] - 58:2; 99:24

begins [1] - 75:9

behalf [4] - 14:21; 23:19; 38:13; 44:25

behavior [2] - 21:8, 23

behest [1] - 104:12

behind [1] - 99:20

belief [3] - 93:16, 20; 108:25

below [3] - 63:14; 107:4, 6

beltway [1] - 26:1

benchmark [25] - 6:22; 7:10, 12; 8:8,

11, 14; 10:9, 20; 11:3, 9-10; 13:6, 13,

15; 45:22; 46:6, 11; 49:2-4; 67:6, 11;

68:4; 97:18; 98:10

benchmarks [1] - 68:13

benefit [2] - 27:23; 74:8

best [2] - 57:8, 21

bet [2] - 33:4; 105:5

better [3] - 57:7; 64:5; 87:20

between [8] - 12:5; 51:16; 62:3; 67:14;

73:9, 15; 99:8; 107:20

Bexar [15] - 6:14; 72:19; 73:5; 94:10;

97:19, 22; 98:7; 105:17, 20; 106:9, 12,

19; 107:12, 17

big [2] - 55:11; 101:17

bill [25] - 27:16; 28:2, 12; 31:4, 6-8, 10,

15, 18; 34:22; 36:13; 37:5, 11, 14;

38:25; 39:1; 40:18; 41:4; 43:10, 15

Bill [2] - 30:7; 34:9

bills [18] - 27:7, 21; 29:16; 30:15; 32:9,

14, 17, 21; 33:1, 3, 7-8; 37:10; 38:18,

24; 40:10; 41:25

bit [6] - 37:18; 42:7; 64:23; 66:15; 69:3;

100:1

bivariate [3] - 15:3, 13; 17:24

black [9] - 46:18, 22; 47:16, 21; 48:11;

50:6; 51:4, 11; 52:2

blacks [7] - 46:4, 13; 47:7; 48:16; 49:7,

11, 20

blank [1] - 56:5

block [35] - 60:14; 61:2, 4, 6, 8; 66:20;

68:3; 69:8, 24; 70:3, 15; 71:6, 8; 73:14;

77:11; 83:7, 20; 84:22; 86:8; 89:6, 10;

91:8, 24; 92:20; 93:18, 21; 108:12, 21,

25

blocs [7] - 60:16; 61:13; 69:16; 73:21;

74:3; 91:24; 93:12

board [2] - 69:13; 93:22

Board [1] - 58:5

Bonnie [1] - 42:8

borne [1] - 49:8

bottom [9] - 18:16; 36:9; 56:7; 57:3;

59:5; 89:19, 22; 90:10; 92:12

Botts [1] - 99:3

boundary [1] - 51:9

box [1] - 44:10

brand [1] - 56:4

brand-new [1] - 56:4

break [8] - 19:18; 40:9; 44:17, 19;

54:11, 13, 21; 110:13

brief [3] - 26:17; 38:12; 96:21

briefly [7] - 5:25; 7:6; 9:22; 10:2;

47:10; 71:13

bring [3] - 24:23; 25:1; 40:6

broad [1] - 106:19

broadly [1] - 99:2

brought [3] - 26:14; 89:9; 98:21

Bruce [1] - 42:8

Bryan [1] - 14:21

budget [8] - 29:4; 31:4, 7-8; 38:25;

41:17

business [1] - 101:17

button [1] - 55:11

BY [53] - 4:2, 15, 25; 6:11; 9:4, 13;

14:23; 17:23; 18:19; 20:14; 24:18; 25:7,

17; 30:3; 34:16; 38:15; 40:15, 24; 43:2;

45:3, 15; 47:3; 50:14, 21; 55:7, 20;

57:10; 60:8; 62:16; 64:21; 70:7; 71:2,

12; 76:10; 79:19; 81:4; 84:17; 85:17;

92:6; 94:5; 96:14, 22; 108:8; 113:5-7,

9-10, 12

C

C1 [1] - 48:1

C100 [4] - 46:6, 13; 47:8, 17

C100's [1] - 47:23

C185 [6] - 46:7, 12, 15; 47:6, 8, 18

C185's [1] - 47:24

C220 [2] - 72:12, 14

C23 [1] - 47:21

calculated [4] - 46:10; 47:11; 49:21,

23

calendar [1] - 11:22

candidate [20] - 8:14, 17; 10:7; 12:6,

24; 14:12; 18:23; 23:6, 10; 47:5; 48:5;

49:7, 19, 22-23; 50:6

candidates [13] - 11:1; 12:6, 10; 14:16;

19:2; 21:4; 46:5, 9, 14; 47:9; 48:7, 18;

49:13

capability [2] - 44:10, 12

capture [2] - 24:3

Carolina [2] - 5:5, 8

CASE [3] - 3:12; 24:12; 44:22

case [22] - 3:21; 5:23; 7:6; 20:2; 28:9;

29:9; 35:9; 45:16; 53:20; 59:8; 61:8;

62:23; 63:2; 76:19; 77:22; 78:17; 79:4;

82:22; 98:17; 99:10, 25

cases [4] - 56:23; 64:8; 82:5

categories [1] - 18:7

category [1] - 14:9

caucus [3] - 105:12; 106:1, 4

Caucus [1] - 76:11

causes [1] - 61:7

caution [1] - 63:2

CD [16] - 48:8, 10, 22, 25; 49:4, 12-13;

51:12, 14-15, 20, 22; 52:4

CD20 [2] - 97:17

116

census [6] - 16:24; 17:8; 84:21;

103:22, 24

center [2] - 48:11; 51:12

certain [2] - 31:15; 97:11

certainly [7] - 16:24; 20:15; 65:3;

79:10; 97:21; 104:21

certify [1] - 112:10

cetera [3] - 24:4; 104:15

chairman [1] - 99:6

Chairman [4] - 42:8; 68:15; 99:5, 8

chairman's [5] - 95:20, 25; 96:3, 6

challenged [1] - 98:16

challenges [1] - 107:1

chamber [1] - 5:20

chances [1] - 3:23

change [8] - 5:8-10; 59:5; 60:3; 92:3;

109:3

changed [4] - 60:14; 64:18; 92:12;

109:1

changes [7] - 48:15; 82:12; 92:20;

96:5; 97:7, 14

changing [2] - 93:16

charge [6] - 33:19; 34:8, 21; 35:25;

36:13; 37:2

chart [5] - 9:18, 25; 10:3; 18:15; 110:7

check [2] - 29:19; 36:16

choice [12] - 8:15, 17; 10:7; 11:1; 12:5;

14:16; 23:7, 10; 47:5; 48:7; 105:14

choose [4] - 34:17; 56:12, 23; 58:19

chose [3] - 56:19; 58:16; 93:21

circumstances [1] - 41:19

cite [1] - 79:9

cities [3] - 64:9, 16

citizen [4] - 15:7; 20:19, 21; 22:9

citizens [4] - 20:20, 22, 25; 21:10

citizenship [3] - 65:8, 10, 22

City [1] - 69:9

city [3] - 64:8; 69:14

clarify [5] - 15:1; 23:24; 24:7; 38:17;

84:8

classification [1] - 12:18

classifications [1] - 53:1

classified [1] - 47:13

clean [1] - 110:16

cleaning [1] - 110:17

clear [10] - 11:2; 49:8; 53:8; 69:22;

74:9; 75:19; 76:18; 83:4; 98:24

clearly [1] - 86:8

CLERK [2] - 3:3; 54:23

clever [1] - 55:19

click [8] - 59:11; 60:3; 86:2, 5; 88:13;

92:20; 108:19

clicked [2] - 59:6; 93:12

clicking [5] - 59:11; 88:10; 91:2, 6;

110:9

close [3] - 66:9; 72:6; 90:15

club [1] - 101:16

co [1] - 111:4

co-counsel [1] - 111:4


117 of 130 sheets to 117 of 130 01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM

coalition [2] - 48:25; 49:5

coalitions [2] - 50:9, 18

coincidence [4] - 95:7, 9, 17

colleagues [2] - 31:19; 111:23

COLLYER [142] - 3:5, 10, 18; 4:18, 24;

6:7; 8:25; 9:2, 12; 14:18, 20; 18:17;

19:17, 24; 20:4, 6, 9, 11; 23:14, 17;

24:5, 9, 15, 23; 25:3, 14; 29:22; 30:2;

34:14; 38:7, 10; 39:17, 20, 24; 40:3, 7,

19, 21; 42:12, 17, 21; 43:20, 23; 44:1,

6, 13, 19, 21; 45:1, 10, 14; 46:25; 47:2;

49:2; 50:16, 19; 54:4, 7, 13, 17, 25;

55:2, 5, 18; 59:19; 61:14, 18, 22; 70:4,

19, 22, 25; 71:11; 72:12; 74:24; 75:2, 5,

12, 14, 17, 22, 24; 76:6; 78:11, 18, 21;

79:2, 7, 12, 17; 80:21, 23; 84:15; 85:1,

4, 9, 13; 92:2; 94:3; 96:8; 98:1, 6, 18;

99:7, 15, 24; 100:2, 4, 14, 18; 101:3, 6,

11, 15, 20; 102:2, 19, 25; 103:8, 10, 12,

14, 23; 104:6; 106:3; 108:2, 4, 6;

109:12, 19; 110:4, 12, 17, 23, 25;

111:2, 6, 9, 11, 14, 18; 112:6

color [4] - 18:12; 71:6, 8

colored [1] - 91:25

colors [1] - 18:7

column [3] - 10:3, 5, 14

combination [1] - 98:13

combined [1] - 46:18

comfortable [1] - 99:13

coming [8] - 25:25; 27:16; 43:24;

51:16; 100:12; 102:20; 109:13

comment [3] - 80:3, 9; 106:5

commercial [1] - 101:23

commitment [1] - 52:10

committee [8] - 27:3, 25; 37:14; 43:9;

98:22, 25; 99:2

common [1] - 87:25

communicating [1] - 102:14

communities [1] - 63:20

community [7] - 62:10; 67:18; 69:9,

13; 106:12

compare [5] - 8:8, 19; 10:19, 22; 13:16

compared [2] - 28:14; 32:25

comparing [1] - 13:20

comparison [3] - 10:19; 11:18; 106:14

complained [1] - 64:9

complete [2] - 48:14; 79:22

completely [2] - 48:10; 56:5

compliance [1] - 81:21

complies [1] - 96:17

compliment [1] - 24:16

comply [1] - 27:4

complying [6] - 86:4, 6; 90:13, 22;

92:11, 19

composition [1] - 34:23

compromise [2] - 69:11; 102:16

computer [13] - 9:8, 25; 24:20; 43:22;

44:15; 55:10, 14, 21; 59:17; 75:10;

76:1, 3

computers [1] - 24:23

concentration [2] - 66:24; 67:21

concentrations [1] - 70:8

conceptually [1] - 53:12

concern [5] - 49:25; 50:2; 81:20; 82:1,

9

concerning [5] - 27:7; 40:11; 41:1, 3;

43:9

concerns [5] - 82:2, 4-5, 13, 24

conclude [3] - 8:21; 13:23; 45:21

conclusion [2] - 21:15; 46:2

conclusions [4] - 6:18; 7:6; 48:24;

52:15

conference [1] - 107:19

confidence [1] - 22:13

confirm [1] - 58:6

conflict [1] - 52:21

confusion [1] - 64:7

Congress [4] - 58:5; 72:24; 95:5;

102:20

Congressional [24] - 33:18; 45:18, 24;

46:3; 47:6; 48:1; 51:5; 58:9; 71:14, 18;

72:23; 73:17; 94:6, 25; 97:10; 98:7;

100:13; 101:8; 102:6, 11, 13, 24

Congressman [3] - 96:25; 102:7

Congresswoman [1] - 101:21

connect [1] - 55:22

connected [1] - 51:14

connection [2] - 28:11; 31:16

connections [1] - 69:14

Consent [1] - 31:10

consent [2] - 28:6; 40:18

consequence [2] - 75:23

consider [2] - 16:10; 82:9

considerations [1] - 37:17

considered [3] - 43:12; 62:25; 70:12

consistent [2] - 43:14; 100:8

constituents [1] - 64:5

Constitution [1] - 63:22

constructing [2] - 87:9; 90:7

consult [1] - 94:2

contained [1] - 67:9

contest [1] - 4:21

context [1] - 53:9

contiguous [2] - 62:25; 74:16

continually [1] - 25:1

continue [5] - 74:11, 20, 23; 97:23;

107:9

contrary [3] - 78:23; 79:5; 104:8

contrast [2] - 46:16; 71:6

controversial [1] - 31:10

conversation [2] - 102:9; 103:22

conversations [3] - 82:16, 20; 99:3

convert [1] - 16:1

convince [2] - 8:16; 12:25

convinced [1] - 22:12

copied [2] - 96:25; 107:16

copy [2] - 40:1, 6

corner [1] - 55:12

corners [2] - 62:21, 25

117

correct [75] - 10:12, 17; 11:20; 13:8,

25; 14:1; 15:4, 6, 8-9, 14; 16:3, 14;

18:9; 19:5, 24; 20:16; 21:11, 18; 22:2;

23:4; 26:13; 27:22; 28:1, 8, 10; 30:20;

33:10; 34:17; 35:11; 38:5; 45:6, 19-20;

52:13; 60:10; 61:19; 76:20, 23-24; 77:2,

6-7, 9, 12-13, 16, 20-21; 80:19; 81:7,

16; 82:3; 83:7, 12, 25; 84:1, 23; 89:2, 7,

12; 90:15; 94:13; 95:2, 20; 96:3; 97:11;

102:23; 112:10

correctly [7] - 18:22; 22:16; 41:16;

57:17; 81:8; 86:22; 97:17

Council [10] - 15:11; 19:5, 7; 20:13;

49:18; 58:3, 14; 63:24; 65:13; 81:16

councilman [1] - 69:14

counsel [1] - 111:4

count [1] - 8:9

counted [2] - 47:16; 62:21

counties [13] - 6:4, 7-9, 12; 21:20;

22:17, 25; 51:19; 73:21; 109:5, 7

country [1] - 101:16

County [57] - 21:25; 22:7; 26:3; 31:19;

38:1; 47:25; 48:2, 9, 14, 17, 22, 25;

49:12, 17; 51:2, 7, 10, 18, 20, 25; 52:6;

56:3; 63:22; 66:6, 13; 68:18, 20, 25;

71:4; 72:19; 73:5; 77:15; 78:2; 81:6, 21;

82:1, 25; 83:1; 94:10; 97:19, 23; 98:8;

105:17, 20, 22; 106:9, 12, 19; 107:12,

17

county [14] - 22:17; 48:3, 8; 49:10;

50:12; 58:19; 59:6, 22; 68:8; 70:14;

73:12; 84:20; 109:6

county-wide [1] - 22:17

couple [3] - 27:10; 38:16; 100:9

course [4] - 31:7; 32:5; 34:1; 63:19

Court [29] - 3:16; 4:12, 16; 25:9, 18;

27:23; 40:4; 55:16; 56:1; 58:23; 63:7,

15; 66:4, 8; 68:10, 19; 71:21; 72:5,

9-10, 15; 75:4; 83:18; 84:2; 99:16, 18;

112:13

court [2] - 111:16, 25

Court's [4] - 3:23; 64:24; 74:8; 109:20

Court-drawn [4] - 72:5, 9, 15

COURTROOM [2] - 3:3; 54:23

cover [3] - 6:18; 22:23; 25:12

covered [1] - 22:7

create [1] - 81:10

created [2] - 58:6; 60:15

creating [1] - 87:12

credibility [1] - 99:25

criminal [1] - 31:16

criteria [2] - 30:18; 34:13

critical [2] - 104:14, 16

cross [9] - 21:2; 25:15; 80:21, 23;

84:15; 110:3, 7, 10, 21

CROSS [8] - 9:3; 14:22; 24:17; 85:16;

113:6-8, 15

cross-examination [5] - 25:15; 80:21,

23; 84:15; 110:3

CROSS-EXAMINATION [8] - 9:3;


01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM to 118 of 130 118 of 130 sheets

14:22; 24:17; 85:16; 113:6-8, 15

cross-level [1] - 21:2

crosshair [1] - 9:24

crossover [2] - 49:5, 11

CRR [2] - 112:10, 13

Cuellar's [1] - 102:8

Cuoto [1] - 111:4

current [2] - 16:4; 49:12

cursor [3] - 10:1; 61:4; 66:14

cut [7] - 60:13; 61:5; 62:18; 63:3; 67:3;

110:8, 10

cuts [4] - 51:22; 52:6; 61:12; 78:5

cutting [2] - 51:7

CV [1] - 4:10

CVAP [4] - 10:23; 65:9, 22

cycle [2] - 36:3, 11

cycles [1] - 11:24

D

Dallas [1] - 6:14

Dan [2] - 23:19; 69:6

Daniel [2] - 38:13; 45:12

dark [2] - 18:12; 52:1

data [29] - 11:11; 13:19; 15:2, 7, 14,

16, 18-20; 16:2, 16-17, 25; 17:4; 18:2;

20:15, 17, 20; 21:22; 48:22; 80:5; 86:8;

87:6; 103:22, 24; 104:2; 106:16

Date [1] - 112:13

date [1] - 40:17

dated [1] - 38:24

dates [1] - 39:3

David [3] - 65:19; 82:14; 86:16

days [1] - 38:22

deal [1] - 73:25

dealing [1] - 20:21

debate [2] - 68:21, 25

decade [3] - 5:17; 33:13, 16

decade-related [1] - 33:13

decide [1] - 104:18

decided [4] - 24:13; 63:2; 97:8; 104:16

decision [4] - 99:8, 12

decisions [5] - 52:19; 100:6; 104:16,

24; 105:18

declared [1] - 32:6

decrease [1] - 46:16

deemed [1] - 16:7

defendant [1] - 3:8

Defendant's [2] - 3:16, 20

defendants [1] - 99:19

Defendants' [3] - 18:17; 78:19

DEFENDANTS' [3] - 3:12; 24:11; 44:22

defense [1] - 59:25

Defense [6] - 4:10-12; 9:18; 42:5, 17

defer [1] - 75:21

degree [1] - 104:20

delay [1] - 41:19

delegation [6] - 102:13, 15, 24;

105:20; 106:21

delegations [2] - 107:14; 108:1

demand [1] - 32:7

democrat [4] - 14:13; 33:23; 57:19;

102:15

democratic [8] - 6:2; 12:9; 63:12;

105:12, 15; 106:1, 3

democrats [8] - 33:22; 34:8, 21; 36:2,

13; 37:2; 105:20; 106:23

demographic [3] - 11:11; 88:7; 93:2

demonstrate [3] - 56:1; 72:3; 76:25

demonstrated [1] - 93:7

demonstration [2] - 59:17; 74:9

demonstrative [1] - 3:14

denied [1] - 5:10

dense [2] - 51:10

Department [6] - 20:3; 26:16; 36:22;

45:9; 98:16; 109:23

depended [1] - 87:11

deposition [8] - 77:25; 78:4, 8; 79:5,

21; 82:22; 98:19

describe [2] - 47:10; 55:19

described [1] - 38:19

describes [1] - 78:14

DESCRIPTION [1] - 113:19

deselect [1] - 59:21

design [1] - 103:1

designate [1] - 79:3

designation [2] - 79:4

detail [2] - 28:16; 72:2

details [1] - 37:9

determine [8] - 12:1; 13:10; 18:20, 23;

19:11; 22:6, 8; 104:7

determined [1] - 32:20

determining [1] - 11:7

Devaney [2] - 44:3, 24

DEVANEY [9] - 44:24; 45:3, 15; 47:3;

49:3; 50:14, 21; 53:25; 113:12

developed [2] - 77:16; 81:19

deviation [5] - 62:2; 71:25; 73:8

Dewhurst [1] - 62:5

difference [1] - 65:24

different [21] - 7:24; 47:24; 49:15;

50:10, 18; 51:6; 56:6, 19; 57:6; 59:1;

62:15; 63:16; 64:5; 70:24; 79:14; 96:5;

97:8; 104:20; 108:23

difficult [2] - 15:18; 100:5

difficulty [1] - 63:19

digit [1] - 74:18

digital [2] - 55:15; 75:11

digits [1] - 73:23

direct [13] - 3:9; 4:9; 21:9; 23:23;

25:12; 26:11, 15, 18; 41:20; 76:22;

86:20; 109:23; 110:20

DIRECT [4] - 4:1; 45:2; 113:5, 11

directed [1] - 79:23

direction [5] - 77:19; 80:15; 97:8;

100:22; 104:10

directive [2] - 100:22; 104:22

disagree [3] - 80:11, 16; 104:19

118

disagreed [1] - 97:7

disagreement [1] - 101:1

disastrous [1] - 3:22

discretely [1] - 8:22

discriminatory [1] - 99:19

discuss [1] - 98:23

discussed [1] - 98:22

discussion [1] - 82:11

Discussion [1] - 94:4

dispute [1] - 97:4

distribute [1] - 3:16

distribution [1] - 21:3

district [95] - 8:11, 20; 12:2, 14; 13:1,

6, 10-11, 17-18; 19:18; 25:23; 26:2;

34:3; 47:15; 48:4, 10-12, 14, 25; 49:5;

51:23, 25; 52:1, 23, 25; 53:2, 10; 56:13;

57:21; 58:22; 59:12; 60:4, 18; 61:15,

17, 20; 62:4, 7, 14, 17, 19; 63:5, 13;

64:15; 65:20, 23; 67:20, 22; 68:8; 69:5,

7, 19; 70:3; 73:1; 80:5; 81:2, 10; 82:17;

87:12; 88:2, 4; 90:8, 19, 21; 94:17, 21,

25; 95:1, 4, 6, 11-12, 15-16; 97:20, 23;

101:17, 23; 107:2, 4, 6, 8, 11, 16

District [36] - 7:1; 23:7, 11; 25:21;

45:24; 47:23; 48:1; 56:2; 57:13; 58:16;

60:19; 63:6, 8; 66:14, 16-17; 68:11;

69:4, 6; 86:18; 87:3; 90:11, 14; 92:1,

7-8, 10, 18; 95:24; 96:3; 97:10; 98:7, 14

districting [1] - 58:4

Districts [6] - 17:8; 21:16; 22:8; 23:2;

47:19; 51:6

districts [66] - 6:21, 24-25; 7:11, 19;

8:8, 10, 12, 14, 22; 10:9, 25; 11:15;

12:20; 17:1; 22:21; 23:3; 28:12; 34:23;

45:22; 46:4, 8, 11, 14-15; 47:8, 13, 17;

48:17; 51:5, 16, 21; 53:3, 6, 15-17;

64:13; 66:13; 67:5, 8; 68:1; 71:20,

23-24; 72:11; 73:5-7, 9; 74:21; 77:19;

81:6, 9, 20; 94:6; 97:14; 103:1; 104:25;

105:6; 107:16; 109:8

DistrictViewer [1] - 55:23

divide [1] - 19:21

divided [1] - 52:9

division [1] - 51:18

Doctor [1] - 23:18

Document [1] - 24:3

Doggett [1] - 51:13

DOJ [1] - 66:2

DOJ's [1] - 68:12

done [17] - 16:21; 22:10; 35:6; 36:19,

22, 25; 41:17; 43:20; 44:17; 49:17;

54:16; 77:6, 11; 83:20; 84:6; 103:4;

110:11

door [1] - 102:7

double [1] - 86:3

double-click [1] - 86:3

down [39] - 30:7; 31:9; 37:16, 18; 42:7;

52:5, 24; 57:4; 58:8; 59:5; 61:5, 9;

64:10; 66:16, 18, 20; 68:3; 69:24;

70:13, 15; 71:23; 72:1; 73:6, 14; 74:4,


119 of 130 sheets to 119 of 130 01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM

13; 81:9; 83:6, 24-25; 84:5, 19; 88:24;

89:1, 16; 107:4, 24; 108:19

downstairs [1] - 101:1

Downton [5] - 71:16; 80:11; 98:25;

102:22

downtown [2] - 69:15, 17

Dr [35] - 3:9, 11; 4:3, 8, 10, 16; 5:1, 22;

6:17; 7:5, 7-8, 18; 8:3, 5; 9:5, 14, 16;

10:1; 14:17, 24; 20:15; 44:3, 17; 45:4;

49:9; 52:12; 53:13, 25; 109:22, 25;

110:5, 10

DR [10] - 3:12; 4:1; 9:3; 14:22; 44:22;

45:2; 113:5-7, 11

draft [3] - 56:2; 68:23; 80:7

drafting [1] - 69:11

draw [10] - 56:2, 13; 58:23; 59:7;

71:25; 81:6, 9; 104:1; 108:23; 112:2

drawer [1] - 71:14

drawers [3] - 63:23; 102:3, 18

drawing [19] - 16:20; 58:22; 59:7; 62:6;

65:1; 66:5; 68:20, 25; 77:1; 78:1; 81:2;

84:10; 88:2; 90:19, 21; 99:11; 103:23;

104:5

drawn [15] - 34:4; 58:16, 20; 70:13;

72:5, 9, 15; 77:5, 10; 79:24; 80:2, 15;

81:20; 101:12

drew [8] - 16:23; 77:18; 80:4; 95:20,

24; 104:11; 108:24

drill [1] - 69:23

driven [4] - 61:12; 62:14; 70:12

drop [6] - 84:5; 88:24; 89:1, 16; 107:6;

108:19

drop-down [5] - 84:5; 88:24; 89:1, 16;

108:19

drops [1] - 83:25

during [10] - 26:24; 30:15; 41:8, 10;

55:17, 23; 68:25; 78:8; 79:20; 84:10

DX660 [1] - 96:7

E

e-mail [11] - 42:8, 10; 43:1; 96:23;

97:12, 17; 103:6, 9, 13, 16, 21

e-mails [1] - 65:19

early [6] - 26:8, 12; 39:1; 86:24; 102:5,

12

easiest [1] - 73:23

easily [1] - 47:12

easy [1] - 67:9

echoes [1] - 50:12

Education [1] - 58:5

effect [4] - 7:20; 8:10; 41:13; 78:3

effective [1] - 65:25

effort [1] - 5:21

efforts [1] - 15:18

EI [2] - 17:25; 21:14

eight [6] - 6:3, 6; 22:19; 71:24; 82:18

either [12] - 5:19; 23:2; 39:17; 47:15;

65:11; 69:13; 91:4; 99:1, 4, 8; 104:9;

110:20

El [3] - 6:14; 77:8; 105:23

elect [30] - 6:21, 25; 7:14, 20, 23; 8:9,

14, 17, 22; 11:8; 13:1, 3, 6, 11, 16;

14:8; 22:21; 46:5, 8, 14-15; 47:5, 9, 15,

20, 22; 48:5, 7, 18; 49:13

elected [8] - 7:21, 25; 10:25; 12:24;

35:24; 36:1; 58:3; 106:22

election [41] - 5:8; 8:1; 10:8, 11, 15,

20; 11:4, 12, 18, 20, 22, 24; 12:1, 13,

19; 13:10, 12; 16:5, 7; 17:21, 25; 18:25;

19:16; 48:21; 49:19; 56:17, 21, 25;

57:7; 58:17; 59:2; 65:13; 70:11, 13;

82:16; 98:13; 109:3

elections [52] - 6:2; 7:10, 13-14, 18,

20-22, 25; 8:1, 13, 18-19; 10:6, 15,

24-25; 11:7, 13-14, 17, 19, 23, 25;

12:13, 15, 19-20, 25; 13:2, 14-15;

14:11, 16; 15:15, 17; 18:21; 46:6; 49:5,

14, 17, 25; 56:10, 12, 14, 19, 22; 57:12,

23; 62:15; 90:6

electoral [1] - 50:2

electorate [1] - 22:23

eliminate [1] - 105:1

ELMO [1] - 50:25

elsewhere [3] - 7:3; 53:7; 104:22

embarrassing [1] - 75:17

emergency [2] - 32:6; 39:2

emphasize [1] - 47:10

enable [1] - 73:1

enacted [8] - 10:14, 19; 11:5, 11; 12:3,

15; 13:11

encompassed [1] - 4:13

encouraged [1] - 25:9

end [11] - 19:19; 26:7; 38:21-23; 74:17;

80:3, 8; 92:1; 99:17

ended [2] - 63:5; 102:19

endogenous [10] - 7:13, 17; 10:25;

11:2, 5, 7, 14; 12:19, 22

engine [2] - 101:23

Engstrom [17] - 3:9, 11; 4:3, 6, 16; 5:1,

22; 6:17; 8:3, 5; 9:5, 14, 16; 10:1;

14:17, 24; 20:15

ENGSTROM [8] - 3:12; 4:1, 7; 9:3;

14:22; 113:5

Engstrom's [3] - 4:8, 10; 49:9

entail [1] - 10:24

enter [1] - 50:15

entering [1] - 50:22

entire [6] - 53:18; 67:18; 83:18; 86:9

entirely [1] - 97:20

entitled [1] - 112:11

entries [1] - 36:9

environment [1] - 100:5

equal [1] - 49:16

Eric [8] - 97:2, 5, 16; 102:12, 17, 23;

103:16

errors [1] - 19:23

essential [2] - 7:9; 90:25

essentially [1] - 17:7

119

establish [2] - 4:22; 11:16

estimates [7] - 21:3, 7; 22:9, 11, 13;

104:3

estimating [1] - 21:22

et [3] - 24:4; 104:15

ethnic [6] - 65:1, 4-5; 69:24; 86:21;

88:6

evaluate [1] - 8:6

evaluating [3] - 7:9; 8:22; 81:18

evening [2] - 110:13; 112:4

evenly [1] - 49:10

eventually [3] - 72:18; 103:21; 107:22

everywhere [1] - 52:1

evidence [6] - 8:2; 42:18; 53:23; 64:25;

79:6; 99:18

evidenced [1] - 8:18

evident [1] - 92:3

exact [1] - 98:10

exactly [4] - 8:25; 24:5; 58:24; 62:1

exam [1] - 44:7

EXAMINATION [20] - 4:1; 9:3; 14:22;

24:17; 38:14; 45:2; 55:6; 76:9; 85:16;

108:7; 113:5-9, 11, 13

examination [6] - 25:15; 55:17; 80:21,

23; 84:15; 110:3

EXAMINATIONS [1] - 113:3

examine [2] - 12:13, 20

examined [2] - 21:24; 49:18

example [19] - 23:5; 52:22; 60:20, 23;

61:4, 10; 62:23; 64:2; 69:19; 74:5, 14;

93:19; 95:8; 101:5; 105:17; 106:18, 22;

107:2; 109:4

examples [3] - 69:22; 100:24; 101:16

excellent [1] - 79:16

except [1] - 102:19

exception [2] - 12:8; 93:24

exceptions [1] - 27:16

exchange [1] - 26:23

excluding [1] - 12:21

excuse [6] - 5:11, 13; 7:17; 8:13; 92:7;

109:1

exercise [1] - 75:11

exhibit [11] - 3:14; 39:17; 40:3; 42:15;

44:12; 55:16; 75:11; 76:2; 78:22; 98:2;

103:14

Exhibit [12] - 3:17; 4:11; 9:17; 42:5,

16-17; 45:17; 78:20; 96:6, 9, 16

EXHIBITS [1] - 113:18

exhibits [9] - 39:7, 12, 14, 22, 25;

111:13, 16, 19, 24

Exhibits [2] - 4:9

exogenous [24] - 7:18, 21-22; 8:1, 13,

18-19; 10:6, 8, 15, 20, 24; 11:12; 12:21,

23-24; 13:2, 12, 14-15, 19-20; 14:10

expected [1] - 28:18

expense [1] - 16:21

experience [5] - 5:2; 28:19; 81:2;

100:8

experiences [1] - 5:3


01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM to 120 of 130 120 of 130 sheets

expert [4] - 16:11; 20:1, 3; 44:3

expertise [1] - 4:21

experts [1] - 59:25

explain [11] - 6:24; 7:6; 12:23; 71:22;

78:4, 23; 79:15, 23; 83:21; 86:7; 103:20

explained [1] - 77:18

extensive [1] - 27:17

extent [2] - 27:15; 54:15

extra [1] - 15:18

F

F10 [1] - 75:7

face [1] - 20:15

facilitate [2] - 68:6; 105:19

fact [11] - 50:13; 52:19; 64:11; 78:4,

13; 79:20; 81:18; 83:14; 88:25; 92:23;

108:22

factor [1] - 47:19

fail [1] - 105:13

fair [4] - 28:16; 41:7; 75:20

fairly [2] - 21:5; 49:10

fall [1] - 104:13

falls [1] - 99:25

false [2] - 19:22; 108:24

familiar [5] - 16:8, 10; 29:12; 72:17;

94:10

family [1] - 62:11

far [6] - 36:8; 41:8; 57:4, 7; 58:11;

62:22

Farrar [4] - 67:2, 15, 20; 68:2

Farrar's [2] - 67:22; 70:2

fast [1] - 32:7

faster [1] - 69:3

Fayetteville [1] - 5:8

fear [1] - 98:14

features [1] - 86:2

February [1] - 104:5

felt [3] - 97:21; 98:13; 99:6

few [11] - 5:7; 15:1; 22:22; 24:20, 25;

26:10; 31:3; 38:17; 100:20; 107:1

figure [4] - 62:21; 67:24; 104:13;

107:20

figured [1] - 50:10

file [1] - 55:15

filed [2] - 4:12; 24:2

files [1] - 16:3

filing [1] - 47:13

filled [1] - 41:16

final [3] - 35:18; 37:5; 80:6

finally [2] - 15:25; 53:13

findings [3] - 4:13; 5:25; 6:20

fine [6] - 55:25; 67:20; 71:1; 76:6;

109:22; 112:6

finished [1] - 41:18

firmly [2] - 105:11, 14

first [23] - 5:19; 23:24; 24:21; 25:14;

31:3, 5; 35:1; 37:11, 14-15; 43:3; 56:9;

64:23; 66:15, 19; 72:15; 88:5; 92:9;

98:11; 106:19; 108:20

fit [1] - 52:18

five [25] - 23:25; 27:4, 21, 23-24;

28:10, 24; 29:19; 31:11, 24; 32:1, 9;

33:2; 34:7, 22; 35:13; 36:6, 12; 37:1;

38:19; 43:13; 51:6; 53:3; 54:14; 105:23

five-day [18] - 27:4, 21, 23-24; 28:10,

24; 29:19; 31:11, 24; 32:1, 9; 34:7, 22;

35:13; 36:6, 12; 37:1; 38:19

five-month [1] - 33:2

flagged [1] - 17:21

flattered [1] - 76:17

flawed [1] - 7:8

flight [1] - 109:15

floor [2] - 25:1; 95:14

focus [1] - 45:18

focused [1] - 25:10

focussed [1] - 25:22

follow [6] - 51:7; 64:2, 20; 66:14; 74:4;

106:8

follow-up [1] - 106:8

followed [1] - 64:8

following [4] - 47:14; 80:4; 82:9; 104:9

follows [1] - 69:16

Force [1] - 3:8

foregoing [1] - 112:10

forget [1] - 54:1

forgive [1] - 4:18

form [2] - 15:19, 25

format [1] - 26:19

formula [1] - 53:5

forth [2] - 35:7; 45:16

forward [2] - 49:18; 95:13

foundation [1] - 50:13

foundational [1] - 48:20

four [11] - 12:11, 16; 14:7; 37:17;

43:16; 73:5; 78:5; 79:14; 96:2; 103:17

fourth [1] - 3:6

frankly [1] - 16:22

free [1] - 110:17

FREEMAN [17] - 23:19; 38:12, 15;

39:6, 9, 12; 40:10, 14-15, 20, 24; 42:16,

19, 25; 43:2, 18; 113:10

Freeman [4] - 23:19; 26:22, 24; 38:13

frequently [2] - 28:24; 29:19

Friday's [1] - 110:21

front [4] - 38:18, 25; 39:3; 43:12

frustrated [2] - 25:2; 97:9

full [1] - 45:10

fully [1] - 105:24

function [1] - 65:13

functional [5] - 11:12, 18; 12:1; 13:9;

53:19

functions [1] - 49:5

FURTHER [2] - 108:7; 113:16

G

Garza [11] - 75:19, 24-25; 76:7, 11, 13;

120

78:14; 106:23; 107:7; 108:9, 23

GARZA [20] - 75:23; 76:3, 8, 10; 78:19,

24; 79:3, 8, 16, 18-19; 80:22; 81:4;

84:17, 25; 110:19, 24; 111:1, 8; 113:14

Garza's [1] - 107:2

gathered [1] - 66:2

GE [1] - 10:4

General [5] - 57:16, 19; 62:5; 108:16

general [14] - 6:2; 7:13; 10:6, 11;

11:17; 12:13; 14:16; 18:25; 46:5; 48:21;

49:4, 14; 97:13

generally [2] - 49:12; 111:22

gentle [1] - 80:22

Geographic [1] - 16:8

Gerardo [2] - 54:10; 55:1

GERARDO [8] - 55:6; 76:9; 85:16;

108:7; 113:13

GIS [6] - 16:9, 11, 14-15, 18; 18:3

given [7] - 68:14; 69:17; 76:18; 77:22;

104:23; 112:1

goal [4] - 67:5; 68:10; 105:1, 3

goals [1] - 107:11

Gonzales [1] - 60:25

Gonzales' [1] - 102:8

Gonzalez [1] - 44:25

goof [1] - 34:20

Government [1] - 45:8

government [1] - 45:9

governor [5] - 12:9; 32:6; 41:9, 11

Governor [3] - 56:15; 62:4

governor's [1] - 32:7

grab [1] - 52:8

grabbed [1] - 52:3

grabs [2] - 51:25; 52:7

granddaughter's [1] - 101:12

great [3] - 29:9; 73:25

grid [1] - 60:13

ground [1] - 107:1

group [8] - 6:10; 13:4; 21:4, 11-12;

49:21; 84:22

groups [1] - 50:10

growth [2] - 46:25; 47:1

gubernatorial [1] - 57:5

guess [8] - 9:17; 64:10; 91:11; 98:24;

99:23; 100:3, 9; 105:2

guessing [1] - 85:21

guidelines [1] - 106:19

Guillen [5] - 62:8, 12; 77:19; 80:1; 81:3

Gulfton [1] - 25:25

H

H113 [2] - 95:22

H283 [2] - 66:10; 86:17

half [1] - 64:24

hall [1] - 40:8

hand [4] - 56:6; 58:8, 25; 85:21

Handley [5] - 109:22, 25; 110:5, 10

handy [1] - 102:2


121 of 130 sheets to 121 of 130 01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM

Hanna [5] - 65:19; 81:15, 19; 82:1;

98:21

happy [2] - 5:18; 105:6

hard [1] - 51:4

Harris [13] - 6:15; 21:25; 22:7; 26:2;

31:19; 38:1; 66:6, 12; 68:17, 20, 25;

71:4; 82:25

Harvard [1] - 45:6

Hays [1] - 52:6

head [3] - 51:19; 63:11; 87:23

header [1] - 43:1

hear [4] - 32:18; 33:1; 86:22

heard [5] - 86:20; 88:1; 94:16; 106:5,

11

hearing [15] - 27:19, 25; 32:2, 5; 33:4;

35:1; 37:10, 21-22; 39:3; 41:5, 22, 25;

110:22

hearings [15] - 27:4, 17; 33:8; 35:2,

10, 14, 17; 36:13; 37:4, 24; 38:24; 42:2;

43:9, 13, 16

HEBERT [2] - 23:16; 85:3

held [4] - 27:17, 25; 35:10, 15

hello [1] - 55:8

help [10] - 43:8, 11; 71:17, 19; 72:18;

85:18; 86:7, 11, 14; 105:19

helpful [1] - 40:4

helpfully [1] - 110:6

Hernandez [3] - 67:1, 14, 19

hi [1] - 24:19

Hidalgo [8] - 56:3; 77:15; 78:2; 81:6,

21; 82:1; 83:1

high [1] - 18:11

higher [1] - 57:5

highest [2] - 57:19; 103:2

highlighted [1] - 58:12

Highway [1] - 25:25

highway [1] - 64:6

highways [1] - 64:3

hiring [1] - 16:22

Hispanic [34] - 19:19; 20:21; 22:4;

23:7, 10; 46:18, 22; 47:17, 21; 50:5;

52:2, 7; 53:3, 5, 17; 65:16; 88:8, 15, 18,

25; 89:4, 8, 22; 90:4; 91:4; 92:12, 15;

103:2; 108:11, 18

Hispanics [12] - 46:4, 13; 47:7; 48:3,

5-6, 16; 49:7, 12, 20; 52:24

history [3] - 29:15; 35:3; 112:1

hit [2] - 34:20; 75:7

HOCHBERG [5] - 24:11, 17; 38:14;

113:8, 10

Hochberg [10] - 23:6, 22; 24:19; 25:8,

20; 33:6; 38:16; 40:11; 42:10; 43:24

Hochberg's [1] - 23:23

Hodge [1] - 9:12

hold [2] - 41:18; 76:4

home [5] - 58:13; 61:18, 24; 112:6

Honor [57] - 3:8, 14; 4:23; 9:1; 14:19;

18:18; 23:16; 24:8; 29:25; 34:15; 38:12;

40:2, 6, 9; 42:9, 16, 19; 43:18; 44:2, 24;

54:6, 10, 20; 55:14; 59:15; 70:23;

75:13, 18, 21, 23; 76:5, 8; 78:10, 19,

24; 79:16, 18; 84:13, 25; 85:7, 11; 94:2;

96:6; 108:5; 109:10, 20, 24; 110:14-16,

19; 111:1, 3, 8, 10, 22; 112:5

honor [1] - 52:10

Honor's [1] - 75:10

Honors [2] - 23:19; 74:22

hook [4] - 9:8; 24:20; 39:15, 19

hope [5] - 11:6; 55:24; 75:16; 79:12;

105:25

hopeful [1] - 54:18

hopefully [1] - 40:16

hoping [1] - 53:25

hour [1] - 110:10

hours [4] - 68:23; 83:11, 19; 86:13

House [57] - 5:13, 18; 6:19; 7:1; 22:21;

23:7, 11; 25:21; 26:5, 12; 27:19, 25;

28:11, 15, 20-21; 30:19, 23; 31:15;

32:20; 33:11, 21; 34:23; 35:11, 15, 23;

36:1, 10, 14; 41:14; 42:3; 43:9; 56:2;

57:12; 58:5, 9, 12; 63:6, 16; 64:23;

65:2; 68:11; 72:22; 94:17; 95:10, 14,

24; 96:2; 101:8; 102:20; 105:2

housekeeping [1] - 111:12

houses [1] - 63:11

Houston [2] - 25:24; 26:2

HOWELL [13] - 17:3, 10, 12, 16; 56:19;

63:17; 69:22; 71:1; 75:1; 106:8, 11, 14;

109:15

Howell [1] - 70:2

Howell's [1] - 70:25

HP [3] - 32:3, 5; 41:19

Hubert [1] - 23:9

Huberty [3] - 69:11, 18

Huberty's [1] - 69:6

HUGHES [28] - 9:4, 13; 14:17; 24:7,

13, 18; 25:5, 7, 15, 17; 29:25; 30:3;

34:15; 38:9; 39:8, 11, 14, 19, 22; 40:1,

5, 9, 13; 42:9; 43:22; 113:6, 9

Hughes [10] - 9:7, 9-10; 24:19; 38:18,

24; 39:6; 40:19; 41:24; 110:8

Hughes' [1] - 25:3

human [1] - 31:16

Humble [2] - 69:9, 15

hundreds [2] - 29:2

HVAP [6] - 10:22; 65:21, 24; 89:18;

91:4, 12

hypothetical [1] - 99:17

I

idea [6] - 53:24; 57:8, 20; 103:17;

106:15

ideal [1] - 107:16

identified [3] - 13:17; 17:18, 21

identify [3] - 7:22; 8:12; 21:12

ignores [1] - 7:10

imagine [2] - 24:15; 100:5

impact [2] - 92:24; 93:5

121

impaired [1] - 13:17

impeach [1] - 78:12

implications [1] - 104:17

important [6] - 31:22, 25; 32:13;

38:19; 97:22

imported [1] - 16:17

imports [1] - 18:2

impossible [1] - 103:25

improper [1] - 78:12

improved [1] - 14:3

improvements [1] - 53:6

IN [3] - 3:12; 24:11; 44:22

inappropriate [1] - 21:6

include [5] - 11:6; 13:3; 20:20; 45:24;

101:3

included [5] - 5:5; 20:23; 24:1; 50:25;

99:3

includes [1] - 89:6

including [3] - 20:2; 29:10; 95:11

increase [3] - 46:17, 20

increased [1] - 46:18

increasing [1] - 53:4

incredible [1] - 33:1

incumbent [1] - 58:9

incumbent's [1] - 10:23

incumbents [3] - 58:12; 72:22

indeed [1] - 80:22

indicate [1] - 98:20

indicated [1] - 83:14

indicating [8] - 10:13; 60:12, 15, 23;

61:9; 67:4, 18; 91:20

indicating) [6] - 10:4; 58:7; 60:21;

66:17; 67:1; 109:2

individual [1] - 94:22

individual's [1] - 53:10

individually [1] - 6:9

individuals [1] - 100:10

inference [1] - 21:2

Information [2] - 16:8; 86:5

information [13] - 16:15; 17:17; 29:21;

41:24; 43:12; 57:6; 58:10; 65:5, 14;

90:17; 94:20; 95:2

Informed [1] - 31:10

initial [4] - 32:2, 5; 45:17; 56:2

input [2] - 16:25; 100:6

inquiries [1] - 82:12

inside [2] - 50:12; 59:9

inspect [2] - 44:15; 54:11

inspection [1] - 44:18

instance [5] - 60:9; 66:4; 68:17, 24;

77:8

instances [3] - 30:22; 32:8; 66:8

instruction [1] - 82:10

insufficient [1] - 21:1

insulted [1] - 100:18

intend [1] - 44:8

intense [1] - 100:5

intensity [1] - 59:1

intent [1] - 105:1


01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM to 122 of 130 122 of 130 sheets

interesting [3] - 50:9; 53:24; 59:19

interiano [1] - 79:13

Interiano [42] - 44:5; 54:11; 55:1, 8,

16, 21; 57:11, 25; 58:23; 59:22; 62:17;

63:6; 64:22; 66:11; 68:10, 19; 70:1, 23;

71:3, 13; 72:3, 8, 20; 73:16; 74:10, 22;

75:4, 7; 76:12; 78:15; 79:20; 85:18;

86:7; 87:6; 90:2; 93:4; 94:6; 95:20;

96:15, 23; 108:9

INTERIANO [8] - 55:6; 76:9; 85:16;

108:7; 113:13

Interiano's [1] - 44:7

interim [4] - 72:5, 9, 15

Internet [3] - 39:8, 14; 55:22

internet [1] - 39:20

Interstate [2] - 51:8

intervals [1] - 22:13

intervenors [2] - 3:9; 44:25

introduce [1] - 25:18

intrusion [1] - 52:3

involve [1] - 22:20

involved [6] - 29:8; 34:2; 58:4; 67:13;

69:12; 105:3

involving [1] - 12:5

iPad [2] - 25:1, 5

irregularity [2] - 28:13, 17

issue [5] - 25:12; 26:15; 30:16; 53:8,

15

issues [3] - 5:14; 65:22; 69:1

isthmus [1] - 51:15

it'll [3] - 60:24; 69:2

item [4] - 58:17; 70:10; 108:20

items [2] - 31:3; 89:16

itself [1] - 49:1

J

jag [1] - 64:7

JANUARY [1] - 3:1

job [1] - 103:17

John [5] - 9:7, 10; 24:19; 44:24;

106:23

Johnson [4] - 101:21; 102:1, 10

Jose [1] - 76:11

JUDGE [155] - 3:5, 10, 18; 4:18, 24;

6:7; 8:25; 9:2, 12; 14:18, 20; 17:3, 10,

12, 16; 18:17; 19:17, 24; 20:4, 6, 9, 11;

23:14, 17; 24:5, 9, 15, 23; 25:3, 14;

29:22; 30:2; 34:14; 38:7, 10; 39:17, 20,

24; 40:3, 7, 19, 21; 42:12, 17, 21;

43:20, 23; 44:1, 6, 13, 19, 21; 45:1, 10,

14; 46:25; 47:2; 49:2; 50:16, 19; 54:4,

7, 13, 17, 25; 55:2, 5, 18; 56:19; 59:19;

61:14, 18, 22; 63:17; 69:22; 70:4, 19,

22, 25; 71:1, 11; 72:12; 74:24; 75:1, 5,

12, 14, 17, 22, 24; 76:6; 78:11, 18, 21;

79:2, 7, 12, 17; 80:21, 23; 84:15; 85:1,

4, 9, 13; 92:2; 94:3; 96:8; 98:1, 6, 18;

99:7, 15, 24; 100:2, 4, 14, 18; 101:3, 6,

11, 15, 20; 102:2, 19, 25; 103:8, 10, 12,

14, 23; 104:6; 106:3, 8, 11, 14; 108:2,

4, 6; 109:12, 15, 19; 110:4, 12, 17, 23,

25; 111:2, 6, 9, 11, 14, 18; 112:6

Judge [2] - 70:2, 25

judges [1] - 57:1

judicial [1] - 5:16

Justice [4] - 36:22; 75:19; 98:16;

109:22

Justice's [2] - 20:3; 26:17

K

keep [11] - 52:10; 64:14, 19; 67:2, 9,

19, 23, 25; 68:5; 107:8, 10

keeping [2] - 54:17; 67:5

keeps [1] - 16:2

kept [2] - 54:15; 64:10

key [1] - 75:7

kind [4] - 26:19; 52:8; 56:6; 65:5

kinds [1] - 15:3

knowing [3] - 3:21; 19:18; 68:7

knowledge [3] - 20:8, 12; 21:6

known [2] - 16:9; 25:24

knows [1] - 71:21

L

label [1] - 51:22

labeled [1] - 43:4

labeling [2] - 60:24; 73:11

labelling [1] - 73:11

laminate [1] - 3:22

laminated [1] - 9:18

laminating [1] - 3:21

laptop [1] - 25:6

large [6] - 3:21; 6:4; 21:19; 22:13;

49:6; 66:25

larger [2] - 73:21

last [25] - 8:4; 11:20, 22; 14:10; 24:1,

22; 25:23; 29:24; 30:22; 31:10; 33:9,

13; 40:11, 17, 22, 25; 41:12, 14; 45:11;

52:11; 83:9; 95:10; 110:19; 111:12

lasted [2] - 68:22

late [1] - 41:16

Latino [12] - 3:8; 8:17; 10:6; 12:5, 10;

14:11; 17:22; 22:21, 23; 70:8

Latinos [2] - 21:4; 22:23

law [1] - 62:23

lawyers [2] - 24:23; 40:7

lead [3] - 3:22; 52:20; 71:14

leading [1] - 22:15

learned [5] - 29:7; 37:12; 56:15; 63:18

least [5] - 34:1; 71:5; 86:25; 108:1

leave [2] - 63:6; 101:2

leaving [4] - 98:2; 111:2, 11, 14

led [1] - 63:13

left [10] - 24:21; 50:22; 56:6; 58:8, 25;

122

69:18; 85:25; 95:12; 109:2, 25

left-hand [3] - 56:6; 58:8, 25

legal [2] - 52:19, 21

legislation [7] - 28:14; 29:5; 31:22, 25;

39:2

legislative [9] - 7:11, 15; 11:23; 29:15;

38:20; 40:12; 41:8; 83:11; 100:12

Legislative [11] - 15:11; 19:5, 7; 20:13;

49:18; 58:3, 13; 63:24; 65:12; 76:11;

81:16

legislators [2] - 24:25; 28:6

Legislature [2] - 29:11; 30:13

legislature [5] - 29:23; 56:3; 66:10;

77:12; 97:9

less [6] - 12:10, 16; 16:21; 87:19;

99:18; 103:17

letter [3] - 58:3; 66:2; 68:12

level [40] - 15:10; 21:2, 8; 49:16; 58:18;

59:7; 60:6, 14; 66:21; 68:3; 69:4, 24;

70:3, 15, 17; 71:8; 72:2; 73:12, 14;

77:11; 83:7, 20; 84:6, 20-22; 86:9; 87:1;

88:21; 89:6, 10; 91:8, 22; 108:12, 16,

18, 25

Lieutenant [1] - 62:4

light [2] - 18:13; 67:16

lightning [2] - 50:15, 22

likely [3] - 7:25; 41:12; 76:3

limit [1] - 23:2

limited [4] - 11:3; 25:10; 79:4; 104:24

line [12] - 48:15; 51:4, 7; 64:20; 67:16;

68:5, 8; 69:16; 74:4, 13; 101:12

Line [1] - 63:22

lines [6] - 27:11; 51:5; 64:2, 8; 67:16;

80:5

list [6] - 16:4; 17:18; 32:23; 40:10;

101:8; 111:24

listening [1] - 97:6

literally [4] - 60:12; 66:20; 69:16;

103:18

live [3] - 59:17; 61:14; 72:25

lives [3] - 60:25; 61:11; 68:7

living [1] - 68:7

Lloyd [1] - 51:13

load [1] - 57:22

loaded [1] - 87:4

loading [1] - 87:2

loads [1] - 59:4

local [1] - 63:20

lock [1] - 112:1

locked [2] - 50:1

look [34] - 5:23; 6:12; 7:19; 8:10, 13;

11:12; 12:24; 13:14; 16:7; 29:20; 32:4;

34:6, 9; 35:3; 36:5; 40:16; 53:15-17;

56:13, 17, 24-25; 57:12; 58:8; 61:3;

68:9; 69:7; 80:6; 87:7, 11; 94:23; 96:15

looked [22] - 6:14; 7:19; 11:17, 24;

21:9; 22:1, 7; 33:8; 34:4; 56:10; 57:14;

62:21; 65:9; 80:7; 81:24; 86:14; 87:24;

94:21; 98:12; 109:6, 8

looking [13] - 6:1; 13:18; 16:5; 31:3, 9;


123 of 130 sheets to 123 of 130 01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM

37:17; 56:8, 17; 57:7; 63:5; 89:13; 91:3,

13

looks [4] - 8:21; 53:14; 80:5; 85:19

loop [1] - 26:1

lose [1] - 47:21

loss [2] - 7:2; 10:4

lost [5] - 18:20; 47:4, 20; 53:2; 87:15

Loui [1] - 5:12

low [3] - 18:12; 87:16, 18

lower [3] - 55:11; 71:9; 73:24

lowest [2] - 70:17; 103:2

LRB [1] - 105:13

lumped [1] - 21:10

Luna [3] - 67:1, 14, 19

lunch [2] - 54:16; 110:11

M

ma'am [13] - 56:22; 61:16; 64:1; 79:18;

98:5; 101:14, 19; 102:5; 103:11, 25;

106:10, 13; 109:16

machine [2] - 39:16, 19

mail [11] - 42:8, 10; 43:1; 96:23; 97:12,

17; 103:6, 9, 13, 16, 21

mails [1] - 65:19

main [3] - 31:7; 37:10

maintain [1] - 107:10

major [14] - 27:7, 16, 20; 29:5; 31:18;

32:9, 21, 24; 33:7; 37:10; 43:15; 64:3;

73:20; 79:22

majority [8] - 10:7; 18:24; 19:19;

33:20; 49:7; 53:4; 99:11

majority/minority [1] - 81:11

mALC's [1] - 79:4

MALDEF [1] - 68:14

manner [6] - 77:1, 15; 78:24; 79:24;

81:6, 20

map [59] - 6:19; 18:11; 35:11, 16, 18;

37:25; 38:1; 51:13; 56:4; 57:24; 63:23;

64:12; 65:2; 66:5, 10, 15; 69:24; 70:24;

71:14, 18; 72:5, 7, 9, 15-16; 73:17;

78:5; 79:21, 24; 80:1, 11, 15; 84:23;

86:2; 88:6; 89:5; 95:10, 20-21, 25; 96:3,

6; 102:3, 12, 16-17, 19-21; 105:7, 12,

15, 22; 107:22; 108:15

mapping [1] - 84:3

maps [6] - 34:4; 77:10, 15; 78:2; 99:20;

103:23

Maptitude [6] - 16:12, 18, 23-24; 18:2

marginal [1] - 53:6

mark [5] - 44:11; 55:15; 67:3; 85:21;

91:25

marked [7] - 9:17; 39:15, 18, 22, 25;

40:3; 96:15

match [1] - 17:24

material [1] - 4:11

matter [6] - 7:13; 34:10; 44:2; 54:18;

111:12; 112:11

matters [3] - 4:23; 5:2; 34:10

McCain [8] - 57:15; 87:8, 13, 15-16,

18; 89:21; 90:15

mean [25] - 12:7; 15:23; 16:20; 21:2,

19-20; 22:4; 29:22, 24; 32:13; 56:22;

63:18; 64:1; 82:14; 87:22; 91:9; 99:24;

100:4, 7, 16; 101:4; 102:7; 103:6;

104:13

means [4] - 24:5; 33:12; 53:9; 71:21

meant [1] - 103:10

measure [1] - 52:16

meet [2] - 9:10; 54:8

meets [1] - 29:23

MELLETT [5] - 96:11, 13; 109:24;

110:15; 112:4

Mellett [2] - 110:6; 111:23

member [7] - 94:22; 95:11, 16; 104:23;

105:14; 107:15, 18

members [36] - 56:24; 60:25; 64:4;

69:21; 72:24; 77:5, 11; 87:11, 24;

94:17; 95:5; 99:14; 100:23-25; 101:3;

104:10, 23, 25; 105:4, 12, 15, 17, 19,

24-25; 106:3, 18, 20-21; 107:11, 18, 20

memory [1] - 32:4

mentioned [9] - 22:17; 56:5; 63:9;

89:3, 13; 93:2, 9; 106:9

menu [3] - 83:6, 25; 84:5

met [3] - 68:4; 95:15; 102:6

method [1] - 8:6

methodology [3] - 7:7; 22:12

Metropolitan [1] - 73:20

Mexican [1] - 76:11

micro [1] - 60:6

microcosm [1] - 107:12

mid [1] - 33:16

mid-decade [1] - 33:16

middle [5] - 9:24; 34:14; 51:10; 61:10;

66:19

might [5] - 18:12; 27:18; 75:6; 102:16;

109:5

million [2] - 46:19

mind [3] - 26:14; 27:14; 78:14

minimum [1] - 104:17

minorities [3] - 46:8; 47:4; 50:1

minority [6] - 45:21; 46:10, 17; 47:15;

95:5; 101:3

minus [2] - 71:23, 25

minute [2] - 3:9; 72:1

minutes [8] - 4:19; 8:25; 44:4; 50:22;

52:10; 54:14; 109:21; 110:8

miss [1] - 59:13

missed [1] - 60:7

Mississippi [3] - 5:13, 17, 20

misspeak [1] - 11:6

misspoke [1] - 17:12

model [1] - 91:8

moment [3] - 9:8; 94:2; 98:3

month [2] - 33:2; 37:22

months [1] - 103:21

morning [2] - 110:1; 111:8

123

MORTARA [55] - 44:2, 7, 15, 20; 54:6,

10, 14, 20; 55:1, 7, 14, 20; 57:10;

59:15, 21, 25; 60:8; 62:16; 63:15;

64:21; 70:1, 5, 7, 23; 71:2, 10, 12;

72:14; 74:22; 75:3, 7, 13, 15, 18, 25;

76:4; 78:10, 12; 79:11; 80:20; 84:13;

85:7, 14; 96:20; 108:5, 8; 109:10, 18,

20; 110:6, 14, 16; 111:22; 113:13, 16

Mortara [3] - 24:13; 85:6; 96:18

most [11] - 7:14; 22:23; 24:24; 33:2;

35:25; 47:21; 59:3; 72:17; 87:24; 105:3;

109:6

mostly [1] - 25:24

mother [1] - 4:7

move [13] - 17:1; 19:17; 45:4; 58:8;

61:6; 63:16; 69:3; 70:23; 74:6; 92:21;

97:8; 111:16

moved [2] - 82:15; 106:12

moving [6] - 7:5; 68:4; 95:13; 106:16;

111:13, 16

MR [158] - 9:4, 13; 14:17, 19, 21, 23;

17:23; 18:18; 20:14; 23:13, 16, 19;

24:7, 13, 18; 25:5, 7, 15, 17; 29:25;

30:3; 34:15; 38:9, 12, 15; 39:6, 8-9,

11-12, 14, 19, 22; 40:1, 5, 9-10, 13-15,

20, 24; 42:9, 16, 19, 25; 43:2, 18, 22;

44:2, 7, 15, 20, 24; 45:3, 15; 47:3; 49:3;

50:14, 21; 53:25; 54:6, 10, 14, 20; 55:1,

7, 14, 20; 57:10; 59:15, 21, 25; 60:8;

62:16; 63:15; 64:21; 70:1, 5, 7, 23;

71:10; 72:14; 74:22; 75:3, 7, 13, 15, 18,

23, 25; 76:3, 8, 10; 78:10, 12, 19, 24;

79:3, 8, 11, 16, 18-19; 80:20, 22; 81:4;

84:13, 17, 25; 85:3, 5, 7, 11, 14-15, 17;

92:6; 94:2, 5; 96:6, 9, 11-14, 18, 20, 22;

97:25; 108:5, 8; 109:10, 18, 20, 24;

110:6, 14-16, 19, 24; 111:1, 8, 22;

112:4; 113:6, 9-10, 12

MS [18] - 3:8, 14, 20; 4:2, 8, 15, 22, 25;

6:11; 8:24; 9:1; 71:2, 12; 111:3, 10, 12,

15; 113:5

multiple [2] - 19:2; 82:15

multivariate [7] - 15:3, 8; 20:18, 24;

21:10, 14

must [3] - 59:21; 76:15; 111:16

N

name [8] - 4:5; 9:7; 10:23; 25:14, 20;

45:10; 101:22

names [1] - 9:14

narrow [1] - 51:15

nearly [1] - 79:21

necessary [2] - 98:11; 99:6

need [23] - 4:19; 9:8; 24:20; 34:17;

37:18; 39:12; 40:13; 42:19; 61:8; 73:23;

75:25; 82:7; 83:4; 91:5; 92:23; 96:18;

100:21; 107:8; 110:5; 111:19

needed [3] - 43:1; 71:20; 82:8


01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM to 124 of 130 124 of 130 sheets

needs [1] - 76:5

neglected [1] - 40:6

never [13] - 5:15; 53:13; 59:15, 17;

83:19; 84:2; 86:14, 20; 89:4; 91:3;

105:1; 109:1, 6

new [6] - 13:17; 48:1, 4; 51:14; 56:4

next [13] - 3:7; 23:21; 40:9; 42:25;

44:1; 54:9; 57:22; 61:21; 82:18; 88:13,

17, 20; 90:9

nice [5] - 9:10; 18:15; 23:18; 54:8;

110:25

nine [2] - 105:21; 107:23

NO [1] - 113:19

nobody [1] - 64:16

non [1] - 12:6

non-Latino [1] - 12:6

none [1] - 85:4

normal [1] - 32:19

north [3] - 51:19; 68:4; 92:1

North [1] - 5:8

northeastern [2] - 51:23

northern [1] - 51:25

note [1] - 23:25

nothing [2] - 69:1; 104:2

notice [3] - 26:18; 27:24; 59:5

noticed [2] - 95:9, 11

November [2] - 16:6

Nueces [7] - 6:15; 47:25; 48:2, 6; 82:2,

25

number [17] - 8:9; 11:16; 22:3; 32:19,

25; 33:1; 42:15; 46:4, 7; 47:11; 65:25;

70:11; 74:3; 83:15; 92:20; 103:14

numbers [6] - 65:9; 73:24; 74:1, 19;

92:12; 103:19

numerous [1] - 15:24

O

OAG10 [2] - 56:20

oath [1] - 80:18

object [2] - 42:9; 78:12

objection [7] - 3:16; 44:13; 79:11;

80:20; 111:18

obtained [1] - 17:4

obvious [1] - 63:11

obviously [5] - 57:3; 60:5; 61:1; 62:1;

87:19

occasion [1] - 103:4

occur [3] - 27:7; 41:21; 73:17

occurred [6] - 27:12; 36:3, 12; 41:7,

25; 47:22

odd [1] - 25:15

OF [20] - 4:1; 9:3; 14:22; 24:17; 38:14;

45:2; 55:6; 76:9; 85:16; 108:7; 113:5-9,

11, 13

Office [1] - 70:12

office [7] - 15:21; 17:5; 25:4; 94:22;

95:12, 15; 101:2

offices [7] - 73:2; 94:17, 25; 95:1, 4, 6;

100:12

Official [1] - 112:13

officially [1] - 58:4

officials [2] - 36:1; 57:18

offset [4] - 7:2; 53:2, 5, 21

often [6] - 27:6; 62:24; 64:18; 82:16;

100:24; 102:11

old [4] - 16:6; 47:25; 50:1; 51:13

once [8] - 18:2; 41:17; 42:22; 56:15;

58:16; 80:4; 86:18, 25

one [78] - 7:9; 8:21; 9:7; 12:8; 14:10;

18:2; 21:9; 24:25; 25:12; 26:13, 15;

29:7, 14; 31:18; 32:2; 34:9; 35:10, 14;

36:9, 11, 25; 40:4; 43:4; 49:6; 52:11;

56:14, 17; 59:9; 60:10, 13, 22; 61:2, 10;

62:18; 63:12; 65:14; 67:11, 13; 68:13,

22; 69:4, 6; 71:7, 23, 25; 73:22; 74:6;

78:9, 13; 79:14; 80:18; 81:13, 15;

82:18; 83:15; 84:22; 91:18, 20-21; 95:1,

8-10, 24; 100:10; 101:16; 103:10;

105:3; 107:24; 108:5; 111:12

one's [1] - 64:11

one-on-one [2] - 83:15

ones [9] - 63:10; 67:11, 13; 74:12;

88:2; 94:8; 95:18

open [12] - 29:9; 60:19; 61:17, 19, 21;

66:10; 72:6; 85:23; 86:3; 102:7; 107:22;

111:16

opening [1] - 56:4

Opiela [4] - 97:2; 98:4, 6; 102:12

Opiela's [1] - 103:1

opinion [1] - 95:6

opportunity [2] - 13:3; 106:21

opposing [1] - 5:7

opposition [1] - 5:9

option [1] - 109:20

options [5] - 56:7; 58:18; 73:25; 85:25;

89:6

orange [1] - 51:5

order [9] - 3:4; 23:24; 24:2; 54:24;

61:5; 63:1; 67:2; 92:24; 94:25

ourselves [1] - 98:22

outline [3] - 60:4; 66:16; 80:4

outlines [1] - 69:8

outside [2] - 94:20; 95:1

overlapped [2] - 107:17, 21

overlay [3] - 58:6; 94:18

overpopulated [1] - 74:6

own [3] - 13:4; 42:13; 104:25

P

p.m [4] - 3:2; 54:21; 112:7

pad [1] - 3:6

Page [2] - 113:3, 19

page [6] - 24:2-4; 27:13; 42:25; 43:1

pages [1] - 79:1

painstaking [1] - 94:13

pairing [1] - 61:20

124

Palm [2] - 41:5

paper [2] - 25:2; 111:17

paragraph [2] - 43:3; 86:10

parenthesis [1] - 43:4

parlance [1] - 12:14

part [14] - 7:17; 9:24; 17:8; 27:10; 48:1;

59:12; 62:13; 64:10; 75:11; 104:8;

105:16, 24; 106:20; 109:6

participated [1] - 68:17

participating [1] - 68:20

particularly [4] - 32:3; 57:17; 66:13;

112:2

parties [1] - 3:15

partisan [2] - 62:14; 90:20

party [4] - 15:23; 33:19; 35:25

Paso [3] - 6:14; 77:8; 105:23

pass [5] - 8:24; 14:17; 32:17; 43:18;

84:25

passage [1] - 28:14

passed [5] - 28:15; 31:10, 15; 33:3;

66:10

passing [1] - 33:1

past [4] - 16:12, 23; 30:13; 52:19

pattern [1] - 50:9

pause [1] - 96:21

pay [1] - 104:10

paying [1] - 37:8

peach [1] - 91:25

peach-colored [1] - 91:25

people [13] - 15:23; 41:22; 46:19; 48:3;

57:4; 64:12; 68:6; 73:11; 74:3; 81:13;

83:14; 108:23

per [1] - 16:11

Perales [3] - 3:7; 59:21; 60:2

perales [1] - 76:14

PERALES [16] - 3:8, 14, 20; 4:2, 8, 15,

22, 25; 6:11; 8:24; 9:1; 111:3, 10, 12,

15; 113:5

Perales' [1] - 18:15

percent [41] - 12:11; 46:14, 20; 47:1;

49:21; 50:5-7, 16-17; 52:24; 53:3; 62:4,

13; 65:6, 21; 66:2; 67:3, 6, 11, 23; 68:1,

4, 11, 13, 16; 70:16; 93:19-21; 99:5;

107:3, 6, 8, 10

percentage [14] - 18:8; 21:21; 22:4;

46:10, 16, 21-22, 25; 49:23; 57:20;

89:25; 90:1, 5

percentage-wise [1] - 21:21

perfect [2] - 101:4; 105:17

perform [1] - 57:21

performance [3] - 12:14; 57:8

performing [4] - 12:2, 14, 16

perhaps [1] - 27:23

period [1] - 33:2

periodically [2] - 65:12; 71:19

permission [3] - 75:10; 85:7; 111:3

Perry [11] - 56:15; 57:14; 62:4; 87:8,

13-14, 16, 21; 89:20; 90:14

person [2] - 71:23; 80:11


125 of 130 sheets to 125 of 130 01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM

pertains [1] - 34:2

Peña [10] - 62:8; 77:19, 22, 25; 79:20,

25; 80:7, 14; 81:1, 3

Peña's [6] - 61:24; 78:14; 79:5, 14;

80:2, 10

Ph.D [1] - 4:17

phase [1] - 76:19

phases [1] - 96:5

pick [4] - 59:3; 62:7; 64:20; 74:15

picked [4] - 11:25; 12:4, 7; 93:18

piece [6] - 11:2; 28:14; 31:22, 25;

66:17

pieces [3] - 29:5; 61:11; 95:23

place [5] - 15:22; 41:25; 69:1; 73:23;

110:2

Plaintiff's [3] - 9:17; 96:9, 16

Plan [6] - 46:7, 11, 13; 47:8, 23

plan [32] - 5:14; 6:22; 7:3, 10, 12; 8:7,

20; 10:14, 16, 19; 11:3, 5, 11; 12:3, 15;

13:7, 11, 14; 19:4, 12, 15; 45:18, 22;

46:3, 6, 11; 47:6, 25; 48:1; 49:4

plans [5] - 16:20, 23; 77:1, 5; 81:18

plate [3] - 42:23; 54:1; 59:16

plays [1] - 100:11

plurality [2] - 18:24; 53:16

point [24] - 10:19; 11:15, 18; 27:20;

28:9, 13; 32:13; 38:3; 46:21; 53:24;

60:5; 61:1; 68:19; 73:10; 74:23-25;

96:19; 97:5; 99:1; 105:11, 14; 107:3, 5

pointed [2] - 92:4; 95:14

polarized [8] - 5:4, 23; 6:1, 6; 14:14;

15:5; 22:20

policy [1] - 63:23

political [5] - 80:4; 87:6; 93:2; 104:17,

24

politicians [1] - 104:18

politics [1] - 50:12

population [48] - 15:7; 19:19; 20:20;

21:21; 22:9; 46:17, 22-23; 48:2, 11;

51:11, 14, 25; 52:7; 56:10; 65:10, 16;

66:25; 70:11; 73:8, 14; 83:6, 25; 84:3,

20; 86:8; 88:13, 19, 25; 89:2-4, 8, 12,

15, 22; 90:4; 91:4; 93:12, 15, 23-24;

103:3; 108:18; 109:3

populations [4] - 47:16; 52:3; 67:8;

72:19

portion [6] - 58:12; 60:4; 61:7; 62:18;

69:17; 109:1

portions [2] - 59:13; 60:6

position [1] - 64:17

possible [7] - 6:19; 8:6; 22:8; 41:21;

86:8; 103:2

possibly [2] - 57:8; 64:7

Posting [2] - 30:19; 37:20

posting [20] - 27:4, 19, 21, 24; 28:11,

24; 29:19; 30:23; 31:2, 11, 24; 32:1, 10;

34:7, 22; 35:14; 36:6, 12; 37:1; 38:19

potential [1] - 52:20

power [2] - 49:16; 50:11

practice [2] - 32:20; 104:1

practiced [1] - 104:1

Precinct [1] - 91:19

precinct [46] - 17:5, 9, 13-14; 18:12;

19:8, 15, 18; 21:8; 59:10, 12; 60:9, 17,

20; 62:18; 63:4, 7, 12, 14, 18, 20-21,

24; 64:3, 11; 67:16; 69:7, 20; 71:7;

78:5; 91:16, 22; 93:1, 3, 5, 20; 107:24

precinct-by-precinct [2] - 17:5

precincts [21] - 16:1; 17:19; 19:12;

21:3; 58:21; 59:2, 4; 60:13; 63:10; 64:2,

6, 17; 67:4, 7, 15; 68:9; 71:7; 73:20;

74:17; 92:24

precious [1] - 4:19

preclearance [4] - 5:6, 10-11, 20

predominantly [1] - 51:17

prefer [1] - 110:1

preference [2] - 13:4; 49:8

preferences [1] - 69:20

preferred [14] - 23:6, 10; 46:5, 8, 14;

47:9; 48:5, 18; 49:13, 19, 22; 50:5, 7

prefiled [7] - 4:9; 21:9; 23:23; 25:12;

26:15, 18; 41:20

prefiling [1] - 24:1

prepare [1] - 110:21

prepared [4] - 5:3, 18; 44:4; 110:6

prepares [1] - 19:8

presence [1] - 21:1

present [3] - 3:9; 28:7; 80:1

presenting [1] - 50:13

presents [1] - 63:20

presidential [1] - 57:5

press [1] - 55:12

pressure [3] - 32:8; 100:1; 105:8

presumably [1] - 53:18

pretend [1] - 21:7

pretty [1] - 49:16

previous [3] - 5:17; 17:20

previously [5] - 59:22; 81:5; 83:10;

92:14

primaries [4] - 6:2; 19:2; 50:3

primary [10] - 12:9; 18:25; 48:22;

49:15, 17, 19, 25; 50:6

principle [1] - 81:15

print [2] - 25:2; 40:8

printed [1] - 40:1

probative [1] - 7:14

problem [1] - 75:16

problems [2] - 98:14; 108:3

procedural [1] - 28:13

procedure [2] - 25:16; 44:2

proceed [1] - 42:25

proceeded [1] - 81:14

proceeding [1] - 78:25

Proceedings [1] - 112:7

proceedings [2] - 96:21; 112:11

process [35] - 5:15; 35:15; 37:7; 50:3;

56:2, 11, 15, 23; 58:2, 22; 61:25; 62:6,

13; 63:25; 72:4; 74:18, 20; 82:15;

84:11; 86:24; 87:25; 94:13; 95:4, 13;

125

99:11; 102:6, 12; 104:20; 105:16, 19,

23; 106:20, 25; 107:24

product [1] - 80:6

professor [1] - 45:5

project [2] - 7:21; 44:8

proper [1] - 39:13

proportional [1] - 19:10

proportionality [1] - 19:9

proposed [7] - 19:4, 12, 15; 35:18;

46:7, 11; 47:6

proposing [1] - 97:8

protect [1] - 104:23

provide [2] - 98:14; 112:4

provided [3] - 9:19; 20:13; 94:18

providing [1] - 40:5

public [10] - 27:25; 29:6, 10; 30:22;

37:21, 24; 100:10, 14, 19

publicly [2] - 37:12, 25

pull [11] - 42:5; 56:7; 61:2; 73:4, 7;

83:6, 24; 84:18; 86:17; 89:20

pulling [1] - 56:9

pure [2] - 95:17

purely [2] - 62:14; 99:17

purple [2] - 51:11; 52:2

purpose [4] - 12:22; 99:19; 104:8

purposes [1] - 13:20

pushed [1] - 15:24

pushing [1] - 8:1

put [18] - 9:16; 15:19; 27:11; 38:18, 25;

39:3; 48:4; 60:9; 61:17, 19; 69:8; 74:16;

89:21; 95:17, 23; 105:9; 108:10

putting [3] - 48:19; 107:1; 109:7

puzzle [1] - 109:8

Q

quarter [1] - 54:19

quarters [1] - 47:1

question-and-answer [1] - 26:19

questioned [1] - 108:9

questions [27] - 9:16; 14:19; 15:1;

23:13; 24:20; 26:20; 38:7, 9-10, 17;

54:5, 7; 63:15; 64:22; 65:8; 71:10; 75:3,

6; 76:15; 81:21; 85:2; 87:3; 97:25; 98:1;

108:4; 109:11; 111:15

quick [5] - 5:1; 14:20; 38:16; 85:10

quickly [4] - 4:24; 5:1; 45:4; 111:25

quite [5] - 37:18; 51:23; 86:7; 98:2;

100:1

R

race [1] - 87:21

races [3] - 87:8, 23; 89:20

racial [7] - 77:11; 83:6, 20; 86:21;

92:23; 93:5

racially [8] - 5:4, 23; 6:1, 6; 14:14;

15:5; 22:19


01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM to 126 of 130 126 of 130 sheets

raised [5] - 25:12; 26:15; 81:19, 21;

82:1

range [2] - 32:17; 33:4

rarely [3] - 27:8, 21; 37:10

rather [9] - 3:20; 7:20, 23; 56:17;

60:18; 61:6; 64:6; 78:25; 79:22

ratios [1] - 103:19

RDR [2] - 112:10, 13

RDR-CRR [1] - 112:10

re [2] - 52:9; 106:22

re-divided [1] - 52:9

re-elected [1] - 106:22

reach [2] - 46:2; 52:15

reached [2] - 48:24; 99:17

read [4] - 43:3, 5, 7; 86:9

reading [3] - 32:12; 37:13, 15

ready [3] - 41:22; 80:7; 96:9

reaggregated [1] - 20:17

realize [2] - 99:22; 108:24

realized [2] - 99:15; 106:25

really [11] - 4:18; 19:17; 21:2; 29:9, 24;

32:12; 55:18; 64:17; 104:13

reason [5] - 57:3; 60:7; 61:3; 62:13;

73:19

reasons [5] - 7:9; 64:19; 93:2; 99:21

recalled [1] - 87:22

receive [1] - 83:14

received [7] - 3:15; 5:6, 20; 12:10;

49:22; 83:15

receiving [1] - 4:17

recent [2] - 5:2

recognize [1] - 96:23

recollection [9] - 39:9; 40:17; 42:6,

20-21, 23-24; 43:6; 59:16

recommendation [1] - 99:4

reconstituted [6] - 10:8, 14, 20; 11:4,

13; 13:12

record [19] - 4:5, 8; 13:24; 15:2; 23:24;

24:7; 30:22; 39:21; 44:11; 55:11; 71:22;

72:14; 74:8; 75:19; 76:18; 83:5; 92:4;

94:4; 112:10

recorded [3] - 55:15; 75:15, 20

recording [3] - 75:8, 25; 96:19

records [3] - 16:4; 29:9

RECROSS [2] - 76:9; 113:14

RECROSS-EXAMINATION [2] - 76:9;

113:14

Red [7] - 18:16, 20; 19:4, 8, 13, 16;

20:6

red [3] - 51:22; 67:16; 107:18

RedAppl [18] - 44:8; 55:21; 56:1;

58:11; 59:25; 65:11; 66:11; 73:1; 74:1;

83:5, 12, 19; 85:18; 86:14; 94:17,

19-20; 104:2

redirect [5] - 38:12; 39:13; 42:10, 13;

84:16

REDIRECT [6] - 38:14; 55:6; 108:7;

113:9, 13, 16

redistricting [15] - 8:7; 28:12; 30:15;

33:14, 16; 34:2, 7; 36:3, 11; 37:2; 41:4;

42:3; 43:9; 104:21

Redistricting [1] - 34:10

reduce [1] - 52:24

reduced [1] - 46:6

reduction [2] - 46:7; 53:20

redundant [1] - 4:11

refer [1] - 10:5

reference [1] - 98:18

referenced [1] - 26:16

references [1] - 98:19

referring [7] - 35:19; 81:1; 95:21;

97:16; 102:10, 16; 103:19

refers [2] - 30:12; 97:18

reflect [2] - 60:4; 93:21

refresh [7] - 40:16; 42:6, 19, 21-22;

54:1; 59:16

refreshing [2] - 42:24; 43:5

refused [1] - 5:10

regard [6] - 21:15; 68:6; 82:25; 83:1;

104:24

regards [1] - 102:11

region [4] - 22:18; 62:12; 67:21

region-wide [1] - 22:18

registered [1] - 16:5

registration [1] - 17:18

regular [3] - 30:12; 34:18; 38:21

related [14] - 28:14; 31:4, 7-8, 15;

33:8, 13; 34:22; 35:15; 36:13; 37:24;

40:18; 41:22, 25

relates [2] - 28:9; 35:13

relatively [3] - 32:19, 25

released [3] - 37:5, 12, 25

reliable [5] - 16:7; 21:7, 22; 22:9;

52:16

relied [3] - 15:19; 19:4; 81:14

rely [1] - 25:5

relying [1] - 20:13

remain [1] - 101:23

remainder [1] - 69:18

remember [12] - 22:3; 27:15; 41:16,

19; 57:11; 63:10; 66:5; 94:11; 108:10,

13

remembered [1] - 57:14

remind [2] - 68:10, 19

remove [11] - 60:20; 61:7, 10-11, 16;

62:20; 63:3; 69:2; 91:3; 94:25

removed [4] - 61:18; 67:21; 95:6, 15

removing [3] - 60:16; 95:4

reorientation [1] - 48:14

reoriented [1] - 48:10

repeat [1] - 39:10

replication [1] - 17:9

report [14] - 5:3, 7, 19; 18:16, 20; 19:8;

21:13; 49:9; 50:5, 24; 51:1; 53:13;

65:12

reported [4] - 19:13, 16; 29:14; 58:13

Reporter [1] - 112:13

reports [5] - 4:8; 5:18; 19:5; 20:6;

126

45:18

represent [1] - 92:15

REPRESENTATIVE [5] - 24:11, 17;

38:14; 113:8

Representative [35] - 23:6, 9, 21; 25:8;

31:21; 33:5; 38:16; 40:11; 42:10; 43:24;

61:24; 62:8, 12; 69:5, 10, 12, 18-19;

79:25; 80:1, 6, 25; 81:2; 101:9, 21;

102:1, 10; 107:2, 5, 7, 15

representative [11] - 23:23; 24:9, 19;

25:21; 26:12; 35:24; 69:9; 95:13; 101:7,

11, 22

Representatives [5] - 26:6; 34:24;

35:11; 36:10, 14

represented [3] - 48:7; 51:13; 64:6

representing [1] - 32:22

represents [1] - 50:25

republican [9] - 6:2; 14:12; 56:13;

57:18; 59:3; 63:14; 93:19; 102:14

republicans [3] - 87:20; 105:21

request [1] - 15:22

requesting [1] - 97:24

requests [1] - 15:24

required [1] - 72:10

requirements [1] - 104:11

requires [1] - 27:24

Research [1] - 20:13

reside [2] - 47:7; 48:17

residence [1] - 58:6

resolved [1] - 83:1

respect [6] - 6:18; 46:3; 47:6; 57:12;

111:12, 15

response [1] - 19:22

responsibility [1] - 110:20

rest [1] - 51:15

result [4] - 48:15; 74:16; 81:11; 103:5

results [5] - 3:22; 7:25; 19:12, 16;

52:20

retired [1] - 16:20

retrogressed [4] - 13:13, 25; 14:2, 4

retrogression [16] - 5:4; 6:19; 8:6, 20;

13:21; 20:2; 46:2; 47:14, 22; 52:12,

16-17; 53:1, 5-6, 14

returns [1] - 17:25

reverse [1] - 24:2

review [3] - 4:13; 9:22; 10:2

RICHARD [7] - 3:12; 4:1; 9:3; 14:22;

113:5

Richard [1] - 4:6

rid [2] - 62:18; 106:23

right-hand [1] - 85:21

Rights [5] - 81:7, 12, 22; 104:9, 11

ripples [1] - 97:14

rises [1] - 99:25

road [2] - 64:20

role [3] - 79:22; 100:11; 109:7

room [4] - 40:7; 62:9; 81:3; 107:19

rooted [1] - 48:8

roughly [4] - 38:22; 62:3; 63:5


127 of 130 sheets to 127 of 130 01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM

round [2] - 50:15, 22

routinely [1] - 27:18

Rule [1] - 63:22

rule [28] - 27:4, 19, 21, 24; 28:11,

23-24; 29:20; 30:19, 23; 31:2, 11, 24;

32:2, 10; 33:9; 34:7, 22, 24; 35:14;

36:6, 12; 37:1, 20; 38:19; 63:21; 111:20

rules [1] - 107:1

run [5] - 11:4; 17:25; 23:1; 57:1; 65:12

running [4] - 57:19; 93:11, 15; 108:15

runs [2] - 48:13; 51:16

rural [6] - 51:19; 73:18, 20; 109:5, 7

Ryan [3] - 71:16; 72:18; 98:25

S

San [6] - 72:14, 25; 94:9; 97:19; 98:8

sanctions [1] - 31:16

sandwiched [1] - 51:15

satisfaction [1] - 83:2

satisfied [1] - 82:12

save [1] - 54:2

saw [3] - 22:5; 26:10; 93:25

SBOE [3] - 58:10; 64:12, 15

school [4] - 64:13; 69:13; 101:12

scope [2] - 22:14, 16

SCOTT [5] - 24:11, 17; 38:14; 113:8

Scott [5] - 23:6, 22; 25:20; 112:10, 13

screen [19] - 9:16, 20; 23:25; 24:3;

26:25; 27:1; 30:5; 32:15; 55:10; 56:6;

57:25; 72:21; 84:23; 87:7; 91:17; 92:3,

13; 98:3

screens [1] - 44:9

scroll [4] - 42:7; 90:3, 12; 91:12

se [1] - 16:11

Search [1] - 34:20

search [2] - 30:7, 21

seat [5] - 7:15; 48:9; 61:17, 20

seated [2] - 3:3; 54:23

seats [3] - 7:11; 11:23; 33:20

second [1] - 66:22

Secretary [7] - 15:21; 16:2, 17; 17:4;

70:12

Section [8] - 4:23; 5:2, 5, 14-15; 8:5;

81:22

section [2] - 86:10

see [63] - 8:19; 9:20; 13:1, 13, 16;

18:11, 15; 26:24; 27:1; 29:19; 30:4, 10,

18, 25; 31:9, 14; 32:15; 34:6; 35:3;

36:5; 37:11, 16, 19, 22; 38:17; 39:24;

41:14; 51:2, 4, 6, 8, 10, 22; 52:1, 4;

53:20, 22-23; 54:4; 58:7, 9, 18, 25;

59:19, 24; 62:1, 15; 66:23; 67:16;

69:16; 70:9, 20; 71:9; 73:6, 8; 74:2;

80:4; 85:25; 90:14; 92:14, 20; 108:21;

110:8

seeing [3] - 13:21; 32:1; 41:11

select [5] - 59:7; 83:15; 88:18; 108:11,

20

selected [4] - 59:23; 60:5; 70:10;

107:19

selecting [2] - 59:12; 60:6

SELLS [24] - 14:19, 21, 23; 17:23;

18:18; 20:14; 23:13; 85:5, 11, 15, 17;

92:6; 94:2, 5; 96:6, 9, 12, 14, 18, 22;

97:25; 113:7, 15

Sells [1] - 14:21

sells [8] - 14:25; 44:15; 75:8; 76:5;

85:9, 14; 108:10

Senate [7] - 5:5, 13, 18; 27:17; 58:5, 9;

102:22

Senfronia [1] - 69:5

sense [1] - 13:23

sent [2] - 37:14; 58:3

separately [1] - 20:25

served [2] - 26:5, 13

SESSION [1] - 3:1

session [14] - 27:18; 28:24; 29:2;

30:12; 34:17; 38:20; 39:1; 41:8, 10;

56:3; 83:11

set [4] - 9:15; 41:22; 45:16; 54:12

setting [1] - 11:11

settings [1] - 6:3

setup [1] - 99:16

seven [16] - 6:4, 15; 11:19, 25; 12:4, 7,

15; 18:21; 22:17, 24; 46:20; 71:24;

105:20; 106:22

several [4] - 63:9; 65:19; 85:25; 103:7

shade [8] - 18:3, 5; 57:23; 65:5; 84:19;

86:8; 89:15, 18

shaded [2] - 58:17; 89:13

Shading [1] - 86:5

shading [54] - 57:22; 58:19, 21; 61:2;

62:14; 65:1, 4, 7, 11, 16; 66:5, 23; 69:2,

8, 25; 70:2, 10, 16, 20; 71:4, 8-10;

77:11; 83:6, 20, 24; 84:3, 6, 19-20;

86:11, 21; 88:6, 11, 18, 25; 89:2, 6, 12;

90:20; 92:23; 93:6, 16; 108:10, 15, 17,

19

shape [1] - 61:12

share [1] - 6:20

shared [1] - 3:15

sharing [2] - 49:16; 50:11

Sharpstown [1] - 25:25

shifted [1] - 48:12

shifting [2] - 20:18; 50:9

shifts [1] - 49:21

short [1] - 4:16

shots [1] - 23:25

show [18] - 14:7; 26:23; 34:21, 25;

35:5; 60:24; 62:20; 66:8, 15, 22; 70:1;

71:3, 7; 72:23; 73:1; 92:2; 96:10

showed [5] - 40:11; 41:24; 74:1; 80:11;

108:12

showing [3] - 39:22; 54:4; 78:21

shown [8] - 39:21; 63:7; 69:23; 78:16;

79:21; 80:3; 84:23; 103:12

shows [8] - 12:19; 30:22; 36:9, 11;

41:11; 59:1; 84:5

127

side [16] - 25:24; 56:6; 58:8, 25; 60:1;

61:23; 62:17; 64:5; 66:21; 68:7; 85:3,

22; 100:13; 102:21; 111:24

sign [1] - 105:22

signature [1] - 41:13

signed [2] - 41:12; 107:23

significant [1] - 29:6

significantly [1] - 32:18

similar [3] - 10:13; 80:5, 7

simply [2] - 76:25; 79:9

single [4] - 43:15; 64:15; 73:23; 74:18

situations [1] - 100:21

six [1] - 105:22

size [1] - 19:9

skip [1] - 52:11

slate [1] - 56:5

slow [1] - 66:11

slower [1] - 110:9

slowly [2] - 88:5, 10

small [4] - 32:19, 25; 53:14; 74:12

Smith [2] - 50:1; 96:25

software [4] - 16:14; 17:2; 59:18;

73:25

solid [1] - 51:4

Solomons [5] - 42:8; 99:5, 8; 100:7, 21

solution [1] - 101:2

Somerset [3] - 106:12, 15

sometimes [7] - 3:22; 61:3; 64:2, 9,

19; 86:21

somewhat [3] - 34:2; 47:23; 49:15

somewhere [3] - 32:17; 53:21; 98:19

sorry [16] - 17:12; 20:5; 22:5; 25:15;

35:12; 40:22; 58:16; 59:6; 65:21; 69:5;

73:5, 18; 92:9; 93:19; 94:12; 100:16

sort [10] - 25:25; 41:13, 16; 48:9, 12;

50:1, 12; 51:3; 53:11; 103:12

sorts [1] - 37:9

sounds [2] - 29:3; 112:6

source [2] - 15:12; 20:2

South [9] - 5:4; 6:4, 9-10, 13; 21:20;

22:18, 25; 57:16

southwest [1] - 25:24

space [1] - 90:3

spaghetti [3] - 42:23; 54:2; 59:16

Spanish [7] - 15:14, 16; 16:2, 16;

17:22; 18:11

speaker [6] - 97:21; 98:20; 99:6, 9;

100:6, 22

Speaker [1] - 99:9

special [2] - 41:8, 10

specific [8] - 28:2; 56:25; 57:11; 58:11;

59:2; 62:7; 94:8

specifically [11] - 8:11; 21:16, 25;

22:1, 7; 23:1; 57:14; 66:6; 77:14; 94:9;

97:10

spell [1] - 45:11

spelled [1] - 4:6

spend [1] - 83:11

split [13] - 19:12; 49:10; 63:13; 64:3, 9,


01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM to 128 of 130 128 of 130 sheets

14, 16; 68:25; 69:7, 20; 93:1, 5

splits [10] - 19:8, 10, 15; 60:11; 63:7,

18, 20-21, 24; 96:2

splitting [3] - 67:7; 74:17; 92:24

spoken [1] - 50:11

sponsored [1] - 31:18

SSTO [3] - 16:17; 17:24; 18:2

SSVR [34] - 10:23; 17:4; 65:6, 9, 13,

15, 20, 22; 66:2, 5, 22, 24; 67:3, 21;

68:1, 11, 13; 69:1, 25; 70:2, 11, 16, 18;

71:3, 8-10; 89:14; 98:10; 106:16; 107:3;

108:15

staff [11] - 25:1; 98:25; 99:2, 12; 100:5,

11; 102:8, 21-22; 107:9

staffer [2] - 26:13; 37:8

staffs [1] - 102:6

stand [3] - 54:11; 55:11; 83:9

standard [4] - 17:2; 47:14; 52:18; 53:5

standards [1] - 52:21

stands [1] - 30:19

stars [5] - 57:25; 58:2; 72:20, 22, 24

start [9] - 56:4, 8-9; 60:6; 70:9; 85:8;

91:1, 6; 109:21

started [6] - 56:15; 63:24; 68:3; 82:15;

103:23; 107:1

starting [1] - 3:6

starts [1] - 38:22

state [12] - 4:5; 6:19; 7:11, 15; 11:23;

25:20; 53:16, 18, 21; 57:16; 65:24; 77:4

State [21] - 5:5, 13; 6:3; 15:22; 16:2,

17; 17:4; 22:24; 25:22; 46:20; 54:10;

55:1; 58:4; 65:8; 72:11; 76:23; 95:10;

97:9; 104:22; 105:2

State's [4] - 15:21; 16:3; 70:12; 110:19

States [4] - 14:21; 23:20; 38:13

statewide [7] - 46:19; 53:14, 19; 56:12;

57:1, 18

statewides [1] - 56:16

statistic [4] - 65:11; 70:13; 73:13;

93:24

statistical [1] - 50:13

statistics [15] - 56:7-9; 59:5; 60:3;

70:13; 73:4, 7; 89:19, 22; 90:10, 25;

91:1, 13; 103:19

STEPHEN [3] - 44:22; 45:2; 113:11

steps [1] - 89:11

Steven [1] - 45:12

sticks [1] - 51:24

still [8] - 32:25; 39:6; 54:15, 17-18;

62:19; 72:22; 91:15

stock [1] - 112:1

Stop [1] - 108:12

stop [4] - 75:8; 88:22; 96:18, 20

stopped [1] - 68:5

story [1] - 49:15

straddles [1] - 25:25

straight [3] - 61:7; 64:20; 68:5

Straus [1] - 99:9

street [1] - 101:12

stretches [1] - 66:17

strong [1] - 69:14

study [1] - 32:12

sub [1] - 111:4

subcommittee [1] - 27:25

subject [3] - 34:9; 41:22

submission [2] - 5:6, 15

submit [3] - 55:16; 111:19

subsequent [2] - 32:5; 35:2

subset [1] - 53:15

substantial [1] - 52:2

succeed [1] - 90:15

successful [1] - 87:12

sufficient [1] - 49:11

suggest [1] - 44:16

suggestion [1] - 103:1

summarize [5] - 5:25; 27:13; 79:7

summary [3] - 4:17; 5:1; 110:7

Sunday [2] - 41:5

supplemental [8] - 31:6; 41:1, 15;

45:17; 47:12; 48:20; 50:4, 24

support [1] - 97:22

suppose [1] - 39:11

surname [7] - 4:6; 15:14, 16; 16:2, 16;

18:11

surnames [2] - 17:22

surprised [1] - 100:11

suspend [3] - 29:4; 32:9

suspended [24] - 27:21; 28:4, 11, 24;

29:20; 30:19, 24; 31:4-6, 11-12, 24;

33:9; 34:24; 35:7, 10, 14; 36:6, 12;

37:2, 20; 38:3

suspension [2] - 32:2; 37:10

swirled [1] - 48:12

switch [2] - 72:23; 108:18

SWORN [3] - 3:13; 24:12; 44:23

sworn [1] - 78:16

system [7] - 5:8; 16:14, 18; 18:4; 29:9;

85:18; 86:15

Systems [1] - 16:8

systems [1] - 16:9

T

table [2] - 60:1; 85:3

Tabulation [1] - 17:7

taps [1] - 16:15

Tarrant [3] - 6:14; 48:13; 51:20

Task [1] - 3:8

taught [4] - 42:22; 54:2; 59:15, 17

teens [1] - 65:23

ten [18] - 3:9; 4:19; 8:25; 44:4; 46:6;

52:10; 74:20; 82:17-19; 105:21; 106:20;

107:23

ten-minute [1] - 3:9

tended [1] - 87:20

tends [1] - 100:11

tenth [1] - 107:23

term [11] - 26:7, 13; 29:20, 22, 24;

128

30:15, 23; 31:10; 33:9; 40:12; 91:11

termed [1] - 47:15

terminology [1] - 49:6

terms [7] - 12:1, 13; 36:6; 76:22;

79:23; 80:15; 81:14

testified [13] - 35:23; 37:9; 41:20;

76:22; 77:5, 14; 79:14, 20; 80:14; 81:5,

13, 25; 83:10

testify [4] - 36:17; 77:10; 88:1; 94:16

testifying [1] - 76:23

testimony [37] - 21:9; 23:23; 24:1;

25:13; 26:11, 16, 18; 27:1, 9, 15; 29:6;

33:5; 35:9, 13; 43:14; 48:20; 60:11;

68:14; 76:19; 77:18, 22; 78:1, 13-14,

17, 23; 79:13, 23, 25; 80:10; 82:21;

86:13; 93:12, 15; 98:19; 104:14; 106:11

Texas [54] - 6:3, 9-10, 13; 15:10;

18:25; 19:5, 7; 21:20; 22:18, 24-25;

25:21, 23; 26:5; 29:8-10, 15; 30:12, 23;

33:11, 20; 34:23; 35:10, 15; 36:1, 10,

14; 38:9, 20; 46:20, 23; 47:4; 49:18;

51:12; 56:3; 57:1, 16; 58:2; 62:24;

63:22; 65:9, 25; 76:23; 81:15; 99:24;

104:22; 109:21; 110:21; 111:23

text [4] - 10:24; 86:7, 9

thematically [2] - 18:5

themselves [4] - 64:18; 95:11; 100:23;

105:18

therefore [4] - 24:2; 73:21; 97:19;

99:15

Thereupon [1] - 54:21

they've [2] - 27:17; 50:10

thin [1] - 66:21

thinking [1] - 52:22

thinks [1] - 78:15

thirds [1] - 28:6

Thompson [3] - 31:21; 69:10, 15

Thompson's [2] - 69:5, 19

thoroughfare [3] - 60:15; 63:3; 67:5

thousands [1] - 86:13

three [28] - 11:20, 22; 12:16; 14:7;

47:1; 50:22; 56:12; 57:23; 66:21; 67:25;

68:23; 69:22; 71:20; 72:24; 73:5; 78:5;

79:14; 87:8, 10, 22, 24; 89:20; 90:6;

100:25; 103:21; 105:21

three-quarters [1] - 47:1

threshold [1] - 97:11

throughout [4] - 53:17; 56:11, 23;

87:25

ticket [1] - 57:2

tie [1] - 76:16

Tim [1] - 96:9

TLC [1] - 20:4

today [8] - 16:25; 24:14; 25:11; 36:17,

25; 76:25; 77:14; 80:4

together [7] - 36:25; 67:25; 95:23;

104:25; 105:18; 107:20; 109:8

tomorrow [5] - 54:16; 109:22; 110:1;

111:4; 112:3

took [7] - 7:5; 14:8; 15:18; 20:15; 68:3;


129 of 130 sheets to 129 of 130 01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM

93:18; 107:4

top [7] - 32:15; 36:10; 51:22; 57:2;

63:10; 87:23; 91:16

topic [2] - 52:11; 63:16

topics [3] - 20:18; 50:23; 52:11

total [18] - 20:22; 46:19, 22; 48:3;

56:10; 71:24; 73:8, 13; 89:25; 90:4;

91:4; 93:11, 15, 17, 23

totally [1] - 7:10

totals [1] - 90:3

touching [1] - 62:21

track [2] - 32:7; 84:21

trafficking [1] - 31:16

training [6] - 83:12, 15-16, 19; 86:14

transcript [1] - 112:10

transfer [1] - 53:11

translates [1] - 46:21

transparent [1] - 107:25

Travis [20] - 6:15; 48:9, 13, 16, 22, 25;

49:12, 17; 51:2, 5, 7, 10, 17-18, 25;

52:3, 6, 9; 105:22

trial [4] - 8:4; 23:24; 26:17; 59:17

tried [2] - 62:21; 68:5

true [7] - 8:4; 25:3; 27:12; 81:18; 84:7;

96:2

truly [1] - 53:19

truth [1] - 80:18

try [6] - 21:7; 59:3; 64:14; 67:24; 68:6,

15

trying [12] - 22:6; 24:7; 56:13; 62:7;

63:12; 64:19; 74:12, 18; 87:7; 104:13;

107:9; 108:22

turn [6] - 66:22; 67:15; 73:10; 88:6;

89:1; 90:20

turned [2] - 88:25; 107:17

turning [1] - 18:15

turnout [13] - 15:14, 16; 16:3, 16; 17:4;

18:3, 7, 12-13; 57:6; 87:19; 103:2;

106:14

two [28] - 7:8; 9:14; 12:10; 13:24; 15:3;

23:2; 25:23; 28:6; 35:14; 36:9; 38:24;

51:16; 58:18; 60:22; 62:25; 63:11; 65:9;

66:13; 68:8, 22-23; 71:19; 73:22; 79:14;

98:14; 107:18

two-thirds [1] - 28:6

types [2] - 41:23; 57:6

U

ultimately [1] - 102:21

unclear [1] - 66:15

uncommon [1] - 32:9

under [10] - 30:21; 47:6, 8, 17; 51:13;

53:1; 73:10; 80:18; 88:7

underperformed [1] - 56:16

undertaken [1] - 19:11

unfortunately [4] - 24:2; 55:22; 64:1;

66:12

United [4] - 14:21; 23:20; 38:13

unless [3] - 44:13; 63:15; 111:18

unnecessary [1] - 97:21

unsplit [1] - 91:16

up [54] - 8:9; 9:8, 15; 11:23; 17:25;

19:18, 21; 24:20; 26:24; 32:4, 14, 16;

34:20; 38:18; 39:15, 19; 41:11, 14;

42:5; 48:13; 51:20; 52:6; 54:12; 55:3;

56:8; 57:2; 60:22; 61:2; 63:5; 64:14;

66:18; 67:14; 69:4; 73:4, 7; 74:15, 17;

75:22; 86:3, 17-18; 89:20; 94:21, 23;

98:9; 102:19; 103:12; 106:8, 15; 110:16

upfront [1] - 106:2

upset [1] - 97:5

urban [3] - 6:12; 73:18, 24

usable [1] - 15:19

uses [1] - 49:6

usual [3] - 52:21; 53:1

V

vacuum [1] - 56:18

value [1] - 20:16

VAP [6] - 88:8, 15; 90:5; 92:15; 93:17

variable [1] - 89:15

variation [1] - 21:24

variety [3] - 56:14; 64:18; 93:3

various [1] - 29:16

vary [1] - 57:1

vast [1] - 99:11

verbally [1] - 111:16

Veronica [1] - 60:25

versus [2] - 46:11; 106:15

Vice [1] - 68:15

Vice-Chairman [1] - 68:15

video [6] - 44:11; 55:15; 75:25; 76:2;

85:5, 8

viewed [1] - 77:6

Villarreal [3] - 68:15; 107:5, 15

violate [2] - 81:7, 11

visit [1] - 64:4

visited [2] - 67:23; 105:6

visually [1] - 18:11

Vo [1] - 23:9

vote [5] - 49:7, 10, 22; 62:4; 105:7

Vote [1] - 17:7

voted [4] - 17:18-20; 105:15

voter [1] - 106:14

voters [11] - 16:5; 21:15; 22:10, 22;

23:7, 10; 47:21; 66:24; 67:21; 70:8

votes [7] - 10:7; 12:11; 18:24; 19:10;

21:3; 52:23, 25

voting [31] - 5:4, 23; 6:1, 6; 14:14;

15:5, 7; 17:9; 20:19, 22-23; 21:8, 23;

22:9, 20; 49:11; 53:4, 8, 10; 65:10, 16;

88:18, 25; 89:4, 8, 22; 91:4; 108:18

Voting [5] - 81:7, 11, 22; 104:8, 11

VTD [20] - 15:10; 16:25; 17:5, 7; 58:19;

59:8; 60:14, 20; 69:4; 70:14, 18; 71:9;

84:21; 87:1; 108:16, 18; 109:2, 4, 9

129

VTDs [2] - 17:7; 69:1

W

wait [1] - 55:18

waiting [1] - 90:10

waive [1] - 27:18

waived [1] - 38:20

waiver [5] - 41:1, 3, 21, 25; 43:15

waivers [3] - 27:6; 40:11; 41:7

Wallace [2] - 112:10, 13

watermark [2] - 87:17, 19

ways [3] - 66:1; 107:12; 108:23

Website [7] - 29:10, 15, 19, 21; 30:4;

31:3; 34:6

week [2] - 24:1; 64:24

weeks [2] - 25:23; 103:17

welcome [1] - 55:5

West [1] - 62:24

west [2] - 26:1; 51:17

western [4] - 48:13; 51:17; 52:7; 62:17

white [6] - 3:18; 8:14; 12:23; 50:8;

51:17

whites [3] - 49:9, 11, 20

whole [6] - 33:23; 64:10; 100:10, 15,

19

wholly [1] - 67:9

wide [3] - 22:17; 93:3

wife [1] - 109:16

win [4] - 10:4; 18:24; 49:24; 90:14

win-loss [1] - 10:4

window [1] - 91:12

wins [3] - 50:6

wise [1] - 21:21

wish [1] - 73:25

wished [1] - 105:7

withdrawn [2] - 68:18; 94:15

witness [25] - 8:24; 14:17; 23:15; 38:8,

11; 39:21; 42:13; 43:19; 44:1, 9; 54:5,

9; 55:11; 78:13, 16, 22; 84:13, 25; 85:2;

99:21; 109:19, 25; 110:19

Witness [7] - 86:4, 6; 90:13, 22; 92:11,

19; 96:17

WITNESS [66] - 3:12; 6:8; 17:6, 11, 15,

17; 19:23; 20:1, 5, 8, 10, 12; 24:11, 25;

40:22; 43:25; 44:22; 45:12; 47:1; 49:4;

50:18; 55:4; 56:22; 59:24; 60:2; 61:16,

19, 23; 64:1; 70:6, 20; 72:13, 17; 80:25;

92:5; 98:5, 9, 24; 99:10, 23; 100:1, 3, 9,

16, 20; 101:4, 10, 14, 19, 25; 102:5, 23;

103:6, 9, 11, 13, 16, 25; 104:19; 106:7,

10, 13, 18; 108:3; 109:14, 16

witness's [2] - 78:13, 16

witnesses [2] - 41:23; 106:5

won [4] - 10:7; 12:20; 18:20; 87:13

wonder [1] - 26:19

wonderful [1] - 55:18

wondering [1] - 62:24

word [1] - 28:17


01/25/2012 08:59:45 PM to 130 of 130 130 of 130 sheets

130

words [3] - 12:2; 13:14; 97:4

works [2] - 84:16; 91:15

worst [1] - 57:9

worth [1] - 52:22

wrapping [1] - 27:11

wraps [1] - 52:5

Y

year [4] - 5:6, 12; 29:23; 30:13

years [6] - 5:7; 11:20, 22; 26:7, 10

yellow [2] - 51:7; 107:19

yield [1] - 52:20

yourself [3] - 25:18; 43:5; 104:12

Z

zero [7] - 71:19, 21; 72:10; 73:22;

74:21; 94:6

zeroed [1] - 72:9

zeroes [1] - 74:19

zeroing [4] - 72:4, 19; 73:16; 94:13

zip [1] - 111:25

zoom [13] - 58:15; 60:15; 63:4; 66:12,

18, 23; 71:3, 5; 73:14; 74:2; 86:18; 87:5

zoomed [1] - 61:1


case 5:11-cv-00360-olg-jes-xr document 597-13 filed 02/02 ... · court reporter: scott l. wallace,...

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